Owen Sound Attack 2018-19 Season Thread (Part 2)

[HockeyPops]

How ironic it would be to acquire a proper, OHL-calibre veteran goalie *AFTER* a sell-off! We needed this in August 2017. All of the goalies that DD acquired since then who played with the team (Bowman and Lafreniere, and even Torchia) have proven to be not good enough to play in the OHL, while the best veteran goalies that the Attack had over this period--Vella and Propp--were traded away without playing a single game in that role which we still need filled. How does a scenario like that happen?? It's mind-boggling as a fan.

I don't think you will be acquiring a true OHL calibre veteran goalie. Price is too high and not many options, plus they won't get as much playing time if you are trying to develop two '01s. But you could land a capable veteran backup, who may not put up all star number, but would insulate your younger goalies from getting shell shocked by the top teams for the rest of this year and next year.

 

[Otto]

Suzuki will NOT be an OA next year. Why is anyone even having this discussion.

This.....

Montreal is under a lot of pressure to succeed... and if they aren't going to succeed the fans want to at least see some hope. Montreal has a lot of young talent both in the NHL and outside of it... they want to get those guys playing together ASAP... no way Suzuki is an OA next season

 

[LR8]

Need for a goalie has haunted Attack. Obviously something behind the scenes must have good wrong. Mcniven to return? Helvig? Raaymakers? Import draft? Something went wrong.
Blaming Coaching staff is unfair without good goaltending. The list of teams that won with goalie under 900 save percentage is very short. This Owen Sound team has allowed very few shots against most nights. That is truer test of Coaches. Goalies need to make saves. Toughest position mentally to play but it is one of the easiest to analyse using raw stats. Size is nice, Athleticism is nice, you may favor a certain style of player, but in the end 920 save percentage wins championships.

6 different Goalies in the last 16 months - only 1 has ever had save percentage above 880. Not something a coach can really do much about. Coaches have limited chances against as they have one of the lowest shots against totals.

2 Goalies the same age is not good for anyone, including the Goalies. Having them be 01's is not good. Statistically obvious. Sub 900 save percentage, and negative goals saved adjusted against league average is not good. Building around 2 17 year old goalies is not good. Someone should be protecting and mentoring them for development. Can not find example of 2 17 year olds working anywhere ever before.

Do not overvalue getting lots of work and wins.
12 goalies in OHL this year under 18 years of age who have faced 200 plus shots.
Save percentage; 4th and 6th respectively out of the 12.
Adj. GSAA; both negative, 4th and 10th out of the 12 young goalies in the league.
Both young and could develop to be outstanding. Current numbers are average at best for the 17 year olds. Higher Numbers are most similar to Keyser (behind Brodeur) or Fulcher (starter) at that age, and lower stats goalie are similar to Pecchia (behind Helvig) and Hughes (behind Fazio) Goal is the foundation of any team.

OS should have won in the last 2 years with that group of skaters. Similar to Soo except they had better netminding. Not sure there is anything that can be done about goal at this time - too late.

 

[Generallyspeaking]

Goalies are always fighting each other for playing time. If you truly believe an older veteran goalie would "mentor" a younger possible replacement and lose playing time your crazy. The goal of any of these players is to play and be noticed to get to the next level. Let them continue to play and develop. If the losses start getting to them they obviously don't have the mental fortitude to play at this or the next level.

 

[LR8]

the best veteran goalies that the Attack had over this period--Vella and Propp--were traded away without playing a single game in that role which we still need filled. How does a scenario like that happen?? It's mind-boggling as a fan.

All of the numbers for your current tandem are better than the goalies that you mention. Getting older and worse is not good.

 

[OHL insideout]

Wadda, the losses have already been "getting to them" and to the rest of the team!
There is almost always an older more experienced #1 goaltender riding along with a younger, less experienced partner waiting in the wings to take over the #1 position when he is ready to handle the pressures of being "that guy"...

 

[aresknights]

Have you actually compiled the data on this or is it Speculation? Not asking to be a "Richard" . But if you haven't done the research I may pick it up.... I had done the research into the whole " The NHL is keeping more junior eligible players since the lost season of 04/05 than before it" and I'm pretty sure the data I collected can be applied here.... I just need to update my spreadsheet

No i havent, just a gut feel. I could very well be incorrect. If so Ill own it.
It was just a response to a post saying kids are more likely to get returned if they play for London.

 

[aresknights]

Who cares, **** the knights! Just go out and buy another player.

Good plan. Hopfully they thought of that

 

[jamemcca]

Crowd looks terrible tonight!

 

[three dog night]

Was the box score right just 2,100 still a holiday for some people.

 

[Jack Attack]

With 2 17 y/o goalies, you really have only one more year max of development before you need to hand over the reins to one. Even a '99 goalie that is returning next year would be a good acquisition to help buy the time these goalies need.

Good idea in theory, good to have older goalie mentor the younger, but there is no 99 goalie out there who's available who's better than Guzda or McLean except perhaps Propp. All the good ones are on good teams and thus a trade won't happen. There are lots of weak veteran goalies...and I don't see why DD would trade for Propp if he traded him away last year after having him for 5 minutes. It all would've worked out if Attack got Raaymakers like they seemed to be hoping for last year already.
Hopefully Guzda and McLean can push each other and get lots of support especially against the difficult teams, but look at the pre-Christmas games, McLean was playing amazing and tonight Guzda has a great game. They are good goalies who need their team to give that extra support defensively and not leave them out to dry. That will boost their confidence.

 

[Noofgoof]

Was the box score right just 2,100 still a holiday for some people.

Three blowout losses in a row and a Canada game at the same time on a Wednesday night. I’m not shocked . Get used to the crowd size its about to drop considerably in the next few weeks with the impending sell off.

 

[AttackSound]

Was the box score right just 2,100 still a holiday for some people.

Listed 3,100

 

[three dog night]

Listed 3,100

Must have corrected it

 

[Millpond]

Crowd looks terrible tonight!

Lots were in the concourse watching TC

 

[OSA]

I often wonder if DD offered up Russell and whatever 2nd and 3rd picks we had left at this time last year for DiPietro, if that would gotten the deal done. Boy would that deal have looked like sheer genius today.

 

[OSAttackFan88]

Apparently the Ottawa 67s GM was spotted at the game tonight.. something maybe happening shortly

 

[aresknights]

Apparently the Ottawa 67s GM was spotted at the game tonight.. something maybe happening shortly

Just for fun Ill guess Hancock or Durzi.

 

[Attackfan72]

Who cares, **** the knights! Just go out and buy another player.

Well said!

 

[Attackfan72]

We are about to lose to a team that sold off its 1st line d pair. A top forward and their starting goalie. A team that isn't even in a playoff spot.

Seriously this weekend better be a damn wake up call for Dale DeGray.

Sell off.
Fire Todd Gill
Re-evaluate the scouting staff.

Agreed!

 

[INTENTIONALLYOFFSIDE]

Hopefully Guzda and McLean can push each other

Jack, you make a well-intentioned point; however, it is a hockey fallacy.
In goaltending the only time you have a goalie pushing another is when a young backup is brought in and even then it is really only a motivational tactic for the younger goalie to improve. Every coach at every level except pro hockey will tell the young guy, "the starter's job is there for the taking, you just have is outplay the other guy". When in reality it is the starter's job to lose not the other way around. Successful teams have players who understand their roles; you have a starter and you have a backup....teams with a 1A and a 1B never work in reality.
In OS case you have 2 young quality goalies battling for the starter's job which will delay their development until one of them is gone. The reason being is the most important time for goalie development is practice; this is where mistakes happen, goals are scored and corrections made. However, most goalies who are battling for starts know that coaches use practice as a measuring stick for the next game so they abandon development (for fear of letting in too many goals) and try to stop more shots than the other guy.
DD"s inability to find a suitable goalie last season has lead to the issues this season.

 

[AttackSound]

Good to see the team pull the win together tonight.

Nose to the grindstone type of game and everything earned by a 60 minute effort, tough loss for the Storm's Gogolev those types of injuries are never pretty to see. Unfortunately they do happen from time to time.

 

[OSMike]

I don't believe this theory that an older goalie mentors a younger goalie or is needed to make a younger goalie better. Sure they provide some tips, and an opportunity to observe an older more established goalie, but the older goalie wants to keep his job and impress, just like the young guy. We have a goalie coach who has done well to bring about a number of top notch goalies. That's who they need to listen to, I would say as well more important for a goalie is a sports psychologist for mental prep. There is no goalie out there that is available that I would trade for this year. Let these 2 get a good dose of in game action and see who shakes out to be the best. Next year see what the market is an flip one and hopefully have a prospect coming up to backup.

WJC is done so start the sell off.

BTW a little off topic but IMO Tim Hunter is to blame for Canada's loss. Picking Comtois for that penalty shot was a terrible call. How he has no plan for who would take a penalty shot or his first SO. You could see him looking around bewildered trying to decide who to put out there... He choked and went with the easy choice. Frost / Suzuki / Hayton would have been my go to guys. I wasn't impressed by Canada's top line all tournament and no adjustments were really made. Nick and Markus both played really well IMO.

 

[Tickattack]

I understand that world junior players can’t be traded during the tournament. Can Canada’s players be traded now that they have been eliminated, or do they have to wait until the tournament is over?

 

[Naz]

I understand that world junior players can’t be traded during the tournament. Can Canada’s players be traded now that they have been eliminated, or do they have to wait until the tournament is over?

Good ? but I don't think so