Salary Cap: Pittsburgh Penguins Salary Cap Thread - Sign Beau Bennett

[Beauner]

Yes. He is. Because he's playing across from Sidney Crosby and Evgeni Malkin and on our top powerplay.

Look at what Kasperi Kapanen is doing with Malkin without that usage comparatively to what he had done previously. Blueger is in the conversation for best analytical defensive centers in the league right now.

If playing with Sidney Crosby and getting PP time is all it takes to succeed then why didn't David Perron work here?

 

[Randy Butternubs]

Given how Zucker's struggled, it's really not even a given that he's going to be the one Seattle picks after all.

Which then makes getting rid of Zucker a bit more difficult as he's got a partial no-trade clause.

 

[Shady Machine]

Why not protect Blueger, leave Zucker exposed, and if Zucker isn't taken then make said trade you mention?

this is the obvious choice. Dude is the least impactful player in a healthy top 9 and costs 5.5m per. I don’t give a shit what JR paid for him anymore. If Seattle takes him, he can be replaced. If Bleuger goes, he is much harder to replace.

Honestly I don’t see the protect list up front as a difficult choice at all:

-Sid, Geno, Blueger, Jake, Rust, Kap, McCann

Let Seattle get their pick of Zucker, Tanev, Carter, ZAR lol (whoever else I’m missing)

 

[Gurglesons]

If playing with Sidney Crosby and getting PP time is all it takes to succeed then why didn't David Perron work here?

 

[Peat]

Direct damage spells are for chumps and the back to back teams had a few more guys who brought a boards/blue paint game we sometimes don't have today.

 

[HandshakeLine]

Which then makes getting rid of Zucker a bit more difficult as he's got a partial no-trade clause.

Yeah, I think Zucker's not particularly valuable given the decline in his play and his partial NTC, which sucks considering what we paid for him. I'm sure he'd be moveable, but I'm not sure he'd bring back more than Pettersson, barring a banger of a post-season, of course.

 

[HandshakeLine]

Direct damage spells are for chumps and the back to back teams had a few more guys who brought a boards/blue paint game we sometimes don't have today.

Bard spotted.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Why not protect Blueger, leave Zucker exposed, and if Zucker isn't taken then make said trade you mention?

That'd be the perfect situation with, I guess ZAR being taken, but I don't really think Seattle's gonna go for that.

This team has wasted legitimate and extensive resources on a 3C to replace Bonino. They finally developed a homegrown talent who has been an important cog to the bottom 6, and apparently now he's expendable.

We have Jeff Carter through next season, and McCann for the foreseeable future. TB's the 4C for at least another season, especially with Sullivan around.

Again, I like TB a lot. But as of now, and for the next couple of seasons, he's a 4C. Not a bad thing, he's a very good 4C, but a 4C nonetheless, and a role/position I'm not prioritizing over potentially fixing Geno's line for another serious run at the Cup.

That has more to do with cap and construction. And we've regularly had a complete top-6 comparatively when you look at what other teams are icing as their top 6 Cs. Look at Toronto and Edmonton and what they are icing as a top-six given the talent they drafted.

Your take on Blueger is simply wrong. If we lose him this team would be f***ed.

You're out of your mind re: TB's importance to this team, imo. Just like lunatic levels of overrating the dude, and I say that as someone who really likes TB and has been praising the dude's emergence this season. "The team would be f***ed without TB" is not something I expected to read on this fine Wednesday afternoon but here we are. Some Hornqvist/Kessel idolization levels of crazy.

My stance is that in order to solve the vacancy on Geno's wing opposite Kap, a trade's very likely going to have to be made (unless we land Hyman or Coleman, the former will probably stick around in Toronto). I'd explore a Zucker trade because as much as he's reviled around here, he's still a good player that probably needs a change of scenery. If you lose Zucker for nothing, you gain the cap space and a roster spot to chase one of those guys in FA, but FA is never a sure thing and we're probably spending Zucker's entire cap hit on them regardless.

I'm not prioritizing Zucker over TB. I've been saying repeatedly that I think Zucker should be gone this off-season to find a better fit. I'm hopeful there's a Perron-Hagelin deal to be made, and think losing Zucker for pure cap space is a mistake, but if we can get a better return for TB in a trade with regard to Geno's line, I'd make that trade without hesitation. Sorting out the middle-6 winger situation, particularly finding the final piece for Geno+Kap, is much more important than TB if we're talking about chasing one last Cup before age/injury slams the window shut--if it's even open anymore.

A trade's the way to go. Whether it's Zucker dealt or TB dealt, something's gonna have to be moved in order to secure the missing piece for the top-6.

Think we're done here, neither side is budging.

 

[Shady Machine]

Yes. He is. Because he's playing across from Sidney Crosby and Evgeni Malkin and on our top powerplay.

Look at what Kasperi Kapanen is doing with Malkin without that usage comparatively to what he had done previously. Blueger is in the conversation for best analytical defensive centers in the league right now.

Honestly this is a pointless conversation as they can and should protect both. It only becomes relevant when you have to allocate cap dollars and in my view they can keep both. Plenty of other players to move first.

 

[HandshakeLine]

I think you can more reasonably gamble on Zucker sticking through the ED than McCann, and McCann has been the vastly better player for us.

 

[Fordy]

That's just not even remotely true and it's more accurate to say the team has spent more time in the sid/geno era trying to find them wingers. They had Staal from 06-12. Bonino 16-17 and now Blueger/McCann the past 2 years. That's 5 years out of 15 years where we had less than ideal solutions at 3C.

How many times did we try to find wingers for 87/71 before 2016? And how many assets did we spend doing that? Hossa, Ponikarovsky, Neal, Jokinen, Iginla, Hornqvist, LEE STEMPNIAK, Perron. The list goes on and on.

Do people remember anything before 2016?? Am I taking crazy pills here???

are you saying neal, hossa, and hornqvist weren't successes? even iginla was a success

 

[BillyOcean]

Pettersson and Zucker count for nearly 1/8th of the cap. I don't see why the penguins can't have their cake and eat it too with retaining all current players and finding a winger for Malkin moving those guys out. At least one of those guys has to go.

Keep in mind too that we haven't seen Malkin and Kapanen with McCann all too much and Carter at all.

I would not at all be surprised if Malkin and Letang take less money to stay with the organization as well.

 

[Peat]

Bard spotted.

I've always been about Gish builds for sure.

 

[Extra Texture]

What about Saad?

Guentzel Crosby Rust
Saad Malkin Kapanen
McCann Carter Rodrigues
Aston-Reese Blueger Tanev
Lafferty Zohorna Angello

Man, I was just considering this the other day as a kind of miserly, semi-illegal way around the Seattle issue and losing assets for free.

-Give signals to Saad's camp that we would be interested in bringing him in when the FA period opens
-Move Zucker to a team that was light on forwards and too heavy on Dmen
-Sign Saad to replace Zucker at around 5M AAV and (hopefully) profit

My original idea had actually been to try to steal Saad from Colorado in FA, and then hopefully dangle Zucker as an almost like for like replacement to them via trade, but the Seattle draft is a week before the FA period opens. And, frankly, that would probably require us to take a D asset from Colorado like Graves or (more likely) EJ. And that gives us a whole other headache. Potentially lose Pettersson's 4.1M in the draft, and Zucker's 5.5M via trade, only to add on ~9-11M and a total logjam at D, unless we could flip one of them elsewhere.

I'm assuming Colorado are going to trade anyone else, or pay any bribe, in order to keep Makar, Towes and Sam Girard protected.

I like Saad more than most, but I don't know if he's the sort of guy we need for Geno+Kap. Miles Wood (I know, I have a problem) would be perfect. I would seriously be working the phones to try and pry him out of NJ, even if it cost significant assets. The issue is that it'd require a 3rd team to get involved, and that's always a headache.

Wood would be magnificent. Like truly dancing in the streets, "ladies and gentlemen, we got him" awesome. But not do I think NJD now hang a "do not touch" sign on him as part of their franchise going forward, but I worry about the eye-watering price of getting the seeming "franchise piece" that would complete the puzzle. I think JR going to so hard after Zucker for a long time, and paying over the odds for him in the end, has left me scarred.

The example of Sam Bennett, who I know many on this form were fiending after, shows me we can still get a buy low(ish) guys out there that might still be an awesome fit.

 

[HandshakeLine]

I've always been about Gish builds for sure.

Was always super OP in the earlier sourcebooks, but I'll be honest, I haven't tried them in the newer editions.

 

[The Old Master]

Pettersson and Zucker count for nearly 1/8th of the cap.

i would be looking at moving more than just those two but looking doesn't mean you make the trade. it would depend on the return, imo

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Man, I was just considering this the other day as a kind of miserly, semi-illegal way around the Seattle issue and losing assets for free.

-Give signals to Saad's camp that we would be interested in bringing him in when the FA period opens
-Move Zucker to a team that was light on forwards and too heavy on Dmen
-Sign Saad to replace Zucker at around 5M AAV and (hopefully) profit

My original idea had actually been to try to steal Saad from Colorado in FA, and then hopefully dangle Zucker as an almost like for like replacement to them via trade, but the Seattle draft is a week before the FA period opens. And, frankly, that would probably require us to take a D asset from Colorado like Graves or (more likely) EJ. And that gives us a whole other headache. Potentially lose Pettersson's 4.1M in the draft, and Zucker's 5.5M via trade, only to add on ~9-11M and a total logjam at D, unless we could flip one of them elsewhere.

I'm assuming Colorado are going to trade anyone else, or pay any bribe, in order to keep Makar, Towes and Sam Girard protected.



Wood would be magnificent. Like truly dancing in the streets, "ladies and gentlemen, we got him" awesome. But not do I think NJD now hang a "do not touch" sign on him as part of their franchise going forward, but I worry about the eye-watering price of getting the seeming "franchise piece" that would complete the puzzle. I think JR going to so hard after Zucker for a long time, and paying over the odds for him in the end, has left me scarred.

I'd gladly pay the Zucker price for Wood. I say that as someone who really, really wants to hang on to 1sts and guys like Poulin moving forward.

Dude's younger than Jake and brings the perfect mix of skating/speed, "get his nose dirty", and production that Geno's line desperately lacks to finally be sorted out, imo. He's not gonna be a PPG player or anything, but I don't think we need to chase that kinda guy.

Jake-Sid-Rust
Wood-Geno-Kap
McCann-Carter-Tanev

That's a top-9, top-6 especially, that's going to go a long way toward powering through to one last Finals appearance.

If the goal is to chase that last Cup before the big names are too old/banged up to be worth their cap hit and role to the team anymore, we've gotta act pretty aggressively (but intelligently) here. If the goal is to stay the course and hope for the best until the writing's on the wall that Hextall needs to shift to a more long-term, builder approach, then that's another story I guess.

 

[Trade]

Yeah, top-6 wingers grow on trees. That's why we've got 15 years of the Sid/Geno era without a truly complete top-6.

Top 6 winger who is only playing in the top-6 because our entire second line is dead. ERod or McCann will be in the top-6 when healthy, not Zucker. So Zucker may be a top-6 winger, but not here. Why the infatuation? Hope he helps us in the playoffs and if his performance there causes us to re-evaluate, you do it. But that still doesn’t mean we lose Blueger.

I know people may have repressed memories of the post-Bonino/pre-Teddy era, but c’mon.

 

[Gurglesons]

That's just not even remotely true and it's more accurate to say the team has spent more time in the sid/geno era trying to find them wingers. They had Staal from 06-12. Bonino 16-17 and now Blueger/McCann the past 2 years. That's 5 years out of 15 years where we had less than ideal solutions at 3C.

How many times did we try to find wingers for 87/71 before 2016? And how many assets did we spend doing that? Hossa, Ponikarovsky, Neal, Jokinen, Iginla, Hornqvist, LEE STEMPNIAK, Perron. The list goes on and on.

Do people remember anything before 2016?? Am I taking crazy pills here???

You just listed a bunch top six wingers we acquired nearly every year?

We currently have 8 wingers pacing for over 35 points.

Our issue from 2009-10 to 2014-15 was never that we couldn't afford wingers. It was that Shero saw what happened in 2010 in the playoffs defensively and put all our money into building a defense because Sid and Geno could figure it out.

This idea that we need to complete change the entire left wing side of our team when we are the 3rd best team in the league at scoring goals is just bizarre.

 

[Peat]

Was always super OP in the earlier sourcebooks, but I'll be honest, I haven't tried them in the newer editions.

Real strong in 5e. Paladin's a little OP at times, and Bard and Warlock build really strong that way too.


Anyway, pretending to be on topic, I'll be waiting to see what emerges from the playoffs, but right now I think we could see one of McCann/Blueger traded before the expansion draft, Carter protected, and Zucker exposed. And on the blue line, I'm waiting to see how Pettersson-Marino go before taking too many decisions.

 

[Gurglesons]

Real strong in 5e. Paladin's a little OP at times, and Bard and Warlock build really strong that way too.


Anyway, pretending to be on topic, I'll be waiting to see what emerges from the playoffs, but right now I think we could see one of McCann/Blueger traded before the expansion draft, Carter protected, and Zucker exposed. And on the blue line, I'm waiting to see how Pettersson-Marino go before taking too many decisions.

I feel like eye test wise Marino has been our worst defensemen for a full month now. Which isn't exactly inspiring much confidence in me on getting rid of Petts.

Oddly enough his xGF numbers are best on the team since April 1st. But he's also getting butter soft usage which I don't like given what he is supposed to bring here.

I just realized Matheson and Ceci have combined for 15 pts at 5v5 in 10 games in April lol.

 

[3ladesof5teel]

Pettersson and Zucker count for nearly 1/8th of the cap. I don't see why the penguins can't have their cake and eat it too with retaining all current players and finding a winger for Malkin moving those guys out. At least one of those guys has to go.

Keep in mind too that we haven't seen Malkin and Kapanen with McCann all too much and Carter at all.

I would not at all be surprised if Malkin and Letang take less money to stay with the organization as well.

That would be excellent if they did take less but they dont owe us anything. I would like to think they love it here and would be given the opportunity to finish thier careers here.

Geno has dealt with his fair share of injuries but when hes on there arent too many out there that are better.............Ever, I would like to think that he understands that he would possibly need to take less if we are able to keep this ship running. I wouldnt blame him though if he went after the money. I do think he really likes Pittsburgh

 

[3ladesof5teel]

I feel like eye test wise Marino has been our worst defensemen for a full month now. Which isn't exactly inspiring much confidence in me on getting rid of Petts.

Oddly enough his xGF numbers are best on the team since April 1st. But he's also getting butter soft usage which I don't like given what he is supposed to bring here.

I just realized Matheson and Ceci have combined for 15 pts at 5v5 in 10 games in April lol.

I think you said it yourself, Petts is getting sheltered and it seems to be for good reason. Marino is younger ( not by much) but I think his skillset is far superior then Petts and feel Petts would be by far more replaceable, even internally

 

[Gurglesons]

I think you said it yourself, Petts is getting sheltered and it seems to be for good reason. Marino is younger ( not by much) but I think his skillset is far superior then Petts and feel Petts would be by far more replaceable, even internally

I'm really down on both of them right now. But yeah, obviously Marino has the better frame and skills.

 

[Beauner]

are you saying neal, hossa, and hornqvist weren't successes? even iginla was a success

The point is that we have spent infinently more assets trying to acquire the perfect mix of wingers than we have trying to get a 3C. The assertion that the team has spent "75%" of the sid/geno era trying to find Teddy Blueger's is just an outright lie