Post-Game Talk: Pathetic effort by the buds 2:4.

[BoredBrandonPridham]

Hogwash!

You get the best centers you can get to play for your team. End of story end of debate

You don't understand the debate. I said better centers would be better, but the debate is about how to align the centers we have.

 

[kivaerijo]

Obvious lack of effort. Skated for 5 minutes at the end and almost scored 2 on a very weak goalie.

I am curious though if anyone else noticed that Nashville seems to run interference a little more than most teams on the dump in? I understand making the guy take the long way but they seem to get in the way longer than you'd expect to be allowed. It's like an extra full second from most teams. If that isn't going to be called the Leafs need to start interfering longer, most the D can skate so getting in the way longer won't be hard. It makes it so much easier on the rest of the team to defend when you have that much more time to get back and cover your man.

Funny ou bring that up, I was saying the whole game how the leafs were doing that. Wondering how they weren't getting called for it. Believe this is a case of "your" team always being right, and "their" team being wrong.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

The posts above me is right. I'll try to put things in another way. What I'm doing is looking at things from a team perspective first, line perspective second and player perspective last.

I don't care for trying to maximize production from our #1C, I care more about looking at what the line as a whole is producing and what I care the most for is how you can get as much production out of all the lines combined.

With Bozak on the first line, that line is still almost as productive offensively and is stronger defensively than with Kadri. It gets stronger faceoffs and therefor we don't have to have that line pinned in our own zone, where it becomes a complete liability.

This allows us to have Kadri and Lupul on the second line, which instantly becomes a much better line offensively that can be sheltered enough to mask defensive liability.

Team > Line > Player

Some posters here seem to have their priorities the other way around. They'd rather field an ineffective second and third line if it meant the first, and the center in particular, could produce a little bit more.

Terrific post!

 

[The Winter Soldier]

The other difference is that you added "in order to put skill in positions with better defensive matchups", which is the context you stripped away and is extremely important. It's completely fine to put a "passenger" on the top line in order to spread skill in other areas, coaches do it all the time, and it's something we can leverage with good depth -- making the most of what you have.

What makes him a "passenger" is that his play doesn't really stand out -- positively or negatively. He's fairly solid in all areas of the game and I don't see any problem with him being on the ice for 1st line minutes.

Sure having a better player would be better, but not at the expense of having an unbalanced attack.

Well reasoned, well argued.

We are building a team here, not an all star team of skilled players to win a poolies competition. A good team is one that has all the pegs in the right holes, not just fill some holes where it is lopsided and not as effective.

 

[ACC1224]

The posts above me is right. I'll try to put things in another way. What I'm doing is looking at things from a team perspective first, line perspective second and player perspective last.

I don't care for trying to maximize production from our #1C, I care more about looking at what the line as a whole is producing and what I care the most for is how you can get as much production out of all the lines combined.

With Bozak on the first line, that line is still almost as productive offensively and is stronger defensively than with Kadri. It gets stronger faceoffs and therefor we don't have to have that line pinned in our own zone, where it becomes a complete liability.

This allows us to have Kadri and Lupul on the second line, which instantly becomes a much better line offensively that can be sheltered enough to mask defensive liability.

Team > Line > Player

Some posters here seem to have their priorities the other way around. They'd rather field an ineffective second and third line if it meant the first, and the center in particular, could produce a little bit more.

That is apparent to all but a few.
Some get to caught up in the Fantasy of it all.

 

[Eb]

Since Bozak is not very good defensively, and brings a negative value physically, Nonis should probably upgrade there, and soon.

Great subjective post

 

[thewave]

Terrific post!

I thought with Bozak historically that line has be a negative at even strength and tally it's points on special teams.

 

[Daisy Jane]

exactly -

I said this before: having Bozak, gives our line up balance. it might not be the sexiest thing there to have Bozak on the first line - but Bozak on our first line makes our second, third and fourth lines much more balanced, and play our viper-strike out a lot better.

 

[Atomos2]

Mark Masters ‏@markhmasters 15m

RT @ExtraSkater Last night Morgan Rielly had toughest zone starts on team (9% O/DSt%) & the 2nd best possession stats (58% 5v5 CF%)

 

[thewave]

exactly -

I said this before: having Bozak, gives our line up balance. it might not be the sexiest thing there to have Bozak on the first line - but Bozak on our first line makes our second, third and fourth lines much more balanced, and play our viper-strike out a lot better.

Sadly there is no viper and there is no strike unless you mean strike out. Since Bozak has been out Kessel +\- starts to rise. Every other year with Bozak it's a negative. The line is deficient except on PP

 

[Eb]

Games like last night show exactly why going with Kadri as our first line center would have been disastrous. He is simply not ready to be thrown into that position yet.

He's had one great game playing first line center this year, EDM. The rest have been either terrible, or nothing to brag about.

 

[Mess]

Nashville plays a style and system under Barry Trotz that believes "Defense wins Championships".

Even with a no name goalie in net that only a few have heard of before this game their team defense limits chances and controls the flow.

A rush team like the Leafs offensively with a high propensity for mistakes defensively is the kind of team Nashville will feed on.

 

[Dallas Eakins*]

Horrible game all around,Clarkson was the only bright spot, and the only one willing to put in 60 minute, and has shown up to play for every game he's been involved in this season as anyone who does more than read his stats line will tell you, but I'm sure no one will admit to that because he's the first overpaid player in history.

Gardiner, Franson, and Ranger, are terrible beyond words, how so much discussion was centered around Phaneuf not being a number one d-man baffles me now, clearly 2 through to 4 are where they become a laughing stock.

Also terrible nights by Kadri, Lupel, and Kessel turnover machines and it is just maddening how little the Leafs value getting pucks on net, down by three goals with about ten to go we had these guys trying fancy no look behind the back passes all of which ended up on Predator's sticks.

 

[ErnieLeafs]

The other difference is that you added "in order to put skill in positions with better defensive matchups", which is the context you stripped away and is extremely important. It's completely fine to put a "passenger" on the top line in order to spread skill in other areas, coaches do it all the time, and it's something we can leverage with good depth -- making the most of what you have.

What makes him a "passenger" is that his play doesn't really stand out -- positively or negatively. He's fairly solid in all areas of the game and I don't see any problem with him being on the ice for 1st line minutes.

Sure having a better player would be better, but not at the expense of having an unbalanced attack.

So... Outside of Calgary with Stajan, who employs a passenger on their 1st line? I'll absolutely wait for this gem.

We'll be here all day, because that comment was tripe

 

[tamle]

Glad I fell asleep after first period on this game, judging from the comments.

 

[New Liskeard]

It says a lot about Kessel and JVR's abilities, when they can continue to produce with mannequin between them, I agree.

What you're saying, in more words, is that you're fine having a complete passenger on the 1st line.

Actually I read that, the poster is happy the line is working, regardless of who the center is. Funny how people take offence on who plays center, even if the team is doing well, winning games, and scoring lots of goals.

 

[New Liskeard]

Games like last night show exactly why going with Kadri as our first line center would have been disastrous. He is simply not ready to be thrown into that position yet.

He's had one great game playing first line center this year, EDM. The rest have been either terrible, or nothing to brag about.

Regardless of those facts, people still want Kadri out there, even though Bozak has shown he belongs there, and Kadri has failed thus far.

 

[Faltorvo]

Nashville plays a style and system under Barry Trotz that believes "Defense wins Championships".

Even with a no name goalie in net that only a few have heard of before this game their team defense limits chances and controls the flow.

A rush team like the Leafs offensively with a high propensity for mistakes defensively is the kind of team Nashville will feed on.

They looked very disinterested in trying to adjust and battle for the win.

 

[thewave]

Regardless of those facts, people still want Kadri out there, even though Bozak has shown he belongs there, and Kadri has failed thus far.

More of these bs statements with no substance? He has shown **** all other than he is there. If he shows us 60-70pts you can say well he belongs there, heck if he can center Kessel and help keep the line a + for an entire season that would be great too.

Even with Kadri etc Kessels +\- started going up. Even strength play man, let it sink in, understand.

 

[mcleex]

Such a promising start to the game, the first 10 minutes the Leafs absolutely dominated

Terrible 2nd period, one of the worst periods of the season, also the special teams were not good at all, the Leafs just can't get over that 6 game over .500 hump they will always hover around 4-6 games over .500

 

[New Liskeard]

More of these bs statements with no substance? He has shown **** all other than he is there. If he shows us 60-70pts you can say well he belongs there, heck if he can center Kessel and help keep the line a + for an entire season that would be great too.

Even with Kadri etc Kessels +\- started going up. Even strength play man, let it sink in, understand.

I suppose if you want to look over the last two and a half years, the line produces best, with Bozak in the middle. I guess this slump that Kessel is in has nothing to do with Bozak being on, and Kadri in the middle has been a failure so far. If you chose to ignore the facts and reality, that's your choice, but the facts are all there. Next you are going to argue the Leafs don't have a 13-8-1 record? Your act is getting very old, and tiring.

 

[thewave]

I suppose if you want to look over the last two and a half years, the line produces best, with Bozak in the middle. I guess this slump that Kessel is in has nothing to do with Bozak being on, and Kadri in the middle has been a failure so far. If you chose to ignore the facts and reality, that's your choice, but the facts are all there. Next you are going to argue the Leafs don't have a 13-8-1 record? Your act is getting very old, and tiring.

The first line is a nightmare at ES, if it were a good line Kessel would end seasons with +10 or more year after year. A real dominant C can absolutely turn that line into being a 200ft line instead of a special teams line.

Bozak has never really been absent to try anything else the past two years, wth

 

[Clark4Ever]

Nashville has always had our number at the ACC for some strange reason, even during the Pat Quinn era.

Last night had 'letdown' written all over it.

 

[BoredBrandonPridham]

So... Outside of Calgary with Stajan, who employs a passenger on their 1st line? I'll absolutely wait for this gem.

We'll be here all day, because that comment was tripe

To be fair, I'm more talking about not playing all their best players on the first line. There are plenty examples of that. I'm not going to get into a subjective debate over who is a "passenger" or not, as there is no concrete definition of what a "passenger" is so it's a waste of time.

 

[ErnieLeafs]

To be fair, I'm more talking about not playing all their best players on the first line. There are plenty examples of that. I'm not going to get into a subjective debate over who is a "passenger" or not, as there is no concrete definition of what a "passenger" is so it's a waste of time.

Okay, let's hear your ideas on who doesn't play their best CENTER on their first line. You could argue that Boston doesn't with Bergeron, but Kreijci and Bergeron are a 1a/1B combo. But ..... Where else in the league does this happen?