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tatoo

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Mar 16, 2002
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ddo quebec
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I really think it's time to try and package bickell and TT for a 1st line left winger,and maybe try and trade Daley and one of our Rockford forwards for a no.4 d man.Its a lot easier said then done,but it would be ideal before the circus trip.
 

BK

"Goalie Apologist"
Feb 8, 2011
33,636
16,483
Minneapolis, MN
I really think it's time to try and package bickell and TT for a 1st line left winger,and maybe try and trade Daley and one of our Rockford forwards for a no.4 d man.Its a lot easier said then done,but it would be ideal before the circus trip.

No to trading TT. Trading a top flight prospect who is crucial to the teams future is just dumb. We are not the Penguins.
 

Blackhawkswincup

RIP Fugu
Jun 24, 2007
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The Hawks would probably have to add a 1st or Schmaltz.

I would probably be fine adding a 1st ,, JVR is signed for 2 more years at (4.25M)

JVR-Toews-Hossa
Panarin-Anisimov-Kane

Would be pretty good top 6 for 2 1/2 years ,, JVR D effort would need to improve but Toews/Hossa can protect him defensively
 

scarchelli

Registered User
Aug 19, 2014
982
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Shaw is expendable now that garbutt is here. He could get moved for someone also. The only dman who can be moved is rundblad and daley. They aren't gonna trade daley already, that wouldn't make sense. Which leaves the ever popular rundblad.
 

TLEH

Pronounced T-Lay
Feb 28, 2015
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Bomoseen, Vermont
completely fine with losing a 1st bickell TT and Shaw for JVR even. These guys are expendable to us.. Plenty of Forwards in the minors and TT is great but can't play LW and we need Grinder type for 1 LW. JVR has a great contract too.
 

BK

"Goalie Apologist"
Feb 8, 2011
33,636
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Minneapolis, MN
completely fine with losing a 1st bickell TT and Shaw for JVR even. These guys are expendable to us.. Plenty of Forwards in the minors and TT is great but can't play LW and we need Grinder type for 1 LW. JVR has a great contract too.

That is a HUGE over payment for JVR. Talk about a brutal trade. The fact that you consider it is hillarious to me. TT is not expendable if you have foresight to what the team needs past this year. TT is still very young and we need to have patience with and not destroy the future for a marginal upgrade that will end up hurting the team long term.
 

Blackhawkswincup

RIP Fugu
Jun 24, 2007
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Chicagoland
That is a HUGE over payment for JVR. Talk about a brutal trade. The fact that you consider it is hillarious to me. TT is not expendable if you have foresight to what the team needs past this year. TT is still very young and we need to have patience with and not destroy the future for a marginal upgrade that will end up hurting the team long term.

JVR is signed for 2 more years at affordable cap hit

Acquiring him would improve odds for next 3 playoffs which is hardly destroying future

Hawks would have great top 6 for Kane/Toews prime + Keith/Seabrook/Hammer last years of prime

With that said if they wanted TT and Shaw then the 1st would be out of equation
 

BK

"Goalie Apologist"
Feb 8, 2011
33,636
16,483
Minneapolis, MN
JVR is signed for 2 more years at affordable cap hit

Acquiring him would improve odds for next 3 playoffs which is hardly destroying future

Hawks would have great top 6 for Kane/Toews prime + Keith/Seabrook/Hammer last years of prime

You realize that TT has out paced JVR playing less minutes and less PP time? JVR scored 56 pts last year and was -33. Not a typo, -33. We are not talking about a star player we are talking about JVR.

TT, Dano, Pokka, etc. are all players who we need for their potential but also their deals for the future. I am ok with trading some talent but certain players such as TT should be off limits unless it is a HUGE reward coming back.
 
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EddieOs HairPluggs

Registered User
Nov 11, 2015
46
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I really think it's time to try and package bickell and TT for a 1st line left winger,and maybe try and trade Daley and one of our Rockford forwards for a no.4 d man.Its a lot easier said then done,but it would be ideal before the circus trip.

I Could not be anymore amendment against this initial trade idea. We are way over reacting here.

1. NO trading Teuvo Teravainen. His contract is fantastic. He has little leverage at the moment against the Hawks salary cap.

2. Bryan Bickell Cleared Waivers. Which means nobody wants Bryan Bickell. The Hawks saving some money and opening up some cap space, if I read how the contracts work correctly. But could be wrong.

3. Chicago Blackhawks are currently the 6th best team in Western Conference. In which their best defenseman just sat out a month. In which we just rejuggeled half the roster. Let's calm DOWN!

4. The majority of last year's roster played over 200 games together. They knew each other's tendencies inside and out. Give Coach Q some time to work with the current lineup. They still need some time to adjust to familiarity. 15 games is not long enough in my book. Give coach Q some time to work this out. I think they have done nothing but prove to us they can develop talent.

5. The time to trade for players is at the trade deadline for players with expiring UFA contracts. Those are the cheapest deals and you can trade Way cheaper rates. You get to test drive the player for a couple of months before entering free agency. So you are not stuck with a player who doesn't fit for 4 more years.

6. Teuvo Teravainen is a RFA in 2017. So if he walks away that is multiple future draft pick. Your essentially trading away Teuvo Teravainen(Future Star), potential 1st, 3rd, (maybe 2nd) round draft pick in draft compensation. All for what? Any player worth getting for that is already locked up for 6 million over next 12 years. Which we can not afford under current salary cap.

7. For what exactly.

8. Circus Trip is not at all intimidating. In fact, it could not be a better time to play these clowns (Except Kings).

9. Teuvo Teravainen is producing at a high level right now in my opinion.

In conclusion, I think it is a terrible idea. If we really need a 1st line player, we should wait to closer to trade deadline to lower value. We do not trade our star prospects. You get bargain with expiring UFA contracts. What Stan Bowman is doing has proven to be successful.

I do not have any other ideas for, and do like where your head is at creatively.
 
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Pepe Silvia

Registered User
Jan 2, 2012
8,915
0
Chicago
completely fine with losing a 1st bickell TT and Shaw for JVR even. These guys are expendable to us.. Plenty of Forwards in the minors and TT is great but can't play LW and we need Grinder type for 1 LW. JVR has a great contract too.

I'd want Bowman fired if that actually happened. Not a chance in hell
 

EddieOs HairPluggs

Registered User
Nov 11, 2015
46
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Well then just look at this year? He has been meh.
What I was eluding too.

Looking for a larger sample set without Phil K. I have not watched much of JVR to give any real opinion on his abilities. But his numbers did greatly spike once Phil joined the leafs. Having played against Phil K. On Phil K wiki page he scored 286 points in Bantam's, 8 of those came against me.

JVR Career +/- is -38. Just saying

Before people start throwing magical trade possibilities in the air. I did a fun DEEP DIVE into into NHL salary cap and contracts a while back to educate myself. Since I wanted to predict Hawks lineup for future. I highly recommend people understand a few terms before throwing names out. It may seem like simple obvious words but each word carries ALOT of value when talking trade negotiations.

Unrestricted Free Agent
Restricted Free Agent
Draft Compensation Picks

I think the restrictive free agent draft compensation picks is one of the more powerful pieces of the NHL labor agreement. The owners made off like bandits here. With young players generally restricted till 26-27 years old. Other GM's would be very hesitant to pay such large compensation draft picks. Really limiting the Players salaries long term. Big piece of the puzzle to the Brandon Saad trade. It plays into why we Signed Brandon Bollig to some odd 3 year contract and than shipped him off shortly after.


This is one of the reasons how Theo Epstien turned Boston into World Series champ so rapidly after taking over. They eventually changed the rule. But he would trade for particular expiring contracts and would get supplemental draft compensation picks. Before anyone realized how valuable the draft picks were. He got players like Jacoby Ellsbury and Justin Masterson along with others this way.
 
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BK

"Goalie Apologist"
Feb 8, 2011
33,636
16,483
Minneapolis, MN
What I was eluding too.

Looking for a larger sample set without Phil K. I have not watched much of JVR to give any real opinion on his abilities. But his numbers did greatly spike once Phil joined the leafs. Having played against Phil K. On Phil K wiki page he scored 286 points in Bantam's, 8 of those came against me.

JVR Career +/- is -38. Just saying

Before people start throwing magical trade possibilities in the air. I did a fun DEEP DIVE into into NHL salary cap and contracts a while back to educate myself. Since I wanted to predict Hawks lineup for future. I highly recommend people understand a few terms before throwing names out. It may seem like simple obvious words but each word carries ALOT of value when talking trade negotiations.

Unrestricted Free Agent
Restricted Free Agent
Draft Compensation Picks

I think the restrictive free agent draft compensation picks is one of the more powerful pieces of the NHL labor agreement. The owners made off like bandits here. With young players generally restricted till 26-27 years old. Other GM's would be very hesitant to pay such large compensation draft picks. Really limiting the Players salaries long term. Big piece of the puzzle to the Brandon Saad trade.

Ok then look at this year and when he was in Philly. The information is there. I already mentioned his +/- and it is terrible. JVR has offensive talent but he has some glaring defensive issues. He does not have the value some think and he performs to what his deal is so far.

While the Madison Capitals are a decent program, they don't play a very difficult schedule from what I remember (aka the skip most of the Michigan AAA teams and top prep. teams) so I would not put much merit in Bantam point totals.

Not sure if you know this but a lot of the posters here understand how the cap works and the terms you listed so I guess kudos for educating yourself on how things work.
 

EddieOs HairPluggs

Registered User
Nov 11, 2015
46
0
Ok then look at this year and when he was in Philly. The information is there. I already mentioned his +/- and it is terrible. JVR has offensive talent but he has some glaring defensive issues. He does not have the value some think and he performs to what his deal is so far.

While the Madison Capitals are a decent program, they don't play a very difficult schedule from what I remember (aka the skip most of the Michigan AAA teams and top prep. teams) so I would not put much merit in Bantam point totals.

Not sure if you know this but a lot of the posters here understand how the cap works and the terms you listed so I guess kudos for educating yourself on how things work.
No need to sell me on your thoughts about him. I'm not a fan of the deal.

Trust me, I am not saying I was any good at hockey.

I never intended to come off like I knew more about contracts or was smarter than others. I was not trying to talk down to anyone. Just needed to get that little note off my chest since lots of names are thrown around that quickly get thrown back. Case example above. Just was offering my thought process before I personally throw trades in the air. My whole post was not directed towards you. Just the first sentence.
 
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Fortyfives

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Jul 13, 2011
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Not that I want TT traded, but I wouldn't worry about young talent on this team for a while. The bowmans are going to continue to find college free agents or international undrafted talents to fill the pipeline until the league changes the rules.
 

Keithsteeth

Registered User
Nov 10, 2013
858
5
Why in the world would we trade TT? Because he's started a bit slow this year?

Maybe we should trade Toews too
 

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