Poll: James "Disco Killer" Rutherford

[Shady Machine]

Again... exactly my line of thinking.

JR makes perfect sense as a shill GM. Especially when you tell him he doesn't have to do much except occasionally warm some milk up, put on some sweats and go say something clever on Twitter, or whatever (remember... the guy was headed for retirement). Leave the heavy lifting to Morehouse and the AGMs. Which is just... a disaster we should have all seen coming.

I hate how correct you are

 

[Tasty Biscuits]

Again... exactly my line of thinking.

JR makes perfect sense as a shill GM. Especially when you tell him he doesn't have to do much except occasionally warm some milk up, put on some sweats and go say something clever on Twitter, or whatever (remember... the guy was headed for retirement). Leave the heavy lifting to Morehouse and the AGMs. Which is just... a disaster we should have all seen coming.

Yes indeed. JR was basically brought in as a "respected GM" for commincation purposes around the league to afford the Pens time to figure out what they want to do in their managerial-transition period, or whatever you want to call it.

He is the Wizard of Oz, and the AGMs + Morehouse are the men behind the curtain.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I hate how correct you are

You must believe me when I say I hope I'm wrong. And I've BEEN hoping to be wrong for quite a few years about a lot of things. But, beyond reason... it just isn't happening.

 

[Gunnar Staal]

I've always considered JR as the "old sensei" to the triumvirate of AGM's we've got, so I'm not as hard on him as I probably should be. Most of what he's done, I've actually liked (excluding the Despres trade and overpaying for certain assets, but I don't know how much of that is him and how much of that is the triumvirate), but I don't see him being the fall guy.

I'm going to be really cynical right now (as even my cynical self didn't see the Pens have a chance of missing the playoffs this year, considering our standing in January) and say that MJ is the scapegoat that is fired at season's end, JR is "reassigned" to an advisory role, One of the triumvirate becomes GM, Rick Tocchet becomes the head coach and Craig Adams becomes an assistant coach (thus never going away).

The sad part is that the above scenario has a very real chance of happening. And that is what is most cringeworthy.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Oh wow... and I thought I was at my low point of fandom, already.

Thanks a lot, man.

 

[UnderratedBrooks44]

Oh I think the not so secret plan all along was to use JR as a bridge to Botterill et. al. Makes it look like there's change as opposed to the same old, and they can kind of split the difference between what people want and what they actually want to do internally. Botterill and those guys get some learning experience while the public seemingly gets what they wanted.

By the way, I haven't heard any shining praise for Botterill as a cap genius this season. Wonder why.....

 

[Til the End of Time]

botterill has been passed over for 2 gm jobs and also bungled this cap situation.

i really feel like any dolt with excel and half a brain could be a so-called "cap genius."

botterill can be shown the door with the rest of the idiot assistants.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

botterill has been passed over for 2 gm jobs and also bungled this cap situation.

i really feel like any dolt with excel and half a brain could be a so-called "cap genius."

botterill can be shown the door with the rest of the idiot assistants.

I don't always agree with you... but this seemed very succinct and spot-on.

I've always wondered exactly what it takes to be such a "cap guru." Aside from the free time to do it and a laptop. Butterbean seems like yet another product of the "We're so smart and clever that we do nothing but **** gold" mentality of the Penguins. Botterill is more than likely yet another average to below average run-of-the-mill league exec. that has been packaged as some sort of "next one" by the team in their never-ending quest to LOOK and SOUND like they know what they are actually doing.

 

[cassius]

Marc Bergevin would have been the perfect hire in hindsight... and I get that he wasn't available.

He satisfies the whole "you gotta be friends with Lemieux" thing and the guy is a damn good GM too.

 

[BHD]

Except when they are up a goal or two.

That is on the players. The systems in place are way better than before, and would actually be useful if the team didn't fold like a cheap tent.

But again, this comes back to what Cole was saying. Accountability. Players either don't see the need to play the system or struggle to play it when things get tough.

 

[themethod7]

I'm going to be really cynical right now (as even my cynical self didn't see the Pens have a chance of missing the playoffs this year, considering our standing in January) and say that MJ is the scapegoat that is fired at season's end, JR is "reassigned" to an advisory role, One of the triumvirate becomes GM, Rick Tocchet becomes the head coach and Craig Adams becomes an assistant coach (thus never going away).

Assuming MJ is gone and the Pens promote his replacement from within like we know they will, I wonder what the chances are that they go with Jacques Martin instead of Tocchet, or if that would even make a difference.

 

[SHOOTANDSCORE]

I voted to can him but he is only part of the problem. The AGM's need to pound salt too.

Then it's a good thing our system is almost devoid of prospects worth writing home about. He can't give away what's not there.

Goodbye Murray.

Again, I implore people to not give up on Perron. He's an exceptionally talented winger who works hard. Just because he's in a slump during one of the worst slides in recent Penguins hockey memory, doesn't mean he's a bust.

He will be very good for this team when this team finally rights the ship. I'd be astonished if he didn't put up gaudy numbers and play extremely well for the majority of next season, assuming we take the necessary steps to eliminate Kunitz/Comeau/etc. from the top six and finally round out the wingers for Sid and Geno.

Yup. People forget that Neal had some pretty brutal stretches too.

 

[sheriff bart]

Canes fan here. Are you guys familiar with Jimmy's work in Raleigh? Built a team with no identity, failed to see the changes that needed to be made, always thought he was one fringe move away, and missed the playoffs year after year. This was the guy to fix your problems?

 

[Shwag33]

Canes fan here. Are you guys familiar with Jimmy's work in Raleigh? Built a team with no identity, failed to see the changes that needed to be made, always thought he was one fringe move away, and missed the playoffs year after year. This was the guy to fix your problems?

Most people agreed with a lot of his moves at the time then go back and bash him for it. Aside from despres; everyone knew that trade was ******** from the start.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

JR has probably been a little better than I expected, on the balance.

But it isn't fair to characterize this fanbase as being anything close to comfortable with the idea of bringing him on. At any point. Very few were. It was a "hope for the best" kind of situation, unless I completely misinterpreted the feeling around here in the offseason. We aren't dumb (despite the majority view to contrary) -- we all saw what he did to Carolina.

You had your usual SHUT UP THE PENGUINS ARE AWESOME AND ALWAYS MAKE THE RIGHT MOVES contingent. But you always do with anything. You could bring zombie Hitler on as head of marketing and these people would praise the move because that's what "good fans do."

 

[BHD]

I remember when somebody on the main boards scorned me for suggesting he is a bad GM.

 

[Bennett Brauer]

I just don't know who the answer is, if not JR or any of the assistants, then who? I know there should be plenty of coaches available if we decide to fire Johnston, but in terms of a GM, who would you guys hire? I mean, we hated the idea of promoting Botterill and Hynes, but at this point, it sounds pretty realistic.

 

[UnderratedBrooks44]

I just don't know who the answer is, if not JR or any of the assistants, then who? I know there should be plenty of coaches available if we decide to fire Johnston, but in terms of a GM, who would you guys hire? I mean, we hated the idea of promoting Botterill and Hynes, but at this point, it sounds pretty realistic.

They're not firing JR. To me it's a shoo-in they'll stick with the plan and keep JR for next year then Botterill will be gifted the job, and I'll predict it now: Any significant deals they make next season there will be articles about how involved Botterill was. God, it's sad when I can make those predictions and feel really confident about them.

 

[bluedevil58*]

As a Canes fan, it feels like a breathe of fresh air not having this GM at the helm.

 

[sf expat71]

They're not firing JR. To me it's a shoo-in they'll stick with the plan and keep JR for next year then Botterill will be gifted the job, and I'll predict it now: Any significant deals they make next season there will be articles are how involved Botterill was. God, it's sad when I can make those predictions and feel really confident about them.

Didn't he say himself that he is a short-term hire whilst pushing off retirement during his intro press conference? I doubt they'd fire him after one year anyway, but he's got what? 2 more years max after this one? So yeah, you're right, and vomit.

 

[UnderratedBrooks44]

As a Canes fan, it feels like a breathe of fresh air not having this GM at the helm.

Anything to alleviate the stench of your team I guess. They've got their own problems, and frankly I usually could care less if fans of other teams come in here, but if it's just going to be multiple people saying JR sucks then it's not really necessary.

 

[Bennett Brauer]

As a Canes fan, it feels like a breathe of fresh air not having this GM at the helm.

I keep seeing Canes fans come here and say this.

He's done some pretty stupid things as your GM, he hasn't done nearly anything as stupid here. IMO his worst (and only bad) move was Despres for Lovejoy and in theory, it isn't a big deal, to me anyways. When I rationalize it, Despres' future here was a bottom pair defenseman, sure we could have gotten more for him, but we didn't, oh well, we have futures here, we're not desperate.

I think JR has done a lot of good things for this team, keep in mind he has better resources here than he did with Carolina, it's a bigger market here, and he addressed a lot of needs whether people want to realize that or not. He is an upgrade over Ray Shero.

 

[sheriff bart]

Anything to alleviate the stench of your team I guess. They've got their own problems, and frankly I usually could care less if fans of other teams come in here, but if it's just going to be multiple people saying JR sucks then it's not really necessary.

We love you too.

As for the stench of our team, we smell it.

Sorry to infringe on your personal internet. It's not like you guys had a thread here talking about whether JR was doing a good job or anything. I was just saying that some of the things shouldn't come as a surprise when you look at his track record over recent history.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Like I said, though... not that many people (around here, at least) are THAT surprised.

It was always a move viewed with a wary eye. And he's had plenty of help running this team into the ground. The last regime VERY much included. I actually suspect he does less than we all assume. The guy was on his way to a permanent spot in the easy chair before Mario called. He probably still has one asscheek in the cushion, uh... so to speak.

 

[lastcupever75]

These are the real reasons why the Penguins are struggling. None of it is because we traded James Neal for Patric Hornqvist and Nick Spaling. Hornqvist covers every part of the ice in both zones, also has a great shot and is awesome in front of the net, to me that's better hockey than Neal being a perimeter sniper. Hornqvist also shows so much heart and hustle, as much as Geno and Sid, nobody else comes close to those 3 in terms of visibly trying your best.

1. First and foremost, two very key players are done for the rest of the year and have been for most of the year in Olli Maatta and Pascal Dupuis.

2. The Penguins didn't anticipate Chris Kunitz's game falling as far as it did and didn't see Beau Bennett as a complete bust.

3. Ties in to #1, and that is injuries. Let's face it, over the past few months we have lost very important players due to long term injuries. Hornqvist, Comeau (important at the time), Ehrhoff in and out of the lineup, we don't know how long Letang will be out, etc. With a revamped roster, did this team have a chance to get into any kind of groove? Story of our season(s). One comes back, another one leaves.

4. We are tight against the cap because we are overpaying Rob Scuderi and Chris Kunitz to do literally nothing. That $7M can be spent better, we can thank Ray Shero for that.

By no means am I making excuses, I think they should have better results, not all of our losses have been bad play though, we just have to convert and we NEED players in the lineup. 3 of our top 4 defensemen have been out along with Dupuis and to an extent, Malkin for a few games. I don't care what team you are, that's tough.

If we need to fire Rutherford and Johnston to be successful then so be it, I just want this team to succeed, we all do. I think we need to find better top 6 options than Chris Kunitz and Blake Comeau, that's a definite, we need to say goodbye to Beau Bennett, he's just a useless player taking up a roster spot, not to mention Craig Adams who I think is gone anyways. We need to hope some team will take Kunitz and Scuderi off our hands for picks, not caring which round, that salary needs to be off the books NOW and not in 2 years.

Other than that, I think the future is bright! I think the addition of Perron was a solid one, even though he is struggling right now, I am fully confident that he will be the player he is expected to be. Maatta and Dupuis SHOULD be back next season, I think it's just as obvious to the front office that Kunitz and Scuderi are done, forward options next season include Kasperi Kapanen and Oskar Sundqvist.

I'm still rooting for them regardless, I want them to earn a regulation win against Ottawa tonight! Though it should be another interesting offseason for the Pens again, I think so anyways.

Sorry for the long post!

all those points you made existed last year as well, except kunitz was a bit better then this year. plus we've had a lights out season from fluery and we're struggling to secure a spot in the playoffs