LeBrun: "Nothing on the front-burner right now" with Dubas and Gardiner

GoJetsGo55

Registered User
Apr 14, 2009
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Winnipeg, MB
Contract depends on which Gardiner you're getting.

If you get regular season Gardiner, you sign him to 5 to 8 years at 5 to 6.5 per year.

If you get playoff Gardiner, you sign him to your AHL team and hope he can turn his career around.
 

Gary Nylund

Registered User
Oct 10, 2013
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They are certainly regular season contenders. I am not convinced that the team D is good enough to be Stanley cup contenders just yet. They have the coach in Babcock to play the type of game you need in the playoffs- not sure he has all the horses he needs yet.

That's fine, we'll just agree to disagree here. I don't see a team in the league that has more "horses" than we do. I'd be hesitant to say we'd be favourites against TB but I think it's close.

Agreed and I am not to concerned about the goaltending, he makes up for a lot of other defensive problems. The team d is what concerns me

Our biggest defensive problems left with Bozak and JVR. That was the one line that really needed to be sheltered and that's just one reason I fully expect us to be better defensively. And we're not as bad as people think either, 11th overall in GA I believe, people keep talking about us as if we were bottom 5, we were not. And our offence looks to be on of the best the league has seen in decades, it's going to be fun watching other teams scramble to figure out ways to stop us. :)

Same here, I think the D is the question mark as it is, if you let Gardiner go you need all the guys above to progress as hoped not just one of them. If Gardiner goes he needs to be replaced, the UFA market is fickle and costly and the trade market probably means an overpayment as D's cost way more to acquire.

I agree completely and if I was in charge, my #1 priority would be to see if Gardiner can be resigned for a fair price. They may be hoping to solve the problem by signing a UFA next summer or that our guys develop etc. but me, I'd rather not take that risk. Sign Gardiner (assuming it can be done for a fair price) and then if he's no longer needed down the road then trade him.
 
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Gary Nylund

Registered User
Oct 10, 2013
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Contract depends on which Gardiner you're getting.

If you get regular season Gardiner, you sign him to 5 to 8 years at 5 to 6.5 per year.

If you get playoff Gardiner, you sign him to your AHL team and hope he can turn his career around.

Haha you're funny. Gardiner had perhaps the worst game of his career in game 7 but up until then, "playoff" Gardiner was fantastic and without his amazing play, there would be more game 7. Keep those hot takes coming though, still a few weeks to kill before the season starts. :)
 

Fourier

Registered User
Dec 29, 2006
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Waterloo Ontario
we would have to get rid of marleau somehow, hes good but for 6.25 hard to justify that when other plays need that money.

cap space right now
13.3
+5.3(horton litr)
+3 (hainsey departure)
+ 3 mil cap increase(rough guess)
= 24.6 mil for
nylander(6.5) + marner(8) +matthews (11)
=25.5

we if we got rid of marleaus contract, we could give the trio the missing cut and give gards the 2 mil ish difference and have a decent amount left over for depth. Alternatively we could bridge nylander.
Do your numbers actually work out though? By your own calculations the team is $900k over. If you get rid of Marleau for nothing you have $5.3M in space. Give 2 to Gardiner and you have $3.3M. But you are down two roster spots including a guy who played in your top 4 and a top 6 winger so you only have 21 players even if everyone else signed for what they are making this year. But you have to make room for raises for guys like Kapanen, Johnsson and Leivo who combined make all of $2.6M. If a guy like Kapanen or Johnsson has a bit of a break out year you could easily be looking at $2M for him alone.
 

NoName

Bringer of Playoffs!
Nov 3, 2017
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Gardiner is likely a casualty of the Cap if Dubas is set on resigning all of Nylander, Marner and Matthews. Gardiner might be divisive but if he has another 40-50 point season (he had 52 last season and 43 the year before) he is going to command a lot of money. Dmen who can put up that amount of points command a lot of money as free agents, even if their work in their own is suspect.
 

SprDaVE

Moderator
Sep 20, 2008
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Leafs could probably extend him to a similar contract to McDonagh and make it work.
 

GoJetsGo55

Registered User
Apr 14, 2009
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Winnipeg, MB
Haha you're funny. Gardiner had perhaps the worst game of his career in game 7 but up until then, "playoff" Gardiner was fantastic and without his amazing play, there would be more game 7. Keep those hot takes coming though, still a few weeks to kill before the season starts. :)

*blushes*
 

Ziggdiezan

Registered User
Apr 10, 2015
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Contract depends on which Gardiner you're getting.

If you get regular season Gardiner, you sign him to 5 to 8 years at 5 to 6.5 per year.

If you get playoff Gardiner, you sign him to your AHL team and hope he can turn his career around.
It is very obvious you dont actually watch the leafs because Gardiner plays amazing in the playoffs. One of the best defenders on the ice in all 3 of his series.

It was a running joke that why couldn't the leafs have Playoffs Jake all the time...
 

Albus Dumbledore

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Mar 28, 2015
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Do your numbers actually work out though? By your own calculations the team is $900k over. If you get rid of Marleau for nothing you have $5.3M in space. Give 2 to Gardiner and you have $3.3M. But you are down two roster spots including a guy who played in your top 4 and a top 6 winger so you only have 21 players even if everyone else signed for what they are making this year. But you have to make room for raises for guys like Kapanen, Johnsson and Leivo who combined make all of $2.6M. If a guy like Kapanen or Johnsson has a bit of a break out year you could easily be looking at $2M for him alone.

the numbers dont work with gards/zaitsev/marleau on the roster, if one leaves we barley have enough money. As for the other players it depends like we have carrick at 1.3 but holl at 675k might replace him, that and two extra forwards on the roster right now, so that should be enough money for raises to the depth players.

All in all we have to let one of zaitsev/marleau be traded or let gardiner go just to make room for the trio but then we also have a smidge leftover if we do. Preferred route would be to trade marleau next off season and zaitsev too, cause i think liljegren could take his spot next year regardless if he bounces back.
 

thewave

Registered User
Jun 17, 2011
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Why is Marleau agreeing to a trade? Consider him on the books next season.

He may want to go back to SJ, it's just possible. They have a good team as well as friends etc. If Toronto retained it would open up slots and we may take a stab at Nash or just give better shots to some of our guys.
 

Notsince67

Papi and the Lamplighters
Apr 27, 2018
16,102
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Maybe concentrate on winning 4 playoff games in the same year first. As a public service announcement to leaf fans if you are talking smack about recent playoff success with another fan, check to see who they are a fan of- if its not Columbus, stop this will not end well. No offense Blue Jacket fans.

Seriously, Leafs (and jackets) have improved and are close to being contenders but wait until you win a round or two before talking smack. Look at Edmonton last year- people were picking them to be in the finals before the season started based on the previous year, they missed the playoffs.

It could happen to the Leafs too, if the goaltending comes back to average or below like EDm last year they are in trouble with that D core.

Maybe Gardiner is not a priority, but if this team wants to be truly elite-defense will have to become a priority at some point.
Fans can't concentrate on winning. Fan concentration is proven not to work.
As for your comment on goaltending, I am pretty sure this applies to every team in the league.
 

rynryn

Reluctant Optimist. Permanently Déclassé.
May 29, 2008
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is that a nice way of saying "we're saving all the money for Nylander"?
 

hockeyguy1967

Trans hockey fan! Go Leafs and Oilers!
Aug 24, 2017
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If Gardiner wants to remain here, he better be thinking like Rielly/Kadri....if he wants max bank, then don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out.
Thing is when Reilly signed he was half the player Gardiner is now. He makes 4 now, he is turning UFA, he will get min 6 with the Leafs if he has similar year last year, if not some other team will overpay in FA like the Leafs did with Tavares.
 

Skinnyjimmy08

WorldTraveler
Mar 30, 2012
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Gardiner is a strange one for me.. Ive never been a fan of the guy and have always wondered what Leaf fans think. Seems like he is loved/hated big time by fans.

I always get a kick out of it cause 1 game fans want him gone and never set foot in a Leaf jersey but then next game fans think he is a top NHL dman.

I dont think Gardiner will be in TO long term. Some team will offer him a ridiculous offer in offseason
 

StreetHawk

Registered User
Sep 30, 2017
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Contract depends on which Gardiner you're getting.

If you get regular season Gardiner, you sign him to 5 to 8 years at 5 to 6.5 per year.

If you get playoff Gardiner, you sign him to your AHL team and hope he can turn his career around.
Don’t see him signing for anything under $6 and for term. He’ll be 29 as a ufa. So this is the last big contract he’ll get. No point being a ufa at 34. Push it to 36.

What are ufa D men getting these days? Yandle scored big in the high $6’s.

No rush now, but come January they have to decide if they want him or risk losing him.
 

FalcorMulch

Registered User
Aug 29, 2018
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447
Do your numbers actually work out though? By your own calculations the team is $900k over. If you get rid of Marleau for nothing you have $5.3M in space. Give 2 to Gardiner and you have $3.3M. But you are down two roster spots including a guy who played in your top 4 and a top 6 winger so you only have 21 players even if everyone else signed for what they are making this year. But you have to make room for raises for guys like Kapanen, Johnsson and Leivo who combined make all of $2.6M. If a guy like Kapanen or Johnsson has a bit of a break out year you could easily be looking at $2M for him alone.

There's also $2.6M in bonus overages on the books right now, which we won't have next season because we're carrying space this season. So we're at $5.9M assuming we can get rid of Marleau. Kap and Johnsson are the most likely candidates for raises. Otherwise we have more than enough players on the Marlies making <$1M capable of 4th line duties.

I come to only $2 million over the cap without trading Marleau. 13F and 7D on the roster. So if we can trade Marleau we have a bit of flexibility. Assumptions are:

* Gardiner at $6M.
* Nylander at $6.5M, Marner at $7.5M, Matthews at $11M.
* $2-3M for Kap and Johnsson. Definitely going to have to bridge them.
* 3 ELC/cheap forwards (2 dressed + 13F). One of these is going to be Grundstrom who is probably on the team in 19-20 whether we're cap constrained or not.
* 3 ELC/cheap defensemen (2 dressed + 7D, not including Dermott since he's already earned a spot). Again, we already have cheap guys that the team was probably going to be relying on regardless (Holl, Liljegren).

So under reasonable assumptions we probably lose Marleau. It's a hit but (1) how many years does he really have left?, and (2) this is also based on two other wingers becoming better players and earning raises. I'm not too concerned about the depth forwards, I trust a lot of the guys on the Marlies. Having inexperienced guys on the bottom pairing is risky but manageable.
 
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FalcorMulch

Registered User
Aug 29, 2018
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447
Why is Marleau agreeing to a trade? Consider him on the books next season.

NTCs are pretty rarely major obstacles. Most players just want control over where they go, they don't want to completely shut down trades. You think he says no to a retirement lap with Thornton in SJS for one year?
 

Sota Popinski

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NTCs are pretty rarely major obstacles. Most players just want control over where they go, they don't want to completely shut down trades. You think he says no to a retirement lap with Thornton in SJS for one year?
You think San Jose wants to pay $6.5 million for Marleau next year?
 

ACC1224

Super Elite, Passing ALL Tests since 2002
Aug 19, 2002
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NTCs are pretty rarely major obstacles. Most players just want control over where they go, they don't want to completely shut down trades. You think he says no to a retirement lap with Thornton in SJS for one year?
99% he goes no where. Marleau will be a Leaf next year.
 

Dog

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Feb 9, 2016
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Kind of weird situation for defense and Gardiner would expect him to be gone. Think he would thrive on a team where he can just be offensive d-man.
 

FalcorMulch

Registered User
Aug 29, 2018
718
447
You think San Jose wants to pay $6.5 million for Marleau next year?

In terms of cash it will be $1.25 after his bonus. In terms of cap hit, they don't really have a lot of big raises to hand out next season but they do have some in 2020-21, meaning they're probably keeping space in 2019-20 regardless. A one-year contract fits. Obviously they don't do it for free but give them pick? There isn't a whole lot of downside for them unless they chase a major UFA next summer, which wouldn't make a lot of sense with the extensions they need to sign in 2020-21.
 

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