Prospect Info: Quinn Hughes, Pt. IV

[Robongo01]

Nvm

 

[Josepho]

There's definitely an inch or two seperating them.

 

[iceburg]

IMO Quinn Hughes is ready for the NHL and size shouldn’t be an issue. For example Brad Marchand is 5’9 179 lbs, Quinn is 5’9 170 lbs (Jack Hughes is listed at 5’10 165 lbs), and Pettersson is 6’2 170 pounds. Pettersson is a lot more frail considering his height to weight ratio, whereas Quinn has a lower centre of gravity and is thicker, which should result in better lower body strength and much greater balance. When looking at all aspects of skating: acceleration, braking, speed, agility, edge work, pivots, lateral movement he is considered by many to be the best skater in all of hockey. He is NHL ready; currently trying to do too much in a league he is superior in, which could result in bad habits to creep in to his game.

I don't really like the Marchand comparison...his nasty side serves him very well in the NHL.
With Pettersson: 1. he dominated the SHL, and 2. no one expected him to be this good defensively.
I actually thought that one of the best signs recently for Hughes is that he fought. Not that he should fight but rather that he doesn't shy away when things get tough. Time will tell whether his transition is faster or slower. I just think, given what he has shown at the college level (or maybe more what he hasn't shown), expectations should be tempered a little. Again, I think we should expect that, over time, he will transition well and be a very good NHLer in the end, just not right away. I'll be pleasantly surprised if I'm wrong.

 

[Josepho]

I think comparing forwards to defencemen in this case is odd regardless.

 

[Melvin]

IMO Quinn Hughes is ready for the NHL and size shouldn’t be an issue. For example Brad Marchand is 5’9 179 lbs, Quinn is 5’9 170 lbs (Jack Hughes is listed at 5’10 165 lbs), and Pettersson is 6’2 170 pounds. Pettersson is a lot more frail considering his height to weight ratio, whereas Quinn has a lower centre of gravity and is thicker, which should result in better lower body strength and much greater balance. When looking at all aspects of skating: acceleration, braking, speed, agility, edge work, pivots, lateral movement he is considered by many to be the best skater in all of hockey. He is NHL ready; currently trying to do too much in a league he is superior in, which could result in bad habits to creep in to his game.

Defensemen are, on average, 2 inches taller than forwards. Being 5'8" for a defender is like being 5'6" for a forward.

The defenders to debut since 1990 who have been 5'9" and shorter, with a weight between 160 and 180 lbs are:

Jared Spurgeon
Torey Krug
Tom Pederson (240 NHL games)
Matt Grzelcyk (63)
Dave Warsofsky (55)
Dan Lambert (29)
Joe Hicketts (13)
Chay Genoway (1)

That's it. For the last ~30 years, those are his size peers.

Both Spurgeon and Krug were 21 by the time they were ready for the NHL. If he steps in as a 19 year old and is anything close to a star, it would be one of the most remarkable accomplishments in NHL history.

 

[Bertuzzzi44]

Defensemen are, on average, 2 inches taller than forwards. Being 5'8" for a defender is like being 5'6" for a forward.

The defenders to debut since 1990 who have been 5'9" and shorter, with a weight between 160 and 180 lbs are:

Jared Spurgeon
Torey Krug
Tom Pederson (240 NHL games)
Matt Grzelcyk (63)
Dave Warsofsky (55)
Dan Lambert (29)
Joe Hicketts (13)
Chay Genoway (1)

That's it. For the last ~30 years, those are his size peers.

Both Spurgeon and Krug were 21 by the time they were ready for the NHL. If he steps in as a 19 year old and is anything close to a star, it would be one of the most remarkable accomplishments in NHL history.

Was curious and did some digging, turns out Dman were/are on average taller, but only by an inch.

2005 - 2006
Dman Forward
73.9 72.9
211.6 203.4

2010 - 2011
Dman Forward
73.8 72.8
209.3 202.0

2014 - 2015
Dman Forward
73.8 72.7
205.0 199.2

2018 - 2019
Dman Forward
73.6 72.6
202.2 197.8
Dman 6’1.6 202.2
Forward 6’0.6 197.8

Biggest change is in Defenceman weight; teams probably trying to get quicker on the backend with how fast the game is now.

 

[Melvin]

Was curious and did some digging, turns out Dman were/are on average taller, but only by an inch.

2005 - 2006
Dman Forward
73.9 72.9
211.6 203.4

2010 - 2011
Dman Forward
73.8 72.8
209.3 202.0

2014 - 2015
Dman Forward
73.8 72.7
205.0 199.2

2018 - 2019
Dman Forward
73.6 72.6
202.2 197.8
Dman 6’1.6 202.2
Forward 6’0.6 197.8

OK, between 1 and 2 inches. Historically it was closer to 2 but it looks like the gap has narrowed some. Doesn't change my point.

By the way I would recommend doing a weighted average based upon games played. If you do that, it's closer to ~1.5 for the past few years

 

[Bertuzzzi44]

OK, between 1 and 2 inches. Historically it was closer to 2 but it looks like the gap has narrowed some. Doesn't change my point.

True. Just thought I’d share as it’s interesting to see how the league is trending over the years.

 

[Melvin]

True. Just thought I’d share as it’s interesting to see how the league is trending over the years.

Here's a graph.

Interestingly, the gap was narrowing and now has started to widen again as the average height of forwards has gone down while the average height of defenders has increased.

Not sure what it means, but it's interesting.

 

[Fatass]

Because it was a gross misuse of the term Generational

Why? No it’s not. It’s a Canuck’s fan board, and (as Canuck’s Fans) we are hopeful that Quinn Hughes will be a game changer like Pettersson is.
IMO Quinn Hughes has all the tools to be the next coming of Bobby Orr. Don’t you hope for that? If Quinn is that good, we will FINALLY win a Cup. How can any of that be bad, on a Canuck’s Fan board?
I don’t come here often, but each time I wonder if we are really Canuck’s fans. I accept I’m a crazy homer, who hates the other teams, but why do some of us here appear to hate our team? Don’t you want us to be good, and win a Cup?

 

[Elias GOATtersson]

There's definitely an inch or two seperating them.

I think that's just Jack being closer to the camera

 

[Ainec]

Why? No it’s not. It’s a Canuck’s fan board, and (as Canuck’s Fans) we are hopeful that Quinn Hughes will be a game changer like Pettersson is.
IMO Quinn Hughes has all the tools to be the next coming of Bobby Orr. Don’t you hope for that? If Quinn is that good, we will FINALLY win a Cup. How can any of that be bad, on a Canuck’s Fan board?
I don’t come here often, but each time I wonder if we are really Canuck’s fans. I accept I’m a crazy homer, who hates the other teams, but why do some of us here appear to hate our team? Don’t you want us to be good, and win a Cup?

they are being realistic instead of talking about bobby orr

 

[Laterade]

Why? No it’s not. It’s a Canuck’s fan board, and (as Canuck’s Fans) we are hopeful that Quinn Hughes will be a game changer like Pettersson is.
IMO Quinn Hughes has all the tools to be the next coming of Bobby Orr. Don’t you hope for that? If Quinn is that good, we will FINALLY win a Cup. How can any of that be bad, on a Canuck’s Fan board?
I don’t come here often, but each time I wonder if we are really Canuck’s fans. I accept I’m a crazy homer, who hates the other teams, but why do some of us here appear to hate our team? Don’t you want us to be good, and win a Cup?

It's safer to be pessimistic than optimistic if you're a Canucks fans because we've been burned a lot and often for the past 40+ years.

Being a homer is fine, but you have to have reasonable expectations. Quinn Hughes had more hype than Pettersson during the prospects training camp believe it or not.
So no one expected Pettersson to be as good as he is because we had reasonable expectations for him and it's great to see him exceed those expectations.

It's more fair to our fan base and Quinn Hughes if we all temper expectations and let him become his own player instead of crowning him to be the next Bobby Orr.

 

[Fatass]

they are being realistic instead of talking about bobby orr

What does being realistic have to do with being a fan? Clearly Hughes as all the tools to be a phenomenal player. Why not hope for that?
Do those same posters hope for Hughes to fail, so their predictions can be right? Do they love the team, or themselves?

 

[Fatass]

It's safer to be pessimistic than optimistic if you're a Canucks fans because we've been burned a lot and often for the past 40+ years.

Being a homer is fine, but you have to have reasonable expectations. Quinn Hughes had more hype than Pettersson during the prospects training camp believe it or not.
So no one expected Pettersson to be as good as he is because we had reasonable expectations for him and it's great to see him exceed those expectations.

It's more fair to our fan base and Quinn Hughes if we all temper expectations and let him become his own player instead of crowning him to be the next Bobby Orr.

In all our years as a team have we seen a defensive prospect that can skate, carry the puck, process the game, and be highly competitive like Hughes? He’s not like we’ve seen here before. I think our expectations should be off the charts with this guy.

 

[CherryToke]

It's safer to be pessimistic than optimistic if you're a Canucks fans because we've been burned a lot and often for the past 40+ years.

It's not pessimism though. Calling him the next Yannick Weber would be pessimistic.

labeling him the next Bobby Orr or generational is delusional.

 

[JT Milker]

Having concerns you document about a player is not ‘bias’.

Hughes - more than maybe any player I’ve ever seen - plays a game that is tailor-made for 4-minute YouTube compilations and Twitter highlights. He does one thing exceedingly well and looks great doing it.

He’s also going to be the smallest defender in the NHL at a position where size does matter (a bit, still) and is bleeding goals in the NCAA.

I’ve said this a few times, but I’m flabbergasted at the level of angst about Pettersson’s weight when he was a forward destroying a men’s league versus the total confidence that this 160 lb pipsqueak struggling defensively in college will step into the NHL as an impact player.

I think he’ll be a good player eventually in the Krug/Barrie mold. But I think some of the hype isn’t grounded in reality.

Absolutely the hype is over the top, but I don't think it's unreasonable to state that you have never been a fan of this player and really haven't ever said much positive about him. IIRC, you said he "scared the crap out of you" or something to that effect back at the draft. And that's fine, we all have biases about certain players, just something to recognize.

 

[Disappointed EP40]

Absolutely the hype is over the top, but I don't think it's unreasonable to state that you have never been a fan of this player and really haven't ever said much positive about him. IIRC, you said he "scared the crap out of you" or something to that effect back at the draft. And that's fine, we all have biases about certain players, just something to recognize.

Dismissing MS's worries as "bias" is unreasonable though.

I also have reserved my expectations for Hughes until I see him play in a pro league. It would not shock me to see him peak as a roving 2nd pairing offensive dman that struggles in his own zone.

This is a world where Pouliot was praised for his impeccable passing and responsibility in his own zone prior to the NHL. (this is NOT a Pouliot comparison -- this is a statement that the jump to the NHL for defenseman specifically is a large one. Especially without pro experience yet.)

 

[polarbearcub]

 

[GetFocht]

looks like hes been working on his shot

 

[GetFocht]

Beauty of an assist too, WOW

 

[JT Milker]

Dismissing MS's worries as "bias" is unreasonable though.

I also have reserved my expectations for Hughes until I see him play in a pro league. It would not shock me to see him peak as a roving 2nd pairing offensive dman that struggles in his own zone.

This is a world where Pouliot was praised for his impeccable passing and responsibility in his own zone prior to the NHL. (this is NOT a Pouliot comparison -- this is a statement that the jump to the NHL for defenseman specifically is a large one. Especially without pro experience yet.)

In no way am I dismissing his worries, I have a ton of respect for his opinion. I’m definitely discounting it though.

 

[Zombotron]

 

[DownGoesMcDavid]

Having a generational night tnt is Quinn Hughes

 

[Motte and Bailey]

Hughes should be a Hobey Baker finalist but he won’t because the NCAA selection process is an embarrassment