Post-Game Talk: Pens 4, Avs 1 - Murray, Hornqvist, Kunitz Lead Pens to a Hard Fought Win

[Pancakes]

I don't think Kunitz is lazy. He's old and slow. He looks more motivated and determined on the fourth line not because he's been demoted but because at his age and current level of play limited minutes are the best way for him to succeed. And he doesn't look so bad when being paired against other fourth lines. It's not that his effort magically changes when he goes down there.

 

[UnderratedBrooks44]

I don't think Kunitz is lazy. He's old and slow. He looks more motivated and determined on the fourth line not because he's been demoted but because at his age and current level of play limited minutes are the best way for him to succeed. And he doesn't look so bad when being paired against other fourth lines. It's not that his effort magically changes when he goes down there.

It's not enough for people to just come to terms with the fact that a guy is old/ineffective and we're stuck with him. They have to frame him as a villain too for some reason. Did the same thing with Scuds and Orpik.

Reality check: I'm here defending Scuds. That's how bad it is/was.

 

[Dread Pirate Roberts]

On a less divisive and more positive note, I love what Murray's doing in net.

 

[Speaking Moistly]

Sucks for Murray, I really wanted him to get that Shutout

The night of disappointments. Could have seen 1000 points, could have seen a SO, could have seen a HT and got none of them.

I don't think Kunitz is lazy. He's old and slow. He looks more motivated and determined on the fourth line not because he's been demoted but because at his age and current level of play limited minutes are the best way for him to succeed. And he doesn't look so bad when being paired against other fourth lines. It's not that his effort magically changes when he goes down there.

I think it's a brutal combination of old and slow and "saving" himself. Aka laziness. It's laziness with a "purpose" but it's laziness and it's what happens when your coach plays someone on l1 who literally can't physically handle that many minutes. He can handle a fourth line role at a decent level of effort but once the minutes increase he starts pacing himself and it doesn't matter.

 

[pistolpete11]

That ENG alone doesn’t mean much at all. I’m sure the team took notice, but by all accounts, they like Kunitz. Him admitting he made a mistake to the media (and probably apologizing to Horny) will smooth everything over and they will carry on. The only way it causes a problem is if there are other incidents we don’t know about and it adds fuel to the fire. I doubt that’s the case, though.

 

[Pancakes]

It's not enough for people to just come to terms with the fact that a guy is old/ineffective and we're stuck with him. They have to frame him as a villain too for some reason. Did the same thing with Scuds and Orpik.

Reality check: I'm here defending Scuds. That's how bad it is/was.

With Orpik the hate made some sense imo because he lacked self awareness about how bad he sucked. He'd mouth off to the media about how we need to do x y or z better while being a big part of the problem himself. I never liked that about him.

 

[Pancakes]

The night of disappointments. Could have seen 1000 points, could have seen a SO, could have seen a HT and got none of them.




I think it's a brutal combination of old and slow and "saving" himself. Aka laziness. It's laziness with a "purpose" but it's laziness and it's what happens when your coach plays someone on l1 who literally can't physically handle that many minutes. He can handle a fourth line role at a decent level of effort but once the minutes increase he starts pacing himself and it doesn't matter.

I don't know if physically being incapable of playing the minutes indicates laziness. I don't think he's saving himself so much as he literally can't play at that speed for anything more than a handful of minutes.

We're kinda saying the same thing more or less I think.

 

[Randy Butternubs]

+Gake. I hope he changes to 44 soon. And yes, I'm going to keep calling him that. Even after looking up the urban dictionary definition.
+Murray.
+Hornqvist.

-Letang.
-Basically the rest of the defense.
-People calling Kunitz a POS. He made a mistake and he knows it. I'm sure Hornqvist was a bit upset, but he's an adult and will get over it. Based on all accounts I've heard, Kunitz is an outstanding person.

 

[Big McLargehuge]

I hope Guentzel wears 59 forever so I finally have a reason to buy a Penguins jersey with my favorite number on it

 

[td_ice]

You can see Kunitz sheepishly laughing and probably apologizing to Hornqvist on the bench after the goal. Horny gave him a tap and said something, probably, "no prob", so I am sure all is good.

 

[Randy Butternubs]

I can't believe I'm defending Kunitz. Maybe I'm still drunk.

 

[TheSniper26]

I get the general frustration with Kunitz(I'm as critical of him as anybody) but publicly saying "I need to be a better teammate" is about as much as a guy can own up to something like that. You could tell he realized his mistake immediately and looked a little embarrassed at the bench. I'm sure it's more a case of a guy just not thinking than being actively selfish.

 

[UnderratedBrooks44]

With Orpik the hate made some sense imo because he lacked self awareness about how bad he sucked. He'd mouth off to the media about how we need to do x y or z better while being a big part of the problem himself. I never liked that about him.

Reporters went to him every time they lost a game. He even joked about it with them once it was so obvious. The players just come up with stuff to say to these inane, redundant questions. It was nothing more than that.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

I can't figure out what happened to Sid in the early part of 2017. 2016 was insanely dominant for Sid. He just took over in every way. The way he is playing right now is very similar to when he looked disinterested under MJ. I could possibly see the guy dealing with a small injury or maybe he just flat out is only focusing on Cups and is preserving his body for when it really matters. Maybe he's taking a page out of Kessel's book?

They took Hornqvist off his line (Part One) and put Kunitz on it (Part Two). It's as simple as that. Sid stopped scoring goals when Horny left his line and his production dipped further when Kunitz was thrown there.

We switched out real net front chaos and trench work along the boards for someone who only has that reputation. This is the result.

 

[wgknestrick]

I can't figure out what happened to Sid in the early part of 2017. 2016 was insanely dominant for Sid. He just took over in every way. The way he is playing right now is very similar to when he looked disinterested under MJ. I could possibly see the guy dealing with a small injury or maybe he just flat out is only focusing on Cups and is preserving his body for when it really matters. Maybe he's taking a page out of Kessel's book?

If it's about preserving his body, then I'll take 2 months of meh Sid for the dominant version we get when it matters. The only thing I want to see go away is this thing where he chooses **** poor linemates. Kunitz went from having a role on that 4th line at 8-10 mins a night to absolutely looking like a ****ing mess, yet Sid wants to play with that? Why does he keep getting pissed at Hornqvist when #72 is the one guy you know who will lay his body out there every single night and do whatever he can to win. That **** needs to be knocked off immediately. (Ahem... Sully).

In all fairness, Crosby has done this for month long periods just about every year. His problem is his effort without the puck. He only "wants" to play when he gets the puck, otherwise it's "glide around" Crosby. The bigger problem is that the team follows him wherever he goes. They seem him not hustling back and they start to try it too. With Malkin hurt there is no one to challenge him either. It's frustrating for sure.

I don't know if Sully is man enough to call him out about it any more. He has disappointed me this season with his analytical ability to solve obvious problems with this team.

Murray is still a great goaltender, but the hits he takes concerns me. Sully needs to ream this team for not roughing up anyone who touches him. He's PITs most valuable player and no one stands up for him at all.

HFBoard,
My god, let the Kunitz hate flow through you. When are you happy with him? ***** when he plays bad, ***** when he scores a goal. It's so tiring. Kunitz has 6pts in his last 6 games and is a +3. Can't we be happy for him? He's been such a good, cheap player for this team for so long, but most of you have long forgotten any of that and still expect him to be a 25yo prime time, 1st line wing. He still has 20 5v5 points this season (1 more than Hornqvist and Rust).

 

[ColePens]

Murray is still a great goaltender, but the hits he takes concerns me. Sully needs to ream this team for not roughing up anyone who touches him. He's PITs most valuable player and no one stands up for him at all.

HFBoard,
My god, let the Kunitz hate flow through you. When are you happy with him? ***** when he plays bad, ***** when he scores a goal. It's so tiring. Kunitz has 6pts in his last 6 games and is a +3. Can't we be happy for him? He's been such a good, cheap player for this team for so long, but most of you have long forgotten any of that and still expect him to be a 25yo prime time, 1st line wing. He still has 20 5v5 points this season (1 more than Hornqvist and Rust).

1) I am really confused why he keeps getting hit, too. He plays deeper than MAF does. It makes no sense other than teams having some type of scouting report to attempt and hit him. I'm sure it's listed as "get in his face" or whatever, but it looks like an actual objective to hit Murray. He's taken way too many.

2) I think there is a middle ground here. I think the frustration festers and the clear example of that would be how dominant he has been on the 4th line, and how he was used in the 3rd period of the Flames (?) game. It was ridiculous. We were praising the guy and then immediately we found out why not.

And also.. the EN just to finish this conversation. It's over/done with. Kunitz owned up to it. But definitely every player probably deep down said "Yikes." or something to that extent. But he took ownership, as a good leader does, and moved on.

An example of leadership is literally Sid going off the ice when chasing 1k. 1k isn't even on his mind obviously other than the media forcing it. He left w/ an open net because he wanted to preserve the win more. Pretty strong leadership, IMO. But I definitely liked that #14 owned up to it and it's now squashed. If he had made an excuse, that's something that could have lingered.

 

[BigEezyE22]

The fact that the media addressed it should tell you it's a big deal. Especially when you're screwing the hardest working guy on your team and wearing an A. PH was out there to get the HT, everyone knew that.

Who asked Kunitz about it anyways?

So the media never brings up anything that isn't a big deal?

 

[CanadianPensFan1]

I don't know if Sully is man enough to call him out about it any more. He has disappointed me this season with his analytical ability to solve obvious problems with this team.

While I have had some issues with some of the decisions HCMS has made, none of them have to do with him being more or less of a man.

I dont get the impression that HCMS is a pushover or scared to take his guys to task for screwing the pooch on the ice.

 

[AjaxTelamon]

So the media never brings up anything that isn't a big deal?

No, I'm surprised they had the guts to ask him about it.

And I'm glad he immediately owned up to it as well. I didn't think he would, honestly. But clearly something needed to happen.

I get that people are sick of Kunitz hate. I'm not a Kunitz hater, and I'm not someone on here every day complaining about him. To me, he's a non-issue as long as he's playing down the lineup, or even if he plays in the top 6 when we're down a couple LW's.

I just really hate what he did there, and would hate it no matter who did it.

 

[Ogrezilla]

1) I am really confused why he keeps getting hit, too. He plays deeper than MAF does. It makes no sense other than teams having some type of scouting report to attempt and hit him. I'm sure it's listed as "get in his face" or whatever, but it looks like an actual objective to hit Murray. He's taken way too many.

2) I think there is a middle ground here. I think the frustration festers and the clear example of that would be how dominant he has been on the 4th line, and how he was used in the 3rd period of the Flames (?) game. It was ridiculous. We were praising the guy and then immediately we found out why not.

And also.. the EN just to finish this conversation. It's over/done with. Kunitz owned up to it. But definitely every player probably deep down said "Yikes." or something to that extent. But he took ownership, as a good leader does, and moved on.

Anyone who thought anything probably just though "aww that's a shame" I doubt anyone would actually be upset with Kunitz for it. I assume Kunitz said "my bad" when they skated by, and that was probably the end of it. Unless the guys were being jags about it, which is possible. I can't imagine there's a single person in that locker room who was legitimately upset about it, aside from maybe Kunitz himself.

Until I read it in this thread, it never even crossed my mind as something that had happened.

 

[BigEezyE22]

The whole "owned up" conversation is getting silly. There's "I probably shouldn't have taken 2 muffins at the breakfast buffet " owning up and then there's "I probably shouldn't have taken the collection basket at church" owning up.

 

[BigEezyE22]

Anyone who thought anything probably just though "aww that's a shame" I doubt anyone would actually be upset with Kunitz for it. I assume Kunitz said "my bad" when they skated by, and that was probably the end of it. Unless the guys were being jags about it, which is possible. I can't imagine there's a single person in that locker room who was legitimately upset about it, aside from maybe Kunitz himself.

Until I read it in this thread, it never even crossed my mind as something that had happened.

That's bc you have no awareness and are also a selfish person.

 

[CanadianPensFan1]

The whole "owned up" conversation is getting silly. There's "I probably shouldn't have taken 2 muffins at the breakfast buffet " owning up and then there's "I probably shouldn't have taken the collection basket at church" owning up.

Wait ... we arent supposed to do that?

 

[Ogrezilla]

That's bc you have no awareness and are also a selfish person.

is this a serious post? Selfish me would have wanted a 3rd Horny goal for my fantasy team Selfish me would want Kunitz to fail and get traded.

 

[CanadianPensFan1]

Anyone who thought anything probably just though "aww that's a shame" I doubt anyone would actually be upset with Kunitz for it. I assume Kunitz said "my bad" when they skated by, and that was probably the end of it. Unless the guys were being jags about it, which is possible. I can't imagine there's a single person in that locker room who was legitimately upset about it, aside from maybe Kunitz himself.

Until I read it in this thread, it never even crossed my mind as something that had happened.

That's bc you have no awareness and are also a selfish person.

Not that I dont think Orge cant defend himself, but that's kind of a reach, no?

This whole Kunitz thing is being blown a bit out of proportion. But because someone DOESNT blow it out of proportion =/= that person also being selfish.

Unless you were being facetious then .. well played, sir lol