Realignment Idea Proposal!

[Truthking]

That's really up to the cities who have bigger buildings and bigger expenses to figure. The real question will be how can places like Hamilton and Mississauga who are in markets they a very sparse interest in junior hockey. Yes these places have populus that should be jumping on the lower levels of sport but those two places will really be the ones who may not survive if the numbers have to be limited or reduced by X thousand of people. The places that can survive will be the ones who have had a solid footprint in the junior hockey community. For example Guelph, Kitchener, Owen Sound, London, Oshawa, Ottawa etc.

But keep in mind that the longer this health crisis continues those bigger centers with bigger facilities and larger staffs will eventually become the target for empty or sparse profit margins and further to that empty or sparse buildings that expect the majority of the buildings capacities full.

Those bigger cities with bigger buildings also have high populations with more tax dollars.

 

[MatthewsMoustache]

What your proposing is ludicrous Soo and Ottawa in the same division for that sake why don't you put Soo and Erie in the same division then. No one in there right mind would agree to this proposal. Right now even divisional games are x6 x6 x8 x8 so explain to me how in the world you'd manage to get a fair schedule out of this??

forgot that just because Ottawa is so far away from me that it’s not close to the northern teams by default, that’s my bad lol

 

[AttackSound]

forgot that just because Ottawa is so far away from me that it’s not close to the northern teams by default, that’s my bad lol

Last I checked Soo is the furthest northwest and Ottawa furthest northeast unless I'm mistaking my geography lessons from high school lol

 

[OMG67]

People need to understand that the league does road trips. I am in Ottawa and follow the 67’s. The 67’s may be on the outer edges of the map but the travel isn’t bad. Ottawa doesn't typically do one off trips. Maybe a few to Kingston but generally speaking they don’t go out he road for one game.

Ottawa plays 11 teams once on the road. The ten in the Western Conference plus Sudbury. They will typically knock off those teams in 5 trips:

1> SSM-SUD +NB
2> GUE-OS
3> WSR-LDN-KIT
4> ER +NIA&HAM
5> SAG-FLT-SAR

Then there are some Central Division leftovers:
1> NB-BAR
2> NIA+HAM
3> BAR+ someone on the way like PBO or OSH
4> MIS +HAM

So, Ottawa is far away but they do 3 in 3’s or 3 in 4’s on the road and then a bunch or 2 game road trips to cover division and some conference games.

I wouldn’t say Ottawa has an overly tough road schedule. Sure, compared to Kitchener or Mississauga, they travel a lot more but it isn’t like it is cumbersome.

SSM is in a tough spot but their division games aren't bad, similar to Ottawa. They play a lot of extra games against SUD. It is just navigating to the rinks in ER, NIA, OSH, PET, KGN are a pain. Once they are in Guelph/Kitchener area, they can hit OS, LDN, BAR, HAM, MIS.

If you want crappy travel, go to the WHL. I am sure there are some teams out there that laugh at the fans in the OHL complaining about travel.

 

[WaW]

People need to understand that the league does road trips. I am in Ottawa and follow the 67’s. The 67’s may be on the outer edges of the map but the travel isn’t bad. Ottawa doesn't typically do one off trips. Maybe a few to Kingston but generally speaking they don’t go out he road for one game.

Ottawa plays 11 teams once on the road. The ten in the Western Conference plus Sudbury. They will typically knock off those teams in 5 trips:

1> SSM-SUD +NB
2> GUE-OS
3> WSR-LDN-KIT
4> ER +NIA&HAM
5> SAG-FLT-SAR

Then there are some Central Division leftovers:
1> NB-BAR
2> NIA+HAM
3> BAR+ someone on the way like PBO or OSH
4> MIS +HAM

So, Ottawa is far away but they do 3 in 3’s or 3 in 4’s on the road and then a bunch or 2 game road trips to cover division and some conference games.

I wouldn’t say Ottawa has an overly tough road schedule. Sure, compared to Kitchener or Mississauga, they travel a lot more but it isn’t like it is cumbersome.

SSM is in a tough spot but their division games aren't bad, similar to Ottawa. They play a lot of extra games against SUD. It is just navigating to the rinks in ER, NIA, OSH, PET, KGN are a pain. Once they are in Guelph/Kitchener area, they can hit OS, LDN, BAR, HAM, MIS.

If you want crappy travel, go to the WHL. I am sure there are some teams out there that laugh at the fans in the OHL complaining about travel.

Or even the Q where Rouyn and Val D'or have each other, then like the next closest team is 5-6 hours away lol.

 

[OMG67]

Or even the Q where Rouyn and Val D'or have each other, then like the next closest team is 5-6 hours away lol.

Even Gatineau has to travel through Montreal for all teams except the two you mentioned.

The OHL in general has very little travel. Talk of realignment for the sake of travel schedules is almost classified as a first world problem in hockey terms.

 

[jamemcca]

A writer for our site, Dana has some realignment ideas. Check them out. I know this discussion gets opened up every two years but I kind of like this one. I know some will find some flaws. Happy to engage is some friendly discussion!

The OHL Realignment

if it ain’t broke don’t fix it

 

[AttackSound]

People need to understand that the league does road trips. I am in Ottawa and follow the 67’s. The 67’s may be on the outer edges of the map but the travel isn’t bad. Ottawa doesn't typically do one off trips. Maybe a few to Kingston but generally speaking they don’t go out he road for one game.

Ottawa plays 11 teams once on the road. The ten in the Western Conference plus Sudbury. They will typically knock off those teams in 5 trips:

1> SSM-SUD +NB
2> GUE-OS
3> WSR-LDN-KIT
4> ER +NIA&HAM
5> SAG-FLT-SAR

Then there are some Central Division leftovers:
1> NB-BAR
2> NIA+HAM
3> BAR+ someone on the way like PBO or OSH
4> MIS +HAM

So, Ottawa is far away but they do 3 in 3’s or 3 in 4’s on the road and then a bunch or 2 game road trips to cover division and some conference games.

I wouldn’t say Ottawa has an overly tough road schedule. Sure, compared to Kitchener or Mississauga, they travel a lot more but it isn’t like it is cumbersome.

SSM is in a tough spot but their division games aren't bad, similar to Ottawa. They play a lot of extra games against SUD. It is just navigating to the rinks in ER, NIA, OSH, PET, KGN are a pain. Once they are in Guelph/Kitchener area, they can hit OS, LDN, BAR, HAM, MIS.

If you want crappy travel, go to the WHL. I am sure there are some teams out there that laugh at the fans in the OHL complaining about travel.

So true sometimes I think we the fans forget how somewhat easier it is for OHL teams to travel this league. Even looking at an Owen Sound standpoint. From a divisional standpoint the furthest trip is Erie and those 6 games are split between x2 double-header weekends one in Erie and the other in Owen Sound. Probably the toughest trips Owen Sound does beyond that are the eastern swing which typically includes Ottawa in a 3 in 2.5 day stint or the northern circuit which includes a stop in the Soo which is 3 in 4 usually starting with Soo on the Thursday and finishing in North Bay Sunday afternoon. After that most of the remaining trips are manageable in regards to travel.

Where Owen Sound gets self-shafted in scheduling and travel dates back to 2000 when Owen Sound was resurrected and name changed where they were given a few options on who and where they wanted to be in the a division with, naturally Owen Sound decided that the Midwest would be there landing spot due to the geographic position on the provincial map. This saw the newly named Attack be placed in a division with Erie, Kitchener, London and Guelph. As Owen Sound or should I saw the Platers prior to the name change had ties with the city of Guelph it was only natural that the two cities would have a stronger relationship as rivals in the same division and conference.

Looking at the divisions as a whole I think the real question everyone has to ask themselves is, is if you could change the divisions around would you miss those long-standing rivalries or accept the fact that the long-standing team and fan enthusiasm of bitter rivalries would disappear. For as much as I'm an Owen Sound fan and disapprove of certain teams coaching styles and playing styles around the league as most fans do because of the belief that certain cities get the upper-hand in certain games or buildings , we all have to accept that there will be one thing that will never change in this league no matter who you put in a division with who every team plays the same number of games at home and on the road and that will never change and to further that home teams do get advantages that road teams don't e.g. knowing their own buildings little subtleties that make the home team take advantage of like who teams like Peterborough have awkward corners that bounce the puck back out into traffic instead of around the back of the net, or how everyone around the league believes that Owen Sound has a small building when in truth be told it's the same dimensions as every other city in the league no matter how you look at the building.

No matter what people think about travel road trips will only change if the league expands the teams and divisions and trips will change that way and that will probably never happen under the current teams.

 

[HockeyPops]

TEMPORARY COVID REALIGNMENT IDEAS

I am hijacking this thread for the purposes of suggesting temporary realignment for the 2020-2021 season, assuming the border remains closed to travel for the start of the season.

Here is a proposal, stolen from the Covid thread:

They're going to have to work out something different for the Grehounds. Driving past Sudbury, North Bay, and Barrie as they make 12 hour drives to Windsor and Sarnia is not going to help with reducing travel.

The entire reason the West division exists is because of travel through Michigan. Swapping the Greyhounds and Ice Dogs for a season would make a ton of sense. It would make something of a North Division.

What other ideas do folks have?

 

[Kingpin794]

TEMPORARY COVID REALIGNMENT IDEAS

I am hijacking this thread for the purposes of suggesting temporary realignment for the 2020-2021 season, assuming the border remains closed to travel for the start of the season.

Here is a proposal, stolen from the Covid thread:

What other ideas do folks have?

I don't think you have to realign divisions for this season. The Soo are probably going to be in the same boat as Flint, Saginaw, and Erie. Probably will see the American teams get all their head to head games done in the first month or so until things open up while the Soo, Sudbury and North Bay face each other.

 

[Fischhaber]

I don't think you have to realign divisions for this season. The Soo are probably going to be in the same boat as Flint, Saginaw, and Erie. Probably will see the American teams get all their head to head games done in the first month or so until things open up while the Soo, Sudbury and North Bay face each other.

So let's say you do that and the border doesn't open. Then what? The American teams have to be here from the start if the border is not open at the beginning of the season.

 

[HockeyPops]

So let's say you do that and the border doesn't open. Then what? The American teams have to be here from the start if the border is not open at the beginning of the season.

As much as it seems risky, rumour has it that it's the tentative plan for now.

 

[Fischhaber]

As much as it seems risky, rumour has it that it's the tentative plan for now.

Hopefully 3 stubborn owners will not tank the season for the rest of the league. I think that proposal is foolish and risky.

 

[Otto]

Maybe you see a number of 3/4 team hubs?

USA:

Flint
Saginaw
Erie

West

Windsor
Sarnia
London
Owen Sound

South

Hamilton
Niagara
Guelph
Kitchener

East

Ottawa
Kingston
Peterborough

Central

Oshawa
Mississauga
Barrie

North

Sault Ste. Marie
Sudbury
North Bay

 

[ohloutsider]

Maybe you see a number of 3/4 team hubs?

USA:

Flint
Saginaw
Erie

West

Windsor
Sarnia
London
Owen Sound

South

Hamilton
Niagara
Guelph
Kitchener

East

Ottawa
Kingston
Peterborough

Central

Oshawa
Mississauga
Barrie

North

Sault Ste. Marie
Sudbury
North Bay

Close but I would put Owen Sound with Barrie and Missy. Oshawa back to the east. The rest looks good - did read they were looking for no "overnight trips" so this would fit that mold except the US group.

 

[AttackSound]

Close but I would put Owen Sound with Barrie and Missy. Oshawa back to the east. The rest looks good - did read they were looking for no "overnight trips" so this would fit that mold except the US group.

From a geographical stand point Owen Sound and Barrie are more of a divisional rivalry than Erie on a season basis. According to sources out of Owen Sound it's not that "They were looking for No Overnight trips" just less of them to cut down on the spread of Covid-19 infection.

DeGray On Return To Play Interview with Attack manager Dale DeGray where he states limited number of overnight trips around 3:30 mark of the interview.

 

[Otto]

Close but I would put Owen Sound with Barrie and Missy. Oshawa back to the east. The rest looks good - did read they were looking for no "overnight trips" so this would fit that mold except the US group.

No worries.. i just did it up quick.. yours works better

 

[EvenSteven]

TEMPORARY COVID REALIGNMENT IDEAS

I am hijacking this thread for the purposes of suggesting temporary realignment for the 2020-2021 season, assuming the border remains closed to travel for the start of the season.

Here is a proposal, stolen from the Covid thread:

What other ideas do folks have?

I know they talked about clusters, but no need to only have 3 to 4 teams in each cluster if the main idea is to get everybody home after a game without having to stay in a hotel. The US and northern teams notwithstanding.

I would say that three hours max has to be the reasonable distance between cities in order to get a team there and back on game day.

The north and the US clusters are what they are, driving distance aside.

In these divisions, I am not taking into account any current division rivalries etc. This is going strictly by distance between cities.

US:
Erie
Sag
Flint

North:
Soo
Sud
NB

The driving distance between the furthest cities in the following divisions are under three hours. Sure these divisions are lopsided as far as amount of teams in each division, but I am ensuring three hours or less between cities.

West:
Win
Sar
Lon
Kit
Gue
Windsor to Guelph is about three hours.

Central:
Nia
Ham
Miss
OS
Bar
Osh
Owen Sound to St.Catharine’s is around three hours

East:
Ott
Pete
King
Peterboro to Ottawa is around three hours.

Adhering to my rule of three hours between cities, Oshawa and Ottawa are too far apart to be in the same division.


I understand the issue of staying in hotels overnight. In my job, I frequently stay in hotels across Ontario. The only issue for an OHL team would be cost.

Under regular circumstances, our crews have two employees to a room. Under today’s circumstances, we are now only allowed one person per room with the company eating cost. That would cost an OHL team a ton of money to put players in hotels if the same rules applied.

You’re looking at 21 or 22 players. Coaching staff. Training staff. That could get to almost 30 bodies. It’s easy to see why they don’t want to go through the cost/risk of staying in hotels.

 

[HockeyPops]

I liked the idea of smaller divisions because trying to keep social interactions down to smaller sized groups seems to be the direction public health has been leaning, ie. Max gathering size 50, teachers not moving between classrooms, and minor hockey max league size 50 participants.

 

[Millpond]

If the owners wanted to move they would have.

How many of you travel to watch your team on the road ?

How many road trips in a season ?

Would you go to more / less if there was re-alignment ?

 

[OSAttackFan88]

I like OS in the Midwest because I live in Port Dover and it’s more convenient to watch them when they play in London, Kitchener and Guelph. All under 90 min drives from my place. So that’s nice lol

 

[Otto]

Now we have 2 active threads on a subject that has beaten to death

 

[Hammer9001]

Now we have 2 active threads on a subject that has beaten to death

Not an attack on Millipond, and that he has a habit of doing this, more so recalling this.

Necromancer