Phoenix CXXII: Drawing a LeBlank

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TheLegend

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Right, but TL ( theres always a "but" huh? :laugh: ) the way theyve reacted, comments since Friday about how "this wouldve been good for ASU, Tempe & the taxpayers, the fans, the players & the organization, for the
future of hockey in Arizona"
(words to that effect) havent they already assigned blame? Started the stone rolling? Just a matter of time before they get to picking up even more stones & throwing them dontchathink?

Well I also believe ASU would have benefited. But the risk was too great for them in light of what's also pending.

They can try to spin it that way however they want, but the majority will never buy it.
 

TheLegend

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Just curious about the timing. If you believe Leblanc, IA and ASU have been discussing this arrangement for over a year. Why wasn't ASU concerned sooner? Withdrawing suddenly at the 11th hour gives the impression that ASU wasn't so much worried about the contents of the bill as they were surprised by the opposition to it.

Because IA was talking and negotiating mainly with Athletics Department people (along with Catellus).

My opinion is the decision to withdraw came from way above them.
 

WildGopher

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Jun 13, 2012
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... yes, and you'd think they'd have learned that shoehorning an NHL club into a Basketball Specific facility is an absolute "no no", lousy Lease or not yet they facilitated precisely that yet again in Brooklyn. These pretensions, that just because a building is brand new with all the amenities & suites etc, that hockey fans will just over-look the fact that the score-clocks hanging over the Blue Line, that one end of the rink is blank, dead-end wall, that they need to see a Chiropractor after attending a game to straighten out there necks & backs.... its just crazy. Like a 40 or 50 something woman who dresses like a 25yr old & buys shoes 2 sizes too small because she thinks its sexy. Meanwhile cutting off circulation, hideously misshaping her internal organs & toes, disabled, crippled and no, that doesnt "look good" to begin with... or the poor woman from Russia... F sized breast implants explode at 30,000' on an Aeroflot flight between Moscow & LA.... Is it really worth it Honey?.... Thats how the NHL operated in this case. Must be totally state of the art and who cares if it squeezes the life out of the team, doesnt fit properly & could wind up killing us.

uh . . . yeah. Something like that, er, analogy. :laugh:


By the way, here's the Arizona House press release announcing the time of Rep. Kern's press conference on bill SB1474 tomorrow - it's at 11:30. We don't know who else, if anyone, might be there in support. Props to Llama for finding news of the conference.

http://www.azleg.gov/press/house/53LEG/1R/170203COYOTESKERN.pdf
 
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MaskedSonja

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Feb 3, 2007
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... yes, and you'd think they'd have learned that shoehorning an NHL club into a Basketball Specific facility is an absolute "no no", lousy Lease or not yet they facilitated precisely that yet again in Brooklyn. These pretensions, that just because a building is brand new with all the amenities & suites etc, that hockey fans will just over-look the fact that the score-clocks hanging over the Blue Line, that one end of the rink is blank, dead-end wall, that they need to see a Chiropractor after attending a game to straighten out there necks & backs.... its just crazy. Like a 40 or 50 something woman who dresses like a 25yr old & buys shoes 2 sizes too small because she thinks its sexy. Meanwhile cutting off circulation, hideously misshaping her internal organs & toes, disabled, crippled and no, that doesnt "look good" to begin with... or the poor woman from Russia... F sized breast implants explode at 30,000' on an Aeroflot flight between Moscow & LA.... Is it really worth it Honey?.... Thats how the NHL operated in this case. Must be totally state of the art and who cares if it squeezes the life out of the team, doesnt fit properly & could wind up killing us.

There are some seriously awesome mental images going on with this.....You have any plans on writing a book someday k? I'll paygood money for an autographed copy :naughty:
 

Killion

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Feb 19, 2010
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Fugu....

Meet the original Agent K. :D
... role played by Tommy Lee Jones, MIB?... Yeah... Weak substitute for the real deal but ok. :laugh:
uh . . . yeah. Something like that, er, analogy. :laugh:
... :D how do you take them seriously when they behave like this, repeatedly? they act like Gold Digging Bimbo's... rockin on the horse sized pills so... yeah... unhuh... www.youtube.com/watch?v=nApfhU0Wwvs ... diggit... boy... pills... thrills chills kills.... must be one Hell of a party going on down there on the Avenue of the Americas...
 

Llama19

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Jan 19, 2013
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...By the way, here's the Arizona House press release announcing the time of Rep. Kern's press conference on bill SB1474 tomorrow - it's at 11:30. We don't know who else, if anyone, might be there in support. Props to Llama for finding news of the conference.

http://www.azleg.gov/press/house/53LEG/1R/170203COYOTESKERN.pdf

Good find digging up the actual release...

Like I said, do not be surprised if you see Rev. Jarrett Maupin there...

Should be quite interesting tomorrow...we will see it one of the local news outlets does a live stream...if so, I will post it...
 

Killion

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Should be quite interesting tomorrow...we will see it one of the local news outlets does a live stream...if so, I will post it...

... errmygawd.... 1001 Ways to Die... New episode.... Cant wait. Wont be able to sleep. :hyper:
 

WildGopher

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Jun 13, 2012
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Good find digging up the actual release...

Like I said, do not be surprised if you see Rev. Jarrett Maupin there...

Should be quite interesting tomorrow...we will see it one of the local news outlets does a live stream...if so, I will post it...

I doubt the news people will stream it live, but it's possible the press conference would be streamed either by the House GOP media people (their press guy's email address is at the bottom of the release - he could be asked), or by Rep. Kern's people on his web site. I'd guess more likely the former. It might help to find out, because it sounds like Killion is going to hype himself up to stay awake for the next 15 hours in anticipation. And that'll mean 15 hours of bizarro alternate-universe posts we'll have to wake up to in the morning. And I'd say the dude needs his rest - from the looks of a couple of his recent posts, badly. And I thought goalies were the ones who didn't get the head bumps!.:nod:
 

Killion

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And I thought goalies were the ones who didn't get the head bumps!.:nod:
... :laugh: no worries. side effects included narcolepsy... though face plants... waking up with the keyboard glued to ones face... trying to explain to people why the letters of the alphabet... numbers.... F5... Delete... indented into your face... yeah, that can be a bit tricky....
 
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blues10

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Dec 10, 2010
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Does anyone know if AEG can sublease the Arena Managemrnt contract to IA? In other words put IA back in charge of GRA with the AMF.

IA may need to rid themselves of Lebeesur and attempt to make a go of it at GRA long term. He should really have not been pouring gasoline on the streets around Westgate while throwing lit matches out the window of his car for the past while.

I find it strange that there are now back-up arena plans when IA tied all of their cans to one apple cart and said no such plans existed. I can't wait to hear of all the new exciting piles of dirt that Tony will be speaking of. :shakehead

For me its GRA or bust. This will certainly test IA's and the NHL BOG's resolve for the market.
 

mesamonster

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Oct 13, 2011
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Scottsdale, AZ.
Because IA was talking and negotiating mainly with Athletics Department people (along with Catellus).

My opinion is the decision to withdraw came from way above them.

Perhaps made by people who bothered to look under the hood of this badly damaged vehicle. To no ones surprise, there was a body and wheels however no engine. For those who looked beyond knee deep this conclusion by ASU should have been reached months ago. Maybe it was and nobody bothered to tell anyone, including the ice clowns.
 

mesamonster

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Oct 13, 2011
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Scottsdale, AZ.
Does anyone know if AEG can sublease the Arena Managemrnt contract to IA? In other words put IA back in charge of GRA with the AMF.

IA may need to rid themselves of Lebeesur and attempt to make a go of it at GRA long term. He should really have not been pouring gasoline on the streets around Westgate while throwing lit matches out the window of his car for the past while.

I find it strange that there are now back-up arena plans when IA tied all of their cans to one apple cart and said no such plans existed. I can't wait to hear of all the new exciting piles of dirt that Tony will be speaking of. :shakehead

For me its GRA or bust. This will certainly test IA's and the NHL BOG's resolve for the market.

Wouldn`t a semi functional organization have fired Tony years ago? The mere fact that he still exists to propose new piles of dirt is beyond extraordinary. If I am Drummond or Barroway, the two who supposedly have money in this venture, why would you want such a fool wasting your hard earned money?
 

Whileee

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May 29, 2010
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Just curious about the timing. If you believe Leblanc, IA and ASU have been discussing this arrangement for over a year. Why wasn't ASU concerned sooner? Withdrawing suddenly at the 11th hour gives the impression that ASU wasn't so much worried about the contents of the bill as they were surprised by the opposition to it.

Or maybe the devil was actually in the details and ASU found out how little IA planned to invest, and how much they expected in subsidies.
 

blues10

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Wouldn`t a semi functional organization have fired Tony years ago? The mere fact that he still exists to propose new piles of dirt is beyond extraordinary. If I am Drummond or Barroway, the two who supposedly have money in this venture, why would you want such a fool wasting your hard earned money?

He should have been let go after mis-judging the length of the runway years ago. For some reason Barroway and Drummond continue to let him steer the ship in public.

Perhaps Leblanc will hit the media tour in the coming weeks to drum up support for the remaining 3 piles of dirt. Shouldn't be a problem funding an arena somewhere in the valley if past explanations are true.

We, as the Coyotes are going to put in a vast sum of money towards the construction of the facility and of course ASU will be participating. But the only thing we’re looking for from government per se, is helping us fund an arena that we believe will fund itself.

https://ca.sports.yahoo.com/news/an...ew-coyotes-arena-puck-daddy-qa-234557811.html
 

TheLegend

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Perhaps made by people who bothered to look under the hood of this badly damaged vehicle. To no ones surprise, there was a body and wheels however no engine. For those who looked beyond knee deep this conclusion by ASU should have been reached months ago. Maybe it was and nobody bothered to tell anyone, including the ice clowns.

Mesa.... think about this for a moment.....

-- The legislation IA wanted to propose appears around last Monday or so.

-- ASU announces the Olympic Village project at Karsten a couple of days later (on Wed, IIRC).

-- A day or so later Governor Ducey proposes legislation that allows all three AZ universities to retain 100% of the sales taxes they generate (basically giving them all a TIF district).

-- Then Friday ASU abruptly withdraws from the arena project with IA.

During that time some legislators (we don't know how many, but might learn that tomorrow) worry about the proposed IA legislation getting intermingled with ASU's current tax rebate setup. Nobody has come out claiming or proving it would but there's some uncertainty about it.

Now.... you really think this was only about the top echelon at ASU (and possibly the Regents) checking under IA's hood??

ASU is about to be handed the keys to one big cash refinery on top of the money fields they already own. The IA partnership is a like a single derrick in all that and it wouldn't put a dent in that cash production. even if it failed. But it could prevent that refinery from happening at all, IF..... it were to eventually become a problem.

This isn't about a single car...... it's about the entire automaker.
 

uhlaw97

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Jun 8, 2011
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Katy, TX
I still can't understand why the NHL remains so committed to that market, when a far larger market like Houston is out there.

Perhaps Billionaire Buyer Tilman Fertitta can fork over the dough.
 

Fairview

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Jan 30, 2016
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Mesa.... think about this for a moment.....

-- The legislation IA wanted to propose appears around last Monday or so.

-- ASU announces the Olympic Village project at Karsten a couple of days later (on Wed, IIRC).

-- A day or so later Governor Ducey proposes legislation that allows all three AZ universities to retain 100% of the sales taxes they generate (basically giving them all a TIF district).

-- Then Friday ASU abruptly withdraws from the arena project with IA.

During that time some legislators (we don't know how many, but might learn that tomorrow) worry about the proposed IA legislation getting intermingled with ASU's current tax rebate setup. Nobody has come out claiming or proving it would but there's some uncertainty about it.

Now.... you really think this was only about the top echelon at ASU (and possibly the Regents) checking under IA's hood??

ASU is about to be handed the keys to one big cash refinery on top of the money fields they already own. The IA partnership is a like a single derrick in all that and it wouldn't put a dent in that cash production. even if it failed. But it could prevent that refinery from happening at all, IF..... it were to eventually become a problem.

This isn't about a single car...... it's about the entire automaker.

This was always the plan for IA. There likely was not going to be enough tax revenue generated in IA's plan to pay for the arena plus cover the team's multi-million in annual losses in their proposed district, fantasy hotel or not. I can't believe that it took so long for ASU to come to their senses.
 

cbcwpg

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May 18, 2010
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Just curious about the timing. If you believe Leblanc, IA and ASU have been discussing this arrangement for over a year. Why wasn't ASU concerned sooner? Withdrawing suddenly at the 11th hour gives the impression that ASU wasn't so much worried about the contents of the bill as they were surprised by the opposition to it.

Just speculating, and I think some would agree, but I would guess that the higer-ups at ASU got a phone call from someone of power or on the inside of gov't, that basically told ASU.... you let IA hitch their wagon to the ASU horse, we will shoot the horse.
 

SunDancer

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I'll disagree that this isn't a concerning issue. The team had $25 MM per year from COG, and then $15 MM (minus what goes back to COG) for that entire time. LeBlanc totally screwed up with the city, lost the lease and subsidy and then blasted them for what was apparently the franchise's unwillingness to give data to the city they were owed. Now his lead arena project just blew up in his face.

I also found it interesting that he has finally said Glendale is just a bad location for the team, yet they have nothing that is available any time soon. And no subsidies.

There was always talk of some kind of subsidy for a potential owner but the gap year I was specifically referring to was the lockout shortened season before IA took ownership. Glendale agreed to pay $25M in 2010 for the 10/11 season and again in 2011 for the 11/12 season (a payment they had trouble making) but heading into the lockout in 2012 there was no "insurance" from Glendale. That season the NHL alone covered the team's losses. Not sure what the AMF was for 12/13 (or if there even was one) but IA's $15M didn't kick in until 13/14.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sports/hockey/glendale-mayor-talks-tough-on-nhl/article4097946/

Also don't put too much stock into what Leblanc has said about Glendale in the past. He's just a sleazeball who will say or do anything that benefits him at the time. He's constantly posturing and if it suits his purpose to make nice with the city, he will. Recall the vitriol Leblanc spewed when Glendale moved to cancel the lease and then there he was a few months later shaking the mayor's hand and talking about growing revenues for Westgate.

I'm not saying the Coyotes' issues aren't concerning ... just that their situation has been more precarious in the past and they've always managed to stick around.
 

MNNumbers

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Nov 17, 2011
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Does anyone know if AEG can sublease the Arena Managemrnt contract to IA? In other words put IA back in charge of GRA with the AMF.

IA may need to rid themselves of Lebeesur and attempt to make a go of it at GRA long term. He should really have not been pouring gasoline on the streets around Westgate while throwing lit matches out the window of his car for the past while.

I find it strange that there are now back-up arena plans when IA tied all of their cans to one apple cart and said no such plans existed. I can't wait to hear of all the new exciting piles of dirt that Tony will be speaking of. :shakehead

For me its GRA or bust. This will certainly test IA's and the NHL BOG's resolve for the market.

Present lease with AEG seems to give CoG some review rights with anything to do with Coyotes.

Present rent terms with Coyotes:
Team pays 500K rent
City pays 500K annually in arena maintenance/upgrades and this is growing to 1M
Team gets use of arena for practice time (doesn't need separate practice facility)
Team gets free office space
Team gets ONLY game night concessions, etc, which include parking fees.
Team gets 80% of Arena Naming Rights

Present terms with CoG/AEG

City puts a set amount into the operating fund:
5.6M/yr
All arena receipts go into the same fund.
Arena costs are taken from the fund - it's an operating fund.
If Fund is insufficient, it's on AEG to finance the rest.
If, at end of year, there are $$ remaining, they are split between AEG and CoG according to a formula. Details not so important for this post, except that AEG gets first dibs - that is, the first 750K goes to them.

To restore the AMF to the Coyotes would be problematical for several reasons:

1- COG probably doesn't want to leave IA responsible for any record keeping, when they were so remiss earlier about that. This idea is further backed up by the fact that in the first year after the 15M/yr lease was cancelled, the terms were a flat fee paid to IA, with no record keeping required. In other words, COG doesn't believe IA is able to keep good records.

2- Where would the money come from? There is no provision by which AEG can give IA $$ directly from the city, so that kind of 'subsidy' is out. The money would have to come from the operating fund.

3- Since the $$ coming out of the operating fund goes( 1- a piece to AEG, 2- A piece to COG, 3- a completely shared piece to AEG/COG, 4- profit to AEG), then anything AEG offers to IA comes from their pockets, not that of COG. That means that AEG, the operator, would effectively be subsidizing the team. That's very unlikely.
 

GuelphStormer

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Mar 20, 2012
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Guelph, ON
Just speculating, and I think some would agree, but I would guess that the higer-ups at ASU got a phone call from someone of power or on the inside of gov't, that basically told ASU.... you let IA hitch their wagon to the ASU horse, we will shoot the horse.
I would tend to agree. voting to allow a university to raise funds for much needed infrastructure is one thing ... allowing them to then subsidize construction of a new arena for this sundry bunch is very different.

I also have to wonder if the timing of ASU's statement last Friday was intentionally designed to get out in front of a) expected legislator opposition to the bill at this news conference today, and b) expected public opposition to further subsidies of this sadsack franchise.

ASU saves the bill by ditching this team of professionally ungrateful beggars.
 
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