Salary Cap: Pens '23-'24 Salary Cap Thread: "But if you don't get the President of the Pittsburgh Penguins on that phone, you know what's gonna happen to you?"

[Pens1566]

Clearly it is the fault of the fans that the team isn't winning enough.

Like I don't know what to tell you. The reason people talk about it is because it's a problem, I'm sorry if it's boring for you, but it's not like the hockey team is doing anything more interesting. Were the team was winning, nobody would care about the coaching.

Like I get the frustration in talking about the coaching and the team losing, but really, what else is there to discuss with this team? We are middling at best, we are underperforming, we have no prospects worth rooting for, and nobody in the organization seems to care about it.

I'd be happy to talk about the history of hockey or something, but it's not like a lot of the fans on this board really care about the non-Sid era.

Yep. Very few topics to discuss with this team other than the elephant in the room.

Karlsson acquisition isn't new any more, we're not really doing anything of note on the ice, no active team controversy, and the most interesting prospect is Puusy.

I say we bring back the covid thread ...

 

[Randy Butternubs]

I say we bring back the covid thread ...

I don't dislike our Mods that much.

 

[Tasty Biscuits]

Ylonen has shown he can handle it in the NHL while Puustinen hasn't.

Ylonen has shown he can put up good results in a defensive assignment while putting up points at the NHL level. Puustinen hasn't shown he can handle the defensive responsibilities of a bottom-6, nor has he shown he can produce at the NHL.

Not saying he's the answer, but homeboy has literally played 1 NHL game...

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

The issue with Puustinen is that he might not have the wheels or hockey IQ to get into spots to utilize his shot--which seems to be genuinely good. Compounded by the fact that this team's already fallen behind in the standings, so the odds of Sullivan willingly (i.e. without a bunch of injuries in the top-9) putting him in a scoring line role are pretty low.

I'd like to see if he can hack it. May as well with Smith and Rakell ghosting hard the past couple of weeks.

 

[66-30-33]

Kane to Detroit, we can scratch him off our list.

 

[pistolpete11]

Detroit really going all in on the offense.

4th in the NHL in GF/G and 19th in GA/G.

 

[Sidgeni Malkby]

Is it possible management knows this team is going nowhere no matter what they do short of bringing in McDavid, Saros and Makar?
Sullivan has had success in the past with lesser lineups. He might just be the most qualified coach for the rebuild. Maybe they're just keeping him around for when they tear it all down. Since they're most likely not winning jack shit with or without him?

I think there is a limit to changes a team can make, right? It does come down to enjoying the games, and talking about the details.

Technically they did bring in a Makar, with the EK trade. They had to move heaven and earth to do so.

Usually coaches are changed when players stop listening to them, or if the team really sucks. The sad (or positive?) fact is that for Sully, neither of the 2 has happened. If the losing streak had gone on for another 10 games, then you had something. The win streak erased all of that, as it showed that a Sully system CAN win.

Other stuff...
Why has Smith fallen off a cliff recently? He can't seem to hit the net anymore. Doesn't seem to be in the right place anymore. Is it possible that Rakell was somehow creating space for Smith?

Regardless...
The big elephant in the room with this team, is the PP. We all know that.

 

[LOGiK]

Repetitive conversation does blow. Which is probably why I'm not around as much. There's minimal excitement, from me, for this team. The Karlsson addition certainly helps. But they haven't fixed what I think is the team's biggest issue & source of disappointment these last few seasons.

Instead of me talking about it over and over and over again I just don't talk about it.

Well I do... so I'll do it for you!
Speaking of the Karlsson trade, it pushes me past indignation that this ..... ' team? ' here in the 'burgh refuses to have any bit of physicality in their players. What does the club need in the off-season.... tougher to play against? Solid strong physical defensive player? -
"HEY! Know what we need!? EK! He is EXACTLY what we need!"
I mean... it just goes to show the ineptitude is grossly commonplace in the penguins organization.
This management has no idea what chemistry is needed on a hockey club to be successful. They bring in a new gm and nothing changes. I mean... does anyone fall for the smoke show? Not I said the blind man! NOT I!

 

[DesertedPenguin]

WBS released Mark Psysk from his PTO. He might be done. Thought he'd be a bottom pairing candidate but it looks like his injuries have caught up to him.

 

[Zirakzigil]

I don't dislike our Mods that much.

Rude

 

[Andy99]

 

[Josey Wales]

OH Darn The Pens missed their chance to Fire Sullivan & hire John Hynes! HAHAHAHAHA

 

[Josey Wales]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA Flame away on this guy

 

[Empoleon8771]

Not saying he's the answer, but homeboy has literally played 1 NHL game...

I’m not saying Puustinen can’t cut it in the NHL, I’m saying it’s nonsensical to say no to a guy who has proven he can cut it in the NHL because you have a guy who might be able to cut it in the NHL.

Especially considering Puustinen is like oil and water with how their bottom-6 is contracted while Ylonen has shown he can be good in that role.

 

[Gurglesons]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA Flame away on this guy

Didn't read the article, but they should definitely try and see if the Jake - Sid - DOC line can stick.

 

[Empoleon8771]

as usual and proven this year, you have to actually play someone in the nhl to find out if they can handle the nhl responsibilities. zohorna showed it when he finally got a chance. once upon a time we found out 5 different ahl guys could handle themselves in the nhl in the same year we won a cup. but whatever, let's trade for a guy with the same numbers because he's a name of the week before we ever try our own guys

Or maybe Ylonen actually fits what this team needs on the 3rd line while Puustinen doesn't? Crazy thought, the guy who is notorious for having defensive problems doesn't fit on a defensive line!

Your argument is literally this:

The issue with Puustinen is that he might not have the wheels or hockey IQ to get into spots to utilize his shot--which seems to be genuinely good. Compounded by the fact that this team's already fallen behind in the standings, so the odds of Sullivan willingly (i.e. without a bunch of injuries in the top-9) putting him in a scoring line role are pretty low.

I'd like to see if he can hack it. May as well with Smith and Rakell ghosting hard the past couple of weeks.

I don't even mind them trying Puustinen in a scoring line role. I'm arguing against the idea of not trading for a scorer that you know can cut it on a defensive line just because you have Puustinen, who doesn't even remotely fit on a defensive line.

 

[PensandCaps]

Ylonen seems like a nothing player. Don't understand focusing on that guy lol.

Lets get someone a bit more established.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

Repetitive conversation does blow. Which is probably why I'm not around as much. There's minimal excitement, from me, for this team. The Karlsson addition certainly helps. But they haven't fixed what I think is the team's biggest issue & source of disappointment these last few seasons.

Instead of me talking about it over and over and over again I just don't talk about it.

Repetitive conversations were prevalent when our team was good too. There's only so many topics to bring up for one hockey team.
Actually I'd say there's less to talk about when the team is doing well, cuz there's fewer problem areas.
The issue here now is that the Pens play is leading to apathy for the users. The more creative, vocal posters of the past are offering less, and steering convos in interesting directions less frequently. So the inmates are running the asylum in their stead, so to speak.

It's difficult to get excited for a team that will either scrape a 1st round entry and lose, or miss the playoffs altogether. That's especially true when the team is accomplishing nothing for the organization while doing so. This is not a case of a team on the rise, steadily progressing annually.
What they're doing right now is honoring the core and pretending to be something they're not.

That is what's draining. The futility of it. The falsity of it.

A lot of people claim that they are satisfied with the 3 Cups and will roll with whatever happens now. That's bullshit. If they were truly satisfied they'd be happy. They're not. They are very unhappy with current results, coaching and management.

 

[SomeDude]

Ylonen seems like a nothing player. Don't understand focusing on that guy lol.

Let’s get someone a bit more established.

Paying for a Ylonen type when you have guys in the minors you’ve never tried gives me Jim Rutherford asset management flashbacks.

 

[chethejet]

There are just too many AHL guys who are AHL guys. Pens really have no one with a couple players who have the size, assets to be an NHL caliber roster player. Poulin, Pickering, maybe White in a limited role as 4th line center. I am hopeful the LD French Canadian from the juniors who has decent size and skill can develop. Dubas to me will consider the long term and short-term issues and Karlsson is in his prime here and has a 4-year contract remaining. That was a deal I was not 100% on board but still he can be a really good add. From Shero to Dubas, every GM was all in. Maybe dubas is now looking to the future as well. Pens need prospects, picks ect from here. If Sid retires after next year, the dump has to happen.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Ylonen seems like a nothing player. Don't understand focusing on that guy lol.

Lets get someone a bit more established.

Why does he seem like a nothing player?

Also, the Penguins literally don't have any money, so any sort of "established" player is going to be extremely difficult to acquire.

 

[Josey Wales]

Updates from Mike Sullivan: - Tristan Jarry starts in Nashville - Bryan Rust will be available after missing the last three games with a lower-body injury - P.O Joseph is taking part in the team's optional skate. He's been sidelined for 10 games with a nagging lower-body injury

 

[Darren McCord]

Why does he seem like a nothing player?

Also, the Penguins literally don't have any money, so any sort of "established" player is going to be extremely difficult to acquire.

I would still like to see Puusy get a cup of coffee with the team before moving assets.

Or I would like to see Gruden to be the 4th line center and move Accari to 3rd line RW. I think Gruden can be an effective 4th line center and Accari is better at wing.

Point is they should find out if these guys are worth keeping before moving assets.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I would still like to see Puusy get a cup of coffee with the team before moving assets.

Or I would like to see Gruden to be the 4th line center and move Accari to 3rd line RW. I think Gruden can be an effective 4th line center and Accari is better at wing.

Point is they should find out if these guys are worth keeping before moving assets.

Those two aren't competing for the same role. Puustinen is a top-6 injury replacement, while Ylonen is a bottom-6 scorer. Puustinen's competing for the role that Nylander is in right now.

There's no reason to say no to paying a modest price for proven assets (or more proven assets) just because you have other young guys in the organization who might (but probably won't) have the same impact if you give them a chance.

 

[SEALBound]

The thing is, how do we know if we never replace the coach? Maybe no coach can fix this mess and it ends up it's the players. But we can't find out if we just assume it's the players and keep Sullivan around because there's nothing a coach can do.

It just reminds me so much of the later Bylsma days when some were still reluctant about Bylsma being fired and the argument being "it's not his fault Crosby/Malkin lose their shit in the playoffs" or "It's not his fault Fleury is a headcase". "It's the players. Only so much a coach can do".

I mean, that's fair. I'm not on the Sullivan train by any stretch but I at least tip my hat him when they adjusted the system to provide additional NZ support. They we were winning IF we got the goaltending. When the roster is 100% healthy AND they execute and perform, it's a winning team. Keeping all of those things in check every single day is proving to be tough. Like I said, now that adjustments have been made and they still lose, that is shifting my blame to the players, primarily Jarry. As Emp has pointed out, with the lack of cap space and assets, you can only expect so much from the bottom 6.

Now if you want to suggest we fire Reirden and get a better PP coach just to see, then yes 100%, yes. Sullivan is a maybe and part of me is skeptical of available coaches being any better (again, that coming AFTER Sullivan made system changes that were more in line with team abilities. My criticism to him still remains "you don't have to ride stubborn decisions into the f***ing dirt before making a change".)

Their bottom pair right now is Shea-Ludvig, who had 0 games of NHL experience before this year. They're relying a lot on Zohorna on L3, who has under 50 games of NHL experience. O'Connor is currently playing on L1 and he's under a season of games of NHL experience.

We're talking about the 3rd line RW spot. I don't see why Ylonen is somehow not a guy that Sullivan would give a chance to.

Yeah, that kind of puts it into perspective a bit. I will continue to knock Sullivan for Kapanen. Riding McGinn-Carter-Kapanen into the ground is a blemish on his coaching career. There were options available which turns out could have been "literally anything". I don't think Kapanen got the fair shake here but he obviously did himself no favors.

As I mentioned in previous posts I think anyone brought in will have been well-discussed and scouted by Dubas and Sullivan (and the staff) before a trade is made so I don't see issues with a potential "but Sullivan won't play him!".

I would worry more about HF making that statement after a period of time where he's sucked and been demoted. Maybe similar to a Harkins situation.

Ylonen is the same age as puustinen and they have similar AHL numbers. I just don’t understand trading for him before giving puustinen a cup of coffee.

Im just not convince ylonen gets the same chance here he gets in MTL

Puustinen needs to figure the AHL out at the moment. He's having a terrible year, unfortunately.