Organizational Ineptitude - it ain't just Chiarelli

[CantHaveTkachev]

There's no evidence that the OBC had any hand in any of Chia's moves.

But if that is the attitude here (nothing matters cuz OBC) then trade McDavid. Because you're basically saying this team can't improve ever, so throw the pity party if you want, but you can start by leaving McDavid out of it. Stop wasting his time.

Or you know, they could fire them
After all, Lowe MacT and Howson are the reason we are in this perpetual rebuild afterall

 

[Soundwave]

It doesn't matter who the GM is while this "management team" is here as well. You'll see nothing will change when they fire Chiarelli, but I'm sure you'll just start piling on the next guy.

No I won't because if the "next guy" fails, that means McDavid is done here, and in that case I'm done with this franchise. Been a fan since the 80s, but I will go watch the team McDavid is on and this franchise can enjoy sucking for the next 20 years if they want, I couldn't give a crap less at that point and I doubt I'll be the only one. That shiny Katz arena is gonna be half empty if that's what happens.

 

[Soundwave]

Or you know, they could fire them
After all, Lowe MacT and Howson are the reason we are in this perpetual rebuild afterall

And if they had nothing to do with Chiarelli's moves then what?

There's no proof of this conspiracy theory whatsoever. One guy is both POHO and GM here and paid $3 million dollars. It's not to be a lackey to anyone.

 

[Aerchon]

There's no evidence that the OBC had any hand in any of Chia's moves.

But if that is the attitude here (nothing matters cuz OBC) then trade McDavid. Because you're basically saying this team can't improve ever, so throw the pity party if you want, but you can start by leaving McDavid out of it.

There's no "evidence" Chiarelli is as bad a GM as many say either. Technically speaking the Oilers are currently outperforming all the teams built by the previous management. Overall since coming Chiarelli's team has been far more successful than previous GMs.

This is not me saying I think Chiarelli is doing a good job. I don't believe he is.

Just very funny that you want to bring "evidence" into this conversation since most your arguments stem from a fantasy lineup you imagine would be better now than it was back in 2016.

 

[Soundwave]

There's no "evidence" Chiarelli is as bad a GM as many say either. Technically speaking the Oilers are currently outperforming all the teams built by the previous management. Overall since coming Chiarelli's team has been far more successful than previous GMs.

This is not me saying I think Chiarelli is doing a good job. I don't believe he is.

Just very funny that you want to bring "evidence" into this conversation since most your arguments stem from a fantasy lineup you imagine would be better now than it was back in 2016.

Yes there is ample evidence. Not only of his work here as both POHO and GM, not only has Bob Nicholson stated many times that Peter has the final call in all hockey operations, but also how he left Boston as well.

The idea that he would come here to be a lackey is stupid anyway, he could've had 5-6 other jobs, if you're going to invent a conspiracy theory at least make it some what plausible.

He has no incentive to accept a job here on the basis that he would be controlled by anyone else, especially since he's the one who's never going to likely work again as an GM now. No NHL exec in their right mind would accept to have their reputation destroyed to "cover" for someone else.

It's an incredibly stupid theory that presupposes Chiarelli is OK with having his reputation destroyed for what? The same salary he could've gotten from several other teams?

You also have to presuppose that Katz is A-OK with paying $3 million/year (top of the line money) for a "lackey GM" and giving up a 2nd round pick for that. Which is stupid because you can get a lackey GM for 1/4th that salary easily, Tambellini did it for years, so why spend top end money for that purpose? It makes zero sense if you actually take two seconds to think about it.

 

[booyakasha]

Or you know, they could fire them
After all, Lowe MacT and Howson are the reason we are in this perpetual rebuild afterall

 

[Beerfish]

LOL the thought that macT, lowe and the rest of the henchman had no influence on chiarellis many idiotic moves strains belief.

He made some major changes to the team early on and he would have been listening to his pro scouts and other 'good hockey men'

You are either totally naive or have a head in the sand mentality if you think he has not been major influence on just about all major decisions.

 

[Missing smitty]

No I won't because if the "next guy" fails, that means McDavid is done here, and in that case I'm done with this franchise. Been a fan since the 80s, but I will go watch the team McDavid is on and this franchise can enjoy sucking for the next 20 years if they want, I couldn't give a crap less at that point and I doubt I'll be the only one. That shiny Katz arena is gonna be half empty if that's what happens.

So 10 years of horrendous management wasn't enough to show you that Katz needs to get serious about winning? You sound like you have actual grievances with Chiarelli, enough that you won't admit this organization has been horribly run since 2007. I'm sure the years of losing then were somehow Chiarelli's fault too?

 

[Soundwave]

LOL the thought that macT, lowe and the rest of the henchman had no influence on chiarellis many idiotic moves strains belief.

He made some major changes to the team early on and he would have been listening to his pro scouts and other 'good hockey men'

You are either totally naive or have a head in the sand mentality if you think he has not been major influence on just about all major decisions.

So Peter Chiarelli willingly came to Edmonton to be a lackey cover for Lowe/Mac T?

What exactly is the incentive there? He probably could have gotten the GM job in Toronto, the Bruins were the bane of the Leafs existence and he a recent Cup on his resume. He could have gotten jobs in 5-6 other markets very easily given the catchet he had at the time.

For this theory to work, it presupposes Chiarelli willingly would go somewhere to be a cover for someone else and ruin his reputation.

Which is patently ridiculous. He's not even an old guy, he could've been a GM for another 20 years, why on earth would you flush that down the toilet to be Lowe's lackey here when you have many other options available to you.

The whole theory collapses if you give it any real thought. Kevin Lowe is not the one who's gonna take the fall for this, it's going to be Chiarelli, and he's the one going to be known as the guy who couldn't build a team around McDavid from now until forever.

 

[booyakasha]

I wonder how many "Flat-Earthers" are on HFOil?
I'm guessing quite a few.

 

[Soundwave]

So 10 years of horrendous management wasn't enough to show you that Katz needs to get serious about winning? You sound like you have actual grievances with Chiarelli, enough that you won't admit this organization has been horribly run since 2007. I'm sure the years of losing then were somehow Chiarelli's fault too?

Honestly at this point my feelings towards the franchise itself aren't great.

If they didn't win that lottery ticket in 2015 I was already resigned to really not watching much NHL hockey. I was ready for that pick to be Noah Hanifin.

But they got McDavid by fluke, and you can't help but like the kid and be wowwed by his game.

But if they fail this kid and don't give him a proper GM fast, they are dead to me. I've actually thought about the proposition of this Oilers franchise without McDavid and I have no real feeling towards them anymore. They're nothing to me at that point. I'll go watch whatever team McDavid is traded to.

And I don't think I'd be the only one, IMO that arena will have tons of empty seats if they do not hire someone that isn't a moron to be the GM and fast. McDavid is not going to take 8 years of this.

 

[Dan Kelly]

If the oilers miss the playoffs there will be a house cleaning at the top on down again

Don't count on it ! Only Chia will go because the rest of the coaching staff has been replaced already. And if anyone thinks the likes of Wayne, Nicholson, Lowe, MacT and the like are going anywhere, give your head a shake because they aren't !

 

[Missing smitty]

Honestly at this point my feelings towards the franchise itself aren't great.

If they didn't win that lottery ticket in 2015 I was already resigned to really not watching much NHL hockey. I was ready for that pick to be Noah Hanifin.

But they got McDavid by fluke, and you can't help but like the kid and be wowwed by his game.

But if they fail this kid and don't give him a proper GM fast, they are dead to me. I've actually thought about the proposition of this Oilers franchise without McDavid and I have no real feeling towards them anymore. They're nothing to me at that point. I'll go watch whatever team McDavid is traded to.

And I don't think I'd be the only one, IMO that arena will have tons of empty seats if they do not hire someone that isn't a moron to be the GM and fast. McDavid is not going to take 8 years of this.

That arena will never be empty. If people weren't willing to stay away when they were winning 30ish games a year, people will go to anything.

 

[Soundwave]

That arena will never be empty. If people weren't willing to stay away when they were winning 30ish games a year, people will go to anything.

They cant sell that "hope" bull shit if they screw this up, you cannot get a prospect any better than McDavid so that gimmick will be taken away from them.

They could win the draft lottery again after losing McDavid and no one would give a fart.

Doesn't matter anyway because they won't ever win anything if they can't do it with McDavid.

 

[Missing smitty]

They cant sell that "hope" bull **** if they screw this up, you cannot get a prospect any better than McDavid so that gimmick will be taken away from them.

They could win the draft lottery again after losing McDavid and no one would give a fart.

Doesn't matter anyway because they won't ever win anything if they can't do it with McDavid.

That's the problem with this year. McDavid is worth the price of admission, but the rest of the team probably couldn't get Florida level attendance

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

And if they had nothing to do with Chiarelli's moves then what?

There's no proof of this conspiracy theory whatsoever. One guy is both POHO and GM here and paid $3 million dollars. It's not to be a lackey to anyone.

who the eff cares? Lowe was part of the hiring, shouldn't he be held accountable?

you make it out as if Chiarelli some tyrannical dictator that everyone else in the organization cowers too..he's like any other GM in the league, he listens to people in the organization

 

[Soundwave]

who the eff cares? Lowe was part of the hiring, shouldn't he be held accountable?

you make it out as if Chiarelli some tyrannical dictator that everyone else in the organization cowers too..he's like any other GM in the league, he listens to people in the organization

He makes the final call on all major hockey ops decisions.

No team in the league runs on "popular vote" or something either.

 

[Heavy Dee]

Buy Yzerman his own jet.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

He makes the final call on all major hockey ops decisions.

No team in the league runs on "popular vote" or something either.

gee no kidding...and he'll be fired because most of his bets have failed

but if you think things will be solved with the firing of Chiarelli and hiring an "average" GM...you are sorely mistaken

the problems of this organization run a lot deeper than a simple GM change

 

[Soundwave]

gee no kidding...and he'll be fired because most of his bets have failed

but if you think things will be solved with the firing of Chiarelli and hiring an "average" GM...you are sorely mistaken

the problems of this organization run a lot deeper than a simple GM change

Then trade McDavid. He doesn't need to be a part of this.

And you are kidding yourself if you think every GM would've done the Reinhart, Hall, Strome trades and signed Lucic because OBC or some nonsense.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

Then trade McDavid. He doesn't need to be a part of this.

And you are kidding yourself if you think every GM would've done the Reinhart, Hall, Strome trades and signed Lucic because OBC or some nonsense.

they absolutely had input

plus Nicholson and Katz have to "OK" every trade...if the organization wanted to keep Taylor Hall that badly, or Eberle or whoever...they would have nixed the trades

 

[Soundwave]

they absolutely had input

plus Nicholson and Katz have to "OK" every trade...if the organization wanted to keep Taylor Hall that badly, or Eberle or whoever...they would have nixed the trades

You don't hire someone for $3 million/year, give up a 2nd round pick for him, give him both the POHO and GM positions, and then veto every trade he wants to do. No owner in pro sports works like that, you hire a guy at that salary because you expect they know what they're doing.

They don't all put their "vote" into a hat and then draw on deals either.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

You don't hire someone for $3 million/year, give up a 2nd round pick for him, give him both the POHO and GM positions, and then veto every trade he wants to do.

if that were true...than Katz and the Oilers are dumber than I thought are allowing Chia to do whatever he wants without approval

No team in pro sports works like that.

They don't all put their "vote" into a hat and then draw on deals either.

huh? every GM has to go to answer to someone when it comes trades and signing and anything hockey related

 

[rboomercat90]

If the oilers miss the playoffs there will be a house cleaning at the top on down again

Where does the top start and end? I suspect it’s just Chiarelli. Firing the guy hired to be the scapegoat doesn’t begin to address the problems.

 

[Soundwave]

if that were true...than Katz and the Oilers are dumber than I thought are allowing Chia to do whatever he wants without approval


huh? every GM has to go to answer to someone when it comes trades and signing and anything hockey related

The owner is not going to interfere in trades unless it's something incredibly unusual, ie: you think you're trading McDavid or taking on some abnormal contract.

The damn OWNER should not be babysitting the f***ing GM and vetoing his trades.

That's not how this is supposed to work. That's like hiring the most expensive mechanic in town to fix your car and then having to tell him he shouldn't be doing the first 3 things he's trying to do.

No, I'm sorry to break this to you, that's not how it's supposed to work.