Speculation: [POOL'S CLOSED] Trade & Free Agency Talk XXXI

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nickschultzfan

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I can even see Fenton going further and shipping out good young players like Greenway, Kunin, Belpedio, etc. to bring in Kessel with Malkin (with cap dumps going the other way).

Exact wrong direction IMO, but I have changed my thinking after watching the Granlund, Coyle, and Nino trades, and rumored Zucker, Brodin, and JEE shopping. And Staal re-signing.

Fenton seems like he wants an entirely new group of younger players and happy to have vets continue to carry the team in the short-term.
 

Bazeek

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I tend to agree, but Fenton clearly does not value Fletcher era players and I can see him doing this to show Leopold that he is serious about winning while protecting Fenton's new players and picks.

I can even see Fenton going further and shipping out good young players like Greenway, Kunin, Belpedio, etc. to bring in Kessel with Malkin (with cap dumps going the other way).

Exact wrong direction IMO, but I have changed my thinking after watching the Granlund, Coyle, and Nino trades, and rumored Zucker, Brodin, and JEE shopping.
He's already got the job and has only been at it for a year. Spending the last few months saying that he wants to get younger and faster, making trades that support that, then turning around to trade everyone for Kessel and Malkin to prove something to Leipold (who has a history of giving his GM's a lot of time to operate) doesn't really jive.
 
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AKL

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I can see Fenton going full in on Malkin.

Spurgeon
Zucker
JEE

Is better than 95 percent of the league can offer for a tier 1, but 33 year old, often injured center.

Probably will not be the top offer, and losing Spurgeon may do more damage than help, but I think Fenton will have the conversation and then look to flip Brodin and some other Fletcher guy for a bottom-4 RHD.

I’m trying to figure out why Pittsburgh would do this.
 

AKL

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I can even see Fenton going further and shipping out good young players like Greenway, Kunin, Belpedio, etc. to bring in Kessel with Malkin (with cap dumps going the other way).

Exact wrong direction IMO, but I have changed my thinking after watching the Granlund, Coyle, and Nino trades, and rumored Zucker, Brodin, and JEE shopping. And Staal re-signing.

Fenton seems like he wants an entirely new group of younger players and happy to have vets continue to carry the team in the short-term.

How do you get the idea that Fenton would sell the farm for Malkin and Kessel after he’s stated (and supported through action) that his goal is to get younger?
 

nickschultzfan

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He's already got the job and has only been at it for a year. Spending the last few months saying that he wants to get younger and faster, making trades that support that, then turning around to trade everyone for Kessel and Malkin to prove something to Leipold (who has a history of giving his GM's a lot of time to operate) doesn't really jive.
Correct, if we were applying normal logic.

But Fenton said the Wild are getting younger and faster while bringing in Rask and Pateryn, not trading Staal at deadline and re-signing him, and almost trading Zucker for pure vet cap dump. He also failed to ask for an add on in the Granlund trade.
 

Bazeek

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Correct, if we were applying normal logic.

But Fenton said the Wild are getting younger and faster while bringing in Rask and Pateryn, not trading Staal at deadline and re-signing him, and almost trading Zucker for pure vet cap dump. He also failed to ask for an add on in the Granlund trade.
Strictly speaking Rask's younger than Nino, and Pateryn's 5 years younger than Prosser. So even there we got younger. The main piece coming back for Zucker is presumed to have been the pick and Fiala's obviously younger than Granlund, pick or not.

Keeping Staal's the only move that doesn't fit, but we're talking about a pattern not a dogma. The fact remains that Fenton has yet to make a trade or signing that replaces a younger player with an older one. I think that'll change a little once we hit the free agency period, but targeting guys like that in trades just doesn't track for me.
 

AKL

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Correct, if we were applying normal logic.

But Fenton said the Wild are getting younger and faster while bringing in Rask and Pateryn, not trading Staal at deadline and re-signing him, and almost trading Zucker for pure vet cap dump. He also failed to ask for an add on in the Granlund trade.

That pure vet cap dump actually paced for the same number of points as Zucker btw.

Bet you feel pretty dumb now.
 

2Pair

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Correct, if we were applying normal logic.

But Fenton said the Wild are getting younger and faster while bringing in Rask and Pateryn, not trading Staal at deadline and re-signing him, and almost trading Zucker for pure vet cap dump. He also failed to ask for an add on in the Granlund trade.
Can we please stop with this nonsense
 

Bazeek

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Didn’t he basically admit it?
The Athletic said:
The Wild didn’t get any other pieces back — no draft pick, no prospect like Eeli Tolvanen.

Why?

“I think this is fair market value. This is a hockey trade,” Fenton said. “I was involved in the (Ryan) Johansen for (Seth) Jones trade. I was instrumental, probably, in the P.K. Subban for Shea Weber trade, which I called hockey trades and that’s what I told (Poile) all along is we were talking about (with) this deal. This is a hockey trade. This is going to help both of our teams.
On the one hand it's hard to read much into a GM's comments about a trade immediately after it's made. They virtually always say it was a fair deal, good value, etc. On the other hand he does lean into the "hockey trade" idea, which would imply that additional picks/prospects were a tertiary concern. I'm not sure that any of it implies that he and Poile didn't discuss other pieces, though the 'that's what I told him all along" does veer in that direction.
 
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Spurgeon

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On the one hand it's hard to read much into a GM's comments about a trade immediately after it's made. They virtually always say it was a fair deal, good value, etc. On the other hand he does lean into the "hockey trade" idea, which would imply that additional picks/prospects were a tertiary concern. I'm not sure that any of it implies that he and Poile didn't discuss other pieces, though the 'that's what I told him all along" does veer in that direction.

Let's not also forget that Russo reported that Granlund was only made available to Nashville. Not that much of a stretch to think he didn't really care about a pick and just wanted to get Fiala.
 

2Pair

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Didn’t he basically admit it?
Of course he said it after the fact. Common sense tells us that he obviously asked for more than he got. That's just basic negotiating. Common sense also tells us that once the deal is done, he's going to say that that's exactly the deal he wanted.

What's he supposed to say in that situation? "Yeah, I wanted to get more than just Fiala, but Poille outsmarted me"
 

2Pair

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Let's not also forget that Russo reported that Granlund was only made available to Nashville. Not that much of a stretch to think he didn't really care about a pick and just wanted to get Fiala.
Yeah, that's something that Russo would know :facepalm:
 

Dr Jan Itor

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On the one hand it's hard to read much into a GM's comments about a trade immediately after it's made. They virtually always say it was a fair deal, good value, etc. On the other hand he does lean into the "hockey trade" idea, which would imply that additional picks/prospects were a tertiary concern. I'm not sure that any of it implies that he and Poile didn't discuss other pieces, though the 'that's what I told him all along" does veer in that direction.

Yeah, we have his words after the trade, and 3 trades worth of evidence. He’s either horrible at negotiating for additional pieces, or he doesn’t try for them. Because he sure doesn’t get them.
 

Bazeek

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Yeah, we have his words after the trade, and 3 trades worth of evidence. He’s either horrible at negotiating for additional pieces, or he doesn’t try for them. Because he sure doesn’t get them.
5 trades if you count Johansen/Jones and Weber/Subban, which Fenton went out of his way to pull in.
 
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2Pair

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Yeah, we have his words after the trade, and 3 trades worth of evidence. He’s either horrible at negotiating for additional pieces, or he doesn’t try for them. Because he sure doesn’t get them.
One of those 3 trades did have an "additional piece"
 

2Pair

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Pretty probable, actually.
Not sure how you can possibly think that? Are you really saying that you're confident that Russo knows about each and every conversation the Fenton has or hasn't had? Get real.
 
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