Other Chicago & General Sports Thread LXIV: Cactus League

[RayP]

A lot of dumb arguments on this forum but this one we somehow keep circling back to might be the dumbest.

Quintana has been terrible and a bust of a trade.

 

[Kaners Bald Spot]

A lot of dumb arguments on this forum but this one we somehow keep circling back to might be the dumbest.

Quintana has been terrible and a bust of a trade.

As of right now, you're not wrong. We'll see. The Sox FO has proven over a half decade to be a clown college, so I can't trust them on anything, especially player evaluations.

 

[Illinihockey]

It's not like Q's done much for the Cubs except be a #4 ... and looks to be the #5 this year.

He probably got them into the playoffs his first year here

 

[Kaners Bald Spot]

He probably got them into the playoffs his first year here

Yeah he pitched really well down the stretch for them in 2017. Not sure they catch the Brewers without him.

 

[Cubs2024WSChamps]

A lot of dumb arguments on this forum but this one we somehow keep circling back to might be the dumbest.

Quintana has been terrible and a bust of a trade.

46 starts on a WS contender for two players who have yet to even make the majors is a bust?

Hahahaha

 

[RayP]

46 starts on a WS contender for two players who have yet to even make the majors is a bust?

Hahahaha

What have they won with Q?

 

[piteus]

What have they won with Q?

The truth is somewhere in the middle. Quintana hasn't been terrible. He's an innings eater and a competent low #3 / high #4 on a staff. More towards a #4 on a legit WS contender.

That said, the Cubs traded Eloy and Cease thinking Quintana was a #2. Hence, the trade is disappointing to this point. If the ChiSox traded both Eloy and Cease today, I'm thinking they'll get a legit #2 pitcher. The BoSox traded Moncada and Kopech and got Sale back ... a legit #1.

 

[Illinihockey]

What have they won with Q?

They made the NLCS and the playoffs both years.

 

[ColdSteel2]

The truth is somewhere in the middle. Quintana hasn't been terrible. He's an innings eater and a competent low #3 / high #4 on a staff. More towards a #4 on a legit WS contender.

That said, the Cubs traded Eloy and Cease thinking Quintana was a #2. Hence, the trade is disappointing to this point. If the ChiSox traded both Eloy and Cease today, I'm thinking they'll get a legit #2 pitcher. The BoSox traded Moncada and Kopech and got Sale back ... a legit #1.

I can’t believe the Cubs didn’t go for Sale instead. It made too much sense. Is it actually possible Hahn took a lesser return to keep him off the Cubs?

 

[piteus]

I can’t believe the Cubs didn’t go for Sale instead. It made too much sense. Is it actually possible Hahn took a lesser return to keep him off the Cubs?

Haha wasn't giving Sale to the Cubs. If Sale won the Cy Young on the Northside, he would never hear the end of it ... regardless of what he got in return.

 

[ColdSteel2]

Haha wasn't giving Sale to the Cubs. If Sale won the Cy Young on the Northside, he would never hear the end of it ... regardless of what he got in return.

Yeah, that’s what I figured. But every time I brought it up to Sox fans during the World Series year, they were totally down for it. It was usually Russell+, Schwarber+ or Russell + Schwarber they wanted.

 

[Kaners Bald Spot]

Haha wasn't giving Sale to the Cubs. If Sale won the Cy Young on the Northside, he would never hear the end of it ... regardless of what he got in return.

There was only one player the Sox could have received from the Cubs that would have made that palatable, and it was Kris Bryant. If they wanted to trade Bryant for Sale, sure. Otherwise GTFO.

 

[Cubs2024WSChamps]

There was only one player the Sox could have received from the Cubs that would have made that palatable, and it was Kris Bryant. If they wanted to trade Bryant for Sale, sure. Otherwise GTFO.

(Spits out coffee)

The Sox didn't get a "Kris Bryant" for Sale from Boston.

As for Q, the Cubs made the playoffs both years he's been on the team, and has this year plus an option. One less worry in a rotation on a WS contender.

Lol @Bust. Lemme know when those two Cubs prospects are in the majors making a difference. Thanx

 

[Kaners Bald Spot]

(Spits out coffee)

The Sox didn't get a "Kris Bryant" for Sale from Boston.

As for Q, the Cubs made the playoffs both years he's been on the team, and has this year plus an option. One less worry in a rotation on a WS contender.

Lol @Bust. Lemme know when those two Cubs prospects are in the majors making a difference. Thanx

That is what I call a "Cubs Tax" Theo would have had to pay more than anyone else to get Sale.
Sale put up 7.7 WAR in 2017, which is pretty damn close to Bryant's 7.9 in 2016 when he won MVP. It would have been a decent baseball trade.

 

[Kaners Bald Spot]

delete

 

[Cubs2024WSChamps]

And Sale, in 2017 put up a season that blows Bryant's best out of the water.

Bryant won an MVP in 2016 with a 7.4 WAR.

Sales best year was last year with a 6.9 WAR, not 2017.

Try again?

 

[Illinihockey]

That is what I call a "Cubs Tax" Theo would have had to pay more than anyone else to get Sale.
Sale put up 7.7 WAR in 2017, which is pretty damn close to Bryant's 7.9 in 2016 when he won MVP. It would have been a decent baseball trade.

Bryant had a 7.9 WAR season the year he won the MVP (fangraphs). 2017 Sale had a 7.7 WAR.

 

[ColdSteel2]

That is what I call a "Cubs Tax" Theo would have had to pay more than anyone else to get Sale.

It would be interesting to know what Theo would have offered for Sale. My anecdotal study suggested Schwarber and Russell was the price with a Cubs tax included. I can’t say I would have done that, it seemed pretty steep. Sox would be all over that if they could go back though.

 

[Kaners Bald Spot]

Bryant had a 7.9 WAR season the year he won the MVP (fangraphs). 2017 Sale had a 7.7 WAR.

Again, the definition of a baseball trade.

 

[Illinihockey]

It would be interesting to know what Theo would have offered for Sale. My anecdotal study suggested Schwarber and Russell was the price with a Cubs tax included. I can’t say I would have done that, it seemed pretty steep. Sox would be all over that if they could go back though.

Pretty sure Hahn said or implied he would have only traded Sale for Bryant.

 

[Illinihockey]

https://www.nbcsports.com/chicago/c...unlikely-crosstown-deal-jose-quintana-red-sox

Theo

“When Chris Sale was being put to the market, I called Rick and told him we were very interested, and was told that it would have to be a huge package, including Kris Bryant, or there was nothing to talk about. And Kris had just won the MVP award.”

 

[Kaners Bald Spot]

Pretty sure Hahn said or implied he would have only traded Sale for Bryant.

Yup. Theo said more, but in reality if they would have actually hammered out a trade it would have been Sale for Bryant straight up. It would have been one of those deals where both sides felt uncomfortable, and that is when you know it was a fair trade.

 

[Cubs2024WSChamps]

https://www.nbcsports.com/chicago/c...unlikely-crosstown-deal-jose-quintana-red-sox

Theo

“When Chris Sale was being put to the market, I called Rick and told him we were very interested, and was told that it would have to be a huge package, including Kris Bryant, or there was nothing to talk about. And Kris had just won the MVP award.”

At least he aimed high, I guess.

Took scraps instead. That's the White Sox for ya (shrugs)

 

[Kaners Bald Spot]

At least he aimed high, I guess.

Took scraps instead. That's the White Sox for ya (shrugs)

You want to know what's crazy? If the Cubs had made that deal, they probably would have been in on Harper this offseason. You know what else? They probably get him. And they still have Eloy and Cease.

 

[ColdSteel2]

https://www.nbcsports.com/chicago/c...unlikely-crosstown-deal-jose-quintana-red-sox

Theo

“When Chris Sale was being put to the market, I called Rick and told him we were very interested, and was told that it would have to be a huge package, including Kris Bryant, or there was nothing to talk about. And Kris had just won the MVP award.”

Too bad then, guess it was never possible. Would have been ridiculous to trade Bryant for 3 years of Sale IMO.