Speculation: Nightmare Scenario

Jame

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Sep 4, 2002
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It really isn't. It came straight from the mouth of the head scout.

You made a big deal, about a common practice... and you managed to botch the context between the story you were trying to tell ("zomg so many prospects"), and the example which disproves your concern (college and euro prospects to balance it out).

note: his comments accounted for the 2013 contract situation... it's a little different today
 

Jim Bob

RIP RJ
Feb 27, 2002
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This isn't a new problem. Most of us, including our scouts and management have been aware that this is an issue for a while. It is not a problem that "magically appeared" out of nowhere. If you haven't noticed, they have made an effort to draft a large amount of college players in an attempt to allow players to enter the organization on different time frames. This is because there is a contract limit. Even though we have staggered the time frame, it is eventually going to be impossible to sign all of these players, and unless they are traded, they will no longer be our property. You have not seen other teams have this problem before because the amount of youth and draft picks the Sabres have acquired is unprecedented. Therefore, the prudent thing to do is to package and trade some of them, otherwise you are losing these players for nothing.

The contract limit isn't that huge of an issue.

This summer they have 11 UFAs (maybe 2 or 3 are re-signed) and 13 RFAs (a handful of which won't be re-signed).

And, they won't sign every guy that they draft.

The key is not to panic and move guys before the team has a good handle on where they could fit in the squad long term.

If they can add a young impact player (like Dallas did with Seguin), then you make the deal.

But, moving multiple prospects for the next Stewart or Gionta is not the right move.
 

Jame

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Sep 4, 2002
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did this thread turn in to:
"if we dont get mceichel we should panic and make dumb moves"
 

dire wolf

immaculate vibes
May 9, 2006
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You're glossing over the fact that outside of the Bruins, every recent SC winning team has had that one go-to offensive weapon (Kopitar, Kane, Crosby, Datsyuk, Getzlaf, Staal). Right now, we don't have that sure-fire go-to offensive weapon prospect. Sure, MAYBE Reinhart develops into a guy like Toews. MAYBE Grigorenko develops into a guy like Kopitar. McEichel doesn't win us a Cup....but it gets us a heckuva lot closer.

And to your "Getzlaf fell into the teens" comment --- it's a rare occurence that a franchise-caliber guy falls outside the top 5 or 10. It happens maybe once or twice every 3-4 drafts. Something like that strikes me as more luck than quality scouting.

Not exactly true. First of all, don't ignore the Bruins. Their model has worked quite well. Second of all, if you look at the Kings' playoff stats, Kopitar was never the "one go-to offensive weapon."

Last year, Kopitar led the team with 26 playoff points, but Carter and Williams each had 25 points, and Gaborik had 22. Also, Kopitar only had 5 goals, compared to Gaborik (14), Carter (10), Williams (9), Toffoli (7), Brown (6), Muzzin (6) and Doughty and Martinez also with 5.

In 2012, Brown and Carter matched Kopitar for goals, and they primarily won the Cup that year through defense and goaltending anyway.

When the Blackhawks won in 2013, Kane had the most points by a slim margin, but Sharp was the leading goal scorer, and Bickell tied Kane in goals. Toews and Keith had the most assists.

Bottom line - you need high quality depth to win the Cup.
 

Baccus

Garage League filled with Mickey Mouse teams
Feb 18, 2014
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A lot easier said then done, especially when teams know you are going to be losing these guys if they just wait. You end up trading a 2nd rounder you couldn't fit for a future 7th round pick. It's terrible asset management. You have to be proactive.

Yes we should act now to solve a non-existent issue that may in the future have a slight possibility of happening, and do it at a massive discount just...because it sounds more dramatic?

So if a team has a good year drafting, and hits on a higher percentage of draft picks, that's actually a bad thing because, OMG TOO MANY PROSPECTS. Amazing logic.

Frankly if you have a 2nd rounder who's really good but you had no way of fitting them in the line up through trades/buyouts/acts of god and had to then, despite them being so good, dump them to one of 29 other teams just for a 7th round pick, because nobody else would possibly give up more than that for this really good young, contract controlled player, then actually, I'd be glad to be stuck in that position, because the Sabres must be the world most amazing team AND still have an overstocked cupboard....

Are you actually Glenn Healy?

did this thread turn in to:
"if we dont get mceichel we should panic and make dumb moves"

That's how it started, I don't think it turned into it ;)
 

stokes84

Registered User
Jun 30, 2008
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Charleston, SC
We aren't even 10 games into year 3 of what is likely a 4-5 year rebuild. Better bundle up buttercup, cause it ain't gonna get warm for a while

This will be the 4th draft since the rebuild started. After June, it is no longer a rebuild, it is a build up. It better start getting warm.
 

stokes84

Registered User
Jun 30, 2008
19,314
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Charleston, SC
We aren't even 10 games into year 3 of what is likely a 4-5 year rebuild. Better bundle up buttercup, cause it ain't gonna get warm for a while

This will be the 4th draft since the rebuild started. After June, it is no longer a rebuild, it is a build up. It better start getting warm.
 

Man of Principles

The Krueger Effect
Nov 30, 2011
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We're gonna get a lot of good pieces out of this draft either way. If we can't notch the big fish, I'll take two or three more solid prospects and bide my time.

There's always Eric Staal to overpay. I'm not saying that's what Murray will do, but for the first time in a number of years, the timeline would be right and it would make sense.
 

Jame

Registered User
Sep 4, 2002
52,673
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Florida
This will be the 4th draft since the rebuild started. After June, it is no longer a rebuild, it is a build up. It better start getting warm.

There is a difference between when the 1st acts occurred that are contributing to the rebuild and when the full on rebuild started...

also, the act of drafting talent is not the sole act of a rebuild... the rebuild doesn't just end because you've added a certain number of draft picks to the pipeline...
 

TehDoak

Chili that wants to be here
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Feb 28, 2002
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This will be the 4th draft since the rebuild started. After June, it is no longer a rebuild, it is a build up. It better start getting warm.

The gaustad trade was a trade of opportunity, not the start of a rebuild.

We missed the playoffs by 3 points that year.

The expectations the next season were still to make the playoffs.

The Ruff Firing/Pomniville trade signaled the beginning and the lowering of expectations.
 

phosphene*

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Feb 18, 2014
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Not getting McDavid will be a nightmare imo. I know the odds are against us, but still, having a phenom like that in Buffalo would be just too good. A legit marquee Canadian superstar playing number one center on the Sabres is just a slamdunk for a dynasty. Yzerman, Sakic, Crosby, Tavares, Stamkos, etc.
 

Duddy

Everyday is
Dec 24, 2005
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I would be a little pissed that we didn't end up with the 2 top prices, but shortly after I would be pretty damn happy to get another price.

Patience is needed and will be needed in the next few seasons.
 

Jim Bob

RIP RJ
Feb 27, 2002
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Rochester, NY
Having missed out on McEichel? I don't think so.

If Grigorenko & Reinhart are legit top 6 centers, they could lead the Sabres to the playoffs in 2016-17.

Grigorenko would be 5 years post-draft and Reinhart would be 3 years post-draft.

Chicago made the playoffs in Toews' 3rd post-draft season.
 

Man of Principles

The Krueger Effect
Nov 30, 2011
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If Grigorenko & Reinhart are legit top 6 centers, they could lead the Sabres to the playoffs in 2016-17.

Grigorenko would be 5 years post-draft and Reinhart would be 3 years post-draft.

Chicago made the playoffs in Toews' 3rd post-draft season.

Well yeah but neither Reinhart or Grigorenko are Johnathon Toews. I don't know how you can say with certainty that either of their games will touch Toews' a couple years from now. Toews is not only skill and hard work, but he's also staunch leadership. I don't see those qualities eminating from Reinhart or Grigorenko.
 

Jame

Registered User
Sep 4, 2002
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If Grigorenko & Reinhart are legit top 6 centers, they could lead the Sabres to the playoffs in 2016-17.

Grigorenko would be 5 years post-draft and Reinhart would be 3 years post-draft.

Chicago made the playoffs in Toews' 3rd post-draft season.

These things are not possible unless we draft McEichel... if we don't get hims, then our massive prospect pool of top talent will falter in a logjam.
 

stokes84

Registered User
Jun 30, 2008
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Charleston, SC
If Grigorenko & Reinhart are legit top 6 centers, they could lead the Sabres to the playoffs in 2016-17.

Grigorenko would be 5 years post-draft and Reinhart would be 3 years post-draft.

Chicago made the playoffs in Toews' 3rd post-draft season.

I think this is living on a bit of a wing and a prayer, honestly. It is possible, but it's hard to imagine right now.
 

Jim Bob

RIP RJ
Feb 27, 2002
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Rochester, NY
Well yeah but neither Reinhart or Grigorenko are Johnathon Toews. I don't know how you can say with certainty that either of their games will touch Toews' a couple years from now. Toews is not only skill and hard work, but he's also staunch leadership. I don't see those qualities eminating from Reinhart or Grigorenko.

Neither guy has to be Toews.

My point is that in two years time, both guys will be a lot more mature than they are today and that they, along with Girgensons in year 5 post-draft, Zadorov and Ristolainen 4 years post-draft, etc., very well could be a good enough core to make the playoffs minus McEichel.

At the end of the day, the rebuild doesn't hinge 100% on the Sabres getting one of McEichel.

That said, everyone still hopes that one of McEichel end up as a Sabre.
 

Husko

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We draft Hannifan (and say "yay, we have potentially our best dman in team history!") then package our other two picks + maybe a dman to move up and take one of the second tier centers. That still leaves us with Reinhart, Grigorenko, Girgensons, Larsson, and a first round pick at center
 

Jim Bob

RIP RJ
Feb 27, 2002
56,427
35,804
Rochester, NY
I think this is living on a bit of a wing and a prayer, honestly. It is possible, but it's hard to imagine right now.

Why?

I'm looking at the early season play in Rochester and I'm getting really hopeful.

Armia and Carrier could be legit top 6 NHL wingers in two years time.

Ruhwedel and Pysyk add more depth to the blueline.

And that isn't even getting into what guys like Varone, Schaller, and Larsson could bring to the table.

The pipeline is deep and the rebuild isn't dependent on one guy.

Look at the Bruins. They are led by a guy that was overlooked and fell to the second round.
 

Crazy Tasty

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Oct 5, 2005
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Or will we be where the Penguins were when Crosby was a rookie?

The penguins had 3 top 5 picks already in their pool when they got Crosby, and then a #2 the following in J Staal.
Over 5 years as a bottom feeder.

Edmonton drafted 1st overall 3 times in a row.
3 years as a bottom feeder (and counting).

Buffalo is a year and 3 weeks in...
 

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