Speculation: NJ Offseason Thread Part VI

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MadDevil

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Larsson's actual shot isn't bad, but he takes forever to get it off, which usually results in the shot not getting through. His skating also holds him back offensively. Guys like Shattenkirk and Fowler can create offense with their skating by rushing the puck or joining the rush or creating in the offensive zone. Larsson really can't. His offensive ability is pretty much all about his passing, which is really good. But he lacks the other attributes that 40+ point defensemen have.
 

Zajacs Bowl Cut

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this is over the last 3 years...Even Strength points per 60 minutes of ice time

http://stats.hockeyanalysis.com/rat...ense&minutes=500&disp=1&sort=PCT&sortdir=DESC

Adam Larsson 0.72
Niklas Kronwall 0.70
Marek Zidlicky 0.75
Jacob Trouba 0.74
Ryan Suter 0.73
Drew Doughty 0.72
Kevin Shattenkirk 0.79
Morgan Rielly 0.78
Brian Campbell 0.67
Jay Bouwmeester 0.72
Oliver Ekman-Larsson 0.84


so, I mean, yea. and I am in no way saying he is better than or even as good as some of these players offensively. but to say he couldn't get NEAR 40 points if he just got PP time is also silly IMO.
 

NJDevils17

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this is over the last 3 years...Even Strength points per 60 minutes of ice time

http://stats.hockeyanalysis.com/rat...ense&minutes=500&disp=1&sort=PCT&sortdir=DESC

Adam Larsson 0.72
Niklas Kronwall 0.70
Marek Zidlicky 0.75
Jacob Trouba 0.74
Ryan Suter 0.73
Drew Doughty 0.72
Kevin Shattenkirk 0.79
Morgan Rielly 0.78
Brian Campbell 0.67
Jay Bouwmeester 0.72
Oliver Ekman-Larsson 0.84


so, I mean, yea. and I am in no way saying he is better than or even as good as some of these players offensively. but to say he couldn't get NEAR 40 points if he just got PP time is also silly IMO.

He had the same number of even strength points as Doughty if I remember correctly. Not that I think he is as good but without PP time Larsson gets a pretty bad rap for not being an "offensive dman". I bet he would get ~20 points playing on the PP.

We may never know for sure but I wish Hynes would let him play more on the PP.
 

NJDevs26

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Schneider's puck handling probably caused 5 goals(that seems like more than actual but for the sake of argument let's overestimate) he'd still be in elite company in terms of GAA.

Schneider is ridiculously good at stopping the puck that I could care less about his few mishandles of the puck. Happens and it's annoying but hey he's still an elite goalie.

Honestly I don't remember many serious issues this year. In his first couple years yeah he had a few horrendous ones, some of which may have cost us games. I think in part cause he avoided trying to do too much this year. In the past I think the system was more built on goalies trying to play the puck cause of Marty so everyone would attempt to do it - Moose, for example.
 

MadDevil

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He had the same number of even strength points as Doughty if I remember correctly. Not that I think he is as good but without PP time Larsson gets a pretty bad rap for not being an "offensive dman". I bet he would get ~20 points playing on the PP.

We may never know for sure but I wish Hynes would let him play more on the PP.

He's already logging a lot of tough minutes and is excelling at his current role. Is it worth cutting his even strength and PK time just to get him some PP time?
 

NJDevs26

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He's already logging a lot of tough minutes and is excelling at his current role. Is it worth cutting his even strength and PK time just to get him some PP time?

If they trade Severson I don't know how they avoid it unless Schlemko and Warsovsky are going to get ALL the PP time or they make some major addition on the blueline.
 

Triumph

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He doesn't have even close to the amount of creativity or shot that any of those players do. Definitely not even close to Shattenkirk. How many opportunities can you say Larsson really creates? Not much, he plays a very safe game. He doesn't score many goals because lets be honest his shot is pretty weak overall. Guy's a stud defensively but he hasn't shown enough offensively to be put in the same category with those players. Not only that but they have produced for multiple years.

He did have a very lucky season in 2014-15 though. You can't forget that. Can Shattenkirk say that?
 

Ripshot 43

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You all are clearly missing the most important part of the past few pages... And that is..... You don't trade John Quennville. This guy is going to be a good one.
 

VoidCreature

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He's already logging a lot of tough minutes and is excelling at his current role. Is it worth cutting his even strength and PK time just to get him some PP time?

All #1 defensemen log close to 30 minutes a night. If that's the kind of guy we see Larsson as that's how much he'll play. I think he can do it.
 

RSeen

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All #1 defensemen log close to 30 minutes a night. If that's the kind of guy we see Larsson as that's how much he'll play. I think he can do it.

That is not true. Maybe 2 or 3 Dmen do that in the regular season. More in the playoffs but its definitely not all.
 

VoidCreature

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That is not true. Maybe 2 or 3 Dmen do that in the regular season. More in the playoffs but its definitely not all.

1 Karlsson, Erik 28:58
2 Suter, Ryan 28:36
3 Doughty, Drew 28:01
4 Letang, Kris 26:57
5 Subban, P.K. 26:22
6 Pietrangelo, Alex 26:18
7 Burns, Brent 25:52
8 Josi, Roman 25:29
9 Weber, Shea 25:23
10 Ristolainen, Rasmus 25:17

Top 10 in ice time last year, all over 25 a game. All are what I'd call #1's save for Ristolainen. Adam Larsson did 22:31. All except Pietrangelo had more than 3 minutes of PP per game. I think we can give him a little more.

Edit: Looks like Larsson was #4 in short handed ice time per game among defenders. Greene was #3.

Ideally we'd get more depth on defense to take that down a bit for Larsson. But I think he's shown a lot so far in terms of endurance.

Edit again: Larsson had more overall time on ice than some big names last year. Hedman and Subban in particular. Though for Subban that's probably because of his injury. Some others were Hampus Lindholm, Travis Hamonic, Seth Jones and Duncan Keith.
 
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Bleedred

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If we're upgrading on defense in the next few years, Larsson can play PP minutes.

If we're icing guys like Warsofsky and Helgeson next year or don't bring back Schlemko and have a replacement or upgrade to him, our defense will be even worse and he won't be playing PP at all ever.
 

Bleedred

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Schneider's puck handling probably caused 5 goals(that seems like more than actual but for the sake of argument let's overestimate) he'd still be in elite company in terms of GAA.

Schneider is ridiculously good at stopping the puck that I could care less about his few mishandles of the puck. Happens and it's annoying but hey he's still an elite goalie.

I'm having trouble remembering his puckhandling directly leading to any goals against this past year, though maybe there was one or two. There may have been a couple others where his inability to play it might have led to a goal after we couldn't clear our zone. I remember quite a few ''Almost'' situation's leading to a goal against, but not many goals against. Although I do remember about a handful of them directly leading to goals against in his first two years combined as a Devil. Hedberg seemed to be good for about 3 or 4 per year and he never came close to playing as many games as Cory has in even the season Cory only played 45 for us in his first year here.

I remember counting all the bad goals Cory allowed this year and I'm pretty sure it was about 22. I remember counting about 28 (I think) bad goals from Cory in 14-15 and literally about 15 or 16 of them came in October and November. Kinkaid allowed about 19 bad goals in not even 40% as many games as Cory played this year. That's 3 fewer bad goals allowed in 35 or 36 less games played.:help: Which is weird, considering Kinkaid allowed about 8 or 9 bad goals on 40 total in 2014-2015, which explains his significant drop in save percentage this past year.
 

Emperoreddy

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I'm having trouble remembering his puckhandling directly leading to any goals against this past year, though maybe there was one or two. There may have been a couple others where his inability to play it might have led to a goal after we couldn't clear our zone. I remember quite a few ''Almost'' situation's leading to a goal against, but not many goals against. Although I do remember about a handful of them directly leading to goals against in his first two years combined as a Devil. Hedberg seemed to be good for about 3 or 4 per year and he never came close to playing as many games as Cory has in even the season Cory only played 45 for us in his first year here.

I remember counting all the bad goals Cory allowed this year and I'm pretty sure it was about 22. I remember counting about 28 (I think) bad goals from Cory in 14-15 and literally about 15 or 16 of them came in October and November. Kinkaid allowed about 19 bad goals in not even 40% as many games as Cory played this year. That's 3 fewer bad goals allowed in 35 or 36 less games played.:help: Which is weird, considering Kinkaid allowed about 8 or 9 bad goals on 40 total in 2014-2015, which explains his significant drop in save percentage this past year.

His puck handling mess ups are negligible at worst.

It isn't even worth mentioning because how little it factors into a season.
 

Devils1029

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I guess Im in the minority but I don;t want RNH. He's 23 and still slight of frame and a bit fragile, especially to be a #1 center playing up against others in the metro...Only guys I'd want from Edmonton are Hall and Draisatl (MacJesus is untouchable). Yakapov is a bust, Eberle overrated, expensive, and entitled - not great defensively...

Getting the 4th overall and picking Dubois (who I think is better than Tckachuk and can play all 3 forward positions) would be a coup....just don't; see that happening without trading Larsson straight up for #4 and I'm NOT on board with that at all.

I'll hold out hope of trading up to CGY position to grab Keller before Murray gets his greasy freaky mitts on him....
 

Bleedred

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His puck handling mess ups are negligible at worst.

It isn't even worth mentioning because how little it factors into a season.

I honestly think he's puck handling is made too much of a big deal about.

While it's not very good, I don't find it to be a liability either. I thought Hedberg was much more a liability than Cory.

As I said, most of the really good goaltenders in the league aren't great puckhandlers. Just Price, Bishop and a bunch of goaltenders that aren't very good at stopping the puck like Rinne and Smith.
 

Zajacs Bowl Cut

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we were so spoiled with Marty's puck handling that when we see Cory be average at it, we think its worse than it is IMO
 

Emperoreddy

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I honestly think he's puck handling is made too much of a big deal about.

While it's not very good, I don't find it to be a liability either. I thought Hedberg was much more a liability than Cory.

As I said, most of the really good goaltenders in the league aren't great puckhandlers. Just Price, Bishop and a bunch of goaltenders that aren't very good at stopping the puck like Rinne and Smith.

I'm honestly hard pressed to think of any quality goaltender that is held back by poor puck handling.
 

ForeverJerseyGirl

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Cory's puck handling doesn't really bother me. I wish the rest of our team could be as good in their respective positions as Cory is in his, so Cory's puck handling abilities are not even on my list of problems with this team, to be honest.
 

Billdo

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how would you succeed on a team where the coaches dont give you ample time and leeway to learn, the media trashes you, and you had the expectations of 1st overall coming into the league immediately?

Guess we should have traded Larsson as well... Yakupov is in the EXACT same position yet everyone here cant see past the rose tinted glasses and hindsight is too beautiful for some to ignore.


Except it's typically easier for forwards to adjust to the NHL whereas defenseman take a bit longer generally speaking. There were def some people wanting to trade Larsson, I distinctly remember that. Having said all of that, Yak isn't a guy people are giving anything more than a VERY late 2nd (probably not even that) or a middle round pick up for.
 

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Severson is better than Fowler right now.


FOWLER, CAM 5v5 1135:45 2 goals 7 assist - 4 first assist -.48 points per 60

SEVERSON, DAMON 5v5 1102:39 1 goal 14 assist - 7 first assist - .0.82 points per 60


Fowler's most common forward line-mates have been 1st and 2nd liners:
SILFVERBERG, JAKOB 330:19
KESLER, RYAN 330:16
COGLIANO, ANDREW 321:18
GETZLAF, RYAN 315:06
PERRY, COREY 311:11


SEVERSON's most common forward linemates - simiarly 1st and 2nd liners - Clearly not the talent level of Anahiem though.

HENRIQUE, ADAM 298:14
PALMIERI, KYLE 266:20
KALININ, SERGEY 252:23
GIONTA, STEPHEN 244:39
STEMPNIAK, LEE 236:17
ZAJAC, TRAVIS 220:28




Severson on Ice Shot stats.
SF60 24.98 - SA60 27.97 47.2% 3rd best on the team

Fowler on Ice Shot stats
SF60 28.11 - SA60 29.21 49.0% worst Anaheim defender 8 of 8



FOWLER on Ice Goal Stats
GF60 2.06 - GA60 2.59 44.3% He and Bieksa were the worst Anaheim defenders in this category

Severson on Ice goal stats
GF60 2.01 - GA60 2.29 46.8% 3rd best on the team

CF%
Folwer 48.8
Severson 48.8

Severson 21 years old 123 NHL played
Fowler 24 years old 414 NHL games played

i would like to believe we have a real stud in Severson from reading this, but I get the idea that this may be lack of atat interpretation...

youre telling me Severson > Fowler right now?
 

Bleedred

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I'm honestly hard pressed to think of any quality goaltender that is held back by poor puck handling.

I can't think of one either. I think puck handling might be the only use guys like Mike Smith and Rinne have these days, but I'd take Cory over either of them. Smith isn't a good puck stopper and Rinne is a straight up BAD puck stopping goalie in the year 2016.
 

ForeverJerseyGirl

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On Yakupov, I don't have anything against him, but I would hope that if Severson was traded it wouldn't be for Yakupov. If the price for Yakupov is Severson, I'd rather Shero not pay it. If the price for Yakupov is more reasonable, I could see him actually working well here, since he would probably get chances here he wouldn't get somewhere else. I could see the Devils being a potential landing spot for him, and I wouldn't be opposed to that as long as we don't lose Severson for Yakupov. Personally, I think Oilers fans overestimate what Yakupov would net.
 
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