OT: Raise the Jolly Roger: It's All Jordy Mercer/Clint Hurdle/Joakim Soria's Fault

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Cherpak

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Jan 1, 2014
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did you play a 162 game major league season? i mean cmon, i used to play college tennis but i have no idea what its like to be on the pro tour.

Nobody plays all 162 games. Players do need rest, but you also have to be smart and manage that rest appropriately. Starting two offensive black holes at the same time at a critical junction of the season was just piss poor management by Hurdle.
 

Mordax

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Sep 23, 2009
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And I think the 162 thing is overblown. In this situation, you win the division and you do everything to get 4 games. We have a young team. They can handle it.

Yup. It's crunch time, so why not lay all your cards on the table?

I mean, if they end up in the WC game and lose, they'll have plenty of time for rest...
 

cheesedanish87

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I hate to break it to the Pirates, but this rest thing isn't going to help them hit Arrieta any better in the playoffs.

The only thing they can do now to help themselves is win as many games as possible these final 3 weeks to hopefully catch the cards, or at least insure that the wildcard game is played at PNC.

And i don't think anybody would have a problem with the Pirates giving a player a rest every now and then, but you don't rest your players when your playing your biggest series of the year, you rest them when you play Milwaukee or Colorado.
 

cheesedanish87

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Kang isn't getting rested, hes getting benched for Jordy Mercer.

I don't think anybody would have a problem if Hurdle wanted to give Kang one day a week off, as long as it wasn't against teams like the Cubs and Cardinals.


I do think you can please everyone, if Hurdle approached these games like Maddon has nobody would of had a problem with it.

I guarantee you nobody in Chicago is complaing because Maddon played to many of his good players yesterday.

Do you think any Cubs fans are saying today i wish we would of rested Bryant and Rizzo yesterday?
 
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DJ Spinoza

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Aug 7, 2003
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The biggest problem as I see it is that Kang is getting benched too often, and seems to be slightly less effective when he isn't playing every day. It's hard to make absolute statements like that about him given that he's a rookie without a track record, and I fully believe that there are resting algorithmic reasons for the decision that go well-beyond Hurdle favoritism, but I still don't think it's the best decision.

Beyond that, I don't have much to say. Starting Florimon and Rodriguez is inexcusable, but Harrison isn't exactly a good defensive SS, and Lester would have owned Pedro. I think some of the problem is compounded by the fact that Marte is still somewhat hurt- otherwise in game 2, he could have started, with J Hay replacing Polanco, Ramirez at 1st, Kang at 3rd, and Mercer still at SS.

One thing that I think is a bit too much of a short circuit in terms of the Hurdle bashing is a simple preference for Mercer over Kang. The problem is also that Ramirez is getting an extra start or two per week. He's been a solid pickup but isn't as important to the lineup as Kang. Kang should maybe get a day off once a week, and more if they feel like they can squeeze another in, but I don't see any problem with preferring the best defensive SS on the team and having Ramirez on the bench one or two more games per week.

In any case, it's not really a disaster to split. Even splitting the next two is a fine result for us, while it's a bad one for the Cubs. Maybe Arrieta presses too much tonight and we take the third game, really putting pressure on them in tomorrow's game? I do think we probably need to win 3/4 to keep pace with the Cardinals, and was frustrated to see the lineup/result, but so far the results this week are fine.
 

Cherpak

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I can understand why they feel the need to rest Kang as much as they have been. The KBO season was 128 games until this year where it was moved up to 144 games. Since Kang hasn't played a full MLB season then sure you need to manage his amount of games. All most of us are asking is to manage it WISELY. Kang is very important to the success of the team and the way he is used should be more of a priority than a luxury.

Another thing that I can't seem to wrap my head around when it comes to Hurdle's decisions yesterday is that he rested Mercer in the second game against the left handed pitcher which he historically has much better numbers against. The way Hurdle made it seem yesterday was that he was intending to play Mercer in both games. Why play him in the first and rest him in the second if he wasn't intending to play him both games?
 
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DJ Spinoza

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Lineup for tonight is not too much of a surprise - Ramirez in at 1B for Pedro, and Kang at 3B. Righties actually hit Arrieta better than lefties, so those two doing some small damage behind Cutch might be the only chance we have against him. Or some combination of Marte, Ramirez, and Kang doing something to get us 2-3 runs, and Cole really stepping up.

I still haven't totally given up on the division, but we need to finish this week 4-1 I think, and the Brewers seem absolutely hopeless to win vs the Cardinals. Tonight is again the most important game for a variety of reasons, but looking ahead, Dodgers will be tough: Locke/Grienke, and we also face Kershaw, who has been totally lights out. He is susceptible to the long ball, but Kershaw/Liriano doesn't look like a great matchup on paper either. If my math is right, it will be Latos on Sunday.

My mind is working in a bit of overdrive because I won't be able to watch any games until Sunday, unless I have a sleepless night...
 

NewAgeOutlaw

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Well at least Kang is playing. Still don't like it one bit. Benching Alvarez and his 20+ home runs just so you can play Kang without sitting Mercer makes no sense. When the Pirates are using a gb pitcher, Hurdle emphasizes playing a good defensive lineup. So I ask: when the Bucs are facing an elite pitcher, why does Hurdle not try and play his absolute best offensive lineup? The Bucs offense is at it's best when they are hitting bombs, so why bench a guy with legit 30 hr power so a guy with 2 homers on the year can play against a cy young favorite?

Hurdle way way way overvalues defense. Great defense is meaningless if the team gets shut out.
 
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