Salary Cap: Pittsburgh Penguins Salary Cap Thread|10 Games, I Want My 2 Trades..

[Ugene Magic]

Go....

molon labe
Registered User

MB thread: Gusev + 3rd for Petts.

I'd do it. I like the Pens 3rd round selections - we're weak on picks - and Gusev comes off the books in the Summer so you'd be freeing up the LD jam, gaining a pick, and getting a potential top-6 guy for the final stretch. Gusev has been under-performing this year but has a higher upside than anything sitting in our bottom 6 right now.​

I want to give my approval to this as well.

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[HandshakeLine]

I would like us to not carry 10 blueliners on the main roster just for the sake of variety. It's been one of those recent fads I just cannot abide.

 

[Randy Butternubs]

Guentzel-Crosby-Rust
DOC/Zohorna-Malkin-Kapanen
Zucker-McCann-Gusev
ZAR-Blueger-Tanev

Dumoulin-Letang
Matheson-Marino
Riikola-Ceci

 

[pistolpete11]

Not a fan of Gusev. He's just a different option, not necessarily a better option. I'd much rather go after a C and roll with McCann or Zucker on Malkin's LW.

Petts for a UFA 3C/4C + pick is the type of deal I'd be looking to make, though.

 

[MayorofWBS]

Not a fan of Gusev. He's just a different option, not necessarily a better option. I'd much rather go after a C and roll with McCann or Zucker on Malkin's LW.

Petts for a UFA 3C/4C + pick is the type of deal I'd be looking to make, though.

It might be hard to make that deal in season with Pett's cap hit. Detroit might be the only one with the cap space to do that. Buffalo if they can move Staal for futures first.

 

[The Old Master]

Not a fan of Gusev. He's just a different option, not necessarily a better option. I'd much rather go after a C and roll with McCann or Zucker on Malkin's LW.

Petts for a UFA 3C/4C + pick is the type of deal I'd be looking to make, though.

depending on the pick .... it sounds like an over pay.

 

[Trade]

Gusev-Geno-Kappy would be a scary line for any defense to matchup against.

I’m all for trading Petts in just about any kind of decent hockey trade. Not trying to harp on the guy, but even with the handshake agreement with his contract considered, he’s just too overpaid to be on our bottom pair.

Anyone have an insider scoop on why Gusev has fallen off a cliff this year?

 

[pistolpete11]

It might be hard to make that deal in season with Pett's cap hit. Detroit might be the only one with the cap space to do that. Buffalo if they can move Staal for futures first.

Well, I've suggested Petts for Glendening + 2nd before, so...

It depends what's coming back, though. Someone in the previous thread mentioned Zajac, for example.

 

[Peat]

If we're just looking for a 4C, I'd like to try it on with Riikola and keep Pettersson until the summer tbh.

I'd also point out that Jankowski hasn't been an awful hockey player of his life, or even his time here, and just bringing in a 4C and hoping to get great results is probably not gonna happen unless they're a lot better than Jankowski.

I'd quite like to see what Nashville's price on Cousins is.

 

[HandshakeLine]

If we're just looking for a 4C, I'd like to try it on with Riikola and keep Pettersson until the summer tbh.

I'd also point out that Jankowski hasn't been an awful hockey player of his life, or even his time here, and just bringing in a 4C and hoping to get great results is probably not gonna happen unless they're a lot better than Jankowski.

I'd quite like to see what Nashville's price on Cousins is.

It's really hard to tell if the problem with Jank is that he's fallen off a cliff (he's a bit young for that, but players sometimes totally lose their games for all sorts of reasons), the system, his usage, or if the bottom 6 just doesn't have the right kinds of players for him to not be a liability. That's why I'd like to see Sullivan being a bit more flexible with his lines, just because there's the off-chance messing with the line composition could jumpstart him or others. I'd look into Cousins too, but mostly because I think the bottom 6 could use a guy who's a bit of a shitstirrer; I don't expect Cousins to come in and revitalize us, but having a dude with a definite niche to his game would help create some sort of identity beyond "placeholder" there.

@Randy Butternubs - Zohorna on the wing is interesting. He's played a lot of center, but he's had some success there in the Extraliga, and his size would definitely be useful on the boards. The bigger problem I see there is that he doesn't quite know the system yet, and he's not used to playing the game with anyone of Malkin's caliber (though Erat wasn't anything to sneeze at, tbh). I don't see Sullivan making that big of a leap of faith, but it's not the worst idea in the world for a team struggling to find scoring depth.

 

[chethejet]

Sorry Gusev is not the player the Pens need to add.

 

[HandshakeLine]

It depends on price. Gusev is absolutely better than what we have in terms of scoring LWs not named Jake Guentzel. Is he worth Petts? Maybe, but I'd hope to get at least a pick thrown in. Is he worth Petts+? I wouldn't.

 

[Peat]

It's really hard to tell if the problem with Jank is that he's fallen off a cliff (he's a bit young for that, but players sometimes totally lose their games for all sorts of reasons), the system, his usage, or if the bottom 6 just doesn't have the right kinds of players for him to not be a liability. That's why I'd like to see Sullivan being a bit more flexible with his lines, just because there's the off-chance messing with the line composition could jumpstart him or others. I'd look into Cousins too, but mostly because I think the bottom 6 could use a guy who's a bit of a shitstirrer; I don't expect Cousins to come in and revitalize us, but having a dude with a definite niche to his game would help create some sort of identity beyond "placeholder" there.

Well the great selector that is injury is doing a juggle right now, and I'm still not seeing a spark from him. Which, to be fair, could be because we're still juggling him with not a whole lot of quality, or not the right players. Jankowski is a guy who can defend and score; he won't handle the puck well, or forecheck great. We've got forecheckers, but someone who can use the puck a little is sorely needed on the 4th line. Which I guess is maybe a call for Zohorna.

But, in any case, whatever it is, I do feel confident the mix isn't going to make it easy for anyone else coming in unless they're a cut above what we've got. Guys like Glendening, or Sheahan - they'll probably be just as f***ed, unless we can get everyone fit and to stay fit and that injects some quality down there.

It depends on price. Gusev is absolutely better than what we have in terms of scoring LWs not named Jake Guentzel. Is he worth Petts? Maybe, but I'd hope to get at least a pick thrown in. Is he worth Petts+? I wouldn't.

I'm not sure Gusev is better than McCann and Zucker tbh. He'd need to get a real click somewhere on the roster - preferably Malkin - to be absolutely better imo.

 

[HandshakeLine]

But, in any case, whatever it is, I do feel confident the mix isn't going to make it easy for anyone else coming in unless they're a cut above what we've got. Guys like Glendening, or Sheahan - they'll probably be just as f***ed, unless we can get everyone fit and to stay fit and that injects some quality down there.

I think that's a fair cop. (And to be honest, Jank looks like a guy right now who knows he's outmatched and isn't able to contribute-- his confidence seems absolutely shot.) That's why I'd rather explore what we have now to see if there's any one who can step up, even if it's just temporary, without expending resources.

Longer term (i.e. post-ED), it's clear that we need a decent 4C, even when Teddy comes back. Again, if we're not going with a coaching change in the off-season, then I'd hope that we find a way to bring back a 4th line with some offensive presence because, honestly, we see how easily this team can be neutralized by focusing on the big 2 (or big 1 as the case is at the moment).

 

[molon labe]

Sorry Gusev is not the player the Pens need to add.

The trade suggested does not prevent the Pens from making other moves. It's Petts for Gusev and a NJ 3rd (which is a good 3rd). Gets us a pick in the draft, a player who MAY help (as his upside is better than anything else we have in the depth charts) - but if he doesn't help his contract is up in the Summer so you're freeing up 4M+ going forward to address the forward group.

I don't think Petts is getting us someone like Jeff Carter to solve some of the C depth /net front issues. There's also (as has been mentioned) a limited number of teams who can take on 4M - regardless of how good or bad the contract is - without sending similar money out. Of those teams, who has a need for a top 4 LD? Paying 4M to put Petts on your third pair is silly.

 

[HandshakeLine]

Plus Petts for Gusev makes some sense with the looming ED. If we're serious about at least making a good faith effort in the post-season (and I'm not sure we are), it's a move that's worth exploring. If we're not going to try to go for broke this year, I can see the argument for holding on to Petts to get a better price or even as waiting for the bounce-back. But then, you gotta try to get rid of Matheson, which is probably harder to do and might very well actually cost us assets.

 

[HandshakeLine]

I'm not sure Gusev is better than McCann and Zucker tbh. He'd need to get a real click somewhere on the roster - preferably Malkin - to be absolutely better imo.

Just saw this, Peat, apologies. I don't think Gusev is better than Zucker, certainly not in a vacuum. He might have more chemistry with Malkin, though, which is where he'd be (in this hypothetical) and then you can trade McCann for another part and put Zucker on the 3rd, for more scoring depth. It's a gamble, but one that has fairly limited downsides (e.g. Gusev doesn't work, then he's gone after the season).

 

[Shady Machine]

Just saw this, Peat, apologies. I don't think Gusev is better than Zucker, certainly not in a vacuum. He might have more chemistry with Malkin, though, which is where he'd be (in this hypothetical) and then you can trade McCann for another part and put Zucker on the 3rd, for more scoring depth. It's a gamble, but one that has fairly limited downsides (e.g. Gusev doesn't work, then he's gone after the season).

Agreed. Gusev is not a better player than Zucker but I’ve seen enough of Zucker-Malkin and it’s clear GCR will be a thing. Gusev is a cheapish (assuming Petts is a realistic offer) gamble and if it works, solves multiple problems. Once healthy (ha ha I know), you roll with:

GCR
Gusev-Geno-Kap
Zucker-Blueger-Tanev
ZAR-McCann-mish mash of whoever

I like the look and depth of that. Alternatively, keep BART and roll Zucker-McCann and have 2 3rd lines.

 

[Peat]

I think that's a fair cop. (And to be honest, Jank looks like a guy right now who knows he's outmatched and isn't able to contribute-- his confidence seems absolutely shot.) That's why I'd rather explore what we have now to see if there's any one who can step up, even if it's just temporary, without expending resources.

Longer term (i.e. post-ED), it's clear that we need a decent 4C, even when Teddy comes back. Again, if we're not going with a coaching change in the off-season, then I'd hope that we find a way to bring back a 4th line with some offensive presence because, honestly, we see how easily this team can be neutralized by focusing on the big 2 (or big 1 as the case is at the moment).

I'd like them to have a swing at a 4th line with more punch in the off-season but right now my expectations in that are pretty much zero. If they manage it, they'll have to be spot on with pretty much every move there and a hell of a lot luckier with injuries than we've been recently. Things would be different if we had a slew of ELCs that were middle six/third line worthy, but we don't.

The other route is get lucky with a hideously overqualified dirt cheap C like Cullen.

Right now... I agree Jankowski's confidence is shot but more than that, right or wrong, I think the bottom six is playing like they've been told "just play your minutes and don't concede a goal. Give us a blank slate for the top six to win" and there's only so much incomers can do in that too. If Zohorna gets in, maybe he'll give us a shot of energy, but maybe he'll just be another guy playing the system. We could really use some bodies back.

 

[theicebox]

The other route is get lucky with a hideously overqualified dirt cheap C like Cullen

Matt Cullen is currently on the Penguins payroll...

 

[Jules Winnfield]

Gusev isn't the best fit for Sully's style of play but the deal makes sense to me.

We get a LW we need. We aren't committed to Gusev beyond this year and if he works out we can deal with that later.
We get a 3rd round pick when we don't have shit right now.
We clear a body out on the LD.

 

[pistolpete11]

If we're just looking for a 4C, I'd like to try it on with Riikola and keep Pettersson until the summer tbh.

I'd also point out that Jankowski hasn't been an awful hockey player of his life, or even his time here, and just bringing in a 4C and hoping to get great results is probably not gonna happen unless they're a lot better than Jankowski.

I'd quite like to see what Nashville's price on Cousins is.

If we use Petts for Glendening + 2nd as reference...I don't think you are doing much better than a 2nd for Petts in the offseason anyway. They have too many LD, but losing Riikola now and then losing Petts in the offseason is putting quite a dent in that depth. I'm reasonably high on POJ being able to take the step next year, but I'd rather keep Riikola around as insurance.

Sorry, but Jankowski sucks. He's not a victim of a shitty L4, he's a contributor to it. Not that Glendening or someone of that ilk is some lynchpin to having a good L4, but at least he provides something instead of nothing (good RH faceoff guy, blocks shots, throws some hits, etc.). Jankowski is the definition of 'meh'.

Basically, I guess what I'm advocating for is trading Petts a little bit early so you can get a throw in to help the bottom 6 for this year.

 

[HandshakeLine]

I'd like them to have a swing at a 4th line with more punch in the off-season but right now my expectations in that are pretty much zero. If they manage it, they'll have to be spot on with pretty much every move there and a hell of a lot luckier with injuries than we've been recently. Things would be different if we had a slew of ELCs that were middle six/third line worthy, but we don't.

The other route is get lucky with a hideously overqualified dirt cheap C like Cullen.

Right now... I agree Jankowski's confidence is shot but more than that, right or wrong, I think the bottom six is playing like they've been told "just play your minutes and don't concede a goal. Give us a blank slate for the top six to win" and there's only so much incomers can do in that too. If Zohorna gets in, maybe he'll give us a shot of energy, but maybe he'll just be another guy playing the system. We could really use some bodies back.

We don't but Gusev and a healthy Zucker would essentially strengthen the 4th just by bumping everyone down a bit. I agree it's a bit of a long shot, but all of the shots are long shots at this point.

 

[pistolpete11]

Gusev isn't the best fit for Sully's style of play but the deal makes sense to me.

We get a LW we need. We aren't committed to Gusev beyond this year and if he works out we can deal with that later.
We get a 3rd round pick when we don't have shit right now.
We clear a body out on the LD.

Do we need a LW, though? I mean, if we were talking about Forsberg or something, sure, but Gusev isn't any better than Zucker or McCann.

 

[Pens x]

If we're just looking for a 4C, I'd like to try it on with Riikola and keep Pettersson until the summer tbh.

I'd also point out that Jankowski hasn't been an awful hockey player of his life, or even his time here, and just bringing in a 4C and hoping to get great results is probably not gonna happen unless they're a lot better than Jankowski.

I'd quite like to see what Nashville's price on Cousins is.

Who cares what Jank did several years ago? The jank playing for the Penguins this season is AWFUL. If you can’t find an upgrade over him, you shouldn’t be working in hockey.