GDT: Philly vs. Blues | 7pm CST ESPN+ & Hulu

[Mike Liut]

Here we go with the "we gotta be big and mean" thing again. So what do we just trade away all of our skill for a bunch of grinders?

There’s a reason the Leafs can’t make it past rd 1 every year

 

[Linkens Mastery]

There’s a reason the Leafs can’t make it past rd 1 every year

There's a reason a team like the Islanders arent making the playoffs as well.

 

[Blueston]

There's a reason a team like the Islanders arent making the playoffs as well.

The best teams have skill and grind. When we play like that we are among the best. But that is hard way to play and we seem hesitant to pay that price on consistent basis.

 

[BlueDream]

There's a reason a team like the Islanders arent making the playoffs as well.

You mean the team that made it to the Eastern Conference Finals in both of the last two seasons?

Maybe not the best example to use.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

You mean the team that made it to the Eastern Conference Finals in both of the last two seasons?

Maybe not the best example to use.

They also had more skill players the past couple years. They went a more defensive route and it's not worked out greatly for them.

 

[BlueMed]

There’s a reason the Leafs can’t make it past rd 1 every year

That has a lot more to do with their cap issues and their inability to afford any forward depth, defensive depth, or quality goaltending than Marner not willing to battle out there.

 

[Mike Liut]

That has a lot more to do with their cap issues and their inability to afford any forward depth, defensive depth, or quality goaltending than Marner not willing to battle out there.

They’re a soft team

 

[BlueMed]

They’re a soft team

Being soft isn't just about playing physical. The 2019 Blues like the prior Kings and Bruins won with physicality, but teams like the Blackhawks, Lightning, and Red Wings won with speed and skill. This Leafs have been losing because they don't fight back against adversity (in addition to their lack of depth and poor cap/roster structure), and that's a leadership issue within their club, the same issue Carolina has had as well.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

They’re a soft team

Ok? Look at Tampa Bay, they aren't a pure grind team and they've won the past two cups, Calgary and Avs are considered the top two teams in the West, they aren't pure grind teams, Carolina and Florida aren't pure grind teams. You need both skill and grind. Going to far one way either makes you enept at scoring or a leaky mess. Even our 2019 cup team wasn't a pure grind team. If you want to see a pure grind team look at all of the Hitchcock teams that went absolutely nowhere.

 

[Mike Liut]

Ok? Look at Tampa Bay, they aren't a pure grind team and they've won the past two cups, Calgary and Avs are considered the top two teams in the West, they aren't pure grind teams, Carolina and Florida aren't pure grind teams. You need both skill and grind. Going to far one way either makes you enept at scoring or a leaky mess. Even our 2019 cup team wasn't a pure grind team. If you want to see a pure grind team look at all of the Hitchcock teams that went absolutely nowhere.

When did I say pure grind. Re-read my posts

 

[Mike Liut]

Skill and speed are fine, but you better play a full 200 foot game with it.

This is why I said

 

[Linkens Mastery]

I’ll tell you exactly the problem with this team. We have got away from our identity of a heavy team that plays physical. We’ve added guys like Kyrou, Thomas and Saad to the team and we have lost our identity. We are relying on skill and speed and that’s not who we are. Too many nights they don’t want to put in the hard and try to win with speed and skill. We aren’t skilled enough to win that way regularly, especially when we aren’t getting .930 save percentage nightly.

You also said this before hand. Your blaming 3 players. Two of which are our most pure skilled players. When you have players like RoR, Perron, Tarasenko, Schenn, Parayko, and other VETERANS who are playing like lazy bums.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

Until RoR, Perron, Tarasenko and Parayko are no longer here they are supposed to be leading by example. All of them are constantly 1/2 assing it because they want to try to outscore their problems. I have never seen veteran players who want to sleep walk through 80% of the game, pop in a goal, then sleep walk the rest of the game.

 

[Mike Liut]

You also said this before hand. Your blaming 3 players. Two of which are our most pure skilled players. When you have players like RoR, Perron, Tarasenko, Schenn, Parayko, and other VETERANS who are playing like lazy bums.

I mentioned those 3 players who weren’t part of the cup core. I didn’t mean to single them out primarily. I was just saying adding those 3 players have made us less physical than we were. We are getting smaller and less physical as a group year by year.

 

[Mike Liut]

Until RoR, Perron, Tarasenko and Parayko are no longer here they are supposed to be leading by example. All of them are constantly 1/2 assing it because they want to try to outscore their problems. I have never seen veteran players who want to sleep walk through 80% of the game, pop in a goal, then sleep walk the rest of the game.

Yep, those players are part of the problem too.

 

[Mike Liut]

We seldom out work other teams, it ever. I’m not saying you don’t need skill and speed, but you players who play both ends of the ice and this group doesn’t do that.

 

[Mike Liut]

I just don’t know anymore. Do we need defenders who can skate the puck out, or do we need physical defenders who can defend and clear the crease? I just don’t know anymore.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

Yep, those players are part of the problem too.

And these are the players we're supposed to be pinpointing. Not the 22 year old who's just starting to grow to his body and potential and the 23 year old in his second year NHLer playing the most games he's ever played against men. They are super young and still learning. You aren't going to be a perfect NHLer overnight.

Tarasenko didn't hit 30 goals until his 3rd year in the league, And Kyrou is well on his way to destroying Tarasenko's Sophmore year production. (VT 64GP-21G-22A-43P vs JK 59GP-22G-39A-61P)

 

[Linkens Mastery]

I just don’t know anymore. Do we need defenders who can skate the puck out, or do we need physical defenders who can defend and clear the crease? I just don’t know anymore.

You need both, you also need solid smooth skating defenseman as well tho. We have the physical defenders in Bortuzzo and Mikkola, We have a steadfast smooth skaters in Parayko and Faulk, and we have an amazing PPQB in Krug. This issue is, This is Mikkola's first real year, and Bortuzzo should be the #7. We also have a lumbering oaf who can't pass to save his life in Scandella. Army needs to remake the Defense this offseason and ship out Scandella.

Parayko needs a defensively responsible partner that can pass the puck out of the zone. Leddy is like putting a Square Block in a Rectangular hole right now. He fits, but, he doesn't fully fill the hole. He is smooth skating and can pass the puck, but he's missing the defensive abilities.

We also need a defensively responsible RHD that can get the puck out of the zone for the 3rd pairing as well.

????-Parayko
Krug-Faulk
Mikkola-????
Bortuzzo

 

[Mike Liut]

You need both, you also need solid smooth skating defenseman as well tho. We have the physical defenders in Bortuzzo and Mikkola, We have a steadfast smooth skaters in Parayko and Faulk, and we have an amazing PPQB in Krug. This issue is, This is Mikkola's first real year, and Bortuzzo should be the #7. We also have a lumbering oaf who can't pass to save his life in Scandella. Army needs to remake the Defense this offseason and ship out Scandella.

Parayko needs a defensively responsible partner that can pass the puck out of the zone. Leddy is like putting a Square Block in a Rectangular hole right now. He fits, but, he doesn't fully fill the hole. He is smooth skating and can pass the puck, but he's missing the defensive abilities.

We also need a defensively responsible RHD that can get the puck out of the zone for the 3rd pairing as well.

????-Parayko
Krug-Faulk
Mikkola-????
Bortuzzo

I don’t disagree with anything you said

 

[Linkens Mastery]

I don’t disagree with anything you said

Sorry for coming off aggressive today. I just don't understand seeing some people wanting to throw all the blame on Kyrou and Thomas (mainly Kyrou) when the Captains and A. Captains should be scrutinized the most.

 

[Mike Liut]

Sorry for coming off aggressive today. I just don't understand seeing some people wanting to throw all the blame on Kyrou and Thomas (mainly Kyrou) when the Captains and A. Captains should be scrutinized the most.

It just seemed like that because I only mentioned the 3 newest players from the cup team. I was only making a point that we are getting smaller and smaller and less physical each year. Which is a trend I’m not a fan of.

 

[Blueston]

And these are the players we're supposed to be pinpointing. Not the 22 year old who's just starting to grow to his body and potential and the 23 year old in his second year NHLer playing the most games he's ever played against men. They are super young and still learning. You aren't going to be a perfect NHLer overnight.

Tarasenko didn't hit 30 goals until his 3rd year in the league, And Kyrou is well on his way to destroying Tarasenko's Sophmore year production. (VT 64GP-21G-22A-43P vs JK 59GP-22G-39A-61P)

Criticizing Kyrou and Thomas isn’t saying to trade them or that they won’t improve. It’s saying they can do more and we want to see it. That is how winning cultures are built, getting the young talent to buy in. That is why they need to be accountable. I think Berube is really good at this. But there is learning curve and can be painful.

What this team really seems to miss is an identity line. Bozo wasn’t right center fir 4th line. Neither is brown I don’t think. Would like to see Joshua back.

 

[Blueston]

You need both, you also need solid smooth skating defenseman as well tho. We have the physical defenders in Bortuzzo and Mikkola, We have a steadfast smooth skaters in Parayko and Faulk, and we have an amazing PPQB in Krug. This issue is, This is Mikkola's first real year, and Bortuzzo should be the #7. We also have a lumbering oaf who can't pass to save his life in Scandella. Army needs to remake the Defense this offseason and ship out Scandella.

Parayko needs a defensively responsible partner that can pass the puck out of the zone. Leddy is like putting a Square Block in a Rectangular hole right now. He fits, but, he doesn't fully fill the hole. He is smooth skating and can pass the puck, but he's missing the defensive abilities.

We also need a defensively responsible RHD that can get the puck out of the zone for the 3rd pairing as well.

????-Parayko
Krug-Faulk
Mikkola-????
Bortuzzo

I would withhold judgment on whether Leddy is answer. I’d rather have sanheim or Provo, sure, but if Leddy can handle it and is willing to take pay cut that could be option. Transition play is far more important than rigged defense, no matter how much we want it not to be.

 

[ScratchCatFever]

Sorry for coming off aggressive today. I just don't understand seeing some people wanting to throw all the blame on Kyrou and Thomas (mainly Kyrou) when the Captains and A. Captains should be scrutinized the most.

I haven't seen anyone scrutinize a singular player over another for the overall team play other than the people unloading all of their toxicity on Binnington. If you're still hung up on my harmless comment on Perron shadowing Kyrou you grossly misread the intent of that opinion.

It seems we all pretty much agree we are struggling to find our balance between skill and speed and tight and heavy on a night to night basis and running out of time to carve out a solid identity.
What is the tune going to be on the thread tomorrow if we come out and dominate Carolina and win 4-1?