Phantoms (AHL), Reading Royals (ECHL), NCAA, Juniors, Int'l, etc. IV

[FatTugboatFlahr]

You're actually in love with Kostalek.

 

[Jtown]

You're actually in love with Kostalek.

NO but i am tired of people on this board trying to rip on his play to make MORIN look good.

when Appleyard says Morin played bad, and Kostalek played bad it makes it seem as if they played at the same level. ANd if you watched that game and paid attention to how brutal morin was you would laugh at that assesement.

 

[Appleyard]

who do you think played better between the two?

Kostalek offensively. Morin defensively.

Morin had less overall influence on the game... but Kostalek had biggerboth positive and negative.

They both had up and down games, but Morins ups and downs were not so high and not so low.

The worst thing for the team was that both played a game better than ~2 other Rimouski Dmen tonight.

EDIT: Morins game 'brutal'... at worst it was middling to below average. For me Gauthier was the only Rimouski player who constantly stood out positively.

 

[Striiker]

wow , tripod your assesment of morin's game and kostalek and bourque's game is something that i couldn't disagree more with.

Morin was pretty brutal in that game and did nothing note worthy. Meanwhile kostalek again had another big goal.

Let's not be one of those fanbases that feels the need to rip other players to deflect blame from our own player.

You're going too far the opposite way to compensate for what doesn't exist.

You praise Kostalek for a mediocre game where he was trash in the 3rd but act like Morin was atrocious when in reality he broke even on the good-bad scale. He had his poor moments, but he also had some good ones.

Plus, Kostaleks "big goal" was complete luck. He shot bottom right, hit the guy laying on the ice square in the ass cheek, and it deflected top left. It was big for the team, but it wasn't like he did anything impressive himself other then get lucky.

 

[Appleyard]

NO but i am tired of people on this board trying to rip on his play to make MORIN look good.

when Appleyard says Morin played bad, and Kostalek played bad it makes it seem as if they played at the same level. ANd if you watched that game and paid attention to how brutal morin was you would laugh at that assesement.

Pot kettle black.

Speaking of kettles I wonder if Couturier is a proponent of the Kettlebell weight? He probably should have been on the 24kg Kettles instead of winning Gold in Prague...

 

[Jtown]

Kostalek offensively. Morin defensively.

Morin had less overall influence on the game... but Kostalek had biggerboth positive and negative.

They both had up and down games, but Morins ups and downs were not so high and not so low.

The worst thing for the team was that both played a game better than ~2 other Rimouski Dmen tonight.

EDIT: Morins game 'brutal'... at worst it was middling to below average. For me Gauthier was the only Rimouski player who constantly stood out positively.

appleyard , he played 5 shifts in the 2nd. IN each shift he commited an terrible play.

Chek out his brutal play at 13:12 which led to a shot in the slot all along, all of his turnover.

NO morin did not play well on defense today.

 

[Jtown]

Pot kettle black.

Speaking of kettles I wonder if Couturier is a proponent of the Kettlebell weight? He probably should have been on the 24kg Kettles instead of winning Gold in Prague...

appleyard i expected something better from you then trying to derail this thread into a discussion about coots.

hey if you can point out kostalek's bad plays on d , i would love to go back and view them . SO far you have named two.

 

[Jtown]

You're going too far the opposite way to compensate for what doesn't exist.

You praise Kostalek for a mediocre game where he was trash in the 3rd but act like Morin was atrocious when in reality he broke even on the good-bad scale. He had his poor moments, but he also had some good ones.

Plus, Kostaleks "big goal" was complete luck. He shot bottom right, hit the guy laying on the ice square in the ass cheek, and it deflected top left. It was big for the team, but it wasn't like he did anything impressive himself other then get lucky.

striiker morin was not good at all this game.

kostaleks shot may have been luck but this is hockey , shots like that happen all the time.

 

[Appleyard]

appleyard i expected something better from you then trying to derail this thread into a discussion about coots.

hey if you can point out kostalek's bad plays on d , i would love to go back and view them . SO far you have named two.

Wow... someone derailing a thread into a Couturier discussion? I suppose you do have experience spotting/instigating that. I was merely pointing out how hypocritical you are being when it is quite clear to most here that you have historically been extremely hard on some players, while thinking the sun shines out of others arses.

The play leading to the PP against was not so smart either. Heck, I was not intending some Morin vs Kostalek ****. I did not even post in the prospect thread on Morin for that reason all year.

No one else before you actually linked Kostaleks and Morins play in a post directly (just passed comment on how they believed they had played, I dont believe they intended a pissing match)... you were the one who initiated with the reply to Tripod. Everyone else was just talking about a game we saw and how we thought guys played!

 

[Striiker]

striiker morin was not good at all this game.

kostaleks shot may have been luck but this is hockey , shots like that happen all the time.

He had some very nice breakout passes and wasn't as even nearly as bad defensively as you're making it seem.

And yes, I know luck is a huge part of hockey, but you can't act like a goal was some amazing play by him when it was complete luck. Yes, of course it doesn't happen without him taking the shot, but the worst player to ever play the game could have done the same thing and it doesn't make him a good player.

 

[Jtown]

He had some very nice breakout passes and wasn't as even nearly as bad defensively as you're making it seem.

And yes, I know luck is a huge part of hockey, but you can't act like a goal was some amazing play by him when it was complete luck. Yes, of course it doesn't happen without him taking the shot, but the worst player to ever play the game could have done the same thing and it doesn't make him a good player.

striiker do you have hockey streams?

 

[Appleyard]

Anyway... what about Gauthier. I have always wanted to dislike his game and I know he is a guy a lot of people rag on but every-time I watch him I like the guy more. He is not going to be more than a 3rd liner realistically, and probably only a 4th... but his D is awesome, great on the dot and hustles so hard.

Would not be surprised to see him in 5 years being the best 4C in the game. Maybe not what people expect of a 1st rounder... but even if he becomes only that it is a very valuable player.

 

[Striiker]

striiker do you have hockey streams?

Unfortunately no, I just found a Sportsnet stream somewhere.

And to be clear, I'm not saying Morin had a great game or that Kostalek had a bad game. I'm just saying I disagree with how bad you think Morin was and how good you thought Kostalek was, I think it was a lot closer than you're making it seem. But I don't really feel like getting into an argument about it. I said what I thought and we're not going to agree so no point in arguing.

 

[Jtown]

Unfortunately no, I just found a Sportsnet stream somewhere.

And to be clear, I'm not saying Morin had a great game or that Kostalek had a bad game. I'm just saying I disagree with how bad you think Morin was and how good you thought Kostalek was, I think it was a lot closer than you're making it seem. But I don't really feel like getting into an argument about it. I said what I thought and we're not going to agree so no point in arguing.

well said.

 

[Stizzle]

Morin post game interview in French if anyone wants to translate...

http://www.fm93.com/lecteur/audio/echos-de-vestiaire-de-la-coupe-memorial-samuel-m-273220.mp3

 

[Prongo]

Oh snap getting heated in dis piece

 

[Mayo Masseuse]

Morin post game interview in French if anyone wants to translate...

http://www.fm93.com/lecteur/audio/echos-de-vestiaire-de-la-coupe-memorial-samuel-m-273220.mp3

He talks about his disinterest with interviews and only enjoys playing in the playoffs to delude drunken fans into thinking he is performing poorly.

 

[Tripod]

wow , tripod your assesment of morin's game and kostalek and bourque's game is something that i couldn't disagree more with.

Morin was pretty brutal in that game and did nothing note worthy. Meanwhile kostalek again had another big goal.

Let's not be one of those fanbases that feels the need to rip other players to deflect blame from our own player.

To me, your assessment shows how biased you are.

Bourque left his man off the faceoff and let his guy in alone to score a goal. Then later, guy comes in 1-2 on Bourque and he shoots it at the net, neither guy tied him up, he scores on a rebound. Kostalek tried a poke check at the blue line and missed the puck.

How the hell is that playing good?

1st period Morin played a very simple game...I even said "Period over. Morin played mistake free. Had lots of outlet passes that were right on the tape." flyershockey said the exact same thing.

Kostalek did nothing on the 5-3 to control the PP and set it up properly.

Then I also said in the 2nd period: "Morin not taking any chances. Making the smart play all the time. Always looking for the outlet pass. Made 1 rush then passed off. He hasn't ventured in further than the blue line. No pinching so far.

Edit: then just had a giveaway that led to a good chance and took a big hit knocking him down."

And this: "Yup. Looked bad. Other guys left Morin on his own with the 2 guys though."

That was most of my comments thru the game about Morin. There were some others about Bourque being brutal and Kostalek with another giveaway.

IMO, Morin had a good 1st, bad 2nd and even 3rd....hence even game.

You in turn think Bourque and Kostalek were good even though they directly were responsible for 1 goal against and Bourque for 2 against.

And TBH, they were on for a 3rd goal against, but I cannot remember it off hand. Edit: it was the 2nd goal scored right off the faceoff...no one to blame.

Kostalek for sure was more willing to skate with the puck. Morin instead opted for a pass. I don't think he missed a pass the whole 1st period. He had 1clearing attempt that looked like it was going to an Oshawa guy but it bounced of the boards by him and right to the Rimouski teammate. Who knows if planned or not.

And in reality, you proved my point. All you remember are the mistakes he made, none of the good plays. Yet you ignore all the mistakes Bourque and Kostalek made. And that is why you have guys saying you are biased.

 

[Origina1Master]

Anyway... what about Gauthier. I have always wanted to dislike his game and I know he is a guy a lot of people rag on but every-time I watch him I like the guy more. He is not going to be more than a 3rd liner realistically, and probably only a 4th... but his D is awesome, great on the dot and hustles so hard.

Would not be surprised to see him in 5 years being the best 4C in the game. Maybe not what people expect of a 1st rounder... but even if he becomes only that it is a very valuable player.

I agree, his D is awesome and he often gets himself in pretty good position on O. But man the kid has no finish. It's actually quite hilarious to watch; and this is at the junior level! I agree he could be your ideal 4c, and if all goes well a good 3c. It would be nice if he was more physical though. It kinda hurts to spend a 1st on him though. How have the guys taken below him looked? I could just check his draft but I'm being lazy haha.

 

[bennysflyers16]

Pvr d the game and read this thread before watching. Was expecting to see Niedermayer and Igor Ulanov.

Someone's bias and hatred of Morin is really clouding his judgement. Neither guy was overly impressive and to say one was so much better is insanity.

 

[Jtown]

Pvr d the game and read this thread before watching. Was expecting to see Niedermayer and Igor Ulanov.

Someone's bias and hatred of Morin is really clouding his judgement. Neither guy was overly impressive and to say one was so much better is insanity.

i don't hate morin at all. Wtf are u talking about? I am just being honest here. If you want i broke down his mistakes per period . I can give you the times if you want to go back and watch.

 

[phil162888]

To me, your assessment shows how biased you are.

Bourque left his man off the faceoff and let his guy in alone to score a goal. Then later, guy comes in 1-2 on Bourque and he shoots it at the net, neither guy tied him up, he scores on a rebound. Kostalek tried a poke check at the blue line and missed the puck.

How the hell is that playing good?

1st period Morin played a very simple game...I even said "Period over. Morin played mistake free. Had lots of outlet passes that were right on the tape." flyershockey said the exact same thing.

Kostalek did nothing on the 5-3 to control the PP and set it up properly.

Then I also said in the 2nd period: "Morin not taking any chances. Making the smart play all the time. Always looking for the outlet pass. Made 1 rush then passed off. He hasn't ventured in further than the blue line. No pinching so far.

Edit: then just had a giveaway that led to a good chance and took a big hit knocking him down."

And this: "Yup. Looked bad. Other guys left Morin on his own with the 2 guys though."

That was most of my comments thru the game about Morin. There were some others about Bourque being brutal and Kostalek with another giveaway.

IMO, Morin had a good 1st, bad 2nd and even 3rd....hence even game.

You in turn think Bourque and Kostalek were good even though they directly were responsible for 1 goal against and Bourque for 2 against.

And TBH, they were on for a 3rd goal against, but I cannot remember it off hand. Edit: it was the 2nd goal scored right off the faceoff...no one to blame.

Kostalek for sure was more willing to skate with the puck. Morin instead opted for a pass. I don't think he missed a pass the whole 1st period. He had 1clearing attempt that looked like it was going to an Oshawa guy but it bounced of the boards by him and right to the Rimouski teammate. Who knows if planned or not.

And in reality, you proved my point. All you remember are the mistakes he made, none of the good plays. Yet you ignore all the mistakes Bourque and Kostalek made. And that is why you have guys saying you are biased.

This is 100% a fair assessment of the game after just watching it (pvr). Morin was good in the first and decent in the 3rd. He had 2 bad shifts in the second and only played 5 shifts because he got into a fight!! Anyway his outlet passes and board work are strong. This guys game should translate extremely well into the NHL even if there's bumps on the road! Kostalek is a good player as well and if anything his good play (i would assume) has hurt Morin's offensive development as he's getting the first line pp time. If Morin's big shot can translate onto the PP we have ourselves a great player if not he should be a solid physical top 4 defensive dman that should work perfect with an offensive type dman as his partner..

 

[Tripod]

This is 100% a fair assessment of the game after just watching it (pvr). Morin was good in the first and decent in the 3rd. He had 2 bad shifts in the second and only played 5 shifts because he got into a fight!! Anyway his outlet passes and board work are strong. This guys game should translate extremely well into the NHL even if there's bumps on the road! Kostalek is a good player as well and if anything his good play (i would assume) has hurt Morin's offensive development as he's getting the first line pp time. If Morin's big shot can translate onto the PP we have ourselves a great player if not he should be a solid physical top 4 defensive dman that should work perfect with an offensive type dman as his partner..

Thanks. I think it was quite fair.

I did notice that the "5 shifts" was being said over and over, yet a certain someone ignored 5 minute penalty. Almost as if they were trying to mislead.

Anyways, that was how I saw things. Others think he was brutal all game....which simply isn't true.

 

[Jtown]

samuel morin. 12 shifts in the first. I have him down with 3 mistakes including getting beat on the outside by mccarron for a prime shot.

2nd period 6 shifts. 18:45 Bad pass , had a teammate wide open
16:16 mishandled pass leads to team getting pinned in their own zone for a prime scoring opportunity
13:12 turnover led to the best shot of the game
1:49- 1:30- A series of mistakes which begin by him bailing on a pinch and failing to get it deep because he was going to get hit. Loses track of smith for a point blank shot. Fails to defend smith who makes a pass to mccarrron for a point blank shot.


Go ahead, watch . I am not pulling this out of the air. I want morin to succeed just as much as the next person, but i am not going to let that cloud what i see.

 

[phil162888]

samuel morin. 12 shifts in the first. I have him down with 3 mistakes including getting beat on the outside by mccarron for a prime shot.

2nd period 6 shifts. 18:45 Bad pass , had a teammate wide open
16:16 mishandled pass leads to team getting pinned in their own zone for a prime scoring opportunity
13:12 turnover led to the best shot of the game
1:49- 1:30- A series of mistakes which begin by him bailing on a pinch and failing to get it deep because he was going to get hit. Loses track of smith for a point blank shot. Fails to defend smith who makes a pass to mccarrron for a point blank shot.


Go ahead, watch . I am not pulling this out of the air. I want morin to succeed just as much as the next person, but i am not going to let that cloud what i see.

Your expectations of a defencemen are so wrong. If he allows a player to go to the outside and take a shot from a bad angle that is actually a good play! Why not comment about the 30 great breakout passes why not talk about the board battles where he used his body to seperate the puck and then clear the zone like a man against boys! He was not on for one goal against thats the stat that matters the most.

He has few weaknesses that I can see (1) He makes such great outlet passes that sometimes he either holds on to the puck too long or he makes a pass that a pro player can or should take but a guy in junior may struggle with (similar to Luke Schenn but not as bad) (2) Because of his size he can lose track of the puck in the crease (if its in his feet etc) (3) small speedy players with low centers of gravity that take him to the outside can be difficult for him to gain position on (didn't happen last night) (4) Doesn't have confidence carrying the puck once he gains the zone (just like Coburn he can wheel the puck out but once he's in the zone he usually dumps it in the corner) (5) Going back to the passes like Luke he sometimes tries to lift his head up and look for a breakout pass in dangerous situations instead of just rifling the puck out. This causes the turnovers as players tie up his stick and he gets flustered

Strengths.
(1) Wing span is off the charts. if you haven't caught him off balance its almost impossible to get around him (like Pronger,Hedman,Chara)
(2) Board work is exceptional (wins a ton of board battles)
(3) Outlet passes are NHL calibre (always looking for a great break out pass)
(4) Hard blistering shot
(5) Tough as nails. extremely physical when he needs or wants to be. He is and will be an intimidating presence
(6) Good speed for his size (Not as good as Coburn but maybe like Hedman)
(7) Uses his size to shield the puck as he's carrying it out of the zone (like Coburn)

Still Learning not to be overly physical so he's not always in the box (this has probably hurt his game in junior but will be a plus in the pro's going up against NHL size players he won't have to worry about penalties for picking on small players)

Just a quick assessment on the 15-20 games i've seen him play over the past two years