Confirmed Trade: [PIT/OTT/VGK] PART II (see OP)

[KIRK]

If it wasn't legal the league wouldn't have approved it.

If a third team wants to retain salary for picks/players, why shouldn't they be allowed?

Despite what people want to say, Vegas gets a benefit out of this.

This isn't some made up **** like an equipment allergy, or teams misusing the LTIR ala Pronger, shady 12 year cap circumvention deals, or even when the Leafs used their big pockets to be rid of a bad contract.

People are just mad because their GM didn't think of it first.

Nothing more.

Who took 'Jim Rutherford is a salary cap innovator' in the 'yeah, this is actually true' game?

 

[Harvey Birdman]

Couldn’t agree more. Like I said, as long as other teams can do it, I don’t really care.

It just has to be a even playing field for everyone and not have the commish wake up when a handful of teams did it, only to throw the book at the 6th team for trying it as well.

Nothing more. Nothing less.

You are referencing the Kovy punishments to New Jersey? I didn’t agree with what happened to the Devils even though they are a division rival of my team. I wished every team would have been grandfathered in a way of this was allowed before but now don’t do it anymore. I hope the league has learned a lesson from the mishandling of that and if they want to do a course correction in policy/application of the CBA they can’t do it retroactively, and they can’t do it retroactively to only a single offender when there were many. Someone or someone’s figure out how to side step to far, then you say cool good job to these guys figuring out how to bend the rules without breaking them but after this moment no more.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Who took 'Jim Rutherford is a salary cap innovator' in the 'yeah, this is actually true' game?

Not bad for a senile old man that likes warm cookies.

 

[KIRK]

Not bad for a senile old man that likes warm cookies.

Hey, I'm still marveling that he parlayed Brandon Sutter and 2 late 1sts into 2 runs with Bonino, 2 runs with Brassard, and 4 runs with Hagelin.

That legitimately is in 'how Craig Patrick leveraged Luc and Ulfie for years after they were gone' territory.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Hey, I'm still marveling that he parlayed Brandon Sutter and 2 late 1sts into 2 runs with Bonino, 2 runs with Brassard, and 4 runs with Hagelin.

That legitimately is in 'how Craig Patrick leveraged Luc and Ulfie for years after they were gone' territory.

He also drafted Sprong!

I'm just saying...

 

[KIRK]

He also drafted Sprong!

I'm just saying...

I know . . . and wait until you see how he leverages that asset.

Look, jokes aside, I'll be more surprised that not, based on what I've been told for months about JR not letting the asset go to waste this year, to see Sprong in WBS on Tuesday.

 

[Allie Kitsune]

I'm not as crazy about Sprong as most, but I'd infinitely prefer him over Kane.

 

[hangman005]

The only people that are questioning or criticizing the deal are people who don't like the Penguins and don't want them to get Brassard. It's a salt mine on here with those people.

You also forgot Vegas fans who find this deal to be awful value for Vegas.

Using our cap space to save one team money and make the other team better for a player who doesn’t fit our team and makes it worse if we play him. We trade Lindberg for a pick... but the value isn’t there for Vegas. For what we got I’d rather Winnipeg got Brasard

 

[Channelcat]

Bitter fan because his team missed out on said player.

No, I didn't want him in Wpg, and I'm not a fan of any team. Just saying it's cap circumvention. People will choose to view it within their own narrow scopes.

 

[aufheben]

What is shady about it? All 3 teams got things they wanted.

Pitt needed a center.

Ottawa needed to shed cap and stockpile picks/prospects.

Vegas wanted to add punch and used otherwise useless cap space to do so.

3 teams agreeing to a series of trades is not shady in any way. Most of the people complaining cannot seperate their disdain for the Penguins from the reality of the situation.

This is the most complicated and expensive way to acquire a goon I've ever seen.

 

[HandshakeLine]

No, I didn't want him in Wpg, and I'm not a fan of any team. Just saying it's cap circumvention. People will choose to view it within their own narrow scopes.

How is it cap circumvention? All three teams received assets.

 

[HandshakeLine]

This is the most complicated and expensive way to acquire a goon I've ever seen.

Things were getting boring round these parts. GMJR needs to keep his mind alive at the age of 104, so he just lets that inquisitive spirit go where the inspiration takes him.

 

[NewAgeOutlaw]

No, I didn't want him in Wpg, and I'm not a fan of any team. Just saying it's cap circumvention. People will choose to view it within their own narrow scopes.

I'm still waiting for you to explain how this is cap circumvention.

This is the most complicated and expensive way to acquire a goon I've ever seen.

It is only complicated because Ottawa wouldn't retain salary. Presumably, McPhee knew Rutherford needed somebody to retain so he took the opportunity to acquire a player he wanted for his roster.

I really don't see how this is "expensive". McPhee used cap space that is otherwise not going to be used. He gave up nothing to get assets. You can argue until you are blue in the face that those assets aren't very valuable, but the fact is that he gave up nothing of value to obtain them.

 

[aufheben]

I'm still waiting for you to explain how this is cap circumvention.



It is only complicated because Ottawa wouldn't retain salary. Presumably, McPhee knew Rutherford needed somebody to retain so he took the opportunity to acquire a player he wanted for his roster.

I really don't see how this is "expensive". McPhee used cap space that is otherwise not going to be used. He gave up nothing to get assets. You can argue until you are blue in the face that those assets aren't very valuable, but the fact is that he gave up nothing of value to obtain them.

That's how. This transaction may not be "shady" or circumvention but spinning it like this is a reasonable way to go pick up a goon is just as silly.

 

[66-30-33]

Crosby, Malkin, Brassard, Sheahan that's some sick C depth. Looking forward to his 1st game either Tuesday vs Devils or Thursday vs Bruins.

 

[NewAgeOutlaw]

That's how. This transaction may not be "shady" or circumvention but spinning it like this is a reasonable way to go pick up a goon is just as silly.

What is unreasonable about this?

Vegas gets: an nhl player
A 4th round pick

Vegas gives: cap space that wasn't going to be used anyway

What return do you expect Vegas to get out of retaining a few million in salary over 2 years on one contract? A player and a pick seems fairly sufficient to me.

McPhee's entire strategy has been to use the expansion rules and cap space to stockpile assets and picks. Now, people are questioning his motives when he made a trade where he used empty cap space to acquire an asset and a pick. Question: Would people be questioning this trade if the Pens were not involved? Answer: no.

 

[harmonica]

He let them play like that for most of this year.

Whatevs. It's a clever deal for sure. Pens win, Sens win, VGK don't win, but they've already won plenty this season. And now I know why Philly fans so loathe Pens fans. So the board wins too, I guess.

The comment was about the playoffs. Not sure why you are taking it out of context.

Siding with Philly fans is your second mistake.

 

[harmonica]

Then the pens should have kept him and offered up some other player. Vegas has not been bullied by teams. They didn't need Reaves at all. They already have too many forwards and dmen when healthy. GMGM just couldn't help himself from making yet another stupid trade deadline trade that does nothing for his team.

While there is some truth to my comment it was more of a jab/joke at the expense of players who get credited with intangibles; like Toews.

 

[harmonica]

This is the most complicated and expensive way to acquire a goon I've ever seen.

Actually, since they gave up literally and figuratively nothing, it's the cheapest way you have ever seen somebody acquire a goon. Also, he is more of an enforcer than a goon.

 

[Bringer of Jollity]

What is unreasonable about this?

Vegas gets: an nhl player
A 4th round pick

Vegas gives: cap space that wasn't going to be used anyway

What return do you expect Vegas to get out of retaining a few million in salary over 2 years on one contract? A player and a pick seems fairly sufficient to me.

McPhee's entire strategy has been to use the expansion rules and cap space to stockpile assets and picks. Now, people are questioning his motives when he made a trade where he used empty cap space to acquire an asset and a pick. Question: Would people be questioning this trade if the Pens were not involved? Answer: no.

What's unreasonable about it is McPhee should have been able to acquire that player and pick for significantly less value than he gave up, if those pieces were always his end goal. A 4th line/healthy scratch player + mediocre pick isn't worth a 2nd line center with that level of retention. At least I'm guessing that's aufheben's point?

 

[NewAgeOutlaw]

What's unreasonable about it is McPhee should have been able to acquire that player and pick for significantly less value than he gave up, if those pieces were always his end goal. A 4th line/healthy scratch player + mediocre pick isn't worth a 2nd line center with that level of retention. At least I'm guessing that's aufheben's point?

And that would be right if you look at it as Vegas trading Brassard for Reaves and a 4th but that is not what happened. They traded for Brassard so the salary works for Pitt. They can do this because they have cap space. In exchange, they get Reaves and a pick virtually for free.

If they wanted Brassard for themselves, they would have had to best Pitt's offer of Cole, a goaltending prospect, and multiple picks.

 

[BigEezyE22]

I won't be at all surprised if the next CBA adds a rule where you can't retain on a player unless he's been on the team for some set amount of time.

I'd make it so you can only retain real dollars. That way a team can eat 20% of a guy with a $5m hit but $3m salary just to get close to the floor or something.

 

[BigEezyE22]

What's unreasonable about it is McPhee should have been able to acquire that player and pick for significantly less value than he gave up, if those pieces were always his end goal. A 4th line/healthy scratch player + mediocre pick isn't worth a 2nd line center with that level of retention. At least I'm guessing that's aufheben's point?

What value?

He gave up cap space that he wasn't going to use this year and likely not next year.

That extra space doesn't roll over year to year. It be gone right quick.

He got a mid round pick for throw away cap space. He gave up almost zero value.

 

[aufheben]

What's unreasonable about it is McPhee should have been able to acquire that player and pick for significantly less value than he gave up, if those pieces were always his end goal. A 4th line/healthy scratch player + mediocre pick isn't worth a 2nd line center with that level of retention. At least I'm guessing that's aufheben's point?

Pretty much. It's a very weird.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Pretty much. It's a very weird.

It's only weird because it hasn't been done before.

People are way overthinking this trying to find reasons to be mad.