No Man's Land for the last 20 years

[Lafleurs Guy]

The incoming rookies shouldn't be a step back. The irony about Bouillon and Murray is that they've set the bar low enough so that Tinordi and/or Beaulieu will be an improvement. Give them a little more AHL seasoning and these two rookies could give us a superior defense to what we currently have.

Okay, but staying the same back there isn't really a strong argument for "going for it" as far as I'm concerned. We just flat out haven't played well lately.

I still don't think they'll singlehandedly make the team elite, but fortifying the defense will at least give us a shot against teams like St-Louis. Truth is, I don't see any way to make the team as good as Chicago or LA no matter what we do, but does that mean we go back into tank mode? No, we've got a good enough foundation to create a legitimate Cup window. Maybe not dominant, but good enough to beat most playoff teams. An added forward gives us a real shot. Whether we go for it now or wait another season or two depends on what this team does in the next month or two. Are we really a low-scoring team or has the last few weeks just been a slump? Was the embarrassing game against LA a clear warning light, or was it an off-night? None of us can say right now.

I don't think we're going to beat anyone in the playoffs. I still don't think we're built for it. And I don't think one player is going to make that big a difference to this roster.

As for LA being a warning... well if it was just that one game okay. But we've been getting out played since the New Jersey games pretty convincingly. This is not just a one off its a trend.

Meanwhile our idiot coach is giving Eller checking duty while we fiddle with DD in prime scoring ice. To me we're just setting ourselves up for another postseason disaster.

The more I watch this team play the more I think we've got more work to do. Lots of holes to be plugged here. And if Price goes down or starts playing average hockey, the team is toast. We're just playing like crap right now.

 

[habitue*]

Okay, but staying the same back there isn't really a strong argument for "going for it" as far as I'm concerned. We just flat out haven't played well lately.

I don't think we're going to beat anyone in the playoffs. I still don't think we're built for it. And I don't think one player is going to make that big a difference to this roster.

As for LA being a warning... well if it was just that one game okay. But we've been getting out played since the New Jersey games pretty convincingly. This is not just a one off its a trend.

Meanwhile our idiot coach is giving Eller checking duty while we fiddle with DD in prime scoring ice. To me we're just setting ourselves up for another postseason disaster.



The more I watch this team play the more I think we've got more work to do. Lots of holes to be plugged here. And if Price goes down or starts playing average hockey, the team is toast. We're just playing like crap right now.

Wheb are you going to understand that Eller has very limited offensive talent and DD has very limited defensive skills ?

If five coaches behind the bench and five NHL guys at management level can understand that, why not you ?

 

[Kriss E]

Wheb are you going to understand that Eller has very limited offensive talent and DD has very limited defensive skills ?

If five coaches behind the bench and five NHL guys at management level can understand that, why not you ?

Well Eller seem to do just fine with Gallagher and Galchenyuk last year and this year.
His skills may be limited, but they're still good enough to be used over DD, and he won't develop them if he keeps being used as a 3rd line center.

 

[habitue*]

Well Eller seem to do just fine with Gallagher and Galchenyuk last year and this year.
His skills may be limited, but they're still good enough to be used over DD.

The kids were playing between 11 and 15 minutes max against weaker opponents.

Nobopdy knew who were Galchy and Gally in this shortened season . This year, they know and adjusted accordingly.

I would still play Gally with Eller on a third line (with Bournival on the LW) . But Galchenyuk needs to play with a better centerman, Plekanec.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Wheb are you going to understand that Eller has very limited offensive talent and DD has very limited defensive skills ?

If five coaches behind the bench and five NHL guys at management level can understand that, why not you ?

Eller has better defensive and offensive talent. And instead of nurturing this player (who was doing extremely well on the EGG line) we break that line up so that DD can produce. Meanwhile the team's overall play slips in the process.

DD shouldn't be on the roster at all.

 

[Habsterix*]

Wheb are you going to understand that Eller has very limited offensive talent and DD has very limited defensive skills ?

If five coaches behind the bench and five NHL guys at management level can understand that, why not you ?

Eller will become an excellent 3rd line center who can fill in as a second line center if/when needed. He may improve a bit offensively but he's not far from his peak in my opinion, which isn't saying that he's not good by he won't be a constant offensive threat.

 

[Lshap]

The blowout losses to the Kings and Blue are just symptoms of the possession malaise that's been afflicting the Habs for awhile now. Warning signs was the game against the Devils (Dec. 2) and the loss to the Panthers (Dec. 15.)

In the game against the Panthers, the Habs had a 5-5 Fenwick of 40% and in the game against the Devils it was 35%.

That's TML hockey - hoping to win off of goaltending and SH%.

No argument, our possession has sucked. But that represents the Habs at their worst, while that's another day at the office for the Leafs. We didn't look like that the first 30 games and, I hope, won't look like that moving forward.

Okay, but staying the same back there isn't really a strong argument for "going for it" as far as I'm concerned. We just flat out haven't played well lately.

I don't think we're going to beat anyone in the playoffs. I still don't think we're built for it. And I don't think one player is going to make that big a difference to this roster.

As for LA being a warning... well if it was just that one game okay. But we've been getting out played since the New Jersey games pretty convincingly. This is not just a one off its a trend.

Meanwhile our idiot coach is giving Eller checking duty while we fiddle with DD in prime scoring ice. To me we're just setting ourselves up for another postseason disaster.

The more I watch this team play the more I think we've got more work to do. Lots of holes to be plugged here. And if Price goes down or starts playing average hockey, the team is toast. We're just playing like crap right now.

If in the next month we fall back into battling for a WildCard spot, then I'll agree we're seeing a trend, not just a slump. But I'm not there yet. The Habs have looked awful the last three weeks, but we're still near the top of the conference. There's no logical reason to believe three of our lines have forgotten how to pass a puck and score goals. The Habs are better than what we've seen throughout December -- geez, a December slump is like an annual tradition for this team. They'll get over it; I suggest we do, too.

As to the playoffs, there's no correlation between one playoff season and the next. The great thing about NHL playoffs is how last year's goat makes it to the finals, or last year's big winner is dumped in round-one. People act surprised when a team defies expectations, but it happens every frikkin year. I'm not saying close our eyes to our weaknesses, but let's not exaggerate them either. If the Habs remain a top-ten team, supplement their scoring and stay healthy, they will be as built for the playoffs as any team in the East.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

No argument, our possession has sucked. But that represents the Habs at their worst, while that's another day at the office for the Leafs. We didn't look like that the first 30 games and, I hope, won't look like that moving forward.

If in the next month we fall back into battling for a WildCard spot, then I'll agree we're seeing a trend, not just a slump. But I'm not there yet. The Habs have looked awful the last three weeks, but we're still near the top of the conference. There's no logical reason to believe three of our lines have forgotten how to pass a puck and score goals. The Habs are better than what we've seen throughout December -- geez, a December slump is like an annual tradition for this team. They'll get over it; I suggest we do, too.

Well, all I'm suggesting is that we wait for the deadline to see what kind of team we have. Right now (despite our record) we don't look like a good team. Price has been stellar but we're 22nd in goals for and we're getting outplayed almost nightly now.

As to the playoffs, there's no correlation between one playoff season and the next. The great thing about NHL playoffs is how last year's goat makes it to the finals, or last year's big winner is dumped in round-one. People act surprised when a team defies expectations, but it happens every frikkin year. I'm not saying close our eyes to our weaknesses, but let's not exaggerate them either. If the Habs remain a top-ten team, supplement their scoring and stay healthy, they will be as built for the playoffs as any team in the East.

I don't disagree.

My opinion isn't entirely founded on our performance last year though. It's founded on the belief that we're not big enough to be able to withstand the kind of physical play (esp in front of the crease at both ends) that we see in the postseason. Yes we saw this last season but that didn't surprise me either.

I'd love to be wrong but I just don't think we're built for the playoffs. Whistles get put away and we don't do a good job in front of the net at either end. And the 22nd in goals for is a concern as well, not to mention the fact that our team has suddenly adopted some kind of stupid dump and chase system when we've got PK Subban on our roster.

 

[samsagat]

The problem of this team has been the same for the last 10 years or so (since 2001-2002, when they came back to respectability after 3 disastrous years)...

They build a small, fast team that should play a puck-control style but make them play a passive, neutral zone trap instead...

I mean, instead of exploiting their strenght, they try to imitate other teams systems that doesn't fit the kind of players in place...

They change coaches but always go back to this same mind bogging stupidity...

They play a north-south style, when they should switch side to give the opportunity to their quick foward to enter the offensive zone with speed...

When they play a N-S game, they go straight into the funnel the other teams are offering them. So they have to dump and go get the puck in the coners and along the boards, wich is not exactly their bread and butter...

But still, the Habs coaches of the last 10 years haven't figure it out...

 

[Hoople]

The problem of this team has been the same for the last 10 years or so (since 2001-2002, when they came back to respectability after 3 disastrous years)...

They build a small, fast team that should play a puck-control style but make them play a passive, neutral zone trap instead...

I mean, instead of exploiting their strenght, they try to imitate other teams systems that doesn't fit the kind of players in place...

They change coaches but always go back to this same mind bogging stupidity...

They play a north-south style, when they should switch side to give the opportunity to their quick foward to enter the offensive zone with speed...

When they play a N-S game, they go straight into the funnel the other teams are offering them. So they have to dump and go get the puck in the coners and along the boards, wich is not exactly their bread and butter...

But still, the Habs coaches of the last 10 years haven't figure it out...

Nailed it. Great post.

 

[LastRide]

As much as I would like to see the Hab's land the next big fish. I think for this year it might be in their best interest to lay low instead of dumping our prospects and get the raw end of the deal like Gomez. See what they can get for a couple of the Vet's like Markov. Markov can help teams that are in serious contention, and they know it. If they can pull in a real good prospect, I say go for it. DD is another guy maybe they should shop around.

If they can unload Briere for a sack of potatoes, that's good enough for me. Tell Murray and Parros to hit the road. Their services are no longer needed. The Cube at 38 years old right now should be on old age pension. I would consider keeping Gionta on the cheap for 1 or 2 years. Otherwise, if a team is willing to give us something in return we could use than fine. He could be valuable to a team in the running. I like Gio, and think he could still be useful, but he's clearly not the same player this year.

See what's out there in the off season we can sign for free agents or trades. Maybe make something happen during the draft. We need to bring up a couple of the rook's to see what they got and where we stand. Hab's are in a real weird spot right now.

 

[Hoople]

As much as I would like to see the Hab's land the next big fish. I think for this year it might be in their best interest to lay low instead of dumping our prospects and get the raw end of the deal like Gomez. See what they can get for a couple of the Vet's like Markov. Markov can help teams that are in serious contention, and they know it. If they can pull in a real good prospect, I say go for it. DD is another guy maybe they should shop around.

If they can unload Briere for a sack of potatoes, that's good enough for me. Tell Murray and Parros to hit the road. Their services are no longer needed. The Cube at 38 years old right now should be on old age pension. I would consider keeping Gionta on the cheap for 1 or 2 years. Otherwise, if a team is willing to give us something in return we could use than fine. He could be valuable to a team in the running. I like Gio, and think he could still be useful, but he's clearly not the same player this year.

See what's out there in the off season we can sign for free agents or trades. Maybe make something happen during the draft. We need to bring up a couple of the rook's to see what they got and where we stand. Hab's are in a real weird spot right now.

If you are going to trade Markov (which I agree with by the way), Briere (agree) and DD (agree), and then not re-sign Murray, Bouillon and Parros, why in the hell would you want to keep Gionta.........even for cheap.

Keeping Gionta is a band-aid approach. If we are going to clean out the older players, lets go for it. Pleks and Gorges will have to assume the veteran leadership role.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

If you are going to trade Markov (which I agree with by the way), Briere (agree) and DD (agree), and then not re-sign Murray, Bouillon and Parros, why in the hell would you want to keep Gionta.........even for cheap.

Keeping Gionta is a band-aid approach. If we are going to clean out the older players, lets go for it. Pleks and Gorges will have to assume the veteran leadership role.

Gionta's still an effective checker and puts up at least some points. And at the end of the day that's a lot of players to replace. It would be nice to be able to keep one guy around.

Unfortunately the guy we're going to keep around is going to be DD.

 

[LastRide]

If you are going to trade Markov (which I agree with by the way), Briere (agree) and DD (agree), and then not re-sign Murray, Bouillon and Parros, why in the hell would you want to keep Gionta.........even for cheap.

Keeping Gionta is a band-aid approach. If we are going to clean out the older players, lets go for it. Pleks and Gorges will have to assume the veteran leadership role.

It get's to be too much trying to replace that many players. At least Gio is the type of player who tries and shows up most nights, but isn't as effective this year. You need some vet's in the lineup. He is still one of our better player's.

 

[LastRide]

Gionta's still an effective checker and puts up at least some points. And at the end of the day that's a lot of players to replace. It would be nice to be able to keep one guy around.

Unfortunately the guy we're going to keep around is going to be DD.

and yeah I agree. DD will most likely be the guy hanging around. Those type of players who don't show up most of the time are a recipe for disaster. They get some points, but that is all they do. They have no other game.

 

[samsagat]

In fact, Gionta is one of the first I would get rid of...

As he's representing the old mentalitity of " barely making the playoff" that team had for way too long now...

If a team want to have success, a profound change of mentality have to be done when a certain morosity and kindness have been established by the veterans, those who should be the leaders of the team...

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

In fact, Gionta is one of the first I would get rid of...

As he's representing the old mentalitity of " barely making the playoff" that team had for way too long now...

If a team want to have success, a profound change of mentality have to be done when a certain morosity and kindness have been established by the veterans, those who should be the leaders of the team...

If we had a team that was deep up front I'd agree. In fact I felt the same way you do a few months back but I've changed my mind.

We've got so many holes to fill, so many players that should be replaced... Gionta is still serviceable. No point in getting rid of a player who still has some use when there's so much dead wood that needs to be replaced.

 

[Miller Time]

If it weren't for Timmons, we'd have been much worse off the past decade.

Forget "no man's land", we belong in Ilses territory with all the roster stupidity we've enjoyed in recen t years.

 

[habitue*]

The problem of this team has been the same for the last 10 years or so (since 2001-2002, when they came back to respectability after 3 disastrous years)...

They build a small, fast team that should play a puck-control style but make them play a passive, neutral zone trap instead...

I mean, instead of exploiting their strenght, they try to imitate other teams systems that doesn't fit the kind of players in place...

They change coaches but always go back to this same mind bogging stupidity...

They play a north-south style, when they should switch side to give the opportunity to their quick foward to enter the offensive zone with speed...

When they play a N-S game, they go straight into the funnel the other teams are offering them. So they have to dump and go get the puck in the coners and along the boards, wich is not exactly their bread and butter...

But still, the Habs coaches of the last 10 years haven't figure it out...

Nor the GM's

 

[habitue*]

If it weren't for Timmons, we'd have been much worse off the past decade.

Forget "no man's land", we belong in Ilses territory with all the roster stupidity we've enjoyed in recen t years.

Timmins.


Yeah, the guy who gave us A.Kostitsyn and David Fischer. As well as Maxwell, Urqhuart, Mathieu Carle and Max Lapierre. + a plethora of smallish players.

 

[BLONG7]

Timmins.


Yeah, the guy who gave us A.Kostitsyn and David Fischer. As well as Maxwell, Urqhuart, Mathieu Carle and Max Lapierre. + a plethora of smallish players.

Every head scout in the NHL has hits and misses...Overall, we have to like what TT has done, for the most part...

 

[Odelein24]

Timmins.


Yeah, the guy who gave us A.Kostitsyn and David Fischer. As well as Maxwell, Urqhuart, Mathieu Carle and Max Lapierre and Max Pacioretty, Brendan Gallagher, PK Subban, Ryan McDonagh . + a plethora of smallish players.

I added a few that you forgot in your list

 

[rockjngo]

Me thinks Gionta is gone because the team wants to change the identity of the team. The might name Alex Galchenyuk as captain.

 

[rockjngo]

We care about our hockey team, we aren't the Predators or the Coyotes. We tell it like it is. Old age and the style of players are catching up on the team and its time to press the reset button. If we don't we will see another 20 years of No Man's Land.

Please trade our old players and UFAs Gionta, Briere, Bourque, Markov, Diaz, and if we can get something for Parros, Boullion, Murray. At least we can get some picks and continue our rebuild with Galchenyuk, Subban, and Price. If we can upgrade, moving Pacioretty and Gallagher could be options if Evander Kane or someone that level becomes available. If we can move Desharnais, might include Pacioretty for Kane.

We need high draft picks top 10, we aren't going to get superstars when drafting #20 overall or a load of 2nd rounders and 3rd rounders. We are a team without a direction.
Suck like Chicago (Kane, Toews), Pitsburgh (Malkin, Fleury, Crosby).

 

[TennisMenace]

Nothing Bergervin has done made any sense:

Trading of Erik Cole for Michael Ryder, then using the cap to sign Daniel Briere. We move from 6'2" 210lbs speedy winger to 6'0" 200lbs slow semi sniper to 5'9" 180lbs slow winger. This is a downgrade!

Trading for George Parros. At 34 years old, does he have anything left in the tank? He's Gionta's, Markov's age ffs. Parros got knocked out twice this year.

Brandon Prust, ok I love the signing, he's a character guy but he always fight with players above his weight class.

Drew Drewiskie, has yet to play with the Habs this year and probably put on waviers.

Frankie Bouillon, at 37 years old the 5'7" 190lbs defenseman I think is finished. We need bigger defenseman.

Doug Murray, ok he's tough, size, but he's 34 years old, and is one of the slowest player in the league. I still laugh at that mistake against Buffalo when he fell face first giving up a goal in a harmless play. He's done.

Yet we still sell out every game.