Proposal: Preds - Leafs

[GeauxPreds1]

Now... next year if Ellis doesn't extend and goes UFA... the year after if Seattle expansion occurs... if it's not literally "inevitable", it does at least seem highly likely that it's going to come. Even with Hamhuis I'm not confident in our D today without Ellis. But who knows. In two years, maybe Fabbro willl have stepped up. But who knows. I can see the value in the debate, anyway! I'd end up standing pat today. But that could turn out to be the wrong decision, for sure.

We already proved that we can still be a top team without Ellis.. if we can't come up with some kind of cap friendly contract for him before camp or maybe even if they do sign him. poile needs to look to trade him. You don't allow a player of his caliber to walk without getting anything. I don't know if Toronto would even be interested but if an extended Ellis with an reasonably cap hit plus gets trade talk going for nylander you do it. Nylander in my opinion will be close to a ppg player in a couple years

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

We already proved that we can still be a top team without Ellis.. if we can't come up with some kind of cap friendly contract for him before camp or maybe even if they do sign him. poile needs to look to trade him. You don't allow a player of his caliber to walk without getting anything. I don't know if Toronto would even be interested but if an extended Ellis with an reasonably cap hit plus gets trade talk going for nylander you do it. Nylander in my opinion will be close to a ppg player in a couple years

Anyway, Nylander is an excellent young player and more than worthy return, on that side of things I certainly agree. Can we still be a top team without Ellis... I don't know. We were bounced in the 2nd round and looked miserable in the playoffs this past season... without him. Probably they can still be good with or without him. I still want to see the current group get another kick at the can to make things right, though. But that's just me.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

Nylander would go along way in helping with our biggest need in my opinion RW Depth. Not sure if Nylander + Zaitsev + 1st would make me move Subban. I would rather move Ellis and keep big three defenseman together and add help up front.

To address a Subban trade I would want Liljigren in my return.

That works for me. I'd rather the leafs trade for Ellis than Subban

 

[predfan24]

Anyway, Nylander is an excellent young player and more than worthy return, on that side of things I certainly agree. Can we still be a top team without Ellis... I don't know. We were bounced in the 2nd round and looked miserable in the playoffs this past season... without him. Probably they can still be good with or without him. I still want to see the current group get another kick at the can to make things right, though. But that's just me.

I want to see the group get another shot as well. The problem with Ellis is if you let him play out the season without a new contract we will have another Hamhuis/Suter situation on our hands. Losing a top pair D for nothing.

I think the Preds would be smart in the next season or two to trade one of their top 4 for an offensive player. Sometimes I feel having so many great D-men can be a detriment. It's the law of diminishing returns. Having one nice car is awesome. Having two nice cars is great! When I get to 3, 4, 5.....what the hell am I supposed to do with all these cars? lol

Balancing out the team a little more would be great. The key is to do it in a way that maximizes value and leaves the defense in the best possible shape. IMO, a sign and trade involving Ellis might be an answer.

 

[GeauxPreds1]

I want to see the group get another shot as well. The problem with Ellis is if you let him play out the season without a new contract we will have another Hamhuis/Suter situation on our hands. Losing a top pair D for nothing.

I think the Preds would be smart in the next season or two to trade one of their top 4 for an offensive player. Sometimes I feel having so many great D-men can be a detriment. It's the law of diminishing returns. Having one nice car is awesome. Having two nice cars is great! When I get to 3, 4, 5.....what the hell am I supposed to do with all these cars? lol

Balancing out the team a little more would be great. The key is to do it in a way that maximizes value and leaves the defense in the best possible shape. IMO, a sign and trade involving Ellis might be an answer.

I agree. And it's not because I don't like Ellis or think he's a bad defenseman. But out of the top 4 I think he's the most expendable. Unless he signs a contract 6 year 3.5 million then it becomes ekholm. I just this is the time you can sell high on Ellis. Ellis+ for Nylander would be ideal

 

[Armourboy]

I'm just not sold that Nylander is the right guy. Yeah he is solid in the regular season, but his reaction to physical playoff hockey would scare me a bit. We have enough of that type of player as it is.

 

[BigFatCat999]

Sadly, it's a combat of what Preds fans wants/expectations vs Leafs fans wants/expectations.

Preds fans want a Hornqvist style RW back. Someone gritty to park in front of the net.

Leafs fans want a superstar RHD

If there was a way to do a 3 way between the Preds/Leafs/Flyers where Ellis goes to Toronto, W. Simmonds goes to Nashville and the Flyers get what they need.

 

[Starat327]

Sadly, it's a combat of what Preds fans wants/expectations vs Leafs fans wants/expectations.

Preds fans want a Hornqvist style RW back. Someone gritty to park in front of the net.

Leafs fans want a superstar RHD

If there was a way to do a 3 way between the Preds/Leafs/Flyers where Ellis goes to Toronto, W. Simmonds goes to Nashville and the Flyers get what they need.

Brown and Nashville's first. Leafs probably have to send something to nashville though.

 

[zeke]

I'm not giving up Nylander alone for the Preds $9m #3 dman's down years.

 

[zeke]

A 60 point 22 year old winger/center would never be useless. It doesn't matter what tolvenen does. If Nashville could get a player like nylander for Ellis plus they should do it real quick. I'd do it even with an good extension

Leafs aren't trading Nylander for your #4 dman, either.

 

[GeauxPreds1]

I'm not giving up Nylander alone for the Preds $9m #3 dman's down years.

Down years? Your hate for subban is showing man.

 

[Starat327]

Leafs aren't trading Nylander for your #4 dman, either.

That #4 d-man would arguably be your number 1, but yeah, keep throwing position on one team around as if it means absolutely anything. Guess nobody would want the Leafs 2nd best center either, right?

 

[Jumptheshark]

Nylander + Zaitsev/Gardiner + 2019 1st for Subban

Even? What needs to be changed?

Just wow

 

[Jumptheshark]

Nylander + Zaitsev/Gardiner + 2019 1st for Subban

Even? What needs to be changed?

Z'd has no value right now

 

[Halla]

Nylander + Zaitsev/Gardiner + 2019 1st for Subban

Even? What needs to be changed?

not a chance do the leafs do nylander + gardiner + 1st

zaitsev maybe if they don't believe he can turn it around. Im not ready to throw the guy under the bus for a bad 20-25 games after coming back from injury though

 

[Halla]

Compared to Subban? Yeah

Gardiner had 52pt last year....to say he is a scrap is just ignorant

"compared to subban, yeah"

still ignorant. try watching a leafs game next year

 

[PerdFan]

Leafs aren't trading Nylander for your #4 dman,

Subban a #3 and Ellis a #4
OMG that was good. Thanks for the lulz.

 

[BigFatCat999]

Subban a #3 and Ellis a #4
OMG that was good. Thanks for the lulz.

This is the same guy who thinks ALL 1st round draft picks are the same.

 

[Starat327]

This is the same guy who thinks ALL 1st round draft picks are the same.

Same guy who was adamant last year that it was provorov + for nylander, and even then he wasn't sure if hed do it.

 

[ShortSideFlick]

Both teams are trying to contend now and neither team needs a shake up. Therefore neither team is likely to part with a core player. Nashville is a more mature team and the Leafs are just entering their window. If NSH and TOR were to trade it would make a lot more sense for the Leafs to target a guy like Fabbro who is max one more season away and fits their long term window. He'd absolutely warrant a decent return but it would far more palatable for leafs fans. Not sure if he'd be available or not but it's a safe bet he's far more expendable than Subban.

-Dubas just got Tavares to sign by promising he could keep their main cast in the fold. Nylander, Marner, etc. aren't going anywhere, at least for now.

-Subban isn't over the hill or anything, but realistically IF the leafs were going to part with any of their top guys for a D man if would be someone younger whose age is more in line with the bulk of their core. This early into being a contender with that young of a core the Leafs aren't about to trade a guy who lines up with their entire window for a guy who lines up with part of their window. That's a shortsighted move for a team that looks like it could be a contender for a decade or so. It doesn't match Dubas and Co's MO.

-The only way NSH is trading Subban right now is if there's some friction behind the scenes (not implying there is). If that were the case (it's not as far as I'm aware) TOR wouldn't be parting with any "gud young pros" and "gud people" to bring locker room drama into their young team, no matter the talent. Since it's likely not the case, NSH won't be trading him. pretty simple...

The question of what pieces are fair or ridiculous in such a scenario pretty much instantly becomes which players are trash and overrated. No need for a pissing contest...

 

[Viqsi]

Elite D's are not worth trading for.

Worked out for Columbus. Of course, we had to give up our #1C to do it.

That said, I'm pretty sure the Leafs don't necessarily have to swing for the fences like that to get a sufficiently substantial improvement. Rielly can carry the top pairing so long as he's got someone reasonably competent, IMO.

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I think the difference between Gardiner and Zaitsev is a wide margin. And if we're to lose subban we would need him replaced with a rhd which is Zaitsev. And I don't think the 1st helps Nashville because we're in win now mode. So hypothetically if we were to trade subban I would want more offense. I like nylander and I think he's a stud and will only grow and get better but I would want another able body with forward help if our defense is taking that much of a hit.
So Nylander, Zaitsev and Kadri for Subban and bonino would be my counter. I know this isn't going to happen but hypothetically this would be my counter

...yeah, that underrates Kadri just a teensy tiny bit. Seriously, he'd almost certainly displace Turris as #2C and could take a shot at Joey's job on the top line.

* * *​

Sadly, it's a combat of what Preds fans wants/expectations vs Leafs fans wants/expectations.

Preds fans want a Hornqvist style RW back. Someone gritty to park in front of the net.

Leafs fans want a superstar RHD

If there was a way to do a 3 way between the Preds/Leafs/Flyers where Ellis goes to Toronto, W. Simmonds goes to Nashville and the Flyers get what they need.

Ellis for Simmonds would make me cry. Simmonds is good now, but he's on the downward arc of his career and will be looking for significant cash for his next contract - that last, frankly, is just about the only reason why Philly would be willing to trade him.