GDT: Preseason Game 4: Sabres at Penguins 7 PM

[Dubi Doo]

It's who he is... if he keeps putting up 45 plus goals it's fine...but its not ideal


I don't think so, Tage

He can still grow in that regard. Claiming he's a finished product like you said earlier in the thread is a hot take.

Likely seven non-roster forwards and five non-roster defensemen skated Sid, Geno, most of the Pens top 9 and EK and Letang to a one-goal game late. Some good stuff out of Benson with Thompson again, loving the added dimension out of Ryan Johnson's game and the continued offensive thrust to Novikov. Not a lot of differentiation for some, think the AHL cuts will be easier than I would like regarding Kozak and Cederqvist. Oh well, plenty of time yet for both.

I was paying a lot of attention to Comrie, and he did not disappoint. It's only preseason, but that was good to see.

 

[Beerz]

This thread is bananas. Tage Thompson truthers. I had no idea you existed. Oh, if I could turn back time...

Nobody said he sucked. Pointing out his flaws and what people would like to see out of him like any other player does not make one a "conspiracy theorist" or a "whiner".

Everybody that has pointed out something about Tage has made a post about his play and what they have seen and would like to see.

The people that disagree or don't like it have gone after the Posters not the Post with Mod approval apparently with a stamp of approval using the "" emoji.

 

[Beerz]

He can still grow in that regard. Claiming he's a finished product like you said earlier in the thread is a hot take.


I was paying a lot of attention to Comrie, and he did not disappoint. It's only preseason, but that was good to see.

I hope he does grow... because putting up 40 plus goals every year is hard!

 

[OkimLom]

Nobody said he sucked. Pointing out his flaws and what people would like to see out of him like any other player does not make one a "conspiracy theorist" or a "whiner".

Everybody that has pointed out something about Tage has made a post about his play and what they have seen and would like to see.

The people that disagree or don't like it have gone after the Posters not the Post with Mod approval apparently with a stamp of approval using the "" emoji.

It’s pretty clear what your mistake was. You were critical of a player that was on the do not criticize list. You are only allowed to be critical of the pre-approved list of criticized players. Currently this includes: VO.

 

[truthbluth]

It’s pretty clear what your mistake was. You were critical of a player that was on the do not criticize list. You are only allowed to be critical of the pre-approved list of criticized players. Currently this includes: VO.

That's pretty unfair. I'm often critical of Sabres players and I think TT has quite a few flaws in the D zone. But someone said he had "bottom tier hockey sense" which is quite the fiery take. The more people pushed back, the more others dug in. It's just a very wierd takeaway from a few preseason games that the Sabres may not be contenders because of Tage Thompson.

 

[Chainshot]

This is where I’m at. He’s a force offensively, but I’m not 100% confident in him being the 1C you want trying to become a perennial contender. He’s gotta get better in other areas and that’s what I’ll be looking for this season. Shit even Eichel had to get better defensively and was able to be a 1C on a cup winner.

Tage needs to learn to use that reach to disrupt more plays and but also needs to play quicker and more decisively in tight games. I’m not talking about tonight, it is just preseason but this goes back to the end of last season where he slowed down considerably.

His defensive game is one of the biggest opportunities for growth and improvement 5-on-5 as a whole.

 

[HOOats]

It’s pretty clear what your mistake was. You were critical of a player that was on the do not criticize list. You are only allowed to be critical of the pre-approved list of criticized players. Currently this includes: VO.

No, it was saying that a player who has assembled, organized, and proven highly effective one of the most rare and challenging collections of "tools" in hockey history, has "no toolbox." If he meant to say "Tage's all-around game still needs work," there would have been zero push back, but that's not what happened. Players with "no toolbox" crash out of professional sports because they cannot access their "tools" to be productive enough to provide value.

The people that disagree or don't like it have gone after the Posters not the Post with Mod approval apparently with a stamp of approval using the "" emoji.

Critique of critique is... critique. It's literally the thing that we're doing here. If you didn't expect some razzing for dogging a star player for a few lackadaisical plays in the preseason, we might just not be on the same page.

 

[Sabreality]

a lot of people forgot to take the preseason pledge again...happened with the Bills too.

 

[GrierIsGod123]

That's pretty unfair. I'm often critical of Sabres players and I think TT has quite a few flaws in the D zone. But someone said he had "bottom tier hockey sense" which is quite the fiery take. The more people pushed back, the more others dug in. It's just a very wierd takeaway from a few preseason games that the Sabres may not be contenders because of Tage Thompson.

I stand by my comment that Tage has lower end hockey sense ... especially in the defensive zone. He's a physical beast and has learned to use his talent to overcome a lot of his shortcomings. He's a fantastic player and we're lucky he's turned out as good as he has, especially as a Center.

However, we're trying to project out to a cup contender and that's where my concern comes in. He's our #1 Center which is possibly the most important role on a contender. It's not out of the realm of possibility that he significantly improves his d-zone play, faceoffs and situational awareness and I'll gladly shut up. But all I'm saying is this is where I want to see improvement this year. He doesn't need to be Bergeron or Barkov, but I think you could point to Eichel's 2-way improvement as something Tage could achieve. It might be tough with Skinner on his line as you're likely not teaching that old dog new tricks. However we need to get Tage to be at least competent in his own end as we move into our true contention window here (Next 2-5 years with so many cheap contracts).

All this could be said about Cozens as well. He's a physical specimen, great skater/shooter and a hard nosed player but lacks a little bit in terms on hockey IQ (imo of course). If they both make strides and their brains catch up to their physical talent watch out. I think giving them each a solid 2-way/high IQ winger will help as well. With a better d-core and goaltending we're quite easily a playoff team this year even with a bit of regression to the mean on the offensive/goals side.

 

[Kulich Man]

Knee-jerk reactions in game threads are no big deal,

...Except for the guy who saw Power make one oopsie the night before and immediately clamored for a bridge deal. THAT guy needs to chill.

 

[lecherous]

You guys have covered a lot already (JJ, Benson, Kulich all looked great) but you know 20-30 games into the season we're gonna inevitably have some injuries and just need some depth to come up. Biro and Cederqvist definitely look like solid fill-in options to have down in the AHL that can step in and pick up 12-15 mins when needed. Little things like that can make a big difference down the stretch - we all know we have the skill guys but we might need another couple extra screws and dowels to build the IKEA furniture, you know?

 

[Matt Ress]

I stand by my comment that Tage has lower end hockey sense ... especially in the defensive zone. He's a physical beast and has learned to use his talent to overcome a lot of his shortcomings. He's a fantastic player and we're lucky he's turned out as good as he has, especially as a Center.

However, we're trying to project out to a cup contender and that's where my concern comes in. He's our #1 Center which is possibly the most important role on a contender. It's not out of the realm of possibility that he significantly improves his d-zone play, faceoffs and situational awareness and I'll gladly shut up. But all I'm saying is this is where I want to see improvement this year. He doesn't need to be Bergeron or Barkov, but I think you could point to Eichel's 2-way improvement as something Tage could achieve. It might be tough with Skinner on his line as you're likely not teaching that old dog new tricks. However we need to get Tage to be at least competent in his own end as we move into our true contention window here (Next 2-5 years with so many cheap contracts).

All this could be said about Cozens as well. He's a physical specimen, great skater/shooter and a hard nosed player but lacks a little bit in terms on hockey IQ (imo of course). If they both make strides and their brains catch up to their physical talent watch out. I think giving them each a solid 2-way/high IQ winger will help as well. With a better d-core and goaltending we're quite easily a playoff team this year even with a bit of regression to the mean on the offensive/goals side.

Idk man. I think we have to be careful conflating defensive IQ with just maybe leaving the zone a little early or being ready to push up ice. They just haven't necessarily prioritized d zone play in return for moving up ice. I'm assuming you're using more than his last 2 preseason games as a sample.

 

[debaser66]

We need like a 800 million dollar renovation

Drill that well Terry

 

[Aladyyn]

If this guy can be the best player on a Cup winning team over the course of the playoffs I don't see why Tage cannot

 

[GrierIsGod123]

Idk man. I think we have to be careful conflating defensive IQ with just maybe leaving the zone a little early or being ready to push up ice. They just haven't necessarily prioritized d zone play in return for moving up ice. I'm assuming you're using more than his last 2 preseason games as a sample.

Far more than the last 2 preseason games ... it's just a point of discussion going into a big year for the team. I think Tage has huge potential to be a takeaway king in this league. His long reach can be used as an advantage in all areas more effectively. Just become harder to play against which I think he has in him. He was absolutely electric last year, but still left me wanting a bit more overall. I guess I'm spoiled.

I don't disagree that this is partially on the system/coaching the Sabres have been playing. The coaching staff has the challenge of getting these guys to tighten up just a bit, without sacrificing all of their offense. We don't need a Ralph Krueger system, just something in the middle while remaining aggressive.

Again, if our d-core becomes more steady and we get better goaltending it may not matter much. I can't see us being worse with the additions, as well as the subtractions from the starting lineup. If you can recall, we had Boosh (while injured), Fitzgerald, Clague and Bryson playing a good portion of games and sometimes all of them. That's four #7 or worse level guys playing. I'm very optimistic that addition by subtraction will make us much more difficult to beat when healthy. A third pairing that doesn't get run over every night will be huge for shift to shift momentum. Having guys like Ryan Johnson and Nikita Novikov in the wings will help during injuries.

 

[GrierIsGod123]

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If this guy can be the best player on a Cup winning team over the course of the playoffs I don't see why Tage cannot

That's a pretty good comparison. It's not impossible especially if we overwhelm teams with our depth, but we need some of the forwards on this team to get better on the defensive side if we want to sniff a cup.

 

[BuffaloMango]

All this could be said about Cozens as well. He's a physical specimen, great skater/shooter and a hard nosed player but lacks a little bit in terms on hockey IQ (imo of course). If they both make strides and their brains catch up to their physical talent watch out. I think giving them each a solid 2-way/high IQ winger will help as well. With a better d-core and goaltending we're quite easily a playoff team this year even with a bit of regression to the mean on the offensive/goals side.

This is why I thought Greenway - Cozens - Thompson was an effective line last year. If Greenway can find some explosiveness and speed this year and have a bit of a rebirth, I still think that is an advantageous pairing. At least situationally.

 

[Chainshot]

Having growth out of their number one and number two centers in regards to making sure they are conscientiously on the right side of the puck would go far in cutting down on goals against and chances against. And that isn’t going to cut into their offensive production. They will actually have the puck more often and be able to get on the attack. It’s taking the extra step or two into their own zone, the churn and burn that comes from being committed to that sort of game. If they do that, we won’t need to lament, wanting some mythical third line, shut down virtuoso, we will be witnessing that out of the guys getting the lion’s share of the ice time.

 

[GrierIsGod123]

This is why I thought Greenway - Cozens - Thompson was an effective line last year. If Greenway can find some explosiveness and speed this year and have a bit of a rebirth, I still think that is an advantageous pairing. At least situationally.

It'll be really interesting to see if Granato puts Mitts up in the lineup in the coming games. He seemed very open to the idea. I think Mitts needs a guy like Tuch on his line, but then again who doesn't ?

I'm fine with stacking the top 6 until Quinn returns. Then you can see who's working well together and who isn't and make changes accordingly. I think we're resigned to a mediocre third line for now as there's just no way to construct one that looks good on paper.

 

[Aladyyn]

That's a pretty good comparison. It's not impossible especially if we overwhelm teams with our depth, but we need some of the forwards on this team to get better on the defensive side if we want to sniff a cup.

Yep, the Capitals were a top team despite being mostly below average until Trotz implemented a stronger defensive system but even then they were 27th in 5on5 defense and 15th in goals allowed overall in the Cup winning season

 

[BuffaloMango]

It'll be really interesting to see if Granato puts Mitts up in the lineup in the coming games. He seemed very open to the idea. I think Mitts needs a guy like Tuch on his line, but then again who doesn't ?

I'm fine with stacking the top 6 until Quinn returns. Then you can see who's working well together and who isn't and make changes accordingly. I think we're resigned to a mediocre third line for now as there's just no way to construct one that looks good on paper.

I think Mitts adds some fiestiness to the top line. I am not saying his better than Tage but he adds some value Tage doesn't.

I think there were a lot of things at play last year, the big big ones were age and depth. But I also think our lines are set up as "all or nothing". Skinner - Tage - Tuch is our best scoring line. Sure, but it leaves us vulnerable elsewhere. Greenway didn't do a ton to impress last year, but he is going to be total trash with Jost all the time. Sometimes I am not sure if we don't have the players or if we just choose to either put together lines that are either 200mph or driving through school zone.

 

[Push Dr Tracksuit]

Idk man. I think we have to be careful conflating defensive IQ with just maybe leaving the zone a little early or being ready to push up ice. They just haven't necessarily prioritized d zone play in return for moving up ice. I'm assuming you're using more than his last 2 preseason games as a sample.

We have to be careful conflating someone in a preseason game that barely resembled hockey with who a player is.

 

[debaser66]

AI is so weird

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I thought for a second thats a new advert for the next Shoersy season

 

[NotABadPeriod]

I think Mitts adds some fiestiness to the top line. I am not saying his better than Tage but he adds some value Tage doesn't.

I think there were a lot of things at play last year, the big big ones were age and depth. But I also think our lines are set up as "all or nothing". Skinner - Tage - Tuch is our best scoring line. Sure, but it leaves us vulnerable elsewhere. Greenway didn't do a ton to impress last year, but he is going to be total trash with Jost all the time. Sometimes I am not sure if we don't have the players or if we just choose to either put together lines that are either 200mph or driving through school zone.

Based on current practice lines, I think Granato agrees that the lines need balance. He's got:

Skinner-Thompson-Benson
Greenway-Mittelstadt-Tuch
Peterka-Cozens-Olofsson
Girgensons-Krebs-Okposo

Leaving Jost as an extra (expecting Rousek/Biro going down to Rochester).

If Benson actually plays well in the 9 games...and if Greenway can provide value next to Mitts...the only question is whether VO bogs down the Cozens line too much or if he can be adequate enough.

 

[Matt Ress]

Yep, the Capitals were a top team despite being mostly below average until Trotz implemented a stronger defensive system but even then they were 27th in 5on5 defense and 15th in goals allowed overall in the Cup winning season

We've got some great talent but we don't have one of the best goal scorers of all time. I agree with your bigger point though, if they play decent defense they will probably be able to outscore most.

We have to be careful conflating someone in a preseason game that barely resembled hockey with who a player is.

For sure. I was trying to be a little softer with the rebuttal.