Confirmed with Link: Rangers sign Daniel Paille

[offdacrossbar]

What about the first round has been failures? Bobby Sanguinetti is the only 1st rounder who is not an NHL player. Marc Staal was this team's best defensemen for awhile. Kreider, Mcilrath and Miller are all currently on the roster. Is every other first round pick by every other team elite talent 100% guaranteed? No? Oh, okay.



lol you just described every prospect pool in the NHL, great job. What about Duclair and Buchnevich? Cherepanov? DelZotto was even supposed to be a very talented PMD. Michael St. Croix was a very boom/bust pick skill pick. Grachev? Saarela this year. With the draft picks they've had, they've managed to draft guys with skill, the problem is when you aren't drafting them in the top-5, it's not likely they ever reach their potential in the NHL. Almost every team pumping out high end skill players are picking in the top 5-10.



Rick Nash? First overall, something the Rangers haven't had in a dillion years. ONE TIME EVER IN THEIR HISTORY.

Brassard? 6th overall. Al Montoya in 2004 was taken 6th. How many have they had since then?

Zuccarello? Undrafted. Rangers got a guy for free who is better than any of their draft picks. That's good scouting.

Yandle and Ryan McDonagh are the only 2 guys who are a top players on the team that the Rangers didn't draft and were not top draft talent well beyond the Rangers pick. Wow, so many!



They traded a lot of first rounders, that has nothing to do with bad drafting. They also haven't drafted in the top-10 but one time in 10 years, so what do you expect? Could the drafting have been better? Sure, but so could have every other teams. It's not the greatest, but nowhere near the "failure" you suggest it is.

Why don't you just say it, you're just mad the Rangers didn't use every draft pick in the first round to take high skill, high risk Russian talent because you are borderline obsessed with them and think every single one of them is going to be an elite NHL player. You hate the Mcilrath pick, you probably secretly hate Miller, Kreider, and Skjei too.

zuc
nash
mcdonagh
brass
hayes
yandle

those are 6 core guys that weren't nyr draft picks and they are 6 of our top 10 players.

our draft results in the last 5 years have not been anything close to "underrated"

this very site has us ranked at 27th with accolades like...

"The organization doesn't really have any potential top-pairing defenders outside of Brady Skjei"

"The Rangers will have a shortage of decent forward prospects, and it is a problem that will compound itself"

excuse me for not agreeing that our draft results have been "underrated". more like underperforming.

and to your last point highlighted above, oh yeah, i would have drafted tarasenko or kuznetsov over mcilrath 100 outa 100 times and i would have been right to do so. in this case, its pretty clear which teams made the proper call on that one.

 

[Edge]

I think the Rangers have done a good job drafting and/or acquiring young or younger talent that was still developing.

They'd produce a good selection of NHL players.

What they haven't really produced is a superstar.

That's probably the biggest challenge.

I don't think the Rangers current ranking is a result of their scouting and player development, it's a result of trading away picks and moving a guy like Duclair.

That's not really a drafting "issue" per say.

 

[The Gloaming]

Getting back to Paille, not really looking forward to seeing him and Glass together.

 

[offdacrossbar]

I think the Rangers have done a good job drafting and/or acquiring young or younger talent that was still developing.

They'd produce a good selection of NHL players.

What they haven't really produced is a superstar.

That's probably the biggest challenge.

I don't think the Rangers current ranking is a result of their scouting and player development, it's a result of trading away picks and moving a guy like Duclair.

That's not really a drafting "issue" per say.

i think if kreider had taken that step this season rather than regressing, and miller as well- from the beginning of the season and not just the last 2 weeks, i would be more inclined to agree.

while i want to believe we aren't that bad come draft day, i still have to look at reality.

kreider has regressed.
miller still isn't more than a 2/3 tweener.
mcilrath has played well but not enough and he's taken forever
skjei is just a maybe right now.
buchnevich looks promising
stepan looks more like a 3c than a 1c on many nights.

am i missing someone ?

maybe the not producing a superstar thing should read more like, they are too consistent in default drafting USA developmental program kids than they are european skill players.

weve skipped over so much talent to take "safer north american kids".

maybe thats the problem ?

 

[eco's bones]

i think if kreider had taken that step this season rather than regressing, and miller as well- from the beginning of the season and not just the last 2 weeks, i would be more inclined to agree.

while i want to believe we aren't that bad come draft day, i still have to look at reality.

kreider has regressed.
miller still isn't more than a 2/3 tweener.
mcilrath has played well but not enough and he's taken forever
skjei is just a maybe right now.
buchnevich looks promising
stepan looks more like a 3c than a 1c on many nights.

am i missing someone ?

maybe the not producing a superstar thing should read more like, they are too consistent in default drafting USA developmental program kids than they are european skill players.

weve skipped over so much talent to take "safer north american kids".

maybe thats the problem ?

There are signs that Kreider is picking up his game. Throughout his amateur and pro career he's typically been a lot stronger second half player than first half player and he usually carries that into the playoffs. Maybe that's why people are so excited to see him the next season--watching him towards the end of a season/playoffs and thinking he's on the verge of really exploding. IMO it may be he needs to get out of the starting gate a lot faster. It may be he never does. But if Chris is ever going to be a 30 goal 60 point guy he's going to need stronger starts.

 

[Jaromir Jagr]

zuc
nash
mcdonagh
brass
hayes
yandle

those are 6 core guys that weren't nyr draft picks and they are 6 of our top 10 players.

our draft results in the last 5 years have not been anything close to "underrated"

this very site has us ranked at 27th with accolades like...

"The organization doesn't really have any potential top-pairing defenders outside of Brady Skjei"

"The Rangers will have a shortage of decent forward prospects, and it is a problem that will compound itself"

excuse me for not agreeing that our draft results have been "underrated". more like underperforming.

and to your last point highlighted above, oh yeah, i would have drafted tarasenko or kuznetsov over mcilrath 100 outa 100 times and i would have been right to do so. in this case, its pretty clear which teams made the proper call on that one.

What site? And we have no idea what will become of McIlrath. You more than anyone don't, since you still don't recognize he's an NHL player.

Also those comments are relative to prospects. Nowhere does it say anything about our drafting. Does it have us ranked 27th in prospects or 27th in drafting?

Question, how did we acquire Yandle and Nash. Oh, that's right, with a bunch of crap draft picks we developed into talent that was worth top players.

Also Miller has been one of our most consistent forwards all year. Your assessment of him this season is poor to very poor. Thank god you're not drafting. We might have Tarasenko, but every other pick would be ****ed.

 

[Rangers in 7]

zuc
nash
mcdonagh
brass
hayes
yandle

those are 6 core guys that weren't nyr draft picks and they are 6 of our top 10 players.

our draft results in the last 5 years have not been anything close to "underrated"

this very site has us ranked at 27th with accolades like...

"The organization doesn't really have any potential top-pairing defenders outside of Brady Skjei"

"The Rangers will have a shortage of decent forward prospects, and it is a problem that will compound itself"

excuse me for not agreeing that our draft results have been "underrated". more like underperforming.

and to your last point highlighted above, oh yeah, i would have drafted tarasenko or kuznetsov over mcilrath 100 outa 100 times and i would have been right to do so. in this case, its pretty clear which teams made the proper call on that one.

I'd have to agree with you on this regardless of what others say. Those type of players that we passed on are game changers. The Rangers are great at drafting players after the 2nd round. For some reason when it comes to first round picks they miss most of the time.

 

[Jaromir Jagr]

I'd have to agree with you on this regardless of what others say. Those type of players that we passed on are game changers. The Rangers are great at drafting players after the 2nd round. For some reason when it comes to first round picks they miss most of the time.

What are you talking about? Every team passes on game changers in the first round. The Rangers have drafted quality NHL players in the first round almost every time since the Montoya pick (who is a quality backup now even so---obviously still a bad pick).

Staal
Del Zotto
Kreider
Miller
McIlrath
Skjei

Every single one of those players looks to be a quality NHL player either now or in the future. Your statement about them ****ing up the first round is asinine. In addition, if Miller continues to progress along with McIlrath, they are looking like 2 of the best picks in those entire first rounds.

 

[Rangers in 7]

What are you talking about? Every team passes on game changers in the first round. The Rangers have drafted quality NHL players in the first round almost every time since the Montoya pick (who is a quality backup now even so---obviously still a bad pick).

Staal
Del Zotto
Kreider
Miller
McIlrath
Skjei

Every single one of those players looks to be a quality NHL player either now or in the future. Your statement about them ****ing up the first round is asinine. In addition, if Miller continues to progress along with McIlrath, they are looking like 2 of the best picks in those entire first rounds.

Staal and DZ are average nhl players in my opinion. I wouldn't even give staal an average rating. Kreider has yet to develop into the player he can potentially be and continues to only show spurts of quality. I still think kreider can reach 30 goals a season but he goes missing for weeks at a time. Miller is the one player who if he continues to play well can reach his potential. mcilrath has taken forever to develop and while he has gotten better I still wouldn't draft him in the first round. I understand every team misses talented players. Not one of those first round picks you have mentioned have turned out to be stars

 

[Kokoschka]

Staal was well on his way to establish himself as a Top-20 defender before that freak injury occurred. He was this clubs best defender for two season. No way of seeing such things in advance. DZ is currently the best defender in Philly, not that that is saying a lot. As for Kreider, Miller and McI, I'd argue in all of those cases it's a bit early to judge.
Come to think of it not so much for Kreider, actually, I think at this point he is what he is. But I'm not ready to rule out the possibility of Miller being a Top-6er with a pretty amazing skill set who can play pretty much every situation and McI as a mainstay on anyone's Top-4. With the way things are going that season, I'd actually say they're headed in those directions.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Staal and DZ are average nhl players in my opinion. I wouldn't even give staal an average rating. Kreider has yet to develop into the player he can potentially be and continues to only show spurts of quality. I still think kreider can reach 30 goals a season but he goes missing for weeks at a time. Miller is the one player who if he continues to play well can reach his potential. mcilrath has taken forever to develop and while he has gotten better I still wouldn't draft him in the first round. I understand every team misses talented players. Not one of those first round picks you have mentioned have turned out to be stars

Laughable. Staal was a legitimate top pairing defenseman before his injury. What nonsense.

 

[SingnBluesOnBroadway]

Laughable. Staal was a legitimate top pairing defenseman before his injury. What nonsense.

Agreed. I also think he's still an above average NHL defender now even with his injuries.

 

[offdacrossbar]

staal was a 1st pair guy before he got injured.

hes not the same player today.

 

[offdacrossbar]

What site? And we have no idea what will become of McIlrath. You more than anyone don't, since you still don't recognize he's an NHL player.

Also those comments are relative to prospects. Nowhere does it say anything about our drafting. Does it have us ranked 27th in prospects or 27th in drafting?

Question, how did we acquire Yandle and Nash. Oh, that's right, with a bunch of crap draft picks we developed into talent that was worth top players.

Also Miller has been one of our most consistent forwards all year. Your assessment of him this season is poor to very poor. Thank god you're not drafting. We might have Tarasenko, but every other pick would be ****ed.

http://www.hockeysfuture.com/team-rankings/spring-team-rankings-2014-15/page/3

 

[haohmaru]

If you've played 200+ NHL games I'd say it was a successful pick regardless of what round you were taken in.

 

[Mac n Gs]

Laughable. Staal was a legitimate top pairing defenseman before his injury. What nonsense.

Seriously, Staal was a monster before his brother concussed him and that freakish puck to the eye. Staal was literally becoming one of the best defensive defenseman in the league.

FWIW, I think that we've drafted well with the picks we've had. The draft that hurt us the most was 2010 outside of the McIlrath pick. A lot of quality players went after the Thomas pick, Yogan had the potential to be a good AHL player, depth 4th line call up if needed, JASON ****ING WILSON right before John Klingberg (yet we still complain about McIlrath), but at least we got Fast in the 6th round. Imagine if we add Toffoli and Klingberg from that draft?

 

[Ail]

zuc
and to your last point highlighted above, oh yeah, i would have drafted tarasenko or kuznetsov over mcilrath 100 outa 100 times and i would have been right to do so. in this case, its pretty clear which teams made the proper call on that one.

Yeah okay and how many times would you have picked wrong? We've all suggested taking guys that would have been a better choice, but we would have all made mistakes as well. Would the fact that you took Kuznetsov or Tarasenko make up for the fact you probably would not have taken Derek Stepan? Would you have given Zuccarello a contract? What about the guys who were drafted and traded away who were essential to the 'Cup run or traded for players who were? Would you have picked Carl Hagelin or wasted that pick on some late draft mega bust with tons of skill and nothing else?

That's all without considering where and how guys like Miller, Kreider and Skjei will end up and how it will affect the future of this organization. Three guys you probably would not have drafted. It's so much easier to sit here in hindsight and look at all the home runs you would have hit without considering the total whiffs.

 

[Jaromir Jagr]

http://www.hockeysfuture.com/team-rankings/spring-team-rankings-2014-15/page/3

So this is exactly my point. Rankings of prospects and rankings of drafts are completely different things, especially since we're discussing it in a completely different context. This list is essentially due to the fact that we haven't had any top picks in years. All the guys prior to that are already on the NHL. Really this ranking isn't even remotely relative to the conversation.

A) it's ranking CURRENT prospects and not drafting (this would be based on your draft spots, no?)
B) it's ranking players that would have been drafted in the past 2-3 years, obviously most picks are in the NHL from 2004-2011/12 so it's not relative to our discussion

You can disagree with how we've traded away 100 top picks over the past few years, but that has absolutely no bearing on our scouting and drafting. They are two completely separate conversations. Our scouts can't do anything with picks they don't have. For the picks we have had, we've done a damn good job the past decade.

And please with the Staal comment. I hate that we signed him long-term, it was very clearly a mistake, but this guy was amazing to watch prior to his injurie(s)-concussion and eye. He was easily a top pairing D-Man and arguably a top 10 shutdown guy in the league. You may have missed those years though.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Since 2004

Now factor in where the Rangers are drafting on average, (not to mention the tragic loss of Cherepanov, and the cut-short career of Michael Sauer, stellar recent picks like Duclair/Buchnevich).

01 Washington - 1,102 goals
02 Chicago - 1,057 goals
03 Boston - 1,053 goals
04 Pittsburgh - 1,053 goals
05 Colorado - 966 goals
06 Montreal - 856 goals
07 NY Islanders - 824 goals
08 NY Rangers - 818 goals
09 Los Angeles - 800 goals
10 St. Louis - 800 goals
11 Arizona - 789 goals
12 Edmonton - 767 goals
13 Columbus - 687 goals
14 San Jose - 665 goals
15 Carolina - 638 goals
16 Ottawa - 636 goals
17 Detroit - 635 goals
18 Nashville - 631 goals
19 Buffalo - 610 goals
20 Dallas - 587 goals
21 Tampa - 558 goals
22 Anaheim - 550 goals
23 Florida - 503 goals
24 Toronto - 489 goals
25 Philadelphia 485 goals
26 Vancouver 484 goals
27 Minnesota - 440 goals
28 Winnipeg/Atlanta - 417 goals
29 New Jersey - 374 goals
30 Calgary - 299 goals

Terrific post Auf.

All those teams ahead of us in those standings had multiple top six picks since then. We haven't had a single top six pick since 2004.

 

[JohnC]

You may have missed those years though.

Likely too busy crying about Tarasenko

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

To be fair, I think a much better metric would be goals per Gp, not just straight goals. The Rangers have done a great job getting volume out of picks, I agree.

It's easy to sign a 10-20 goal guy to fill in lineup gaps, hard as hell to sign a 30+ goal guy.

That said, I 100% agree the Rangers drafting has been underrated. The amount of NHLers produced / number of available picks has to be up there post lockout.

It depends what you are measuring for.

Getting the 30+ goal scorers in much easier when you get lottery picks every season. When you aren't even drafting in the first round most seasons, getting NHL players is what you are trying for.

 

[Off Sides]

I guess the Rangers draft well, maybe management should find a way to get more picks instead of less?

 

[aufheben]

To be fair, I think a much better metric would be goals per Gp, not just straight goals. The Rangers have done a great job getting volume out of picks, I agree.

It's easy to sign a 10-20 goal guy to fill in lineup gaps, hard as hell to sign a 30+ goal guy.

That said, I 100% agree the Rangers drafting has been underrated. The amount of NHLers produced / number of available picks has to be up there post lockout.

Measuring games played would be just as significant, IMO. Maybe even more so, because several teams ahead of the Rangers are there because of drafting Hall of Famers with #1OA picks. Context is definitely necessary in that list. People can move the goal post from here to Switzerland, but the Rangers as a whole have been a good/very good drafting team over the last ~decade; that's not a debate.

 

[TheTakedown]

Looked good in his Debut tonight. Very quick on the puck, decent hands for a 4th liner, and a lot of speed. Reminded me of Etem with his stride.

 

[ashnathan]

You guys got a great guy. Fast, beast on the PK. But damn....those stone hands. He can be borderline infuriating at times but he will definitely help you guys out. I miss seeing his thunderous hits