Official offseason trades, signings, proposals thread II

[Predsanddead24]

And somewhere in one of these threads, my outside the box question is whether Joey can be an effective sometimes-winger? He at least has the size and willingness to engage that Turris doesn't. We get focused on the idea of 1A/1B with Joey and Duchene and what to do with Turris, and how we still need another winger... but...
Forsberg-Turris-Joey
Granlund-Duchene-Arvy

... or some mashup of that shouldn't be off the table either.

I just don't see why we would go around playing our best players out of position in order to accommodate Turris. I'm sure Johansen would be a decent winger but I'm sure he's better at center, and he's more valuable to us a that position. I guess if we're partway into the season and nothing is working its something you could try, but that's somewhere very far down on the plans to try in my opinion.

 

[froods]

Any need for a RW like Bjudstad? I could see GMJR wanting to bring Bonino back.

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

It might be premature if Poile is still trying to make any last move... he hasn't quite come out and said he's done and flying to Bermuda or something yet, right?

But it sure seems we know 12 of our 13 forwards: JoFA, Duchene, Turris, Granlund, Smith, Bonino, Jarnkrok, Grimaldi, Sissons, Watson... that doesn't exactly leave a lot of room for much change. Assuming we're "out" on Boyle now, then it's basically Carr trying to unseat Salomaki and Gaudreau as the 13th forward? 2 out of those 3 are hitting waivers in October, and all 3 of them have 1-way salaries.

Carr probably you had to give him the $700k just to beat out all the other offers from teams looking to bolster their minor league team - as AHL MVP he was going to get that kind of money. Or get it in Switzerland or the KHL. I don't think that necessarily means he has a job on the big club. But he has an Opportunity.

Assuming there is no training camp surge from any of the prospects, of course - Trenin, Tolvanen, Pitlick would all be pencilled in for Milwaukee, but I think you always consider leaving the door at least a little open if one of them makes a strong enough case in the pre-season.

 

[TK]

Any need for a RW like Bjudstad? I could see GMJR wanting to bring Bonino back.

Nope, plenty of RWs. Need a top 6, or at least top 9 LW. I'd probably rather just have Bonino play wing than pick up Bjugstad anyway if it came to that.

 

[weeze]

It might be premature if Poile is still trying to make any last move... he hasn't quite come out and said he's done and flying to Bermuda or something yet, right?

But it sure seems we know 12 of our 13 forwards: JoFA, Duchene, Turris, Granlund, Smith, Bonino, Jarnkrok, Grimaldi, Sissons, Watson... that doesn't exactly leave a lot of room for much change. Assuming we're "out" on Boyle now, then it's basically Carr trying to unseat Salomaki and Gaudreau as the 13th forward? 2 out of those 3 are hitting waivers in October, and all 3 of them have 1-way salaries.

Carr probably you had to give him the $700k just to beat out all the other offers from teams looking to bolster their minor league team - as AHL MVP he was going to get that kind of money. Or get it in Switzerland or the KHL. I don't think that necessarily means he has a job on the big club. But he has an Opportunity.

Assuming there is no training camp surge from any of the prospects, of course - Trenin, Tolvanen, Pitlick would all be pencilled in for Milwaukee, but I think you always consider leaving the door at least a little open if one of them makes a strong enough case in the pre-season.

If you are Trenin, Tolvanen, Pitlick, Blackwell and maybe a couple more from Development camp, you could be somewhat discouraged that the big roster has so many players on it right now. How does Salo and Fredie still continue to make the roster and basically do nothing but take a roster spot. Give some of these younger guys a chance or cut them lose and bring in a veteran that can bring some value to the club.

 

[triggrman]

I liked Grimaldi on the left side more than the right. I hope we give him a shot with Turris and Grandlund

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

If you are Trenin, Tolvanen, Pitlick, Blackwell and maybe a couple more from Development camp, you could be somewhat discouraged that the big roster has so many players on it right now. How does Salo and Fredie still continue to make the roster and basically do nothing but take a roster spot. Give some of these younger guys a chance or cut them lose and bring in a veteran that can bring some value to the club.

I guess the obvious organizational argument is that if you have 12 forward spots already locked up, it doesn't do a young prospect a lot of good to be #13 and eating hotdogs in the pressbox instead of playing 1st line minutes and all situations in Milwaukee. Whereas nobody cares if Salomaki or Gaudreau do that.

What maybe they could do a little more aggressively I feel is that when they are down a man or two to injury, go ahead and call one of the kids in and leave the veteran #13 in the pressbox - when you can, anyway - sometimes it's game night when a guy reports sick or pulls out of warmups or whatever and that's why you carry the extra guy. But for longer term injuries where you have time to plan things out, it'd be nice to see the kids called up instead. Maybe that's the way you try to message it when you send them down?

 

[TK]

I liked Grimaldi on the left side more than the right. I hope we give him a shot with Turris and Grandlund

Why would Granlund play 3rd line RW? And who would even play 2nd line LW in that scenario? Sissons? Sissons-Duchene-Smith does not sound like a good 2nd line or even a good fit in general in terms of playstyle. Granlund should absolutely get a shot as Duchene's RW, he was basically a 70 point player as a RW for Minnesota.

 

[PredsHead]

It'll be hard for Poile to do much until he gets an idea of what Josi's new deal is going to be and what Smith and Granlund are looking for on extensions. Once he has that, then he will know how much room he has to play with next year and can decide if one or both of Smith or Granlund will be back. If not, then you can try to look at what is out there for them, not saying I would trade them necessarily but if you can get another NHL-ready prospect + for one of them I might. About all I could see us doing until then is maybe using one of the picks we got in the Subban deal to grab a younger Boyle-type guy who can move up and down the lineup or maybe trying to grab a prospect who hasn't lived up to potential for cheap.

 

[PredsV82]

If you are Trenin, Tolvanen, Pitlick, Blackwell and maybe a couple more from Development camp, you could be somewhat discouraged that the big roster has so many players on it right now. How does Salo and Fredie still continue to make the roster and basically do nothing but take a roster spot. Give some of these younger guys a chance or cut them lose and bring in a veteran that can bring some value to the club.

You dont want a true young prospect occupying the 13/14 forward spot. You want them playing in Milwaukee until they are good enough to displace someone from the top 12. Salo and Freddie are maxed out as far as development goes. They are suited to the 13/14 spot.

 

[David Singleton]

I liked Grimaldi on the left side more than the right. I hope we give him a shot with Turris and Grandlund

Trig, has Grimaldi played LW? He's listed as a RW and shoots R, and feels like a player very similar to Arvidsson who is also a "natural" RW. Are you thinking that Grimaldi has the puck skills and mindset to take advantage of playing his off-wing?

 

[David Singleton]

btw, Daniel Carr (if CapFriendly is accurate) is a LW that shoots L (6' 193lbs). He is not eligible to be freely sent down, so he would be exposed to waivers if sent to Milwaukee.

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

It'll be hard for Poile to do much until he gets an idea of what Josi's new deal is going to be and what Smith and Granlund are looking for on extensions. Once he has that, then he will know how much room he has to play with next year and can decide if one or both of Smith or Granlund will be back. If not, then you can try to look at what is out there for them, not saying I would trade them necessarily but if you can get another NHL-ready prospect + for one of them I might. About all I could see us doing until then is maybe using one of the picks we got in the Subban deal to grab a younger Boyle-type guy who can move up and down the lineup or maybe trying to grab a prospect who hasn't lived up to potential for cheap.

I think he has a pretty good idea what Josi's deal is going to look like. He traded away a $9M contract and set an $8M team max limit on his new big UFA signing. I don't think anybody has any trouble imagining the parameters of the Josi deal now.

Sept. 15th is also going to be a bit of a hurdle just to make sure the CBA isn't canned - if it is then it kind of opens a whole new can of worms for next-year planning. (I don't think it will happen, but who knows).

I'd definitely move one of those 2nds to try to get Gusev. But I can't really see Vegas moving him to contender within their conference, right? They probably will try to pin a cap dump with him and send him to one of the Eastern teams swimming in cap space.

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

btw, Daniel Carr (if CapFriendly is accurate) is a LW that shoots L (6' 193lbs). He is not eligible to be freely sent down, so he would be exposed to waivers if sent to Milwaukee.

He has been on waivers a few times in his career already, though - he's turning 28 this fall after all... but anyway, if he can't beat out Salomaki or Gaudreau for a roster spot, then whether he is claimed or clears waivers again isn't really something we need to worry about.

 

[David Singleton]

I liked Grimaldi on the left side more than the right. I hope we give him a shot with Turris and Grandlund

Trig, has Grimaldi played LW? He's listed as a RW and shoots R, and feels like a player very similar to Arvidsson who is also a "natural" RW. Are you thinking that Grimaldi has the puck skills and mindset to take advantage of playing his off-wing?

I will say that I wouldn't mind seeing a Grimaldi - Turris - Smith third line, provided the 1st and 2nd lines were ? - Johansen - Arvidsson and ? - Duchene - Granlund.

 

[Bringer of Jollity]

I will say that I wouldn't mind seeing a Grimaldi - Turris - Smith third line, provided the 1st and 2nd lines were ? - Johansen - Arvidsson and ? - Duchene - Granlund.

Grimaldi, Turris, and Smith are all shoot-heavy forwards though, and Grimaldi/Smith are pretty similar in style (as with Arvy). Who's going to facilitate the non-transition offense on that line?

How about Bonino with Grimaldi and Smith, to aid with puck retrieval/net-front and they can cover Bonino's lack of speed. Then Turris on Duchene's line to give a shooter to pair with the versatile Duchene and playmaking Granlund. Unfortunately, that leaves JOFA together (that line looks to get a bit too comfortable playing together at times).

 

[triggrman]

Trig, has Grimaldi played LW? He's listed as a RW and shoots R, and feels like a player very similar to Arvidsson who is also a "natural" RW. Are you thinking that Grimaldi has the puck skills and mindset to take advantage of playing his off-wing?

he did multiple times in the playoffs, and I do think he's a guy with his agility can take advantage of being on his off wing. Hell, I think it's almost always better as a winger to play your off wing.

 

[David Singleton]

Grimaldi, Turris, and Smith are all shoot-heavy forwards though, and Grimaldi/Smith are pretty similar in style (as with Arvy). Who's going to facilitate the non-transition offense on that line?

How about Bonino with Grimaldi and Smith, to aid with puck retrieval/net-front and they can cover Bonino's lack of speed. Then Turris on Duchene's line to give a shooter to pair with the versatile Duchene and playmaking Granlund. Unfortunately, that leaves JOFA together (that line looks to get a bit too comfortable playing together at times).

Turris can be a shoot-first forward, but is a good playmaker as well. It was role he played well when the Fiala-Turris-Smith line was clicking, although Fiala helped in that regard.

I'm not a coach, but I don't like experiments (ie, moving players positionally, not line combinations in general) on the first and second lines if I can avoid it. I want players in positions for which they are comfortable and can just go "play their game" (words used by Turris himself). This team was the most successful when it had a 1A and a 1B line. They really need to get back to that, and throw in a 3rd line with 2nd line production.

As it specifically regards Turris, as he's coming off a down season in which there may be confidence issues, issues with coaching decisions on how he was deployed, issues with how he was asked to play, or all those those and more. He is the last player in which I want to experiment. That doesn't mean he doesn't ultimately get moved around, but that's not where I start.

 

[David Singleton]

he did multiple times in the playoffs, and I do think he's a guy with his agility can take advantage of being on his off wing. Hell, I think it's almost always better as a winger to play your off wing.

I don't disagree regarding a winger playing off-wing (particularly one having a great shot and good puck skills). Seems more natural to me than what is considered "natural", at least in an attacking offense like what Laviolette runs.

I've always wondered how Arvidsson would do playing his off-wing too. But, if he's not comfortable with it, then it's pretty moot.

 

[triggrman]

I don't disagree regarding a winger playing off-wing (particularly one having a great shot and good puck skills). Seems more natural to me than what is considered "natural", at least offensively anyway.

I've always wondered how Arvidsson would do playing his off-wing too. But, if he's not comfortable with it, then it's pretty moot.

He hasn't played it here mainly because you know, that Forsberg guy..

 

[triggrman]

Why would Granlund play 3rd line RW? And who would even play 2nd line LW in that scenario? Sissons? Sissons-Duchene-Smith does not sound like a good 2nd line or even a good fit in general in terms of playstyle. Granlund should absolutely get a shot as Duchene's RW, he was basically a 70 point player as a RW for Minnesota.

Sorry, I meant Duchene, not Turris. Work keeps getting in my way.

 

[David Singleton]

He hasn't played it here mainly because you know, that Forsberg guy..

lol, need more than one LW. This team kinda sucks there.

 

[TK]

Sorry, I meant Duchene, not Turris. Work keeps getting in my way.

Ok, makes sense now, no worries. And yes, if no one else is signed/traded for and they don't want to play Turris on the wing then Grimaldi actually might be the best option there. Not much at LW currently in the org.

 

[Bringer of Jollity]

Turris can be a shoot-first forward, but is a good playmaker as well. It was role he played well when the Fiala-Turris-Smith line was clicking, although Fiala helped in that regard.

I'm not a coach, but I don't like experiments (ie, moving players positionally, not line combinations in general) on the first and second lines if I can avoid it. I want players in positions for which they are comfortable and can just go "play their game" (words used by Turris himself). This team was the most successful when it had a 1A and a 1B line. They really need to get back to that, and throw in a 3rd line with 2nd line production.

As it specifically regards Turris, as he's coming off a down season in which there may be confidence issues, issues with coaching decisions on how he was deployed, issues with how he was asked to play, or all those those and more. He is the last player in which I want to experiment. That doesn't mean he doesn't ultimately get moved around, but that's not where I start.

With too many centers (and Duchene seemingly locked in to center), somebody is going to have to play out of position barring any further moves. That now leaves Bonino or Sissons on a wing (either of which I think could adapt to that role, with Bonino still able to take face-offs for the line when needed). So maybe Bonino on the 3rd line wing for the same reasons as before with Grimaldi/Smith and Turris and then the other winger splitting the top 6 wing with Forsberg? Sissons has played more wing, but his style of play seems too much of the same to play with Turris and Smith/Grimaldi. Bonino at least gives some different offensive options.

 

[PredsHead]

I think he has a pretty good idea what Josi's deal is going to look like. He traded away a $9M contract and set an $8M team max limit on his new big UFA signing. I don't think anybody has any trouble imagining the parameters of the Josi deal now.

Sept. 15th is also going to be a bit of a hurdle just to make sure the CBA isn't canned - if it is then it kind of opens a whole new can of worms for next-year planning. (I don't think it will happen, but who knows).

I'd definitely move one of those 2nds to try to get Gusev. But I can't really see Vegas moving him to contender within their conference, right? They probably will try to pin a cap dump with him and send him to one of the Eastern teams swimming in cap space.

He might have a ballpark of what the AAV will be for Josi, but will need to plan for the structure of the deal. We're doing much better financially but laying out those big bonus checks may be an issue year after year. Also he will need to know about Granlund and Smith as I don't think we can sign both, so it may be an either or scenario. If you know you can't keep one of them past this year, then you see what you can get for him. Then you can decide if you think its better to keep him for one year and let him walk or to move them for prospects. As for Gusev, I just am not seeing the fit here. Anytime a guy that old, finally comes over its just a roll of the dice as to whether they can adjust or not. If he was making $925k, I would maybe take the risk but at $3M-$4M I just don't see it. Plus with his size I am not sure he would do all the well in the Central come playoff time, we've seen it too many times with the smaller players we already have. IMO we need a skilled big-body guy who can play up and down the lineup, not another smaller guy who will only be effective in the Top 6.