Post-Game Talk: Penguins - 3 Coyotes - 1 | The Lovejoy Leadership Edition

[Michael8771*]

Josh Yohe- Evgeni Malkin has missed nine games this season. The Penguins have scored 14 goals in those games.

Glad to get him back this week.

 

[Jacob]

There are some critical failures with our scoring wings and we need to try someone new. What we are doing now isn't working.

I'm okay with that too. But if Bennett can't cut it in the top 6 I'd put him back on the 3rd line.

I was just addressing the people calling Bennett a bust and wanting him traded. He's cheap and serviceable and I see no reason to trade him even if he hasn't met expectations offensively. Even if he never does. If he's only a 35 point 3rd liner, I'm cool with that.

 

[Shrimper]

The Penguins snapped their four game losing streak to remain seven points ahead of the advancing Ottawa Senators but it wasn't easy. The Coyotes made the game a lot harder than the Penguins would have liked it to have been. The Coyotes are tanking and it isn't a surprise that the Penguins won but it should have been easier and by a larger margin if we're being honest.

The Coyotes started the better of the two teams and scored early on a short-handed break-away by Rieder just 1:34 into the game. For the second game in a row the Penguins were dominated on the shot clock in the first with the Coyotes out-shooting the Penguins 13-3 despite the Penguins having two power-plays.

Read more; http://t.co/4icgH7T8HC

Roll on Tuesday!

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Surely you've seen other posts considering I've been around a while. Yes I may be complaining, but its more about the useless petty arguments that are now our post game talks. Seriously 6 pages are between 2 posters arguing over BB, this isn't a post game talk thread, it was an argue about BB thread. Can't we create a player discussion and let all the constant moaning go on there? ( similar to the all Sid talk thread)

We have these threads to talk about the game, which surely you can see has not happened at all.

The argument isn't about BB getting a fair shake anymore. It's about a team in desperate need of his skill. It's a very relevant argument given what we saw last night.

The game last night is another painful example of this team's inability to score. When one of their most skilled players is rotting away, it's a problem. They need as much help as they can get up front.

I'm 100% sure if Sutter and BB both don't find their games by the playoffs, this team is ****ed. One of these guys can be a ghost, but not both. Not much more can be done for Sutter at this point except to hope he gets more puck luck like last night. He's been given better linemates, PP time and plenty of TOI.

However, the coaching staff won't even give BB PP time to help a unit that's become a laughing stock. BB thrives on the LHB QBing the PP, but they can't even throw him a bone like that to help him and themselves.

It's more than fair to wonder why they aren't trying to help him out of this slump when it's painfully obvious they need secondary scoring. MJ has come out twice now and said he's happy with what BB is doing. So why is everyone being rewarded but him?

 

[MrBurghundy]

The argument isn't about BB getting a fair shake anymore. It's about a team in desperate need of his skill.

The game last night is another painful example of this team's inability to score. When one of their most skilled players is rotting away, it's a problem. They need as much help as they can get up front.

I'm 100% sure if Sutter and BB both don't find their games by the playoffs, this team is ****ed. One of these guys can be a ghost, but not both. Not much more can be done for Sutter at this point except to hope he gets more puck luck like last night. He's been given better linemates, PP time and plenty of TOI.

However, the coaching staff won't een give BB PP time to help a unit that's become a laughing stock. BB thrives on the LHB QBing the PP, but they can't even throw him a bone like that to help him and themselves.

It's more than fair to wonder why they aren't trying to help him out of this slump when it's painfully obvious they need secondary scoring.

They aren't helping him out of his slump, because the organization doesn't think he's even in a slump. They think he's a mediocre hockey player that they are trying to unload at the earliest possible chance. They have absolutely no time or clue on how to develop their prospects if they don't immediately "get it."

Of course I don't need to tell you this, but...

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

They aren't helping him out of his slump, because the organization doesn't think he's even in a slump. They think he's a mediocre hockey player that they are trying to unload at the earliest possible chance. They have absolutely no time or clue on how to develop their prospects if they don't immediately "get it."

Of course I don't need to tell you this, but...

I already know they gave up on him obviously, but they need to face the reality they need as much help as they can get. They duped themselves into thinking they didn't need a shakeup, but it's obvious they need his kind of skill upfront now.

It seems they would rather go down with their "experience" mantra than put a young guy in a prominent role.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

I'm okay with that too. But if Bennett can't cut it in the top 6 I'd put him back on the 3rd line.

I was just addressing the people calling Bennett a bust and wanting him traded. He's cheap and serviceable and I see no reason to trade him even if he hasn't met expectations offensively. Even if he never does. If he's only a 35 point 3rd liner, I'm cool with that.

That's fair. You're right that there doesn't seem to be much middle ground when it comes to Bennett projections because he's such a polarizing player. But whatever he ends up being, we should be trying to find out what he's capable of.

 

[SHOOTANDSCORE]

Bad trade, eh?

In all seriousness this is suppose to be about the aftermath of last nights game. And I apologize to everyone for my part in derailing the thread.

In regards to the game itself, we won, Sid has the scoring lead, MAF played well, and apparently no one got hurt. Overall I'll give the team a 73 on the paradyme scale.

Worse by the minute.

No need for anyone to apologize, discussions go where discussions go. We're all passionate about the Pens (well, except for TTEOT), there's nothing wrong with some spirited discussion. Especially after another crap game that no one wants to talk about.

 

[Lionel Hutz]

I'm okay with that too. But if Bennett can't cut it in the top 6 I'd put him back on the 3rd line.

I was just addressing the people calling Bennett a bust and wanting him traded. He's cheap and serviceable and I see no reason to trade him even if he hasn't met expectations offensively. Even if he never does. If he's only a 35 point 3rd liner, I'm cool with that.

I don't think he's a bust, but he is not meeting expectations. I agree he's serviceable.

When I said "Bennett is the new Tangradi" I was thinking he's the lightening rod discussion, and it seems some people seem to think that using him right will solve all the offensive woes. Pretty similar to the discussion around here in the big dog's final days.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

I don't think he's a bust, but he is not meeting expectations. I agree he's serviceable.

When I said "Bennett is the new Tangradi" I was thinking he's the lightening rod discussion, and it seems some people seem to think that using him right will solve all the offensive woes. Pretty similar to the discussion around here in the big dog's final days.

What are your expectations for a winger playing 13 minutes a game centered by Lapierre or Sutter with 48 seconds of 2nd unit PP time per game?

 

[Ugene Magic]

Uh, I've pretty much said all along he should be put in the top six and see what happens. I don't give a **** if it's gifting him a spot. Saad was basically gifted a spot and he only had 3 points in his first 24 games. Saad has played most of his career with Chicago's best fwds and still been inconsistent until this season.

BB came back in Jan, played well, was promoted and played well with Malkin. Then when Malkin was back, he was never put back with him. So he did earn his spot like you want him to do.

No one is scoring right now. But other guys are being gifted spots. Why does BB have to earn his spot back, but the other unproductive fwds are being gifted top six spots and PP time?

Do tell, and you better have a good argument not based around "experience". Go on and enlighten me.

Saad inconsistent?

Saads 2012/13 stats both Ahl/NHL in that first season line up exactly as his second if you remember he started in the shorten lockout season. The Dude has been anything except inconsistent.

You may want to re-research your totals since I've got him at 10 points.

BB has been nothing but injured throughout his development, you want to talk about inconsistent?

From the start their career totals:

Saad - 402 GP
Bennett - 277 GP

Now factor Saad was drafted a year after Beau, and then that Saad has been playing ice hockey longer in general, not playing roller hockey.

This is somehow the organizations fault though.

Saad, meanwhile managed to be "consistent" coming up through the ranks and improved along the way as he went.

They injured BB so he would stunt his development. They caused him to miss over a hundred games of development.

Saad is just a better player who's not being gifted anything because he has proven himself at every level. Saad gets shifts with anyone and does what is expected of him.

Bennett meanwhile, has been every bit inconsistent for the last 5 years with one solid year to date, 1, and where is the improvement?

Maybe it was "better" to leave him down in WBS to make up for all he lost and gained much experience, confidence among the physical aspects he seriously lacked when he went pro.

Saad didn't have an ounce of the setbacks Beau did to go along with Saad actually has another faucet to his game Beau refuses to use.

So, it's conceivable too say it's inconsistent enough that you can't use the two players to judge one to the other. One actual got a chance to develop just not being injured so much.

Sorry, but that leads to a lot of experience lost.

I don't even feel he's a lost cause, he can still turn it around with a fresh start next season even on this team, or even the season after that.

These two just don't mirror each other at all, but yet is the most used player to compare to Bennett.

Two totally different players on two totally different paths.


But do go on everyone how BB is anything near, Saad.

 

[Fordy]

Saad inconsistent?

Saads 2012/13 stats both Ahl/NHL in that first season line up exactly as his second if you remember he started in the shorten lockout season. The Dude has been anything except inconsistent.

You may want to re-research your totals since I've got him at 10 points.

BB has been nothing but injured throughout his development, you want to talk about inconsistent?

From the start their career totals:

Saad - 402 GP
Bennett - 277 GP

Now factor Saad was drafted a year after Beau, and then that Saad has been playing ice hockey longer in general, not playing roller hockey.

This is somehow the organizations fault though.

Saad, meanwhile managed to be "consistent" coming up through the ranks and improved along the way as he went.

They injured BB so he would stunt his development. They caused him to miss over a hundred games of development.

Saad is just a better player who's not being gifted anything because he has proven himself at every level. Saad gets shifts with anyone and does what is expected of him.

Bennett meanwhile, has been every bit inconsistent for the last 5 years with one solid year to date, 1, and where is the improvement?

Maybe it was "better" to leave him down in WBS to make up for all he lost and gained much experience, confidence among the physical aspects he seriously lacked when he went pro.

Saad didn't have an ounce of the setbacks Beau did to go along with Saad actually has another faucet to his game Beau refuses to use.

So, it's conceivable too say it's inconsistent enough that you can't use the two players to judge one to the other. One actual got a chance to develop just not being injured so much.

Sorry, but that leads to a lot of experience lost.

I don't even feel he's a lost cause, he can still turn it around with a fresh start next season even on this team, or even the season after that.

These two just don't mirror each other at all, but yet is the most used player to compare to Bennett.

Two totally different players on two totally different paths.


But do go on everyone how BB is anything near, Saad.

missing the point lol

 

[steveg]

missing the point lol

seconded...I am lost... LOL

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

But do go on everyone how BB is anything near, Saad.

What is it with everyone who seems to be against Bennett using these kinds of straw man arguments?

Tip: The mention of Saad was for role usage of a young player just starting out comparisons where a club gives a player extra rope to adjust/adapt to the NHL while another club doesn't, not as a direct one-to-one comparisons of their comparative abilities.

 

[JTG]

Simon Despres is to Dan Bylsma as Beau Bennett is to Mike Johnston

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Post #336...

Whatever you're drinking, share with the class.

 

[Kristopher Letang]

Wrong thread

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Saad inconsistent?

Saads 2012/13 stats both Ahl/NHL in that first season line up exactly as his second if you remember he started in the shorten lockout season. The Dude has been anything except inconsistent.

You may want to re-research your totals since I've got him at 10 points.

BB has been nothing but injured throughout his development, you want to talk about inconsistent?

From the start their career totals:

Saad - 402 GP
Bennett - 277 GP

Now factor Saad was drafted a year after Beau, and then that Saad has been playing ice hockey longer in general, not playing roller hockey.

This is somehow the organizations fault though.

Saad, meanwhile managed to be "consistent" coming up through the ranks and improved along the way as he went.

They injured BB so he would stunt his development. They caused him to miss over a hundred games of development.

Saad is just a better player who's not being gifted anything because he has proven himself at every level. Saad gets shifts with anyone and does what is expected of him.

Bennett meanwhile, has been every bit inconsistent for the last 5 years with one solid year to date, 1, and where is the improvement?

Maybe it was "better" to leave him down in WBS to make up for all he lost and gained much experience, confidence among the physical aspects he seriously lacked when he went pro.

Saad didn't have an ounce of the setbacks Beau did to go along with Saad actually has another faucet to his game Beau refuses to use.

So, it's conceivable too say it's inconsistent enough that you can't use the two players to judge one to the other. One actual got a chance to develop just not being injured so much.

Sorry, but that leads to a lot of experience lost.

I don't even feel he's a lost cause, he can still turn it around with a fresh start next season even on this team, or even the season after that.

These two just don't mirror each other at all, but yet is the most used player to compare to Bennett.

Two totally different players on two totally different paths.


But do go on everyone how BB is anything near, Saad.

I may want to do my research again? Really?

Saad played in a few games his first pro season. His first full season was the lockout. From Jan 20 until Feb 25, a span of 18 games, he had three points. Where you get ten points is baffling.

And if you think Saad hasn't been inconsistent until this season, you may want to read this article written this past Halloween.

http://chicago.suntimes.com/?p=205626

When you are done, you can come back and apologize for being wrong about everything regarding Saad.

Your whole post is just... incoherent.

 

[MtlPenFan]

What is it with everyone who seems to be against Bennett using these kinds of straw man arguments?

Tip: The mention of Saad was for role usage of a young player just starting out comparisons where a club gives a player extra rope to adjust/adapt to the NHL while another club doesn't, not as a direct one-to-one comparisons of their comparative abilities.

Remember when we were upset about the Despres trade because:

He was cost controlled
He was young
Showed flashes of brilliance the first two months of the season
He was playing his first full NHL season
Was 6'4" and over 220 lbs and hit, all the while being good in transition and strong enough to fend off pursuers when skating out of trouble
He was a potential 2nd pairing D-man (at worse) and he was traded for a 31 year old in a move that at best, can be called semi-lateral

But after all those arguments were made, we were literally told we were upset because we all thought he was Bobby Orr even though not a single person said so?

I miss those days.

 

[plaidchuck]

Remember when we were upset about the Despres trade because:

He was cost controlled
He was young
Showed flashes of brilliance the first two months of the season
He was playing his first full NHL season
Was 6'4" and over 220 lbs and hit, all the while being good in transition and strong enough to fend off pursuers when skating out of trouble
He was a potential 2nd pairing D-man (at worse) and he was traded for a 31 year old in a move that at best, can be called semi-lateral

But after all those arguments were made, we were literally told we were upset because we all thought he was Bobby Orr even though not a single person said so?

I miss those days.

But remember, they helped his career by moving him. So that move should be celebrated if you're a fan of his.

 

[Still Apps]

Remember when we were upset about the Despres trade because:

He was cost controlled
He was young
Showed flashes of brilliance the first two months of the season
He was playing his first full NHL season
Was 6'4" and over 220 lbs and hit, all the while being good in transition and strong enough to fend off pursuers when skating out of trouble
He was a potential 2nd pairing D-man (at worse) and he was traded for a 31 year old in a move that at best, can be called semi-lateral

But after all those arguments were made, we were literally told we were upset because we all thought he was Bobby Orr even though not a single person said so?

I miss those days.

This post just gave me a brain hemorrhage and a myocardial infarction. Looks like an outline for a course in cognitive dissonance.

 

[MrBurghundy]

missing the point lol

Wouldn't be the first time...