Post-Game Talk: | Pens vs Isles | Shootout loss

[Glamor Toad]

Sully’s been playing the long con. He actually fell in love with Riiko’s play a coupke years ago but decided to stash him in the press box and WBS until the right moment to unleash him on an unsuspecting league. He’ll no doubt be up with the big team cleaning the crease and leading the power play in the playoffs. At least I can dream of a fix for our defense.

It's allllllll coming together now!

 

[DesertedPenguin]

Did Kap touch the ice at all in 3 v 3 Overtime?

No, but most teams don't use more than 6 forwards in OT and the Penguins also had an extended delayed penalty/power play.

Penguins used Crosby/Guentzel, Rakell/Carter, Blueger/Zucker. The Isles took the penalty while Blueger and Zucker were on the ice. The power play was Crosby, Guentzel, Rakell and Letang. Zucker and Carter were the duo that followed after it expired.

 

[td_ice]

For me this one was a win.
Rakell 5 assists in last 2 games. Outstanding again, all over the ice.
I had a really good feeling about how Rakell's game would work with Guentzel's and they've delivered in spades so far.
If you're Sullivan and you break them up, you're nuts.

Yeah Rakell comes as advertised from Ducks fans. In that Rakell, paired with an elite center will do well, they told us. So far so good.

Also remember Shane,O'Brein, ex player, now on,nhln radio, saying, "Pittsburgh fans, you're gonna love Rakell's game. He's gonna do well there."

 

[ColePens]

Rak using his body for protecting the puck is awesome. I love what he brings.

Dare I say I've loved Zucker when he has been healthy as of late, too.

 

[Al Smith]

It's allllllll coming together now!

Sometimes all of the clues are out there for everyone to see. Have I told you my theory on the link between the Lines of Nazca and Stanley Cup winners in years ending in prime numbers?

 

[Andy99]

Rak using his body for protecting the puck is awesome. I love what he brings.

Dare I say I've loved Zucker when he has been healthy as of late, too.

I love what he brings too and he’s actually a better playmaker than shooter…but that’s the trouble…we need finishers and that’s what he was claimed to be and why we supposedly got him,but he’s really not…he’s a good player in this system but I don’t see the goal scoring prowess…hopefully we get contributions from more players along these lines in the POs

 

[gdsmack267]

I have never called out Sid on his effort but that shootout attempt was one of the most ridiculous things ive seen in pro sports. He looked annoyed he had to go out there. Also maybe Sullivan needs to mix it up for once in the shootouts. What is it now? like 7 lost points to shootout losses?

 

[Turin]

Rakell > Rust I said what I said

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

Rakell > Rust I said what I said

Individually no, Rust is the better player

But Centers/linemates matter

 

[Glamor Toad]

Sometimes all of the clues are out there for everyone to see. Have I told you my theory on the link between the Lines of Nazca and Stanley Cup winners in years ending in prime numbers?

That's old hat. The new theory is that it's Big Foots all the way down

 

[jmelm]

I heard he wanted 7 over 5 years. Then there was rumor is it was 3 years he wanted more

This is negotiating 101. Letang asks for 5 years at 7.something, so it stands to reason that if someone was going to offer him less term, he’d want a higher AAV. If I were him I’d do the same thing.

But that’s just a negotiating tactic. He knows a team (be it PIT, MTL or someone else) isn’t just going to meet his ask, so if that’s his starting point, he will come down on what he’ll accept to some extent.

I never heard he wanted a 3 year deal, I’ve only heard 5 years being his ask. It doesn’t mean he’ll get 5 years, and it also doesn’t mean he necessarily wants to commit to playing into his 40s. Maybe he’s asking for 5 knowing it could be front loaded & signing-bonus heavy and that he could retire after 3 or 4 years if he wants and pocket a large portion of that 5 year money.

As I’ve said before, my personal opinion would be to give him 4 or 5 years (as well as front loaded + signing bonus heavy) to keep the AAV as low as possible. Paying him 8 or 8.5 in a flat cap world given our cap situation would really hinder us from doing all the other things we’d want to do.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

So there is not much on the team defense aspect that makes me believe this team can win a best of 7 against anyone except for the fact the playoffs are wild and unexpected. But i think the stat was something like 14 of the last 15 SC winners were over 60% win percentage leading into the postseason? We are on a freefall so there are so many things working against us.

It's just like the writing is on the wall and the team doesn't even bother trying to fix it. The team defense isn't fully schematic because that goal against where Sid just let them go by on the PP was just pure laziness. And that's coming from probably THE HARDEST worker in the NHL. So that makes me just think stale culture or something like that.

Islanders 3-4-3 going into post-season last year. One goal away from OT game 7 in ECF.

Tampa lost the final 3 games before R1 as well.

I'm much more concerned with the frequency of boneheaded mistakes being on the rise, rather than wins and losses. Isles didn't have to work hard for their goals.

That being said, I was encouraged with our 47 shots and having the 13-7 advantage in HDCs at 5v5. That's more in line with how we played during our best times this season. We did pop in 4 goals. All well earned.

CDS was pretty poor as well.

With the increased focus level and precautionary nature of playoffs, I think we will clean up our giveaways.

So if they play with the energy they did yesterday, they should give the opponent a good fight at least.

A little bit of a mixed bag for me. There's some encouraging signs. Work ethic improving. Desperation level rising.
Rakell is doing really well with Sid+Jake, and L1 has sucked 3 years in a row in the playoffs. Can't ignore that. We may have a legit option.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

CDS was pretty poor as well.

Uh what?
What goals were bad against him?

 

[ColePens]

Islanders 3-4-3 going into post-season last year. One goal away from OT game 7 in ECF.

Tampa lost the final 3 games before R1 as well.

I'm much more concerned with the frequency of boneheaded mistakes being on the rise, rather than wins and losses. Isles didn't have to work hard for their goals.

That being said, I was encouraged with our 47 shots and having the 13-7 advantage in HDCs at 5v5. That's more in line with how we played during our best times this season. We did pop in 4 goals. All well earned.

CDS was pretty poor as well.

With the increased focus level and precautionary nature of playoffs, I think we will clean up our giveaways.

So if they play with the energy they did yesterday, they should give the opponent a good fight at least.

A little bit of a mixed bag for me. There's some encouraging signs. Work ethic improving. Desperation level rising.
Rakell is doing really well with Sid+Jake, and L1 has sucked 3 years in a row in the playoffs. Can't ignore that. We may have a legit option.

I can't remember the exact stat from the other thread but it was something like after TDL? I forget the tweet though. And i'm too lazy to research it

 

[AuroraBorealis]

Uh what?
What goals were bad against him?

1st and 2nd

1st goal he had enough time to get across and flag it down with the glove or shoulder it.
It's a good shot, but one I could see Jarry stopping. Came from a fairly bad angle so he should be square to it by the time it comes at him.

2nd goal went by his goalstick when it's coming across to Parise. That needed to be swatted away, or cradled and covered.
Sid was of course responsible for bad D on that goal, but it's still preventable.

 

[Houston Penguin]

I can't remember the last time we were playing this badly going into the playoffs.

It could be a good thing ... we played okay leading into the last few and we see how those ended. Lets try something different I guess?

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

1st and 2nd

1st goal he had enough time to get across and flag it down with the glove or shoulder it.
It's a good shot, but one I could see Jarry stopping. Came from a fairly bad angle so he should be square to it by the time it comes at him.

2nd goal went by his goalstick when it's coming across to Parise. That needed to be swatted away, or cradled and covered.
Sid was of course responsible for bad D on that goal, but it's still preventable.

Let's break this down- I'm using this recap as my reference


Look at 1:15- this is a standard 3 on 2 and should have been a 3 on 3 had Blu not f***ed this up.
As a goalie your main threats in this situation are the puck carrier and the middle guy and CDS' depth is appropriate. CDS assumes the far guy is erased by Friedman. And before you fully blame Friedman he's assuming the middle guy is erased due to Blu's backpressure. Well Friedman correctly recognizes that Blu is dogging it and won't make it so he's stuck in no man's land and the pass makes it across. There are very few goalies who can get to that puck at that set up depth

2:55 mark (2nd goal). And I'm surprised I have to explain this one
The puck is behind the net and CDS is positioned correctly looking backwards. There is a scrum and no goalie on this earth would expect their own guy to flip a puck up towards the dot like that. CDS is looking back behind him to his left and the shot comes from the right in less than 1/2 a second. There's zero time to set up or get your bearings when coming left to right and starting looking behind you.

Try this sitting at your desk: look at something behind you to your left and then whip your head to the right immediately and see if you can get your bearings

 

[Angrrus]

This Pens team is dull, dumb and useless, starting with their "supertstars"
and "leaders" - Crosby, Malkin and Letang. They can't do anything well. They don't care about winning. They don't care about playoffs. They don't care about Stanley Cup. They can't win a game properly in regulation. And mostly, they can't win in dumb 3-on-3 OT or in super dumb shootout either.

It would be best for Pens to miss the playoffs this year.

What a bunch of clueless idiots.

 

[Angrrus]

I don't think a goalie has ever had to do so little movement to win a shootout as that.

Well that is understandable, those attempts were taken by our least talented and skillful players.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

Let's break this down- I'm using this recap as my reference


Look at 1:15- this is a standard 3 on 2 and should have been a 3 on 3 had Blu not f***ed this up.
As a goalie your main threats in this situation are the puck carrier and the middle guy and CDS' depth is appropriate. CDS assumes the far guy is erased by Friedman. And before you fully blame Friedman he's assuming the middle guy is erased due to Blu's backpressure. Well Friedman correctly recognizes that Blu is dogging it and won't make it so he's stuck in no man's land and the pass makes it across. There are very few goalies who can get to that puck at that set up depth

2:55 mark (2nd goal). And I'm surprised I have to explain this one
The puck is behind the net and CDS is positioned correctly looking backwards. There is a scrum and no goalie on this earth would expect their own guy to flip a puck up towards the dot like that. CDS is looking back behind him to his left and the shot comes from the right in less than 1/2 a second. There's zero time to set up or get your bearings when coming left to right and starting looking behind you.

Try this sitting at your desk: look at something behind you to your left and then whip your head to the right immediately and see if you can get your bearings

First off, the Blueger giveaway is their 3rd goal, not 2nd. I never brought that one up.

The first goal is a sweeping lateral play. Parise had to cradle it. It wasn't a one-timer. Whatever Casey was assuming, with his lateral mobility he should have been across and grounded well in time. The push wasn't strong enough.

This is what I'm talking about on goal #2. This gets under him and through to Parise.
There's definitely blame to go around with the backcheckers, but the goalie can block that pass.
He tried to intercept the pass with his glove instead of having his stick in position to clog the lane.

Not saying either of these goals are cake, but they are preventable if a goalie's in good form.

 

[Angrrus]

Letang has played hockey for 30+ years of his life. How does he still not know how to defend 2 on 1s?

The same way as Malkin who is like 37 y.o. and has played hockey for 30+ years of his life still doesn't know how not to get goaded into crosschecking people in the mouth and get 4 game suspensions on the doorstep of playoffs.

They both are simply STUPID. BRAINLESS. IDIOTS.

 

[Turin]

Individually no, Rust is the better player

But Centers/linemates matter

I think if you put Rust on Anaheim he’s putting up close to Rakell’s numbers there. Rust has a better shot than Rakell for sure, but I’m not sure he’s better at much else and will probably be way more expensive.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

First off, the Blueger giveaway is their 3rd goal, not 2nd. I never brought that one up.

The first goal is a sweeping lateral play. Parise had to cradle it. It wasn't a one-timer. Whatever Casey was assuming, with his lateral mobility he should have been across and grounded well in time. The push wasn't strong enough.

View attachment 530424

This is what I'm talking about on goal #2. This gets under him and through to Parise.
There's definitely blame to go around with the backcheckers, but the goalie can block that pass.
He tried to intercept the pass with his glove instead of having his stick in position to clog the lane.

Not saying either of these goals are cake, but they are preventable if a goalie's in good form.

You're right- I had the wrong goal against

Goal against #2 is all on Sid and he makes 2 major errors
#1 At the 2:06 mark he biffs on the cross ice pass. If he doesn't turn his back like that, it's an easy intercept
#2 At 2:09 he stops at the crease. If he keeps skating he again easily clears the puck

Now let's go to CDS and what he sees. Again he's relying on and assuming that certain passing and shooting lanes are going to be eliminated and none of that occurs bc of the clowns around him
At 2:08 he sees Letang is beat wide with a terrible angle. This isn't the end of the world because he knows that the carrier has limited options: a) Pageau can't carry across the middle bc Letang is going to collide with him, so CDS correctly goes down to eliminate a bad angle shot
CDS also knows that b) the only thing that is a threat outside of a bad angle shot is a cross crease pass.

Rewind to 2:07. This is a 2 v 3 situation. Then with Letang and CDS eliminating Pageau it's a 1 v 2 situation.
Every goalie is doing the math here and plays the percentages: there is no way a puck is going to make it to the stick of a single player with 2 teammates coming back
Now go to 2:08 - CDS is locked in and ready for a shot with Letang too far away to interrupt a shot. This is a definite threat. Unbeknownst to CDS, Parise has blown by Sid and Jake.

So you're expecting CDS to have a 3rd eye and recognize/expect that his 2 backcheckers aren't going to get this puck? That's an extremely unreasonable expectation. Has nothing to do with form...every goalie would play that the exact same way

 

[Beau Knows]

This Pens team is dull, dumb and useless, starting with their "supertstars"
and "leaders" - Crosby, Malkin and Letang. They can't do anything well. They don't care about winning. They don't care about playoffs. They don't care about Stanley Cup. They can't win a game properly in regulation. And mostly, they can't win in dumb 3-on-3 OT or in super dumb shootout either.

It would be best for Pens to miss the playoffs this year.

What a bunch of clueless idiots.

Letang has been god awful, but Crosby? Sure his game has some weaknesses now, but he has 77 points in 62 games, pretty decent season. Malkin's had kind of an up and down year, but up until very recently, he wasn't exactly getting much help.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

You're right- I had the wrong goal against

Goal against #2 is all on Sid and he makes 2 major errors
#1 At the 2:06 mark he biffs on the cross ice pass. If he doesn't turn his back like that, it's an easy intercept
#2 At 2:09 he stops at the crease. If he keeps skating he again easily clears the puck

Now let's go to CDS and what he sees. Again he's relying on and assuming that certain passing and shooting lanes are going to be eliminated and none of that occurs bc of the clowns around him
At 2:08 he sees Letang is beat wide with a terrible angle. This isn't the end of the world because he knows that the carrier has limited options: a) Pageau can't carry across the middle bc Letang is going to collide with him, so CDS correctly goes down to eliminate a bad angle shot
CDS also knows that b) the only thing that is a threat outside of a bad angle shot is a cross crease pass.

Rewind to 2:07. This is a 2 v 3 situation. Then with Letang and CDS eliminating Pageau it's a 1 v 2 situation.
Every goalie is doing the math here and plays the percentages: there is no way a puck is going to make it to the stick of a single player with 2 teammates coming back
Now go to 2:08 - CDS is locked in and ready for a shot with Letang too far away to interrupt a shot. This is a definite threat. Unbeknownst to CDS, Parise has blown by Sid and Jake.

So you're expecting CDS to have a 3rd eye and recognize/expect that his 2 backcheckers aren't going to get this puck? That's an extremely unreasonable expectation. Has nothing to do with form...every goalie would play that the exact same way

No one's denying other players goofed too. I just don't think CDS did as much as he could.
It's not about anticipation. His stick needs to be in the default position to block such a passing attempt.

And on goal #1, his job to track the puck, not make assumptions about what his D will or won't do.
There was enough time to adjust, get across and get set. He didn't do it.

Agree to disagree I guess