Other Chicago & General Sports Thread LXI: Bulls Talk

[AmericanDream]

Sure, Davis may not be back. But a change at hitting coach is among the most insignificant and inconsequential moves a team can make.

Maddon will be back, guaranteed. There is absolutely no good reason to not want him back.

you keep saying that, but it is absolutely inherently incorrect.

I doubt you played baseball or at a high level if you think a hitting coach is insignificant..so many examples of good hitting coaches who have changed players careers around...I was lucky enough to have a real good guy named Dick Cannon (yep, he is real and played for the Cubs organization and others), turned my plate approach around completely and minor tweaked my stance bringing my hands a bit higher up while in the Royals organization. I had minor tweaks from other hitting coaches like Brent Byers, but Cannon saw something flawed in my swing that others didn't, and he did that with a lot of the guys.

You have to rely on a players skillset at the major leagues, but hitting and pitching is so technical and mental that the real good coaches get the most out of their players because they can see these issues and adjust on the fly. I saw a Cubs team that was ALWAYS trying to pull the ball no matter the count. Just horrible plate approach and swinging with their feet either planted getting no weight transfer or just opening up so much on their swings because they were not trying to go the other way with the ball. The Cubs plate approach sucked this year, that is on Davis. Power numbers will always fluctuate, but putting the ball in play and especially spraying it to other fields is something this team rarely did and hurt them tremendously. I loved Davis as a player, but I think he just is not a good hitting coach with this group who isn't identifying basic switches needing to be made which is why this offense struggled.

 

[RayP]

Gotta gamble somewhere . This isn't the NBA

Those are my hot takes. What's everyone elses?

I agree with you, and that would be my preferred plan of action. Prioritize a leadoff guy and elite bullpen arm, hope next year this rotation is good enough amen Morrow is healthy when it matters most.

I’ll take Machado over Harper if you make a big signing, which I’m unsure on.

 

[Easy E]

you keep saying that, but it is absolutely inherently incorrect.

I doubt you played baseball or at a high level if you think a hitting coach is insignificant..so many examples of good hitting coaches who have changed players careers around...I was lucky enough to have a real good guy named Dick Cannon (yep, he is real and played for the Cubs organization and others), turned my plate approach around completely and minor tweaked my stance bringing my hands a bit higher up while in the Royals organization. I had minor tweaks from other hitting coaches like Brent Byers, but Cannon saw something flawed in my swing that others didn't, and he did that with a lot of the guys.

You have to rely on a players skillset at the major leagues, but hitting and pitching is so technical and mental that the real good coaches get the most out of their players because they can see these issues and adjust on the fly. I saw a Cubs team that was ALWAYS trying to pull the ball no matter the count. Just horrible plate approach and swinging with their feet either planted getting no weight transfer or just opening up so much on their swings because they were not trying to go the other way with the ball. The Cubs plate approach sucked this year, that is on Davis. Power numbers will always fluctuate, but putting the ball in play and especially spraying it to other fields is something this team rarely did and hurt them tremendously. I loved Davis as a player, but I think he just is not a good hitting coach who isn't identifying basic switches needing to be made which is why this offense struggled.

Moot point, they will still vehemently deny it

 

[Easy E]

I agree with you, and that would be my preferred plan of action. Prioritize a leadoff guy and elite bullpen arm, hope next year this rotation is good enough amen Morrow is healthy when it matters most.

I’ll take Machado over Harper if you make a big signing, which I’m unsure on.

Tough call... Gimme Harper, he will mash at Wrigley .

Oooh also add Monty getting traded, he has value

 

[MurrayBannerman]

I don't think Chili did a bad job. The pitching was a lot more of an issue. Sure, the bats ended cold, but that happens.

 

[Easy E]

I don't think Chili did a bad job. The pitching was a lot more of an issue. Sure, the bats ended cold, but that happens.

just playing

 

[RayP]

Tough call... Gimme Harper, he will mash at Wrigley .

Oooh also add Monty getting traded, he has value

You can’t go wrong either way.

Someone would have to overpay for Monty for me to part with him.

 

[hawksrule]

you keep saying that, but it is absolutely inherently incorrect.

I doubt you played baseball or at a high level if you think a hitting coach is insignificant..so many examples of good hitting coaches who have changed players careers around...I was lucky enough to have a real good guy named Dick Cannon (yep, he is real and played for the Cubs organization and others), turned my plate approach around completely and minor tweaked my stance bringing my hands a bit higher up while in the Royals organization. I had minor tweaks from other hitting coaches like Brent Byers, but Cannon saw something flawed in my swing that others didn't, and he did that with a lot of the guys.

You have to rely on a players skillset at the major leagues, but hitting and pitching is so technical and mental that the real good coaches get the most out of their players because they can see these issues and adjust on the fly. I saw a Cubs team that was ALWAYS trying to pull the ball no matter the count. Just horrible plate approach and swinging with their feet either planted getting no weight transfer or just opening up so much on their swings because they were not trying to go the other way with the ball. The Cubs plate approach sucked this year, that is on Davis. Power numbers will always fluctuate, but putting the ball in play and especially spraying it to other fields is something this team rarely did and hurt them tremendously. I loved Davis as a player, but I think he just is not a good hitting coach who isn't identifying basic switches needing to be made which is why this offense struggled.

At lower levels, sure. At the major league level it's pretty unimportant. These players have had 25 years of repetitions and fine tuning their swings to the point that their swings are instinctual. It takes a fraction of a second for the ball to reach home plate. It's all about reaction. There's no time to pause and think. A good hitting coach in preparation of a game will go over a pitcher's tendencies, and if a player is struggling they'll watch film to analyze whatever slight differences there may be from when the player wasn't struggling. That's their job. But the idea that at the mlb level a hitting coach comes in and implements a new organizational hitting philosophy (or plate approach as you call it) that makes previously good hitters bad is just untrue and silly.

 

[RayP]

I don't think Chili did a bad job. The pitching was a lot more of an issue. Sure, the bats ended cold, but that happens.

For the talent on this team this is unacceptable. Is it all Chili’s fault? No, but he’s going to be the one to take the fall.

 

[Easy E]

For the talent on this team this is unacceptable. Is it all Chili’s fault? No, but he’s going to be the one to take the fall.

He will take the bullet. Bet the house

 

[RayP]

He will take the bullet. Bet the house

Yeah, he kind of has to. I don’t think you can fire Joe yet with the WS win bring so recent, maybe if he has one more disappointing season next year you can think about it.

 

[Easy E]

Yeah, he kind of has to. I don’t think you can fire Joe yet with the WS win bring so recent, maybe if he has one more disappointing season next year you can think about it.

Injuries buy him one last year .

World series win or fired

Just like Girardi

Honestly he is amazing at what he gets out of players. He just misses that killer knock out ie Chapman

 

[hawksrule]

Injuries buy him one last year .

World series win or fired

Just like Girardi

What is Maddon's fireable offense again?

 

[Easy E]

What is Maddon's fireable offense again?

Not winning World Series with the roster he was given.

You cannot have high expectations

Andy Reid with a championship

 

[OhCaptainMyCaptain]

I don't think Chili did a bad job. The pitching was a lot more of an issue. Sure, the bats ended cold, but that happens.

You must have been watching a different team if you think pitching was the issue this year.

 

[MurrayBannerman]

For the talent on this team this is unacceptable. Is it all Chili’s fault? No, but he’s going to be the one to take the fall.

There's a big Kris Bryant sized hole there.

Still, offensively, the team took a small step back, but with all the injuries that's expected.

Chicago Cubs Team Stats » 2018 » Batters » Dashboard | FanGraphs Baseball

 

[hawksrule]

Not winning World Series with the roster he was given.

You cannot have high expectations

Poe's law, I guess. I can't tell if this is satire.

 

[AmericanDream]

At lower levels, sure. At the major league level it's pretty unimportant. These players have had 25 years of repetitions and fine tuning their swings to the point that their swings are instinctual. It takes a fraction of a second for the ball to reach home plate. It's all about reaction. There's no time to pause and think. A good hitting coach in preparation of a game will go over a pitcher's tendencies, and if a player is struggling they'll watch film to analyze whatever slight differences there may be from when the player wasn't struggling. That's their job. But the idea that at the mlb level a hitting coach comes in and implements a new organizational hitting philosophy (or plate approach as you call it) that makes previously good hitters bad is just untrue and silly.

....I am just going to end my discussion here...you simply do not understand the complexity of what major league players go through, the amount of hitting, coaching, videos they work on each and every day..a players swing can just "leave" them for months at a time, but apparently you think think they need little to no guidance at the pro game. Goodbye.

 

[Illinihockey]

Pretty Comfortable

Davis fired

Kintzler, Hamels, Duensing, Wilson, and Murphy gone

Gore signs some basic deal

1-2 relievers signed

KB shoulder surgery

Wildcards

Heyward + primo package or Chatwood cap dump

Harper or Machado signed (think KB can sway it)

Russell exonerated, stays (heals in off-season, bounces back)

Schwarber/Almora gone


Lester - Hendricks - Darvish - Q - Smyly

I'd pick up Hamels option, no reason not to.

 

[OhCaptainMyCaptain]

Not winning World Series with the roster he was given.

You cannot have high expectations

If you told me we’d be closing out games with Jesse Chavez, Dillon Maples, Jamie Garcia, & Jorge De La Rosa, I’d have said there was no chance that teams even makes the playoffs, let along the World Series. If we’re being honest, this team probably overachieved given the circumstances.

 

[hawksrule]

....I am just going to end my discussion here...you simply do not understand the complexity of what major league players go through, the amount of hitting, coaching, videos they work on each and every day..a players swing can just "leave" them for months at a time, but apparently you think think they need little to no guidance at the pro game. Goodbye.

Appeal to authority is super convincing. Cya.

 

[OhCaptainMyCaptain]

There's a big Kris Bryant sized hole there.

Still, offensively, the team took a small step back, but with all the injuries that's expected.

Chicago Cubs Team Stats » 2018 » Batters » Dashboard | FanGraphs Baseball

So the pitching doesn’t get the injury excuse, despite it being more problematic on that side of things? Interesting.

 

[Illinihockey]

I don't think Chili did a bad job. The pitching was a lot more of an issue. Sure, the bats ended cold, but that happens.

The Cubs scored 1 or 0 runs in 40 games this year and just went 22 innings scoring 2 runs in must win games at home. They were 8th in the NL in runs scored from August to the end of the season. The Cubs pitching as a whole was 3rd in ERA in all of baseball this year.

 

[Easy E]

Poe's law, I guess. I can't tell if this is satire.

You need to win now.

He peaked, the team is regressing, you need to make a change quickly with the inevitable cap issues coming. Yes, there were injuries.

Why was Girardi fired?

 

[MurrayBannerman]

So the pitching doesn’t get the injury excuse, despite it being more problematic on that side of things? Interesting.

I'm not trying to fire Jim Hickey either. But, yea, that's fine. I overlooked that.