Really cannot understand the Bylsma hate

[BurghThang]

Pittsburgh fans love to trash coaches, quarterbacks, and goalies (not necessarily in that order)...and this is coming from a lifelong Pittsburgher.

All Bylsma does is win. Anything short of a cup is a fail?
Over the years, all the decimating injuries, and all this team has done is win.

"Fans" get so spoiled. Because you win a cup in '09 doesn't guarantee any repeats.
Julien hasn't won in 2 years...does he suck?
Babcock hasn't won since '08...does he suck?

I'm all for 2nd guessing a decision here, or a lineup there....but some of the vitriol and blind hate towards Coach Bylsma baffles me. I think we are so blessed to have the talent we have, coaches and players alike, and that we have had for so many years.
We have been absolutely blessed to watch the teams we have had, and enjoy the overall success we have had.

OK...flame away...I'm done.
Sorry...I just don't get it

Click to read more...

 

[Beauner]

It's not the fact that we lose in the playoffs. It's how we use. Mismanagement of players, refusing to adjust and letting other teams dictate matchups are all obvious flaws that have cost us in the playoffs to some degree.

 

[Michael8771*]

I don't view it as ''blind'' hate''. I for one believe he hasn't utilized personnel in the most optimal manner possible. We have Sid and Geno, two of the best players in the world. In a sense it's a head start on the rest of the league. Having guys such as these can help propel a team to wins when many players in similar situations cannot. What I'm trying to say is that having these guys masks shortcomings of the team in the REGULAR season. And you're right, DB does win a lot , but again, it's in the regular season, not the playoffs so much. His love and adoration for Adam's and Glass or DE results in him playing them over guys like Despres or Sill. That makes you wonder where his head is at. Let him win us a cup again, You'll see a lot more appreciation then. I don't think the majority here trust his judgement regarding personnel decisions, and there's ample and legitimate reasons as to why. Not to mention his ineptitude in making in game (or even worse) in series adjustments in the playoffs. Hopefully coach Martin will help in that regard.

 

[Ogrezilla]

Dan Bylsma does a lot of things very very well. But he does a few things very very poorly, and they have been the same things for years now and he is not showing any sign of growth. As you noted, he is fantastic at coaching through injuries. He gets everything there is to get from call-ups and grinders.

His problems to me basically boil down to playing favorites with players. He holds his young players to much different standards than his veterans. Guys like Orpik and Adams can make the same mistakes night in and night out, but guys like Despres and Sill are benched for making the same mistakes far less often. He values veteran experience over talent and ability, and we are a worse team for it. In general, there is a lack of accountability for the vets. When we are injured, you see us playing a more structured game. But as soon as the vets start coming back, you see us lose that structure. They have more talent, so they still win games, but if the vets played with the same structure as the call-ups we would be a much better team. I'm sure Disco is telling them to play with structure, but they seemingly aren't listening. That's a problem. its even more of a problem with the vets who are legitimately worse hockey players than the young guys available to replace them, but he refuses to make the switch.

There are other issues, but those are clearly the main ones. He consistently misuses our roster by giving our worst players too many important minutes and by giving our good young players too few minutes. And our veteran players aren't held accountable for their mistakes. If Disco can fix these issues, he will be a tremendous coach. I just don't know if he can fix these problems without a change of scenery. My concern is that he doesn't even see a problem. I think he legitimately thinks Craig Adams and Brooks Orpik are our best defensive hockey players.

 

[ImporterExporter]

We live in a "what have you done for me lately" world, especially in sports. Bylsma is not a horrible coach. He's not even a bad coach. I will be the first to admit i thought a change was needed after this past playoff run, but i've been quite pleased with how he's handled a team that has been decimated by injuries, moreso than any i've probably ever seen.

Does he make some poor judgements, especially in terms of matchups and pairings? Sure, i think most would argue he does. But again, we are all fans, with opinions via a keyboard. It's easy to sit here and judge a guy for various reasons.

I do think his stubborn stance in regards to guys like Adams, Glass, Orpik, Dupuis (this year especially) is concerning. I'd like to know where he stood on the Letang issue as he clearly was not worth 7+M long term, especially when you already had 2 players (Sid/Geno) making big sums and a defensive corps/prospect pool that was arguably the best in hockey.

But yes, the "hate" is over the top. I will however say, that another flop in the playoffs deserves a change.

 

[Frederick Stanley]

If we would lose with our best line up, it's not a big deal. But when we lose to other teams not icing our best line up because the coach refues to make adjustments, bench players which are in a slump etc. that's terrible.

Roster management is also a big deal. Some accountability would be nice.

 

[WhatsaMaatta]

This topic has been covered many times over. It's kind of surprising that the question needs to be asked. This clearly isn't just a "Pittsburgh" fan thing, either. People from all over the world post on here, of which many don't even follow the Steelers or Pirates.

 

[brewski420]

Just the 'appearance' of a coach playing/having favorites to me is just beyond anything a coach should be IMO. If it was just one person/myself thinking he was this way than it would be my problem. The fact that I am not the only one that thinks/sees it makes it more of an issue. Can't think of a worst trait for a coach to have but that is my opinion.


Edit: I am actually very interested is seeing how he does coaching Team USA.

 

[Lomez]

This topic has been covered many times over. It's kind of surprising that the question needs to be asked. This clearly isn't just a "Pittsburgh" fan thing, either. People from all over the world post on here, of which many don't even follow the Steelers or Pirates.

For me, this is the problem. There is such a profound lack of diversity of opinion, thought and ideas on these boards, sometimes it seems as if each post is written by the same person. Not to be offensive to anyone, but I really only pay attention to about five posters on the Pens board, the rest seem to be simply parroting the rant du jour.

I applaud the OP for his boldness in actually trying to promote discussion beyond Bylsma's love of "Gladams," hatred of Despres and other young guys, and--most egregious--his failure to "adjust" in a game. Certainly, Bylsma's record given a couple of superstars, a headcase for a goalie, and a bunch of scrubs, warrant that discussion.

 

[cheesedanish87]

I think DB is well liked and appreciated by the majority of pens fans.

Hes just not liked by the majority of this board.

 

[brewski420]

I think DB is well liked and appreciated by the majority of pens fans.

Hes just not liked by the majority of this board.

This is probably very true.

 

[dueling mullets]

It's his stubbornness to think the Pens only lose in the playoffs bc they didn't get to their game. Maybe that's the case, but he could have iced a much more optimal lineup last season in the playoffs. Iginla should have been crosby's winger. Beau should have been Malkin's LW. 3rd line should have been Jokinen morrow dupuis (which you might recall was tearing it up when it was a line for 8 or so games at end of the regular season, and a 4th line of Vitale, sitter, Adams. But instead, the 3rd and 4th lines were as worthless as they are now, iginla couldn't play RW, and teams openly admitted to the media that am they had to do was double team Crosby because they didn't have to worry about his wingers producing on their own.

 

[Sideline]

Ray Shero got him a Hall of Fame calibre RW for the playoffs. Disco Dan thought that would be the perfect time to covert him to a left winger.

Criag Adams and Tanner Glass playing before Joe Vitale and Beau Bennett.

Malkin and Neal consistently playing less than Crosby at ES.

Mark Eaton playing over Simon Despres.

Stretch passing.

Double shifting Craig Adams in the last minute of every game.

These are just the things off the top of my head.

 

[Florentino Ariza]

Some of the complaints are legitimate. But every coach has a style and generally will employ his strategy, even when it is not working. The stretch passes, for example, look really bad when they are not working and the team keeps trying to make them work. When they are working, though, they are not noticeable and nobody complains. My opinion is that such deficiencies are relatively minor compared to those of other coaches.

I like Bylsma, however, my main beef with him is that it seems like the star players get to do as they please. For example, I believe Crosby is the one who decides who plays with Crosby and Bylsma's control over Crosby's line is mostly a facade . Similarly, I really don't like how our star players get away with acting like children when the other team gets under their skin. It doesn't appear to me as though the coach has them under control and that can have disastrous consequences when Crosby/Malkin/Letang get frustrated (see Flyers series 2011). That is a conundrum all teams with truly elite players face, though. I can't really fault Bylsma for having to manage generational talent.

 

[SEALBound]

All Bylsma does is win

What has he won? I mean...REALLY...what has Byslma "won".

He was a interm call up coach when Therrien got the boot. He kept the same system in place but allowed forwards to be more aggressive. The talent of Sid and Geno propelled them to a winning streak. Favorable matchups in the playoffs hid our shortcomings. Detroit was all banged up and Malkin had his way with them. The only thing Dan was capable of doing was throwing Cooke-Staal-Kennedy, the best third/defensive line in the league at the time, in against top lines which doesn't take a genius to do. The team won the cup that year. His first year...within 6 months. Hardly solely because of him.

Since then...what? It's been playoff after playoff of arrogant coaching that has led straight to our demise.

1. Refusal to match lines anymore. No attempts to get star players away from defensive/shut down pairs.
2. Zero adjustments during game. None. One or in rare occasions two may come the next game, but in game adjustments (unless forced by injury) are non existent.
3. Favoritism of players. By all means, Craig Adams should not be on this team. There is NOTHING he offers that a younger player can't do better. The only thing he has is "being a fourth liner just like Dan was". I honestly believe that Adams gets this benefit of the doubt because he reminds Dan of himself back when and he wants to live through Craig...and give all the chances he never got. Which is sad.
4. Mismanagement of young players as already mentioned.
5. Letting the team lose their **** in the playoffs, then not having the ability to reel them back in.

Any one of these is more than enough to warrant booting a coach because they lead to undeniable playoff destruction.

I don't give a **** about the regular season. Playoffs is the only thing that matters. He does not win there. What "wins" there are, are due to the magic of Sid and Geno. Everything is DESPITE Bylsma.

 

[steelrazor]

It is quite irritating to se all the hate most of the time. I try to ignore it. I take most stuff said about Baylsma here with a grain of salt.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

This isn't just a Pgh thing, c'mon now. Most fans will only support a winner and when things aren't going well, they turn on the coaches and players. This happens in Pgh, Chi, Bos, all around the US, up in Canada, and around the world.

I supported DB all last Summer and felt he could be one of the best coaches in the league if he improved in certain areas. However, he followed the same patterns once again. I was still going to support him until his after season press conference. He literally had no clue or competent answers to very legit questions.

I still want to see him do well, but I don't believe in him TBTH. If he can lead the team to a cup, great. It would be nice to see that my initial feelings about him were right.

I know people are mad about him favouring vets and it pisses me off as well. However, he did keep up Despres last season out of camp and gave BB some looks on the Malkin line. He gave Maatta, a 19 year old rookie, a spot on the team. He is giving Megna a shot with Crosby over Kobasew and he really seems to dig the guy.

I know Megna will get moved off the line by the first commercial break and such, but whatever. As long as Megna is in the lineup and not in the A, I'm happy and see it a a positive from DB.

He has made more changes this season that I like, including adding various breakouts and cutting down on the stretch passes people *****ed about. Ironically, Toronto and Chicago busted up Boston with the stretch pass, but I'm tired of pointing that out.

Things aren't as black and white with DB as people want them to be. I don't hate him, but I will criticize him when he does stupid **** (and he has a tendency to do some really stupid ****). He deserves a lot of the criticism thrown his way (Letang at fwd on a 4-4? Adams and Glass to kill a 4-3 agt one of the fastest teams in the league?)

I still think he can be elite, but I'm much less confident that will happen than I was last year at this time.

 

[DeadGator401]

Pittsburgh fans love to trash coaches, quarterbacks, and goalies (not necessarily in that order)...and this is coming from a lifelong Pittsburgher.

All Bylsma does is win. Anything short of a cup is a fail?
Over the years, all the decimating injuries, and all this team has done is win.

"Fans" get so spoiled. Because you win a cup in '09 doesn't guarantee any repeats.
Julien hasn't won in 2 years...does he suck?
Babcock hasn't won since '08...does he suck?

I'm all for 2nd guessing a decision here, or a lineup there....but some of the vitriol and blind hate towards Coach Bylsma baffles me. I think we are so blessed to have the talent we have, coaches and players alike, and that we have had for so many years.
We have been absolutely blessed to watch the teams we have had, and enjoy the overall success we have had.

OK...flame away...I'm done.
Sorry...I just don't get it

Yes. Anything short of a cup is failure. You have the two best players in the world. You're expected to go out and compete for a championship. EVERY YEAR.

Imagine a coach who said, "Oh you know, second round is good enough."

Are you ok with that? As long as the Playoffs are made and the team wins some games? What's next, as long as they tried their best that's all that matter?

 

[xxxxxxxxxxxxxx]

The only thing Bylsma is capable of is getting blood from stone in terms of grinders.

The sad thing is, when this team is healthy, it's an extremely talented team (top heavy, but still). He does not know how to utilize that talent. He sticks to what he knows, which is grinder hockey. That's why you see guys like Glass, Adams, Engelland and Orpik out there when they're not the best options.

A real X's and O's coach who knew how to get the best out of his talented players would go a long way to bringing this team over the crest of the hill in terms of the truly elite.

Bylsma wins a lot of games with grinders, definitely. But he also coasts along behind the talent of Sid, Geno, Neal, and Kunitz for the vast majority of the time. Regular season be damned, too. Show me the results in the playoffs. I still don't buy that he had an instrumental hand in the Cup run. Sid and Geno each played at a level that hadn't been seen for 20 years, Fleury played well enough to not throw games/series, and we got important secondary scoring. Bylsma was just the change of scenery that the team needed when they tuned Therrien out.

Bylsma is a detriment. I've been saying it for several seasons, and I'll continue to say it until he's replaced. He cannot out-coach anyone, especially the caliber of coaches we're going to meet in the playoffs. He continues to misuse players, play sub-optimal players, and stubbornly stick to a system of stretch passes and passive defense that isn't cutting it. Anyone could coach this team to the top of the Metro division and coast into the playoffs. The real money is earned when he needs to figure out how to get Sid and Geno to stay composed and put them in the best position to produce when it matters come playoff time. As much as it is Sid and Geno's job to remain calm and play hockey, it's Bylsma's job to keep the team running well and playing disciplined hockey.

 

[BurghThang]

What has he won? I mean...REALLY...what has Byslma "won".

More games than any coach in the franchise's 46 year history?

 

[WhatsaMaatta]

McGuirk, to be fair, the team is adjusting their transition game. Adjustments are being made, they have just taken a long time to occur, and there are still a few problems that have yet to be addressed.

 

[Burgs]

More games than any coach in the franchise's 46 year history?

The Penguins have never had a really good coach for any length of time, though. Badger Bob died early, Bowman was run out of town after just 2 years, Herb Brooks was only a semi-retired stop gap option, and so on. Eddie Johnston was a good guy and loyal company man, but nobody ever called him a great coach. And Bylsma lucked into getting his start just as the Pens had become a top team.

He has some strengths going for him but his weaknesses outweigh that come playoff time. And the worst thing is that he's too stubborn to change and never sees himself at fault. Shero should've fired him on the spot for having the gall to complain about "too many options" and declaring the Bruins had "a force field around their net". Cool story, Dan.

 

[Dying Alive]

For me, this is the problem. There is such a profound lack of diversity of opinion, thought and ideas on these boards, sometimes it seems as if each post is written by the same person. Not to be offensive to anyone, but I really only pay attention to about five posters on the Pens board, the rest seem to be simply parroting the rant du jour.

I applaud the OP for his boldness in actually trying to promote discussion beyond Bylsma's love of "Gladams," hatred of Despres and other young guys, and--most egregious--his failure to "adjust" in a game. Certainly, Bylsma's record given a couple of superstars, a headcase for a goalie, and a bunch of scrubs, warrant that discussion.

Agreed. And anyone who differs in opinion often gets shouted down or responded to sarcastically by the masses. It can be fairly brutal to be of a minority opinion on this board.

I think DB is well liked and appreciated by the majority of pens fans.

Hes just not liked by the majority of this board.

I agree with this as well.

 

[Fordy]

I'm not a Pittsburgh fan and I don't blindly hate Bylsma, I have dozens of reasons I don't like him.

 

[Ragamuffin Gunner]

You convinced me.

In Bylsma We Trust!