Salary Cap: Pittsburgh Penguins Salary Cap Thread: Where we talk about Jussi Jokinen

[mpp9]

My one hang-up is that you dont know for sure if any of those LD can step into a top pairing role and succeed. And if you say POJ, take a look at Marino this year... most young Dmen dont step into that right away unless you're a Makar

They should be playing all three pairings pretty evenly at ES.

 

[Peat]

I think Pettersson has shown he can handle that.

When?

 

[HandshakeLine]

I get depth being an issue and whatnot, but this team is in far greater danger of not making the playoffs or bouncing in one with 87 LD than it is from having to play a WB/S kid on the third pairing because 2 of Riikola, POJ, Non-Euclidian Matheson, Pettersson, and Doumoulin broke a leg.

So, I'd buy the need-for-depth argument if we look like we have a legitimate shot at the TDL. But odds are, we won't, so I'd explore offers for Dumo if he's healthy by then.

 

[Empoleon8771]

When?

He got pretty significant usage last year while with Marino IIRC. Like nearly 21 minutes a night heavy usage.

 

[Gurglesons]

I think its silly to act like moving Dumoulin is not a risk, but much like Fleury, Kessel, and Hornqvist I think with the abundance of LD, it just makes sense.

I wouldn’t expect a ton for him though. Either a similar wing in a situation where there is a chance he could be lost in the ED or a couple picks.

 

[Peat]

He got pretty significant usage last year while with Marino IIRC. Like nearly 21 minutes a night heavy usage.

Doesn't cover the quality of competition thing though. Not many worries about the minutes as they're not that far apart at 5v5, but the QoC is a different thing. Not saying he couldn't do it, just not that I'm sure he's done it.

 

[HandshakeLine]

I think its silly to act like moving Dumoulin is not a risk, but much like Fleury, Kessel, and Hornqvist I think with the abundance of LD, it just makes sense.

Exactly. And any trade is always a calculated risk-- no one should ever think otherwise. I just think the odds of us moving on from Dumo and getting assets back outweighs the fear that we'll be looking for another tweener 1st/2nd pairing LD into next year and beyond.

 

[chethejet]

Petts younger and not beat up is more attractive to most teams looking to add a young experienced LD. I move him with that contract and yes I take back a grit caliber forward if I can. Dumo will be back and see what his play offers but if it is a decent second pairing caliber play, fine.
Dumo Letang
Matheson Marino
POJ Cici
Riikola Ruhwedel
works for me.

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

Virtanen is a bull with no brains. But with direction he's a kid that will do what's needed. He's essentially about as smart as Kassian but more gifts offensively. Green just gave up on him and isn't the best with projects at all. Virtanen is a project. The issue there is that they've seen what he could do but he hasn't been able to for a while and it's time to shit or get off the pot.

Agree with bolded but idk if Green gave up. Imo good coach with young guys.

but yeah, (I usually hate speaking on stuff like this from afar) but Virtanen has had a lot going on off ice and he needs to get out of Vancouver imo.

Doesn’t mean he’ll be good when he does but I think if he wants any chance of realizing some of his potential he needs to get out.

Overall, I would buy low but I don’t want to to pay much. I’d prefer Bennett in terms of struggling 2014 draftees on Canadian teams.

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

Dumo is pretty simple to me.

If something makes sense, pull the trigger. But if no offers move the needle in terms of the roster or fair value you don’t move him in season imo. Better to have the depth.

If not, you gotta wait and I know it would be very very frustrating from a opportunity cost/value standpoint..... but with flat cap and expansion it might end up being that you just leave him exposed.

 

[DRAGO 18]

I think trading Dumo makes a lot of sense given the value he would bring back, the LD logjam, and the way his overall play is trending--- but just throwing a bit of cold water on this idea, On Hextall's GM show, he lists mentions Dumo a couple times in glowing terms and states that he expects POJ to hit a rookie wall while playing all the minutes he currently is:

http://cms.nhl.bamgrid.com/images/assets/binary/321509248/binary-file/file.mp3

So, maybe moving Petts is the likelier of the 2?

 

[Andy99]

I just don't think they're going to move a LD, except maybe Riikola, during this season...certainly not Dumo because he's the only known playoff performer in the group...after the season, they should definitely move one of Dumo or Petts before the ED, and I think it should be Dumo if he plays well enough the rest of the season

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

If Bonino's available for a decent price I think we should look into him.

Crosby
Malkin
Bonino
Blueger

Looks pretty good to me. Flip Blueger and Bonino if you think TB's the de facto #3 now.

I could see Bonino and McCann working well together too.

 

[3ladesof5teel]

I think trading Dumo makes a lot of sense given the value he would bring back, the LD logjam, and the way his overall play is trending--- but just throwing a bit of cold water on this idea, On Hextall's GM show, he lists mentions Dumo a couple times in glowing terms and states that he expects POJ to hit a rookie wall while playing all the minutes he currently is:

http://cms.nhl.bamgrid.com/images/assets/binary/321509248/binary-file/file.mp3

So, maybe moving Petts is the likelier of the 2?

I could see that and Rookie D-men to tend to hit a wall. I still and havent been its the Petts camp like some are. But Dumo is kind of worrying me with these injuries etc.

Tough decisions. I think either way if you are offered something you cant refuse you take it. Otherwise let it play out a little

 

[The Old Master]

Dumo is pretty simple to me.

If something makes sense, pull the trigger. But if no offers move the needle in terms of the roster or fair value you don’t move him in season imo. Better to have the depth.

If not, you gotta wait and I know it would be very very frustrating from a opportunity cost/value standpoint..... but with flat cap and expansion it might end up being that you just leave him exposed.

if we can recoup a x-draft protected player we would be ahead imo

 

[Gurglesons]

If Bonino's available for a decent price I think we should look into him.

Crosby
Malkin
Bonino
Blueger

Looks pretty good to me. Flip Blueger and Bonino if you think TB's the de facto #3 now.

I could see Bonino and McCann working well together too.

Bonino has been awful this year.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Bonino has been awful this year.

We seem to have a fundamental disagreement about how we should target players for a playoff run.

I look for players where there's an extended track record of performance, and if they're underperforming over a small sample size of games this year relative to that standard, maybe a better deal can be had. That's a feature, not a bug for a team with limited assets.

Is Bonino cooked this year at 33? Given his smarts, defense, his production last year, and the fact his game was never based on speed, I doubt it.

 

[66-30-33]

Bonino? let's bring back HBK!!!

Our bottom 6 can be

HBK
BART

 

[HandshakeLine]

We seem to have a fundamental disagreement about how we should target players for a playoff run.

I look for players where there's an extended track record of performance, and if they're underperforming over a small sample size of games this year relative to that standard, maybe a better deal can be had. That's a feature, not a bug for a team with limited assets.

Is Bonino cooked this year at 33? Given his smarts, defense, his production last year, and the fact his game was never based on speed, I doubt it.

People were arguing in the GDT that Malkin is ancient at 34, so...

I would see what Bonino's price is, and what the plan would be for creating a 4th line that would work with TB as center before I moved on him. Bonino with salary retained makes some sense in having a 3rd line and 4th line that can compete. But if you're just putting TB back on the 4th with our usual trash, it's not going to do much, I'm afraid.

 

[Empoleon8771]

The Penguins already have their own Nick Bonino. His name is Teddy Blueger.

I know someone will say "but you advocated for bringing in Fleury!", but let's not suggest bringing back retreads based on what worked in 2016.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

People were arguing in the GDT that Malkin is ancient at 34, so...

I would see what Bonino's price is, and what the plan would be for creating a 4th line that would work with TB as center before I moved on him. Bonino with salary retained makes some sense in having a 3rd line and 4th line that can compete. But if you're just putting TB back on the 4th with our usual trash, it's not going to do much, I'm afraid.

I don't see any good reason to disrupt the TB line right now.

But I think Bonino would be a lot better option than Jankowski for forming a line that could do something useful with what's left.

 

[Gurglesons]

We seem to have a fundamental disagreement about how we should target players for a playoff run.

I look for players where there's an extended track record of performance, and if they're underperforming over a small sample size of games this year relative to that standard, maybe a better deal can be had. That's a feature, not a bug for a team with limited assets.

Is Bonino cooked this year at 33? Given his smarts, defense, his production last year, and the fact his game was never based on speed, I doubt it.

If you don’t judge small sample sizes why do you put merit into playoff runs?

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

The Penguins already have their own Nick Bonino. His name is Teddy Blueger.

I know someone will say "but you advocated for bringing in Fleury!", but let's not suggest bringing back retreads based on what worked in 2016.

I'm open to all options for another bottom 6 center who can play a good two-way game.

Hard to find a center who would be in our price range who could have a comparable impact to Bonino at both ends.

I think the two things we really need for a playoff run are a reliable two-way center and a scoring wing who can help the PP.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I'm open to all options for another bottom 6 center who can play a good two-way game.

Hard to find a center who would be in our price range who could have a comparable impact to Bonino at both ends.

I think the two things we really need for a playoff run are a reliable two-way center and a scoring wing who can help the PP.

They don't need another bottom-6 center who plays a 2-way game. They have 2 of those already in Blueger and McCann. McCann is also a guy who can help the PP

Your bottom-6 right now should be ZAR-Blueger-Tanev and McCann as your 4C with a Tanev style LWer and probably ERod on RW. You'll definitely need to go outside the organization to get that LWer and you may need to go outside the organization to get that RWer, but I'd be curious to see ERod in that role.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

If you don’t judge small sample sizes why do you put merit into playoff runs?

Because the Stanley Cup is playoff run merit based.