Salary Cap: Penguins Salary Cap Thread IXIIV: We want a backup goalie right meow

[Sidney the Kidney]

The reality is people far overrate our prospects. Look at the impact players that have been traded at Kessel’s level.

Stone - Brannstrom
Karlsson - Norris
Eichel - Krebs
Patches - Suzuki

Addison and Hallander were never close to that level.

Hossa got Esposito who busted hard, but was still viewed as having some franchise upside along with Armstrong, Christensen and a 1st.

Is your alter ego posting tonight under your username? I could have sworn earlier in the season you were fully on board with the "paying a 1st for Kapanen and Zucker level players isn't good" side of the discussion. Now it's like you're doing the Devil's Advocate thing that you often do.

 

[Gurglesons]

Is your alter ego posting tonight under your username? I could have sworn earlier in the season you were fully on board with the "paying a 1st for Kapanen and Zucker level players isn't good" side of the discussion. Now it's like you're doing the Devil's Advocate thing that you often do.

I think we overpaid for Zucker and Kapanen, but I think they’ve honestly been fine for what we paid for them. Zucker is a disappointment, but I don’t know.

I don’t really see the issue with our forward group as I told you earlier in the season.

 

[Extra Texture]

Man I can't f***ing believe they played Iginla on his off-wing the entire time. Ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

That team should have been ridiculous.

That one is “Pouliot over Forsberg” levels of frustrating. Yeah, the Pens have had plenty of success, but both those decisions keep me up at night thinking “what could have been?”

 

[Extra Texture]

I dunno. He’s been really good for Vancouver.

I honestly don’t see who acquires him and I don’t really understand why Vancouver would move him, but JR.

Ehh I kind of see the logic from JR’s side. Four points out of a PO spot now, with underachievers like Wpg, Edmonton and Calgary to fight off for the last rungs. I don’t think Vancouver makes it and if they do they probably don’t have the roster to make any significant noise. And long term, they probably need to shed salary because of that pricey ass blueline. Now, you have Miller enjoying a great year, and a bunch of contenders thinking he’s THE prize of the TDL and possibly offering top dollar. Some of them, like the Rangers or Flames probably feel like it’s time to do something big with their core, or face roster losses/cap issues soon.

If the value is there, and you’re losing at most a chance to be a bubble playoff team. And in return you get a nice combo of picks and prospects. I can see why he’d take that deal. I think back to earlier this year and how many of us were thinking the Pens might be mediocre this year the way we started. If we were on the outside looking in at the TDL would we hang on to Rust in hopes of getting the 8th seed? Or would we sell him off for a king's ransom to a contender (and then try to sign him again in the summer)?

The weird part to me is that it’s the reverse of JR’s usual way of operating. But I guess to trade futures away and be a gambler, you have to have roster space to actually add players.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

Since Kap joined the team. 50 game minimum filter.
Can you guys stop lumping him together with Zucker? It's seriously annoying and weird.
And yes, he was worth a late 1st at this cap hit and age.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

I dunno. He’s been really good for Vancouver.

I honestly don’t see who acquires him and I don’t really understand why Vancouver would move him, but JR.

Weren't there rumours of him basically being an Orpik Arnold in the dressing room behind Horvat's back?

Miller might want out but hasn't publicized it. We'd likely find out if he was moved. I'd rather he stayed in the west. He's exactly the kind of player the Leafs need. Probably a better deal there if the Leafs part with one of their young D and a cap dump.

As for us, I'm just hoping for a solid veteran back up. Holtby would be interesting. He has a ton of experience and playoff experience to buffer Jarry. So if Dallas can't gain traction on a playoff spot in a week or two, I hope Hextall aims for that.

Holtby would also ease the insane workload on Jarry because Cdshit can't stop a beach ball.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

View attachment 501619

Since Kap joined the team. 50 game minimum filter.
Can you guys stop lumping him together with Zucker? It's seriously annoying and weird.
And yes, he was worth a late 1st at this cap hit and age.

I like Kappy. I don't regret the team making that move at all. Zucker on the other hand has been misused and miscast as a Penguin.

I like Zucker and it's hard not to. He's a hard working bloke that's also just a good person as well. I'd probably see if I can move the guy to one of the Cali teams or his home of Vegas.

I still like Adam Henrique as a fit for this team. I think their cap hits are pretty close (maybe off by 20-50k).

His speed, 2way ability, being able to play C and LW, he'd be a good fit with Geno and Kap. Or right at home with Carter and E-Rod.

Healthy (lol) Penguins...

Guentzel, Crosby, Rust
Henrique, Malkin, Kapanen
Heinen, Carter, Rodrigues
ZAR, Blueger, McGinn

 

[Tender Rip]

As for goalie backup...
I think everyone appreciates that at present it is a shallow market. Some candidates aren't quite out of it yet in terms of playoff aspirations. Others are injured but likely to return before the deadline. It's hard to pick on Hex for not signing one "right meow" if it is very difficult to even point at someone meaningful and available.

So, trade deadline is March 21st. We have 22 games before that time and three back to back situations, and only in one case are we facing two strong teams (@Tampa and @Carolina on March 3rd and 4th). Other than that, we have Seattle and Detroit at home this week and home against the Rangers/@Columbus in the end of February.

Ultimately, there are a number of occasions where we face supposedly weak teams where - especially at home - you just have to accept that there's higher risk of a loss with CDS if we want to give Jarry a break. Like tomorrow. Until a good opportunity presents itself.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

As for goalie backup...
I think everyone appreciates that at present it is a shallow market. Some candidates aren't quite out of it yet in terms of playoff aspirations. Others are injured but likely to return before the deadline. It's hard to pick on Hex for not signing one "right meow" if it is very difficult to even point at someone meaningful and available.

So, trade deadline is March 21st. We have 22 games before that time and three back to back situations, and only in one case are we facing two strong teams (@Tampa and @Carolina on March 3rd and 4th). Other than that, we have Seattle and Detroit at home this week and home against the Rangers/@Columbus in the end of February.

Ultimately, there are a number of occasions where we face supposedly weak teams where - especially at home - you just have to accept that there's higher risk of a loss with CDS if we want to give Jarry a break. Like tomorrow. Until a good opportunity presents itself.

I'd go after two goalies honestly.

Move cds for one.

Get a veteran back up for Jarry and another they can bury in the ahl and call up to their aces squad that has solid nhl experience. A lot of weird shit can happen. Better to have a buffer.

 

[Peat]

I dunno. He’s been really good for Vancouver.

I honestly don’t see who acquires him and I don’t really understand why Vancouver would move him, but JR.

Makes sense to me. Vancouver aren't a contender in the new two playoffs and after that Miller's putting them in the position of letting him walk or paying UFA prices for a power forward entering their 30s, assuming he's even willing to talk reupping there. Moving him at the highest point of value is the logical response.

What pisses me off is when we spend prime assets on mid-tier types like Zucker and Kapanen - guys who cracked the 50 point barrier once between them - who we cross our fingers and hope can get taken to a higher level by Crosby and Malkin because we desperately want the cost certainty of mediocrity. It's discouraging to think we used 2 1st round picks and 2 recent 2nd round draftees on these two.

We wanted guaranteed top six wingers to fill the holes in our top six. The other options were to pay less for gambles, pay nothing in the hope of finding a UFA that worked - that was less of an option in the Zucker trade which was about bolstering for the playoffs, or wait for a star that wasn't on the market.

I'd have probably preferred gambling but talking about mediocrity when we went and got regular top six performers doesn't sit right with me. Yeah, they weren't big points producers, but they were big 5v5 points producers and since we were never targeting a PP upgrade - which, when fit, we've not needed - there was no upgrade needed. They simply have to live up to what they were. Which Zucker hasn't but Kapanen has.

The reality is people far overrate our prospects. Look at the impact players that have been traded at Kessel’s level.

Stone - Brannstrom
Karlsson - Norris
Eichel - Krebs
Patches - Suzuki

Addison and Hallander were never close to that level.

Hossa got Esposito who busted hard, but was still viewed as having some franchise upside along with Armstrong, Christensen and a 1st.

We simply have not had the cupboard for a big time add and I think you could argue a 1st and Addison would get us a Pavelski or Forsberg type rental, but 99% of the time those deals fall flat on their face when it comes to winning championships. Gaborik is the only recent one that comes to mind that worked.

Addison wasn't far off. Wasn't that unusual to see him in top 50 prospects around the time of his trade or shortly after. That big juniors boosted his profile. Norris wasn't a top 50 prospect at time of trade (was only cracking the lists at the time Addison was), Suzuki was kinda 30ish iic. If Zucker had been the sort of top 5v5 producing great possession metric LW he'd been for Minnesota, it would have probably been worth it and all.

And, of course, you don't have much chance of getting your own prospects around this ranking if you never keep your 1st.

 

[Pens x]

As for goalie backup...
I think everyone appreciates that at present it is a shallow market. Some candidates aren't quite out of it yet in terms of playoff aspirations. Others are injured but likely to return before the deadline. It's hard to pick on Hex for not signing one "right meow" if it is very difficult to even point at someone meaningful and available.

So, trade deadline is March 21st. We have 22 games before that time and three back to back situations, and only in one case are we facing two strong teams (@Tampa and @Carolina on March 3rd and 4th). Other than that, we have Seattle and Detroit at home this week and home against the Rangers/@Columbus in the end of February.

Ultimately, there are a number of occasions where we face supposedly weak teams where - especially at home - you just have to accept that there's higher risk of a loss with CDS if we want to give Jarry a break. Like tomorrow. Until a good opportunity presents itself.

You try Lindberg before starting DeSmith. DeSmith should never dress again for this team. This is a perfect example of being overly patient to a fault by Sleepy. Waiting two months for the deadline is insane. Sleepy was a fool to not find a vet backup in the off season, and he got a free pass. Now people are okay with waiting two more months to try to fix his mistake.

I dont care who we are playing - the idiot has been pulled two straight games and has been atrocious over the last 3. He got pulled against the Blue Jackets and got lit up by the sharks; not exactly powerhouse teams.

 

[Goalie_Bob]

Lindberg is hurt.

 

[Tender Rip]

You try Lindberg before starting DeSmith. DeSmith should never dress again for this team. This is a perfect example of being overly patient to a fault by Sleepy. Waiting two months for the deadline is insane. Sleepy was a fool to not find a vet backup in the off season, and he got a free pass. Now people are okay with waiting two more months to fix his mistake.

I dont care who we are playing - the idiot has been pulled two straight games and has been atrocious over the last 3. He got pulled against the Blue Jackets and got lit up by the sharks; not exactly powerhouse teams.

Filip Lindberg has not played for 1.5 months due to injury, gave up 9 goals in his last two starts, and has played in a grand total of 7 AHL games.

CDS has been a good backup for us for more than two years before admittedly sucking pond water this year. Still, Lindberg obviously is not a solution yet - and shouldn’t be unless you desire to ruin him. He needs to get healthy, and then play lots of games first.

 

[Peat]

As for goalie backup...
I think everyone appreciates that at present it is a shallow market. Some candidates aren't quite out of it yet in terms of playoff aspirations. Others are injured but likely to return before the deadline. It's hard to pick on Hex for not signing one "right meow" if it is very difficult to even point at someone meaningful and available.

So, trade deadline is March 21st. We have 22 games before that time and three back to back situations, and only in one case are we facing two strong teams Tampa and Carolina on March 3rd and 4th). Other than that, we have Seattle and Detroit at home this week and home against the Rangers/@Columbus in the end of February.

Ultimately, there are a number of occasions where we face supposedly weak teams where - especially at home - you just have to accept that there's higher risk of a loss with CDS if we want to give Jarry a break. Like tomorrow. Until a good opportunity presents itself.

I don't blame him for not getting a DeSmith upgrade, but I think he should go out and get another Domingue type so there's a backup who's not floundering for Jarry (which also allows DeSmith to go down to WBS and get a month of games in to get his eye in). And I think he could probably do that right meow.

 

[Pens x]

Filip Lindberg has not played for 1.5 months due to injury, gave up 7 goals in his last two starts, and has played in a grand total of 7 AHL games.

CDS has been a good backup for us for more than two years before admittedly sucking pond water this year. Still, Lindberg obviously is not a solution yet - and shouldn’t be unless you desire to ruin him. He needs to get healthy, and then play lots of games first.

Hell, try D’Orio. You can’t play the guy that you know will make you lose the game regardless of who the back up is. You’d think we would have learned that after the playoffs last season. I know it’s hard to believe that Sully is continuing to start a goalie that will lose him the game.

It’s amazing that people continue to give DeSmith such a long leash.

 

[HandshakeLine]

Filip Lindberg has not played for 1.5 months due to injury, gave up 7 goals in his last two starts, and has played in a grand total of 7 AHL games.

CDS has been a good backup for us for more than two years before admittedly sucking pond water this year. Still, Lindberg obviously is not a solution yet - and shouldn’t be unless you desire to ruin him. He needs to get healthy, and then play lots of games first.

Lindberg also likely has an ankle fracture or a high ankle sprain, so that's going to take a long time to get him back into active duty. He's probably going to be out for a good chunk of the remaining season. I'd probably just write this year off for him, developmentally speaking.

 

[DesertedPenguin]

Hell, try D’Orio. You can’t play the guy that you know will make you lose the game regardless of who the back up is. You’d think we would have learned that after the playoffs last season. I know it’s hard to believe that Sully is continuing to start a goalie that will lose him the game.

It’s amazing that people continue to give DeSmith such a long leash.

D'Orio isn't any better. He has a sub .900 save percentage and almost 3 GAA in the AHL. He's only 22, so maybe he improves, but DeSmith has more of a track record.

The only option besides DeSmith is a trade and the market sucks.

 

[Andy99]

As for goalie backup...
I think everyone appreciates that at present it is a shallow market. Some candidates aren't quite out of it yet in terms of playoff aspirations. Others are injured but likely to return before the deadline. It's hard to pick on Hex for not signing one "right meow" if it is very difficult to even point at someone meaningful and available.

So, trade deadline is March 21st. We have 22 games before that time and three back to back situations, and only in one case are we facing two strong teams (@Tampa and @Carolina on March 3rd and 4th). Other than that, we have Seattle and Detroit at home this week and home against the Rangers/@Columbus in the end of February.

Ultimately, there are a number of occasions where we face supposedly weak teams where - especially at home - you just have to accept that there's higher risk of a loss with CDS if we want to give Jarry a break. Like tomorrow. Until a good opportunity presents itself.

speaking about a shallow market…yikes lol…

Penguins Trade Needs: 4 Backup Goalies to Watch

 

[Darren McCord]

View attachment 501619

Since Kap joined the team. 50 game minimum filter.
Can you guys stop lumping him together with Zucker? It's seriously annoying and weird.
And yes, he was worth a late 1st at this cap hit and age.

Stop with stats he sucks and Erod should get his contract spot cause he had a good month and likes puppies

 

[The Old Master]

speaking about a shallow market…yikes lol…

Penguins Trade Needs: 4 Backup Goalies to Watch

on a good team dan? have you watched the pens this year at all? we have no clue how to play defense. we need a goalie that can stop 6 breakaways, and 30 odd man breaks a night.

 

[chethejet]

CDS did have covid issues and who knows what that did to his readiness. He has shown he can be a nice stop gap in the past so I give him a little slack here to get back to 100%. Play him after the Arizona game vs the kraken and if he struggles, then management knows he may not be the guy.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Hextall refusing to sign me to be Jarry's backup is a perfect example of being overly patient to a fault by Sleepy. What the f*** Hextall, I'm sitting right here and I could solve all of your backup problems! SMH he must be too busy sleeping to see me.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

speaking about a shallow market…yikes lol…

Penguins Trade Needs: 4 Backup Goalies to Watch

I feel like Kingerski hates throwing out bigger names whenever discussing market acquisition candidates over the years. They're always like the most milquetoast, unappealing options. I'd much rather wait on CDS to regain form than any of those 4 guys.

Hopefully the Canucks are sellers at TDL and Halak becomes available. This backup thing will still be an issue next season. Just do what you need to do to acquire a good one and keep him.

 

[The Old Master]

CDS did have covid issues and who knows what that did to his readiness. He has shown he can be a nice stop gap in the past so I give him a little slack here to get back to 100%. Play him after the Arizona game vs the kraken and if he struggles, then management knows he may not be the guy.

i tend to think that there is a better chance of getting smithys head screwed on right, than finding a better goalie in a trade.

 

[Gurglesons]

Makes sense to me. Vancouver aren't a contender in the new two playoffs and after that Miller's putting them in the position of letting him walk or paying UFA prices for a power forward entering their 30s, assuming he's even willing to talk reupping there. Moving him at the highest point of value is the logical response.



We wanted guaranteed top six wingers to fill the holes in our top six. The other options were to pay less for gambles, pay nothing in the hope of finding a UFA that worked - that was less of an option in the Zucker trade which was about bolstering for the playoffs, or wait for a star that wasn't on the market.

I'd have probably preferred gambling but talking about mediocrity when we went and got regular top six performers doesn't sit right with me. Yeah, they weren't big points producers, but they were big 5v5 points producers and since we were never targeting a PP upgrade - which, when fit, we've not needed - there was no upgrade needed. They simply have to live up to what they were. Which Zucker hasn't but Kapanen has.



Addison wasn't far off. Wasn't that unusual to see him in top 50 prospects around the time of his trade or shortly after. That big juniors boosted his profile. Norris wasn't a top 50 prospect at time of trade (was only cracking the lists at the time Addison was), Suzuki was kinda 30ish iic. If Zucker had been the sort of top 5v5 producing great possession metric LW he'd been for Minnesota, it would have probably been worth it and all.

And, of course, you don't have much chance of getting your own prospects around this ranking if you never keep your 1st.

Norris was a 1st round pick and had pedigree of that though ala Kapanen.