Post-Game Talk: overtime loss seems like a theme here

[Claypool]

Can you really agree with him though? Sheahan isn't producing, but I guess Blash believes he's realgud.

He's fine for the role he's filling right now on the third line. I get that he isn't scoring. It would be a much larger issue if he was playing with Zetterberg and Tatar, though. When you're trying to grind out points like Blashill is attempting to it shouldn't really be a surprise that Sheahan plays more as the bench gets shortened.

If you're Mantha you have a golden opportunity playing on the top line. He should make sure he stays there. I know it's fun to call Blashill an idiot but he obviously would love to keep giving Mantha more minutes if he plays well. You can't keep giving minutes to a rookie who isn't playing well. That's bad coaching.

 

[Pavels Dog]

No he just isn't playing well. Blashill is trying to win games.

A minimum of one of those two statements is wrong.

 

[Big Poppa Puck]

Sick of this OTL BS. Either lose in regulation or win.

They're gonna OTL themselves into like the 10th pick.

 

[Claypool]

Sick of this OTL BS. Either lose in regulation or win.

They're gonna OTL themselves into like the 10th pick.

Unless they finish in the bottom three it doesn't really matter. I don't think they have much of a chance of catching Arizona or Colorado anyway for a bottom two finish.

The difference in percentage odds between finishing 4th and 14th is just 8.5%. If you finish 4th you have a 9.5% chance. If you finish 10th you have a 3.5% chance. The Jets finished 6th with a 7.5% odds and got the 2nd overall pick.

You can do your own draft lottery simulation with the current standings here.

http://nhllotterysimulator.com/

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

I feel like the Mantha thing is as much about fabricating an excuse to send him back down as anything else

like a multi-step plan or something:

patiently wait for him not to produce for a couple games after killing it for a month
use that excuse to cut his ice time and change his linemates
he's playing with Miller and Glendening now so no need to worry about him producing anymore
send him down whenever you want

also explains the not using him in overtime thing,the last thing you want is him scoring the game winner and ruining your perfectly good plan

I was about to say that's the stupidest damn thing I've ever read, but it's pretty obvious that you're bitterly, sarcastically taking the ****.

 

[Go Wings]

He's fine for the role he's filling right now on the third line. I get that he isn't scoring. It would be a much larger issue if he was playing with Zetterberg and Tatar, though. When you're trying to grind out points like Blashill is attempting to it shouldn't really be a surprise that Sheahan plays more as the bench gets shortened.

If you're Mantha you have a golden opportunity playing on the top line. He should make sure he stays there. I know it's fun to call Blashill an idiot but he obviously would love to keep giving Mantha more minutes if he plays well. You can't keep giving minutes to a rookie who isn't playing well. That's bad coaching.

Your argument might have validity except for the fact that Nyquist continues to play on the top line despite not scoring and have poor possession numbers.

 

[izlez]

I'm one of the biggest supporters of Helm and Abdelkader around.
I think they play a smart, mistake free, game of 5 on 5 NHL hockey that is criminally underrated around here.

I'm one of Mantha and Athanasiou's detractors.
I don't think flash and goal scoring, or an occasional defensive effort play is worth it if you are not out there making good decisions all the time.


Playing Helm and Abdelkader over Mantha and Athanasiou in 3 vs 3 overtime has got to be one of the dumbest things I have ever seen. You don't need smart NHL hockey in 3 vs 3. On defense you need to pick a man and lock him down. Then You just need to beat that man on offense. Simple game. Perfect for Mantha and Athanasiou

 

[Vladdy84]

Only caught the final 5 and OT. Why wasn't Mantha out there?

 

[jkutswings]

Unless they finish in the bottom three it doesn't really matter. I don't think they have much of a chance of catching Arizona or Colorado anyway for a bottom two finish.

The difference in percentage odds between finishing 4th and 14th is just 8.5%. If you finish 4th you have a 9.5% chance. If you finish 10th you have a 3.5% chance. The Jets finished 6th with a 7.5% odds and got the 2nd overall pick.

You can do your own draft lottery simulation with the current standings here.

http://nhllotterysimulator.com/

Then I guess you like fewer players in this draft than I do.

I see 4-6 players that would be a great addition to the team, so I really want a bottom-5 finish.

Getting a friendly ping pong ball for a top-3 pick would be fantastic, but I think 4-6 are still good players.

 

[HIFE]

...Playing Helm and Abdelkader over Mantha and Athanasiou in 3 vs 3 overtime has got to be one of the dumbest things I have ever seen. You don't need smart NHL hockey in 3 vs 3. On defense you need to pick a man and lock him down. Then You just need to beat that man on offense. Simple game. Perfect for Mantha and Athanasiou

I could see one or the other, but together with DD, that was...awkward. Not one of those 3 have the ability rush the puck and deke through an opponent. Surprised they didn't just pass it around for 5 minutes and try to get to a SO, probably a better strategy to win.

I think 3-3 has evolved from last season, especially for the Wings as the quest for points gets so desperate. OT felt loose in the beginning. Offensive gambles like a player trying to go all the way himself. Now it's gotten tedious- cautious plays to keep possession and not allow a rush the other way. Leave it to the Red Wings to turn the exciting possibility of 3-3 into a drawn out chess match. Funny with such care the Wings are still burned regularly.

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

Then I guess you like fewer players in this draft than I do.

I see 4-6 players that would be a great addition to the team, so I really want a bottom-5 finish.

Getting a friendly ping pong ball for a top-3 pick would be fantastic, but I think 4-6 are still good players.

I think the bigger thing is that the percentages only vary by about maybe 10% total if you are the last team out or the #4 from the bottom. I.E. if you want them to completely junk the rest of the season, you're doing so to bump up their lotto chance from long shot to slightly closer shot. I can see why you'd want any increase in your shot at all, but I'd rather the Wings try to succeed and get Athanasiou and Mantha in ever increasing roles in successful games and have a 10% chance than completely throw them to the wolves and potentially crush their confidence for a 15 or 20% one.

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

I could see one or the other, but together with DD, that was...awkward. Not one of those 3 have the ability rush the puck and deke through an opponent. Surprised they didn't just pass it around for 5 minutes and try to get to a SO, probably a better strategy to win.

I think 3-3 has evolved from last season, especially for the Wings as the quest for points gets so desperate. OT felt loose in the beginning. Offensive gambles like a player trying to go all the way himself. Now it's gotten tedious- cautious plays to keep possession and not allow a rush the other way. Leave it to the Red Wings to turn the exciting possibility of 3-3 into a drawn out chess match. Funny with such care the Wings are still burned regularly.

I feel like that's the natural evolution of the 3 on 3. Teams want to limit broken plays deciding a game if they can. Much easier to win in OT if you control the pace.

 

[borisbadenough]

Just keep sending the same guys out there in OT. Things will get better.

 

[jkutswings]

I think the bigger thing is that the percentages only vary by about maybe 10% total if you are the last team out or the #4 from the bottom. I.E. if you want them to completely junk the rest of the season, you're doing so to bump up their lotto chance from long shot to slightly closer shot. I can see why you'd want any increase in your shot at all, but I'd rather the Wings try to succeed and get Athanasiou and Mantha in ever increasing roles in successful games and have a 10% chance than completely throw them to the wolves and potentially crush their confidence for a 15 or 20% one.

But what I'm trying to say is that, even if everything goes according to Hoyle on lottery night, and nobody moves up, I'd much much rather be picking 4 or 5 than 9 or 10. After the first half dozen, I think it tails off.

 

[Reddwit]

He's fine for the role he's filling right now on the third line. I get that he isn't scoring. It would be a much larger issue if he was playing with Zetterberg and Tatar, though. When you're trying to grind out points like Blashill is attempting to it shouldn't really be a surprise that Sheahan plays more as the bench gets shortened.

If you're Mantha you have a golden opportunity playing on the top line. He should make sure he stays there. I know it's fun to call Blashill an idiot but he obviously would love to keep giving Mantha more minutes if he plays well. You can't keep giving minutes to a rookie who isn't playing well. That's bad coaching.

Uh, no, man. You don't get to make such contradictory statements as this and not get called out for it.

That's just an absurd comment. If you aren't providing some scoring and are playing as the 3rd line center, then you are, by definition, not filling your role as a 3rd line center. Not scoring and playing "solid defense" (even though Sheahan's defense is merely adequate) is the role of 4th line center or a 13th forward. That is the only role Sheahan is cut out for right now.

He is 5th among our centers in faceoff percentage.
He is LAST on the team in +/- with -15.
He has the worst P/PG among all of our regular forwards.
He is not one of the go-to PKers.
He is 8th among forwards in hits per game, with an impressive one hit per game.
Of all the "defensive" players on the team, he leads in giveaways.
His CF% is 17th out of 20 on the team among all players who have played at least 300 minutes.
He gives up 2.9 goals against per 60 minutes - 2nd worst only to a guy that got waived this week.
And, his linemates GA/60 when they are NOT playing with him is 4th best out of 21! Meaning, his linemates do exceptionally well defensively when he is off their line.

Anyway you slice it, Sheahan ****ing sucks at the game of hockey.

 

[TKB]

I guess I don't understand what all the confusion about sitting Mantha.

Clearly Mantha sat because Riley Sheahan showed an 0.0 "compete level" when allowing Marchand to blow by him from the blue line in, and then showed no willingness to clear him from the crease, let alone tie him up on game tying goal.

Mantha has to understand how important defense is, and this is just coach Blashill's way of emphasizing that fact...

 

[TheOtherOne]

I guess I don't understand what all the confusion about sitting Mantha.

Clearly Mantha sat because Riley Sheahan showed an 0.0 "compete level" when allowing Marchand to blow by him from the blue line in, and then showed no willingness to clear him from the crease, let alone tie him up on game tying goal.

Mantha has to understand how important defense is, and this is just coach Blashill's way of emphasizing that fact...

Get your alternative facts out of here. Sheahan never scores, so he MUST be good at defense. Obviously. Don't let the eye test and stats get in the way of the evidence.

 

[HisNoodliness]

Unless they finish in the bottom three it doesn't really matter. I don't think they have much of a chance of catching Arizona or Colorado anyway for a bottom two finish.

The difference in percentage odds between finishing 4th and 14th is just 8.5%. If you finish 4th you have a 9.5% chance. If you finish 10th you have a 3.5% chance. The Jets finished 6th with a 7.5% odds and got the 2nd overall pick.

You can do your own draft lottery simulation with the current standings here.

http://nhllotterysimulator.com/

You're correct that our odds of winning the lottery don't change a ton, however our draft position is still better the lower we finish. If we're 4th last in the standings (LV being 3 no matter what) even if we don't win the lottery we're picking 4-7. If we're 6th last then it's 6-9 and so on. Personally I see this draft as having essentially 4 guys I really want: 1)Hischier, 2) Patrick, 3)Liljegren, 4) Vilardi. I expect all of them to be gone by the sixth pick so a top 5 pick is a must so I'd really like to finish 28th or 27th. Even if we don't win the lottery, we're getting a great player that way.

 

[14ari13]

6 teams tied with 49 points. The next 5-10 games are going to be a dog fight.