Value of: Parayko

DatDude44

Hmmmm?
Feb 23, 2012
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why would you keep leddy over parayko?
Contract and the potential return. Leddys been our only “somewhat” consistent D this year. And only a 4 mill cap hit.

We’d Probly get a 2nd for him. But I could see Parayko returning the equivalent to two mid- late 1st rd pick value whether that’s just picks, a pick and spec or a younger D with upside still trying to find his way like a broberg+ or something
 

bleedblue1223

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Jan 21, 2011
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That makes a ton of sense too if its for Parayko. RD for RD.
What's the deal with Bouchard? Minutes and production are way down compared to last season? And even last season he was only 20+ minutes from Oct-Jan, and then was well below the rest of the season.

I'm assuming you guys value Broberg a good amount more than Bouchard.
 

ManofSteel55

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Aug 15, 2013
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What's the deal with Bouchard? Minutes and production are way down compared to last season? And even last season he was only 20+ minutes from Oct-Jan, and then was well below the rest of the season.

I'm assuming you guys value Broberg a good amount more than Bouchard.
I think Duncan Keith really helped Bouchard out last year. Covered for a lot of stuff for him. He has a few things to improve on in the defensive zone, that's for sure. He didn't really have a partner either at the beginning of the year. Until Broberg's injuries healed up, he was playing with guys like Niemelainen, who is a find 6/7, but shouldn't be with Bouchard.

He also hasn't been getting the powerplay minutes because Barrie is so good there.

Basically, he's got a ton of offensive upside, but he's still raw and needs to work on some things on the back end.
 
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bleedblue1223

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Jan 21, 2011
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I think Duncan Keith really helped Bouchard out last year. Covered for a lot of stuff for him. He has a few things to improve on in the defensive zone, that's for sure. He didn't really have a partner either at the beginning of the year. Until Broberg's injuries healed up, he was playing with guys like Niemelainen, who is a find 6/7, but shouldn't be with Broberg.

He also hasn't been getting the powerplay minutes because Barrie is so good there.

Basically, he's got a ton of offensive upside, but he's still raw and needs to work on some things on the back end.
What kind of player would you compare him to or project him as?
 

Djp

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Jul 28, 2012
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The term on his contract is a little scary with back issues, but (if it’s not something doctors expect to be an ongoing issue) he’d be a great fit for Buffalo, I think.

Samuelsson-Dahlin
Power-Parayko

^^looks like a pretty darn good top 4.
He has 7 full years left and he’s 30+ during that time.
 

Blueston

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why would you keep leddy over parayko?
problem isn't who he is paired with per se. it's that they are given insane usage and parayko can handle it but leddy really can't. on top of our scheme issues. blues need a retool for various reasons, but we need coaching change too.
 

tsujimoto74

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May 28, 2012
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Because Parayko will bring a bigger return. Team needs to retool to the younger core.


This is a spot that we've speculated about on the Blues board because of how good a fit we thought it was too. I'm hoping Thompson eventually leads you guys to a Cup, you guys have a really good foundation of a contender, hopefully you get there with a few more pieces.
What’s the expectation as far as return goes if Parayko is moved? The Sabres are one of very few teams that could afford to add him without sending a big contract back, and we have a deep prospect pool, so we could probably put together a good futures package. I don’t think Adams would put our very top prospects on the table, but guys like Rosen or Ostlund might be.
 

bleedblue1223

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Jan 21, 2011
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What’s the expectation as far as return goes if Parayko is moved? The Sabres are one of very few teams that could afford to add him without sending a big contract back, and we have a deep prospect pool, so we could probably put together a good futures package. I don’t think Adams would put our very top prospects on the table, but guys like Rosen or Ostlund might be.
Honestly, no idea. I think Ostlund probably makes sense when looking at prospect rankings/tiers. Johnson fits more the positional need, but I'm not sure he has the upside to justify the trade. Parayko is still very good defensively, and our only defenseman capable of playing a shutdown role, so if we move him and don't acquire someone that has the potential for that role either in his trade or another move, then we are screwed.
 

tsujimoto74

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May 28, 2012
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Honestly, no idea. I think Ostlund probably makes sense when looking at prospect rankings/tiers. Johnson fits more the positional need, but I'm not sure he has the upside to justify the trade. Parayko is still very good defensively, and our only defenseman capable of playing a shutdown role, so if we move him and don't acquire someone that has the potential for that role either in his trade or another move, then we are screwed.
The Sabres are pretty thin in terms of D prospects. Beyond Johnson, there are a couple guys with legit NHL potential, but nobody that’s easily protectable. Jokiharju is a piece that might make some sense for both sides, though. His ceiling isn’t sky high, but he’s a solid young D that could slide right onto the Blues’ roster (and also clear space for Parayko on the Sabres’).
 

Ted Hoffman

The other Rick Zombo
Dec 15, 2002
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What’s the expectation as far as return goes if Parayko is moved? The Sabres are one of very few teams that could afford to add him without sending a big contract back, and we have a deep prospect pool, so we could probably put together a good futures package. I don’t think Adams would put our very top prospects on the table, but guys like Rosen or Ostlund might be.
Depends on who it is and how badly they want him. The Sabres shouldn't touch him; they should be seeking out a goalie. [Colton Ellis is the odd man out in St. Louis; Buffalo should try to buy him low because IMO he's got starting potential even if he's going to need a little time to get there.]

For trade value: I think Parayko would go in a deal where two teams swap underachieving players on "bad" contracts, where each side bets the guy they're getting will be better after the trade and the guy they're unloading won't. Probably straight-up for each other, perhaps swapping a pick and/or a minor prospect where the same hope applies.

I don't know how Flyers fans would feel about it, but I could see Parayko for Provorov, straight-up.
 

bleedblue1223

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Jan 21, 2011
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The idea that he's declining, disappointing, underachieving really needs to stop. He arguably has the most difficult deployment in the league, and has very good possession numbers to back it up, and even considering this season, they are improved over the previous 2 seasons. His offensive production this season is still in his normal range of production too.

2023-02-14_12-46-10.png
 

ManofSteel55

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What kind of player would you compare him to or project him as?
That's a really hard question right now, because it really depends on what elements of his game continue to improve, and to what extent, and some of the names I want to say seem ridiculous, because if he reaches that potential it was a bad deal for Edmonton, but if he doesn't, saying the names sounds ridiculous. Right now, I would say he is a 3rd pairing guy who can play 2nd pair minutes with a stable veteran partner, who can play the point shot position on the powerplay. His potential if he fixes his defensive lapses is through the roof, and I'll seem like a homer if I say the names, ha ha. I think a Mike Green type career is a safe, conservative bet for him, although he is a better passer than Green was. Unless he regresses for some reason of course. With his skill set, if he reaches his potential, he could have a game similar to Al McInnis. I won't say he's destined for the Hall of Fame of course, its a comparison of the skill set of the two, I'm not suggesting he will be an all time great of coruse.
 
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Ted Hoffman

The other Rick Zombo
Dec 15, 2002
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The idea that he's declining, disappointing, underachieving really needs to stop. He arguably has the most difficult deployment in the league, and has very good possession numbers to back it up, and even considering this season, they are improved over the previous 2 seasons. His offensive production this season is still in his normal range of production too.

View attachment 650250
There's times where teh analytics tells a story about a guy that isn't apparent, and then there's times where teh analytics tell a story that's woefully inaccurate. This ... is the second one, because teh analytics don't tell you about things he's done over the last 2+ seasons, like

* Chase a forward, back to the play and oblivious to everything going on, as 2 guys execute a give-and-go where he should have been positioned to take one of them
* Back up and let opposing players get shots off, then wave his stick weakly as they skate by and shovel home the rebound
* Stand in front of his goalie, out of position, and be a perfect screen for the opposition
* Stand 15 feet out of position, watching the 2nd, 3rd, 4th back-door tap-in attempt of the game go through where he should have been positioned
* Stare at the net, shooting lane wide open, and he fakes a slapshot twice and then flips it off to a covered wing and the opposition clears the zone

And on and on and on. Parayko has been bad enough that Berube, who's reluctant to call guys out, has called Parayko out more than a couple times now and was pretty pointed about it after the Buffalo game - and Parayko has been little improved since. (No, even with 2A vs. Arizona he was pretty horrific in that 1st period and it wasn't dramatically better after that.) But I guess that's all wrong too, because teh analytics for his are the mostester awesomenest.

Damn shame actually watching him paints a vastly different picture.
 

bleedblue1223

Registered User
Jan 21, 2011
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There's times where teh analytics tells a story about a guy that isn't apparent, and then there's times where teh analytics tell a story that's woefully inaccurate. This ... is the second one, because teh analytics don't tell you about things he's done over the last 2+ seasons, like

* Chase a forward, back to the play and oblivious to everything going on, as 2 guys execute a give-and-go where he should have been positioned to take one of them
* Back up and let opposing players get shots off, then wave his stick weakly as they skate by and shovel home the rebound
* Stand in front of his goalie, out of position, and be a perfect screen for the opposition
* Stand 15 feet out of position, watching the 2nd, 3rd, 4th back-door tap-in attempt of the game go through where he should have been positioned
* Stare at the net, shooting lane wide open, and he fakes a slapshot twice and then flips it off to a covered wing and the opposition clears the zone

And on and on and on. Parayko has been bad enough that Berube, who's reluctant to call guys out, has called Parayko out more than a couple times now and was pretty pointed about it after the Buffalo game - and Parayko has been little improved since. (No, even with 2A vs. Arizona he was pretty horrific in that 1st period and it wasn't dramatically better after that.) But I guess that's all wrong too, because teh analytics for his are the mostester awesomenest.

Damn shame actually watching him paints a vastly different picture.
Well, I do watch him, and the criticism he receives is still ridiculous. It's almost like playing more minutes in more difficult situations will result in more total bad observations, but his bad observations are still occur at a lower rate than others on the team.

Faulk doesn't get anywhere near the same type of criticism as Parayko, yet he gives up significantly more high danger chances per 60, and this season, he doesn't have the offensive production to justify the poor numbers.
 
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Connor McConnor

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Nov 22, 2017
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I'd stay very clear of a soon to be 30 YO just entering an 8 year deal and looks to be declining already. I don't think he's a #2 anymore.
 

Daley Tarasenkshow

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Nov 7, 2012
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As a Blues fan I have absolutely 0 interest in trading Parayko unless it's a substantial overpayment of a proven/potential player. Really wouldn't have interest in picks.

I personally believe if we find the right partner, he could be back to a shutdown #2. Seems like he's part of the leadership group going forward too.
 

tsujimoto74

Moderator
May 28, 2012
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Depends on who it is and how badly they want him. The Sabres shouldn't touch him; they should be seeking out a goalie. [Colton Ellis is the odd man out in St. Louis; Buffalo should try to buy him low because IMO he's got starting potential even if he's going to need a little time to get there.]

For trade value: I think Parayko would go in a deal where two teams swap underachieving players on "bad" contracts, where each side bets the guy they're getting will be better after the trade and the guy they're unloading won't. Probably straight-up for each other, perhaps swapping a pick and/or a minor prospect where the same hope applies.

I don't know how Flyers fans would feel about it, but I could see Parayko for Provorov, straight-up.
The Sabres have plenty of goalie prospects already. (Frankly, I’d be fine with our goalie prospects if the only one we had was Devon Levi—kid is good.) Ellis doesn’t even look like he’d give Luukkonen a real run for his money. The roster upgrade we need that we don’t have any apparent answer for in our prospect pool is on D. Dahlin, Samuelsson, and Power are 3/4 of an amazing top 4, but the rest of the group needs improvements.
 

bleedblue1223

Registered User
Jan 21, 2011
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The Sabres have plenty of goalie prospects already. (Frankly, I’d be fine with our goalie prospects if the only one we had was Devon Levi—kid is good.) Ellis doesn’t even look like he’d give Luukkonen a real run for his money. The roster upgrade we need that we don’t have any apparent answer for in our prospect pool is on D. Dahlin, Samuelsson, and Power are 3/4 of an amazing top 4, but the rest of the group needs improvements.
Yeah, Levi is a really good goalie prospect, and Portillo is a pretty good one too.
 

Dazed and Confused

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Aug 10, 2007
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What's the deal with Bouchard? Minutes and production are way down compared to last season? And even last season he was only 20+ minutes from Oct-Jan, and then was well below the rest of the season.

I'm assuming you guys value Broberg a good amount more than Bouchard.

Biggest issue for the Oilers defence was/is the right side, and the fact that neither Barrie's nor Bouchard's pairings could be counted on for any form of defensive minutes. Last year Bouchard did take on some defensive responsibility, but he benefited from playing with a steady partner in Keith; this year he was paired with the corpse of Ryan Murray or a rookie in Niemo or Broberg, and the results were less than ideal.

Though he's played his best hockey since New Years, but that's because the Oil went back to using 7 defenceman, with Vinny Desharnais basically eating all of Barrie and Bouchard's defensive minutes. (and he's done an outstanding job with that role.)

I'd say both Broberg and Boucahrd are highly valued, Broberg may have the inside track at the moment, but it's close.

He can still be the #2 that handles all the tough defensive minutes.


He had a back injury, but none of us know what extent or if it's one that can be chronic.

This is basically what the Oilers need. Someone that they can staple to Nurse and have it as a legit all-situations top pairing.



I'd be loath to include Bouchard in this deal, as Parayko doesn't replace his offence, but I'd have no issue offering up something similar to the proposal Karlsson deals: Barrie and one of Pulju/Foegele/Yams for cap and then the equivalent to 2 or 3 firsts in Bourgault, Schaefer or 1st round picks. Maybe mix in Ceci if you want someone that can sort of fit Parayko's minutes?
 

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