Ontario Reign 21-22 Thread 2: Reigndrops keep falling on my head

[kinghock]

I was on the call and heard what was said.

I haven't listened to how Hoven and Bernstein presented it yet but will be posting the full audio from the call soon.

I have listened Hoven and Bernstein KOTP Ep.131 and really did not like it this time.
Hoven provided too many his own guesses, instead of providing real info…

 

[Johnny Utah]

Bjornfot will likely start in the AHL.

Also, don’t forget Doty on the roster.

 

[All The Kings Men]

I have listened Hoven and Bernstein KOTP Ep.131 and really did not like it this time.
Hoven provided too many his own guesses, instead of providing real info…

There's a world of difference between the information he is given and the speculation he makes and it's not always immediately clear which is which.

Blake was asked if Edler or Maatta would be candidates to return.

He said yes one of them but didn't specify which one.

I don't think they KNOW which one... I think they just generally would LIKE one veteran LHD but then Blake also said they anticipate a RHD starting on the left.

ALL OF THAT is in JULY

Things change and none of it means anything that we didn't already know.

Anderson, Bjornfor, Moverare, Nousianen
Those are the ONLY LHD whose rights belong to the Kings

Doughty, Roy, Walker, Durzi, Clarke, Spence, Grans, Allard
on the right

It doesn't take nostradamus to predict that the Kings might need to shift someone over to the left from the right to maximize asset value etc etc etc in fact dozens of people on this very board have made the observation all on their own


IF someone in the front office actually tipped someone in the media off that Edler is preferred over Edler well then that's news to me but I would be stunned if that sort of decision would be discussed that cavalierly

The inclusion of Brock Faber in the Fiala trade caught plenty people by surprise. If you had asked me a week ago if Faber was likely to be traded I would have CONFIDENTLY said no.

so... again.....

Most of the time nobody really knows what they're talking about unless it's about something that requires dates, times and signatures well in advance

Buildings have to be built. Jerseys have to me manufactured.


trades, signings etc? That stuff is fluid

 

[DoktorJeep]

The biggest deterrent to a waiver claim is the acquiring team has to keep the guy on the nhl roster for something like 10 games minimum. Case in point is Clague going to the worst team in the league when he left.

And there are a glut of moves at the end of camp with guys being sent down and easily clearing waivers. Austin Wagner signed a 3 year deal and disappeared into the ether last training camp. Most teams are set for opening night, so carving out a spot for a waiver claim is close to non existent.

How many teams is Moverare a lock to play more than 50% of the games. Probably zero. The only reason he makes the Kings out of camp are injuries or there is a cheaper guy to send down, whatever his waiver status.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Am I the only one that isn't too concerned if we lose Moverare? It would suck, but it's not going to make or break the team.

I don't know about 'concerned' but it would just be terrible asset management to lose a guy on waivers when he's ready to break in just because you don't know how to handle too many bodies for the third year in a row.

Like it sure made sense during the covid years and even at the start of last year to have too many dudes while sorting things out but if as a GM you're so indecisive as to not have some sort of clarity of purpose on what you want from guys at this point it's not a good sign. Do the guy a solid and trade him this summer if he's not in the plans because he's not going back to Ontario, some team is sure to take a good, safe player who has some possibly untapped upside.

 

[cyclones22]

That's the danger of keeping players marinating in Ontario because you've signed bridge players as insurance against failure year after year. Moverare would be a loss, but you've got more touted and higher drafted prospects who are going to be subject to the same possibility next season. It's one thing I can't stand about this Kings leadership. The waiver wire carousel. Either trust in your prospects and development staff or don't. Half measures and hedging bets is a good way to lose draft players and development time for nothing.

 

[lumbergh]

I don't know about 'concerned' but it would just be terrible asset management to lose a guy on waivers when he's ready to break in just because you don't know how to handle too many bodies for the third year in a row.

Like it sure made sense during the covid years and even at the start of last year to have too many dudes while sorting things out but if as a GM you're so indecisive as to not have some sort of clarity of purpose on what you want from guys at this point it's not a good sign. Do the guy a solid and trade him this summer if he's not in the plans because he's not going back to Ontario, some team is sure to take a good, safe player who has some possibly untapped upside.

What is Moverare’s upside? 6/7 D? Isn’t that what waivers are for? I don’t see terrible asset management. It’s just the CBA working the way it I was meant to work.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

What is Moverare’s upside? 6/7 D? Isn’t that what waivers are for? I don’t see terrible asset management. It’s just the CBA working the way it I was meant to work.

If that's what you think his upside is then of course you'll disagree and what you're saying makes sense.

 

[Mats26]

Moverare makes 762,500$ for the next 2 years which is a sweet deal on a cap strapped team to play the #7 role or step in when injuries happen. Maybe he can surprise us this year and continue his good play?

 

[kilowatt]

Don't get me wrong, I think Moverare is a good 7th defenseman. I just don't see his upside being a top four defenseman. I think his upside is a good bottom-pairing defenseman. But I was wrong about Roy and Walker, so what do I know.

 

[BringTheReign]

I think Moverare’s upside depends on if his skating makes progress. He’s a #6/7 because he’s a smart player lacking a key tool—skating ability. You don’t see a ton of guys vastly improve their skating when they’re this old, but you never know.

 

[lumbergh]

deleted

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Don't get me wrong, I think Moverare is a good 7th defenseman. I just don't see his upside being a top four defenseman. I think his upside is a good bottom-pairing defenseman. But I was wrong about Roy and Walker, so what do I know.

And that's fine. Like @lumbergh said, that's exactly how waivers are supposed to work/what they are for, so you don't bury fringe guys forever. I just think it's poor asset management because Blake has been the one holding those fringe guys down until their waiver eligibility expires without really seeing what they've got. Maybe this is all Moverare is, a Jeff Schultz 'safe' clone who will have a nice long career as a bottom pairing guy/#7 but losing a cheap asset that might have upside for free just because you couldn't figure out what the f*** to do with your near-max amount of contracts is the problem, Moverare would just be a symptom, not THE reason for outrage. See also JAD, Vilardi, and some more guys after this year.

 

[Statto]

And that's fine. Like @lumbergh said, that's exactly how waivers are supposed to work/what they are for, so you don't bury fringe guys forever. I just think it's poor asset management because Blake has been the one holding those fringe guys down until their waiver eligibility expires without really seeing what they've got. Maybe this is all Moverare is, a Jeff Schultz 'safe' clone who will have a nice long career as a bottom pairing guy/#7 but losing a cheap asset that might have upside for free just because you couldn't figure out what the f*** to do with your near-max amount of contracts is the problem, Moverare would just be a symptom, not THE reason for outrage. See also JAD, Vilardi, and some more guys after this year.

But that’s always going to be the issue for teams that keep their picks and draft well.

I’m sure he could be moved but probably not for anything that excites, so they will hope that the 2 year deal reduces the waiver risk. Moving those fringe players is a difficult balance of risk/reward and it’s inevitable that teams in our position will have to play the waivers game. To trade these guys there needs to be a dance partner and most of them will probably hope they can pick up an equivalent on waivers if that’s what they need rather than giving up anything of value.

I don‘t like it, but it is what it is.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

But that’s always going to be the issue for teams that keep their picks and draft well.

I’m sure he could be moved but probably not for anything that excites, so they will hope that the 2 year deal reduces the waiver risk. Moving those fringe players is a difficult balance of risk/reward and it’s inevitable that teams in our position will have to play the waivers game. To trade these guys there needs to be a dance partner and most of them will probably hope they can pick up an equivalent on waivers if that’s what they need rather than giving up anything of value.

I don‘t like it, but it is what it is.

let me just be direct and say if we lose JAD or Vilardi on waivers that's a failure and a very different scenario than what's being painted.

Even re: Moverare, Kings need to stop drafting 'projects' if all we're gonna do is develop them for other teams by marinating and then waiving.

 

[All The Kings Men]

let me just be direct and say if we lose JAD or Vilardi on waivers that's a failure and a very different scenario than what's being painted.

Even re: Moverare, Kings need to stop drafting 'projects' if all we're gonna do is develop them for other teams by marinating and then waiving.

How many roster spots actually exist tho? like... every draft pick is a project and every team only has so many spots... the alternative is to just STOP drafting players or to draft bums that never develop at all.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

How many roster spots actually exist tho? like... every draft pick is a project and every team only has so many spots... the alternative is to just STOP drafting players or to draft bums that never develop at all.

How many times last year did you point out there's "too many guys?"

I get how waivers work and roster slots work and I appreciate everyone being gentle and not condescending about it haha, but these are self-inflicted issues by having too many redundant bodies. It's the NHL roster but look at how Grundstrom got fringe'd, for example.

 

[cyclones22]

How many times last year did you point out there's "too many guys?"

I get how waivers work and roster slots work and I appreciate everyone being gentle and not condescending about it haha, but these are self-inflicted issues by having too many redundant bodies.

There's going to be a lot of prospects dying on the vine.

 

[Mats26]

Ok so like I said the Reign roster will have Bjornfot - Spence as top pair and I am fine with that. They need top minutes, not sitting around on the bench. They will be the first call ups anyways.

Kings D so far, unless more moves are made:
Anderson Doughty
Walker Roy
Edler Durzi
Moverare

 

[TruKingFan]

Dying on the vine……such a drama queen take. lmao.
Perhaps there’s just too many good players for the roster at this time - Kings may have a bunch of Jacksons instead of one Benjamin. So if nobody steps up who cares if they “die on the vine”. are you talking about Prospects like Clague? Amadio? Frk? Hults? Tkachev? It’s called attrition.

 

[Schmooley]

Dying on the vine……such a drama queen take. lmao.
Perhaps there’s just too many good players for the roster at this time - Kings may have a bunch of Jacksons instead of one Benjamin. So if nobody steps up who cares if they “die on the vine”. are you talking about Prospects like Clague? Amadio? Frk? Hults? Tkachev? It’s called attrition.

I think they are talking about picks that were high like byfield, turcotte, vilardi, clarke. I like to include kaliyev kupari and bjornfot in there also.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

I think they are talking about picks that were high like byfield, turcotte, vilardi, clarke. I like to include kaliyev kupari and bjornfot in there also.

I just don't even engage with clearly bad faith bullshit anymore

yeah this is all about losing cole hults, lol

 

[TruKingFan]

Wait....have we lost Byfield? Turcotte? Vilardi? Clarke? Are they "dying on the vine" at this time? Or are they dead already? If you believe that, that's freaking hilarious. Kaliyev showed big progress even though he's "under-utilized" according to the peudo GMs/Karens around here. Kupari? Well he's got another year to show what he's got. Did he progress last season? I think most people here will say yes. There's just so many spots available.

And yet Grundstrom the poster boy for being whipped to oblivion signs for another 2 years. How he must like TM riding his ass after scoring 3 goals and then benching him, right? Or even Andersson who signs for LESS than his salary last year. yeah...they hate how this team is treating them.

Conern for playing time sure...but "dying on the vine"? Please. Enough already.

 

[lumbergh]

There's going to be a lot of prospects dying on the vine.

This was always going to happen when a team accumulates this many prospects. If you enjoy having a deeeep prospect pool then you must also take the pain of having some prospects not make it to the Kings.

 

[Schmooley]

This was always going to happen when a team accumulates this many prospects. If you enjoy having a deeeep prospect pool then you must also take the pain of having some prospects not make it to the Kings.

Its a combination of having a deep pool, bringing in players from the outside, and giving those players from the outside first dibs at top roles 5 on 5 and powerplay.
This year a couple guys might leave on waivers.
But I think the organization sees the real rebuild starting with the Turcotte pick so maybe they treat the crop starting with him differently so it doesnt get to this point they are at with Vilardi.