Observations XXVIII

[hido]

Not sure where to put this and sorry if I am repeating something someone has already said (it has implications for next season as well as season tickets; please move if needed): According to my ticket rep, the NHL is being justifiably tight lipped about next season. The rep hypothesized a January start with a shortened season that ended at the normal time so 21-22 is not shortened. That is “very important to the NHL.” This is obviously provided there is some sense of normalcy in the not-too-distant future. They are and will be watching the NFL closely as far as how many fans, if any, can/will attend any upcoming games next season.

They had no problem holding my seats and status with no payments for the foreseeable future. They did offer a refund on the missed games from 19-20 but I told them just to hold it against a future renewal. They thanked me and restated I could get the money back at anytime.

So, in a best case scenario, it looks like hockey early next year, short season, and back to normal in 21-22. No idea how that affects salaries, the cap, etc.

I hope all of you are hanging in there. I don’t post much but I’ve followed the board for quite a long time and have learned the game from all of you. I fell off in March and really couldn’t get into the fake playoffs because I knew what was going to happen, which sucked. But, I’ve missed the board.

And who is “Porter“??? Did someone change their name?

 

[PredsV82]

Well then they can sit at home and not get paid until they figure it out. There is more than one way to skin a cat.

You're being obtuse. You dont know who is going to break the bubble until after it happens and infects the team. By then it's too late.

 

[triggrman]

Look at how poorly the MLB is doing without a bubble. Players not in a bubble environment are gonna get COVID and it will run through a locker room like wildfire

They're still playing though. You can say they're doing poorly but they're not. Cards have had some major issues, Marlins did too but I don't think overall it's been terrible.

 

[PredsV82]

They're still playing though. You can say they're doing poorly but they're not. Cards have had some major issues, Marlins did too but I don't think overall it's been terrible.

Baseball can make up missed games easier than any other sport. They can play doubleheaders and play 4 or 5 games in 3 days. Hockey cant do that. Even if only two teams missed two weeks each, the amount of rescheduling needed would be catastrophic.

 

[drwpreds]

They're still playing though. You can say they're doing poorly but they're not. Cards have had some major issues, Marlins did too but I don't think overall it's been terrible.

Yep- for me it is just another example of the fear mongering that is happening across the board. If you read the headlines and knew nothing else, you would think baseball was a complete mess.

When in reality, around 98% or so of MLB, players and staff, have been negative.

 

[Byrddog]

Baseball can make up missed games easier than any other sport. They can play doubleheaders and play 4 or 5 games in 3 days. Hockey cant do that. Even if only two teams missed two weeks each, the amount of rescheduling needed would be catastrophic.

Hockey also learned that an afternoon game can cause the postponement of the late game when your playing in two cities. I have no doubt the NHL has done a better job than any other sport by far. But like you I do not think it is sustainable for a regular season. Then again I did not think they could pull this playoff off. The competition is mixed We are going to hear crying from Edmonton and Toronto for years now because this was there window because they are going to have to dump Cap for next year. If this new vaccine does not work and next season is played without fans in the stands this league will take 10 years to recover just from a cap[ standpoint.

 

[nine_inch_fang]

Damn, thought we might have some hockey talk in here.

 

[PredsV82]

Damn, thought we might have some hockey talk in here.

What's to talk about other than:

We suck.
Hynes sucks.
Its gonna be a long damn time before we see hockey in person again.

Edit... I suppose we could have the existential discussion of whether we were ever actually a true Cup caliber team or if we simply rode the best 12 months of hockey of Pekkas career to a Cup final and a Presidents cup and once he became less than superhuman we were exposed as a middle of the road perennial 6-8 seed....

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

I don't feel like Rinne was particularly superhuman in the Cup run. I think we were more "poised to be a Cup caliber team" than that we actually were ever Cup contenders. We lucked out a little bit on the way to the SCF, riding a roster that was somewhat thinned out by injuries, but still had some of the key components sliding into place.

Then what was supposed to happen, was that we'd build on that. Fill in some missing ingredients, try to stay healthy, etc. I mean, they did win the President's Trophy. But I thought some of the bad habits were creeping in during that process, and some of the playoff no-shows hurt our two series against Colorado and Winnipeg. We were "this close" to entering a contention phase, but the wheels just fell off the wagon. Player complacency, coaching, Poile's moves, Subban's decline, it all just snowballed and we never got there. So we're back to middle of the road (very generously).

 

[adsfan]

I don't feel like Rinne was particularly superhuman in the Cup run. I think we were more "poised to be a Cup caliber team" than that we actually were ever Cup contenders. We lucked out a little bit on the way to the SCF, riding a roster that was somewhat thinned out by injuries, but still had some of the key components sliding into place.

Then what was supposed to happen, was that we'd build on that. Fill in some missing ingredients, try to stay healthy, etc. I mean, they did win the President's Trophy. But I thought some of the bad habits were creeping in during that process, and some of the playoff no-shows hurt our two series against Colorado and Winnipeg. We were "this close" to entering a contention phase, but the wheels just fell off the wagon. Player complacency, coaching, Poile's moves, Subban's decline, it all just snowballed and we never got there. So we're back to middle of the road (very generously).

Regression to the mean!

 

[token grinder]

Baseball can make up missed games easier than any other sport. They can play doubleheaders and play 4 or 5 games in 3 days. Hockey cant do that. Even if only two teams missed two weeks each, the amount of rescheduling needed would be catastrophic.

I dunno...I'm not a pro athlete, but I have played 3 hockey games in a day. My kid from age 8 til his present 13 plays 4 games in two days in season. It can be done. Maybe expand the roster by 2 if these finely tunes athletes need a break.

Saying that, you don't do back to back to backs (which would probably be ok) often. But you can do them.

 

[nine_inch_fang]

What's to talk about other than:

We suck.
Hynes sucks.
Its gonna be a long damn time before we see hockey in person again.

Edit... I suppose we could have the existential discussion of whether we were ever actually a true Cup caliber team or if we simply rode the best 12 months of hockey of Pekkas career to a Cup final and a Presidents cup and once he became less than superhuman we were exposed as a middle of the road perennial 6-8 seed....

Anything but a covid bitch session I guess. Not there is much else to talk about except roster speculation but didn't expect covid when I saw that there was discussion in here.

 

[glenngineer]

I don't feel like Rinne was particularly superhuman in the Cup run. I think we were more "poised to be a Cup caliber team" than that we actually were ever Cup contenders. We lucked out a little bit on the way to the SCF, riding a roster that was somewhat thinned out by injuries, but still had some of the key components sliding into place.

Then what was supposed to happen, was that we'd build on that. Fill in some missing ingredients, try to stay healthy, etc. I mean, they did win the President's Trophy. But I thought some of the bad habits were creeping in during that process, and some of the playoff no-shows hurt our two series against Colorado and Winnipeg. We were "this close" to entering a contention phase, but the wheels just fell off the wagon. Player complacency, coaching, Poile's moves, Subban's decline, it all just snowballed and we never got there. So we're back to middle of the road (very generously).

Problem is, we lost a bunch of grit and size that offseason so not only did we have to fill in some missing ingredients, we had to replace the likes of Neal, Wilson and Fisher that offseason, which we never did and to this day, haven't. Those guys were hard to play against in the playoffs.

I'm going to throw something out here for you. Two groups of 4 players.

Neal, Wilson, Fisher, Fiala

Duchene, Granlund, Turris, Jarnkrok

I'd argue the second set is more talented on paper but I'd rather go to war with the first set. That's effectively what we went from to what we currently have now.

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

Problem is, we lost a bunch of grit and size that offseason so not only did we have to fill in some missing ingredients, we had to replace the likes of Neal, Wilson and Fisher that offseason, which we never did and to this day, haven't. Those guys were hard to play against in the playoffs.

I'm going to throw something out here for you. Two groups of 4 players.

Neal, Wilson, Fisher, Fiala

Duchene, Granlund, Turris, Jarnkrok

I'd argue the second set is more talented on paper but I'd rather go to war with the first set. That's effectively what we went from to what we currently have now.

In your list I think it's really only Fisher that I think is most impactful. Because we've simply never re-filled his role. Fiala and Wilson brought no particular grit or battle. Neal did to some extent, but we could have had him back anytime in the last couple years basically for free if we had been willing to pick up his salary. So yes we lost grit, also from the incumbent players who stopped working as hard too, and it has definitely hurt us, I agree. And Subban was probably our grittiest player on D the last few years. Put him on the list.

As a remedy, I am wholeheartedly for the idea of improving the team's size and grit. That is not an element which is featured prominently in our prospect list either. Trenin makes the team and should bring some. But past that I think we will have to add more via free agency. Hence chasing the D I've noted elsewhere, guys like Edmundson and Dillon, think about adding another depth forward like Clifford, maybe find a trade like Jarnkrok for Killorn; there are ways to accomplish this. I'm not sure it's so easy to find a true leader like Fisher, though. You can add size and grit. The other things Fisher brought will be harder to find.

But here's the major problem I see: first you have to recognize that it even is a problem to begin with. And that's where I think our front office has failed... and worse yet, may continue to fail. Poile, despite his age and experience, seems to have a relatively progressive hockey philosophy, seems to adopt something of a modern USA Hockey philosophy wrt prioritizing skill over physicality. Would he even be interested in pursuing some of these suggested changes to the roster? I wonder...

 

[Scoresberg]

But here's the major problem I see: first you have to recognize that it even is a problem to begin with. And that's where I think our front office has failed... and worse yet, may continue to fail. Poile, despite his age and experience, seems to have a relatively progressive hockey philosophy, seems to adopt something of a modern USA Hockey philosophy wrt prioritizing skill over physicality. Would he even be interested in pursuing some of these suggested changes to the roster? I wonder...

Poile has already stated after the season that team needs more youth and he needs to fix the 2nd line. Also, by not re-signing Weber or Holzer he only has 5 defenseman under contract for next year which means he has to get two more. Those changes come pretty much naturally.

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

Poile has already stated after the season that team needs more youth and he needs to fix the 2nd line. Also, by not re-signing Weber or Holzer he only has 5 defenseman under contract for next year which means he has to get two more. Those changes come pretty much naturally.

Sure, but with the changes, will he put any priority on size/physicality/grit, or will it not matter to him if we got more smaller/"skilled" players instead?

 

[Armourboy]

Sure, but with the changes, will he put any priority on size/physicality/grit, or will it not matter to him if we got more smaller/"skilled" players instead?

Doubt it. My guess is he is gonna give the young guys a chance to earn a spot and roll with it.

 

[101st_fan]

This season was an example of the difference between a collection of individually talented people and a true team.

The blueline now has gaps to bring in upgrades and to balance out the pairings ... Poile has to look externally for anyone with size, grit, and a defense first mentality to include possibly in the draft with one big kid from the WHL in the 10-15 rankings from Central Scouting.

The second line issues are an enigma. So many players who succeeded in the past just not performing here. Whoever leaves likely moves back to their earlier performance ... which I fully expect will lead to seller's remorse here. Turris, Granlund, Smith are all proven NHL players who for some reason weren't producing as hoped.

This isn't a case of sign (insert name here) and fix everything. Its about re-establishing the team identity, getting buy-in from the front office through the locker room snack staff, then get players who fit that mentality from the stars through the complementary guys. That is the test Hynes faces in his first full year ... re-establishing a winning identity and getting everyone on board.

 

[GoldOnGold]

This season was an example of the difference between a collection of individually talented people and a true team.

The blueline now has gaps to bring in upgrades and to balance out the pairings ... Poile has to look externally for anyone with size, grit, and a defense first mentality to include possibly in the draft with one big kid from the WHL in the 10-15 rankings from Central Scouting.

The second line issues are an enigma. So many players who succeeded in the past just not performing here. Whoever leaves likely moves back to their earlier performance ... which I fully expect will lead to seller's remorse here. Turris, Granlund, Smith are all proven NHL players who for some reason weren't producing as hoped.

This isn't a case of sign (insert name here) and fix everything. Its about re-establishing the team identity, getting buy-in from the front office through the locker room snack staff, then get players who fit that mentality from the stars through the complementary guys. That is the test Hynes faces in his first full year ... re-establishing a winning identity and getting everyone on board.

I am already fully prepared for Granlund to put up 60+ points on a different team next year and for Turris to put up 50+ points after we trade him for nothing.

 

[Scoresberg]

I am already fully prepared for Granlund to put up 60+ points on a different team next year and for Turris to put up 50+ points after we trade him for nothing.

Granlund maybe but I can’t see Turris producing that much anywhere, except if he gets really good linemates and a lot of PP time.

 

[101st_fan]

Granlund maybe but I can’t see Turris producing that much anywhere, except if he gets really good linemates and a lot of PP time.

Turris put up 50 between Ottawa and Nashville the season he was traded and did so a few times in Ottawa. He was on a 50 pt pace for a full season in 2018-19. It isn't unbelievable he would do so again.

 

[Armourboy]

I don't think its out of the realm of possibility. He had an injury riddled season and one where Lavi either didn't play him or barely was for most of the year.

I still think with Granlund it was mostly mental. He got traded out of the blue and just didn't mesh well with Lavi at all. He was starting to get going under Hynes when everything got shut down. Part of me wonders if he really wanted to come back once it restarted.

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

I don't really have anything bad to say about the general skill level of Granlund or Turris. But we already have "generally skilled" players. They are welcome to go somewhere else and find their comfort niches and score 50-60 pts. We have seen that they don't help our team. They don't fit with our core players. It would be nice if that wasn't so. But it is. How can anybody who has watched our team the last couple seasons think that these players can help us? They just don't fit. I'm not going to be a Big Meanie and say that they couldn't possibly help somebody else. They have decent skillsets. Maybe they could help somebody else. But we need to move on.

 

[OldFan]

This season was an example of the difference between a collection of individually talented people and a true team.

The blueline now has gaps to bring in upgrades and to balance out the pairings ... Poile has to look externally for anyone with size, grit, and a defense first mentality to include possibly in the draft with one big kid from the WHL in the 10-15 rankings from Central Scouting.

The second line issues are an enigma. So many players who succeeded in the past just not performing here. Whoever leaves likely moves back to their earlier performance ... which I fully expect will lead to seller's remorse here. Turris, Granlund, Smith are all proven NHL players who for some reason weren't producing as hoped.

This isn't a case of sign (insert name here) and fix everything. Its about re-establishing the team identity, getting buy-in from the front office through the locker room snack staff, then get players who fit that mentality from the stars through the complementary guys. That is the test Hynes faces in his first full year ... re-establishing a winning identity and getting everyone on board.

You must have secondary scoring. Smith has always been that. And he is(was?) defensively responsible and hustles all the time. His problems are age, UFA potential salary and Preds desire to open up positions for youngsters. That and he never hit 30 goals. Preds will actually miss him.
Turris and Granlund should have worked. Who knew?

 

[Osprey]

And who is “Porter“??? Did someone change their name?

If you visit his profile and click on the "Username history" tab, you can see that it's NNCbama.

I don't really understand changing usernames, myself. I've used the same one since I registered 15 years ago .