Salary Cap: Pittsburgh Penguins Salary Cap Thread: Now less Horny. (GMJR is still a moron)

[Big Friggin Dummy]

The Rangers could be a serious monster soon. Like, Avs East kinda monster.

 

[Gurglesons]

The Rangers could be a serious monster soon. Like, Avs East kinda monster.

There is no chance in hell that Buffalo is trading a franchise center to their biggest competitor after Toronto.

Remember what their fanbase was like to Drury?

 

[Gurglesons]

Nah, he's horrendous too.

From what I remember Bogosian was a solid contributor analytically prior to the last couple years.

He's a player that was a good defenseman (Funny, I remember him and Hainsey being one of my underrated group of guys back in the Atlanta days) that simply just got crushed by draft position and injuries.

 

[Khelandros]

prove it!

After offseason filled with trade speculation, Jack Johnson ready for Game 1
The reported reason why Phil Kessel nixed a trade to the Minnesota Wild - Article - BARDOWN

 

[Riptide]

The more and more i think about things (and maybe this is me forcing it i dunno) the more i like the Hornqvist/Matheson trade.

Our top 6 is set and even when we had holes there Hornqvist wasn't getting those minutes. Combine that witha diminished PP role, being 34 and not being a good fit on a line with McCann As 3C (whom i think should play with more offensive minded plyers).

Matheson is a reclamation project sure but he has so much damn upside.

Even setting that aside the only real drawback is the term of the deal. The AAV is a tad high for an NHL defender but not egregiously so.

Maybe this is where i go a bridge too far but i truely believe that JJ is going to be gone. I felt that it would happen before this trade and now im almost certain. If having his replacement already in house makes JR even 0.00001% more comfortable moving that clod, im in. Im all in.

I think moving on from Hornqvist was the right idea for the reasons you listed. My concern is over the riskyness of Matheson. I think there's some potential there that he could do amazing things here. However e could also be a massive bust. And while I get it that to hit homeruns one also needs to take on some risk... The deal is done so I won't freakout or rant on and on about it... but there's absolutely some uneasiness to the risk that JR took - and that's going to take months to go away (I figure MM gets 25-40 games to see if he can settle down enough in his own zone and decision making to be a positive asset to the team).

 

[Son Goku]

Not suggesting we should trade for Eichel, just saying it seems like no one is off limits over there

I don’t even know what we could offer to entice them lol. I almost feel like Marino would have to go the other way as one piece, and as much as I love Eichel, we can’t afford that, plus the other stuff We’d have to move as well.

I f***ing wish we could get eichel

 

[The Great Mighty Poo]

 

[mpp9]

I like JG, but if the Flames could somehow swap him for Eichel, that division with Vancouver and EDM will be nuts.

 

[Riptide]

I'm split on what to do with Simon. On one hand, there is a spot for him in the bottom-6 because the bottom-6 does need playmaking talent. But on the other hand, you already have 6 should be regulars in the bottom-6 (McCann, Tanev, ZAR, Blueger, Sceviour and Lafferty) and it sounds like JR wants to give Poulin and O'Connor a chance at making the team as well. I think I would trade ZAR and give ZAR's money to Simon, and plan on running with:

Simon/Poulin-McCann-Tanev
Lafferty-Blueger-Sceviour

But I'm not completely sold on that and I think that 3rd line is fairly underwhelming, namely because I don't like McCann at center.

If they manage to trade JJ without taking any money back, I'd change my strategy to signing a playmaking 3C, bumping Tanev to the 4th line, bumping Lafferty to an extra and running with:

McCann-3C-Simon/Poulin
Tanev-Blueger-Sceviour

You don't sit Simon for Lafferty. The kids speed is nice but at best he's a 13F, while Simon is a legit NHLer who doesn't look out of place on a 3rd line or in the top 6 in small doses.

 

[JimmyTwoTimes]

After offseason filled with trade speculation, Jack Johnson ready for Game 1
The reported reason why Phil Kessel nixed a trade to the Minnesota Wild - Article - BARDOWN

If he accepts that trade we still have Calen Addison, 1st round pick to start that year with Zucker instead of AG(who they hated) . Then who knows who we could have added at the deadline with that first rounder and Calen Addison. That could have been the difference in adding a bottom 6 top talent or someone for the defense.

Just looking at the UFAs and the teams who were out of playoffs at the time for example....we could have used that first for someone like Mike Hoffman. And then never having to do the Kahun trade either. Which we did due to the injuries to others, wanting to add 2 players.

Guentzel - Crosby - Hoffman/Kahun
Zucker - Malkin - Rust
Hoffman/Kahun - McCann - Hornqvist
Tanev - Blueger - ZAR

That 1st line and 3rd line gets much better just with that one move....

Dammit Kessel

 

[Gurglesons]

If he accepts that trade we still have Calen Addison, 1st round pick to start that year with Zucker instead of AG(who they hated) . Then who knows who we could have added at the deadline with that first rounder and Calen Addison. That could have been the difference in adding a bottom 6 top talent or someone for the defense.

Just looking at the UFAs and the teams who were out of playoffs at the time for example....we could have used that first for someone like Mike Hoffman. And then never having to do the Kahun trade either. Which we did due to the injuries to others, wanting to add 2 players.

Guentzel - Crosby - Hoffman/Kahun
Zucker - Malkin - Rust
Hoffman/Kahun - McCann - Hornqvist
Tanev - Blueger - ZAR

That 1st line and 3rd line gets much better just with that one move....

Dammit Kessel

You’re acting like Rask wouldn’t be on the roster.

 

[Gurglesons]

I think moving on from Hornqvist was the right idea for the reasons you listed. My concern is over the riskyness of Matheson. I think there's some potential there that he could do amazing things here. However e could also be a massive bust. And while I get it that to hit homeruns one also needs to take on some risk... The deal is done so I won't freakout or rant on and on about it... but there's absolutely some uneasiness to the risk that JR took - and that's going to take months to go away (I figure MM gets 25-40 games to see if he can settle down enough in his own zone and decision making to be a positive asset to the team).

Eh. Worst case scenario Matheson is Justin Schultz of the past three years on a bloated contract.

 

[Empoleon8771]

You don't sit Simon for Lafferty. The kids speed is nice but at best he's a 13F, while Simon is a legit NHLer who doesn't look out of place on a 3rd line or in the top 6 in small doses.

Simon literally can't produce while not with Crosby. I'm not going to make claims that he's definitely better than Lafferty, and I'm not even high on Lafferty.

 

[JRS91]

Guess that's why literally every post in the last couple of pages has us packaging him with MM.



MM for Tierney is not equal value. MM is more valuable than a 3C they don't intend to resign.

Staal is 100% not better than JJ. We say he's the worst dman in the league but in reality, there are several that are worse, Staal being one of them.

If we are doing MM+JJ to Ottawa, in what warped world do we have to include POJ or a high draft pick? WTF, your trade value radar is way off and needs to be recalibrated.

Murray is worth a 2nd round pick.

If you think it'll take a 2nd round pick to move Johnson then maybe you should check your own "trade value radar". It took a 1st round pick and a 7th round pick to get Marleau out of Toronto and he only had a year remaining on his deal. Jack Johnson still has 3 years remaining on his contract. How the hell is a 2nd round pick enough?

This is a classic example of fans overrating their bad players. "Wh-Why don't other teams take our bad players for nothing? It's not fair!". Staal isn't worse than Johnson. I'm not in the analytics crowd so don't bother posting a bunch of worthless charts. This isn't baseball. The eye test shows Staal just has more value than Johnson. He has a year left on his deal as well which would add to the value if Detroit decides to flip him at the deadline which I'm sure they plan on doing. If Rutherford manages to get someone to take Jack Johnson without giving up an asset, I'll be ecstatic. I'm not holding my breath though.

 

[JimmyTwoTimes]

You don't sit Simon for Lafferty. The kids speed is nice but at best he's a 13F, while Simon is a legit NHLer who doesn't look out of place on a 3rd line or in the top 6 in small doses.

As of now, No. But we dont know how players like Laff, Angello, Militec, etc will improve in their 3rd year now as a pro. Maybe take that next step in their career. Or 2nd year player Bellerive for example. He started off slow but ended the season hot when moved up in the lineup. Would have been nice if Bjorkvist didnt get hurt, not only missing a full year of development but now will play in Finland next year because of it. He is someone who could have been that perfect bottom 6 player. Still can be but now the timeline is set back a few years.


I do think Simon has gotten better and this could be the year he scores +15 and +25a . Which isnt a reach if he plays a full season. He had 28 points the last two years playing less than 60 games in both.

If he can put up +40pts that helps our bottom 6 a lot. I feel like we have a lot of those situations going into next season. Where most of the lineup has players that "should" have career years. McCann, Kapanen, Blueger, and Simon if we keep him. Ill add Tanev as well since he will have a full year of experience here and if Blueger's numbers go up then so does Tanev.

That is alot of players we are hoping can take that next step. I still think JR either adds a proven forward thru the Murray trade or thru FA. He could wait until midseason but if we can get someone cheap because of the cap situation then we should.

 

[JimmyTwoTimes]

You’re acting like Rask wouldn’t be on the roster.

Even better. Rask in there for ZAR. He was better while at Center as opposed to Wing when with the Canes. Could have gone....

Hoffman - McCann - Hornqvist
Blueger - Rask - Tanev

McCann - Rask - Hoffman
Tanev - Blueger - Hornqvist

Either way the lineup could have been much better if we didnt have to make the trade for Galchenyuk and then another to get Zucker. Keeping our first and Addison. Even if its not Hoffman we would have still likely used that first for someone. Hell maybe it would have been for JGP. Imagine if that happened.

 

[Gurglesons]

Even better. Rask in there for ZAR.

How do people say things like this lol.

Also his cap would prevent the moves you’ve outlined.

 

[JimmyTwoTimes]

How do people say things like this lol.

Also his cap would prevent the moves you’ve outlined.

Not with the deadline. You dont count their full cap hit. They def could have added someone like Hoffman or JGP.

 

[Gurglesons]

Not with the deadline. You dont count their full cap hit. They def could have added someone like Hoffman or JGP.

You would’ve given up a 1st and 2nd for Pageau and then dropped that contract?

 

[NeedleInTheHay]

The Rangers could be a serious monster soon. Like, Avs East kinda monster.

The kind of monster who’s won 2 series in 5 years... I hope so.

 

[JimmyTwoTimes]

You would’ve given up a 1st, 2nd and 3rd for Pageau and then dropped that contract?

Considering what we did this past season instead...you wouldnt have? We lost out on having a 1st for 2 years and Addison as well as Hallander instead. Maybe we are able to keep JGP , never trading for Kapanen. Or figure out a diff way. But regardless, yes when you go for it all at the deadline ...you take that risk.

JGP as our 3C would have been huge for us. He was basically the Isles best player. Having him with McCann and PH would have been close to HBK as we could get. Hes a very good playoff performer. 16 goals in his last two years in the playoffs. Yeah Thats a risk you take.

 

[SEALBound]

After offseason filled with trade speculation, Jack Johnson ready for Game 1
The reported reason why Phil Kessel nixed a trade to the Minnesota Wild - Article - BARDOWN

This is what was always so curious about those who want to continue to emotionally scar themselves with JJ. "Nu uhhhhhh! it was only Kessel for Zuckerrrrrrrr!!!". How many damn times did it need to be reported that it included the JJ for Rask swap? Whatever.

Again, proof that JR is not above trading JJ and that a team isn't above accepting him.

 

[Gurglesons]

Considering what we did this past season instead...you wouldnt have? We lost out on having a 1st for 2 years and Addison as well as Hallander instead. Maybe we are able to keep JGP , never trading for Kapanen. Or figure out a diff way. But regardless, yes when you go for it all at the deadline ...you take that risk.

JGP as our 3C would have been huge for us. He was basically the Isles best player. Having him with McCann and PH would have been close to HBK as we could get. Hes a very good playoff performer.

You are losing those pieces if you sign Pageau because you have Rask. So you need to move either Rask or Hornqvist which if you weren’t taking contracts back would’ve posed a problem.

Addison was a player I’d have liked to keep, but Marino has made him expendable and realistically I don’t see how he would fit in given the make up of our D until Letang was gone.

I just don’t realistically see how we aren’t in a similar position by acquiring Pageau and signing him and if we didn’t sign him seems like we would all be criticizing the deal unless we won a cup.

 

[The Old Master]

After offseason filled with trade speculation, Jack Johnson ready for Game 1
The reported reason why Phil Kessel nixed a trade to the Minnesota Wild - Article - BARDOWN

then why is he still here? and why do we have lefty's coming out of our.........well you know.

 

[JimmyTwoTimes]

You are losing those pieces if you sign Pageau because you have Rask. So you need to move either Rask or Hornqvist.

Addison was a player I’d have liked to keep, but Marino has made him expendable and realistically I don’t see how he would fit in given the make up of our D until Letang was gone.

It was less about Rask and more about JR needing to make two trades to basically replace Kessel. Giving up an extra 1st and Addison because of it. And whether Addison was a fit or not he was still a great asset. I get what you are saying tho. But I am just referring to the fact that we would have been much better off if Kessel accepted that trade.

Having Zucker over Galchenyuk to start the year is the x factor there. We could have then gone into the deadline while being in a better situation. Thats what I am talking about. Especially since Guentzel got hurt, and AG wasnt working...thats why we made the Kahun trade as well. We could have also avoided that. So it did make a pretty big impact on our roster...assets.

Lets say we use that 1st for JPG but dont have to trade Kahun. We go into the offseason in a better situation. Maybe we trade Addison and Hallander to Leafs for Kapanen instead of having to give up our 15th overall. While still having Kahun. Anyway you look at it we would have been better off