Master Bill
Congrats, Oilers! (2023)
- Nov 9, 2014
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Wow, that's kind of shocking when it's compiled like that. We never got out of the 1st round of playoffs during that span as well so it's just horrible asset management.
Prospect Info: [Official]: 2016 Draft Thread
- Thread starter Johnny Hoxville
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Wow, that's kind of shocking when it's compiled like that. We never got out of the 1st round of playoffs during that span as well so it's just horrible asset management.
SmellOfVictory
Registered User
- Jun 3, 2011
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I definitely think some of it was poor asset management, but I get the reasoning behind it. Sutter was trying to build a competitive team to take advantage of having one of the best power forwards in NHL history to build around. Unfortunately he went a little off the deep end with it, and he was definitely awful at cap management.
Some of the picks were easy to defend trading; the 05 2nd for Kiprusoff, even the 2nd round pick for Bourque worked out really well in his first couple of years as a Flame (remember when people were talking about him taking over the reigns as Iggy lite? lol). But there was definitely a little too much mortgaging of the future, combined with some really poor drafting early on.
We currently have a 5.9% chance of making the playoffs.
BUT we have a pretty high chance of drafting in the top three (unless they go on some stupid tear right near the end to get us just out of the playoffs and out of a top 10 pick)
Matthews would obviously be the best pick here, but say we're in the 2-4 range. Do we take Chychrun considering our defense or do we take one of the big wingers where we're desperately lacking? Personally I'd take Puljujarvi. We get an NHL-ready RWer for next year in the one spot in our prospect pool we're desperately lacking in.
BUT we have a pretty high chance of drafting in the top three (unless they go on some stupid tear right near the end to get us just out of the playoffs and out of a top 10 pick)
Matthews would obviously be the best pick here, but say we're in the 2-4 range. Do we take Chychrun considering our defense or do we take one of the big wingers where we're desperately lacking? Personally I'd take Puljujarvi. We get an NHL-ready RWer for next year in the one spot in our prospect pool we're desperately lacking in.
Sean Monahan
JIMMIES ARE RUSTLED
Lunatik
Registered User
- Oct 12, 2012
- 56,248
- 8,384
that is literally not true at all, at least try before just making crap up.
Since 2014
2nd Round
Mitch Wahl (2008)
Markus Granlund (2011)
Tyler Wotherspoon (2011)
Patrick Sieloff (2012)
Mason McDonald (2014)
Hunter Smith (2014)
Rasmus Andersson (2015)
Oliver Kylington (2015)
that would be 8 second round picks alone! not sure where your 7 picks in the top 60 came from
Lunatik
Registered User
- Oct 12, 2012
- 56,248
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Volica
Papa Shango
- May 15, 2012
- 21,444
- 11,117
If we're going to be bad this year (and I'm not saying we should be, or shouldn't be; and not reacting to that Panthers disgrace) may as well be terrible.
If by late December/early January we're still toiling deep in the red with the Oil; I'd honestly say we start moving all possible Vets out and bring in some youth. When you're out of the playoffs, but the team is still winning with a lot of young players there's really no issue there. When the team is way out of the playoffs and you're winning with a veteran lineup that you haven't shipped out; that's when it's just a dumb play by the team in general. Please no repeat of the 2012-2013 season, where a big Big Ern game and a big Bégin game are the difference between drafting 1 and 6.
No to tanking, but if we're going to be bad, may as well do it with the older players gone and a young lineup (I mean, in all seriousness, the vets in Calgary really play a fairly minor role; there's no reason to hold onto Jones, Hudler, Wideman, Russell; even Staj) if the team's horribad.
If by late December/early January we're still toiling deep in the red with the Oil; I'd honestly say we start moving all possible Vets out and bring in some youth. When you're out of the playoffs, but the team is still winning with a lot of young players there's really no issue there. When the team is way out of the playoffs and you're winning with a veteran lineup that you haven't shipped out; that's when it's just a dumb play by the team in general. Please no repeat of the 2012-2013 season, where a big Big Ern game and a big Bégin game are the difference between drafting 1 and 6.
No to tanking, but if we're going to be bad, may as well do it with the older players gone and a young lineup (I mean, in all seriousness, the vets in Calgary really play a fairly minor role; there's no reason to hold onto Jones, Hudler, Wideman, Russell; even Staj) if the team's horribad.
2004: Kris Chucko (1st round)
2005: Matt Pelech (1st round)
2006: Leland Irving (1st round)
2007: Mikael Backlund (1st round)
2008: Greg Nemisz (1st round), Mitch Wahl (2nd round)
2009: Tim Erixon (1st round)
2010: 1st rounder traded to Phoenix for Jokinen, 2nd rounder traded to Chicago for Bourque
**** me. Not that I didn't believe you but I just had to see for myself. God damn that is some sad sad management.
Johnny GODreau
Boom
- Aug 21, 2014
- 8,582
- 22
100TG's its late go too sleep.
In those situations with the lack of 2nds would it have been a good idea to trade down?
Sutter traded down a fair bit; usually moving down a few spots in the first round to pick up a mid round pick.
In 2004, he traded the 19th overall and an 8th round pick for the 24th overall and an extra second rounder (46th overall). That second rounder was then traded for two third round picks.
In 2007, he traded the 18th overall pick to the Blues for the 24th overall and an extra 3rd.
In 2008, he traded the 17th overall for Cammalleri; then traded Tanguay for Montreal's first (25th overall).
In 2009, he picked up a 3rd round pick by moving from from 20th overall to 23rd.
Johnny GODreau
Boom
- Aug 21, 2014
- 8,582
- 22
I remember Sutter really wanted Travis Zajac and thought he could pull an extra asset, NJ caught wind of this and traded up to 20th to pick him.
SmellOfVictory
Registered User
- Jun 3, 2011
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Lunatik
Registered User
- Oct 12, 2012
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Clearly. Missed something, but hey you might be right for onceArguing with straw men, are we?
Yung Rotini
6 Summers
Lunatik
Registered User
- Oct 12, 2012
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SmellOfVictory
Registered User
- Jun 3, 2011
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I remember Sutter really wanted Travis Zajac and thought he could pull an extra asset, NJ caught wind of this and traded up to 20th to pick him.
Ouch. Zajac would've made the Flames' drafting look substantially better, even though he's only one player.
Johnny GODreau
Boom
- Aug 21, 2014
- 8,582
- 22
Speaks about Flames drafting.
A young Zajac between 2006-2010 would've been huge though. Probably would've meant no Olli Jokinen.
SmellOfVictory
Registered User
- Jun 3, 2011
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Agreed, given the fact that the Flames were actually quite competitive (in spite of being unable to exit the first round). Having another good top 6 centre could have make a big difference.
Pizza the Hutt
Game 6 Truther
- Mar 22, 2012
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I think it's worth noting how terrible these players' hockey names are, outside of Backlund, which is so-so.
Greg Nemisz? Matt Pelech? Leland Irving? These guys never had a chance.
Given how much of a crapshoot drafting is anyways, how do you not go outside the box and draft a goalie named "Quick" instead of winger named "Pelech".
And even with Backlund, how do you ignore P.K. Subban? HIS NAME IS A SPECIAL TEAM.
I really hope the Flames begin to pick up on the nominative determinism angle in the upcoming drafts.
Addendum:
That said, our scouts should be looking into the following players for an out of box 2nd+ round pick:
Simon Stransky (LW, WHL)
Carter Hart (G, WHL)
And absolutely - Dillon Dubé (pronounced doo-bey, not doob.)
The headlines write themselves.
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WeegarUnderwood
Fan of Intangibles
That is a great point Pizza. I think with the recent picks we've had, that we have fixed that issue. Players like Kylington (pronounced schilington or something), Gaudreau is great, and several others. I mean I literally do the Italian hand thing whenever I say Mangiapane
I don't know if they're hockey names, but they're great names to me
I don't know if they're hockey names, but they're great names to me
Pizza the Hutt
Game 6 Truther
- Mar 22, 2012
- 2,820
- 519
I agree - Gaudreau, Kylington, TJ Brodie are fantastic hockey names, and Sean Monahan, Sam Bennett are also good, in a more "classic" sense.
Ace Rimmer
Stoke me a clipper.
Even worse are the names available within 5 picks of each of those selections...
2004 - Schneider, Green (also Schremp
)2005 - Niskanen, Downie
2006 - Foligno
2007 - Perron
2008 - Ennis, Carlson
2009 - Johansson, Palmieri
2010 - I guess we can be happy that Gormley didn't exactly pan out... yet. Of course, the one year we get a sniff at the top 15 is the year our 1st is traded. Still, the Jokinen trade made sense at the time.
Not expecting us to get a top two pick, but there's a lot of intriguing big body players highly rated.
Not a big fan of Laine, but Puljujarvi & Tkachuk are very intriguing.
Not a big fan of Laine, but Puljujarvi & Tkachuk are very intriguing.
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