NHL to Seattle Volume XVI - It's Official. Seattle to join the league for 21-22 season.

[PCSPounder]

It makes more sense for Seattle to put their AHL team near the OTHER AHL TEAMS in their division rather than a city that’s only close to the NHL team.

The whole "Well, you need the team close for easy call-ups" really only works when you’re not geographically isolated.

Each team in hockey is on the road 40% of the time. There’s no attempt to mirror AHL and NHL teams being HOME at the same time. (In fact, for teams like San Jose and Manitoba, it’s the purposely the OPPOSITE because of arena availability).

You put the AHL team in California and they’ll be in California for 85% of the season, while Seattle will be in Seattle/Vancouver/California for 70% of the season.

We haven't maxed out the number of available arenas in California... HOWEVER, we've maxed out the number of viable markets in California that have available arenas. In short, Fresno needs to chase away their university (obviously not happening) and Long Beach won't draw squat.

I could name some markets worth a try, but arena solutions are all the more costly and public money ain't happening for this.

 

[PCSPounder]

Perhaps they are saving Sacramento for a Seattle AHL team

Not a viable arena... and while Sac State has lit the fuse on their once-a-decade quest for an arena to replace their current gym, I would not hold my breath for them (certainly not one with a hockey alignment, even though we've been made aware that this has been suggested from the Sac State AD).

 

[Groo]

Not a viable arena... and while Sac State has lit the fuse on their once-a-decade quest for an arena to replace their current gym, I would not hold my breath for them.

Why ?
Aren't they building new digs for the Kings ?
Haven't they played NHL games at the Kings current arena ?
Not sure what Sac St has to do with it at all

 

[PCSPounder]

Why ?
Aren't they building new digs for the Kings ?
Haven't they played NHL games at the Kings current arena ?
Not sure what Sac St has to do with it at all

That new arena is already built and is about to begin serving its 3rd season for the Kings. It is very Barclays insofar as hockey goes (seriously doubt they even have an ice plant)... it's not happening. It's a cool place, though, if you discount the exterior and surrounding work.

Sac State hired a new AD a couple summers ago. He started by stumping to build a new on-campus arena, and the AD expressed an interest in bringing in the G-League and hockey (probably his way of trying to get private money to help build the thing). We've heard nothing more about this since the Kings arranged for their team in Reno to end up in Stockton (starting next month).

 

[AdmiralsFan24]

It is very Barclays insofar as hockey goes (seriously doubt they even have an ice plant)... it's not happening.

Who cares if it's very Barclays? It's an AHL team. San Antonio is "very Barclays", Charlotte when they played at Spectrum Arena or whatever it's called now was "very Barclays." You don't need 17,000 good seats for an AHL team. I have no idea if there's an ice plant and if there's not it obviously eliminates Golden 1 but it really doesn't matter if it's set up like Barclays if it's only for an AHL team.

 

[tank44]

well, to go full circle... I know of one local arena in the Seattle that was 'very Barclay's ' and was so bad that both the the hockey and basketball teams left. One moved out of state and one went to a new arena in the suburbs. Now to fix this arena, they are spending millions to redo it so that it will work for both hockey and basketball to return. Yes, talking about Key Arena here. It doesnt seem as bad in the pictures as what was experienced at Key for hockey where the seats were arranged to point to mid-court and with the hockey alignment you'd be sitting and looking into one zone and would have to physically turn your body (not just head) to see the other obstructed end. Scoreboard was over one of the blue lines and the seats angles toward that.


re: Sacramento, they are not "keeping it for Seattle". This would make most sense for the Sharks or Stockton Flames to be at but neither are so there seems to be some obstacle bringing AHL there.

 

[PCSPounder]

Who cares if it's very Barclays? It's an AHL team. San Antonio is "very Barclays", Charlotte when they played at Spectrum Arena or whatever it's called now was "very Barclays." You don't need 17,000 good seats for an AHL team. I have no idea if there's an ice plant and if there's not it obviously eliminates Golden 1 but it really doesn't matter if it's set up like Barclays if it's only for an AHL team.

Name me an arena set up like this that has accommodated hockey for longer than 10 years.

As tank mentioned above, Seattle is a test case for this, and while the Thunderbirds spent 11 or 12 years in Key Arena, obviously they worked half the time trying to get out into their own digs. I even recall a rumor that the franchise was headed to Victoria during the process.

I've got to think there's another example or two out there. I just think they're the exceptions to the rule. Renting an arena from a major league operator is problematic enough, but doing so with an inferior alignment is usually a turn-off to fans. Having been to Key, to Utah in the Grizzlies Delta Center days, the old Sacramento arena for indoor soccer just to have a good seat end up view-obstructed... it matters.

(EDIT- I can't believe I forgot I saw the Coyotes in Phoenix back in the day... I was lucky that I'd hit Utah first so that I knew what to avoid when buying the American West/Talking Stick ticket.)

 

[AdmiralsFan24]

Name me an arena set up like this that has accommodated hockey for longer than 10 years.

You literally just quoted a post that has had one for longer than 10 years. AT&T Center.

Again, you're talking about AHL here. There are more than enough good seats to house an AHL team. If you have 10,000 good seats and 5,000 seats that suck, it's fine.

 

[KevFu]

To this point, Kev, Seattle is a direct flight then relatively short bus ride to most if not all the CA cities. Curious, Kev, but do the Pacific Division teams play Texas/San Antonio at all and if so are there flights involved in those? If yes, then this, too, is not an issue because those flights are longer. Colorado I'd guess also has to have flights involved because there's no teams close by for busses. Granted, the AHL in the old days with all the teams clustered in the Northeast probably had almost exclusively bus transport but those days are gone now with the Pacific Division. Doing it in Tacoma will not be a big deal if that's what Oak View decides to do.

Texas/San Antonio are in the central now. The Pacific is playing 12 total games against the Central teams (6 home, 6 road). And when they do play on the road, it's a "fly there, play two games back-to-back and leave" situation. They're not barnstorming.

But adding teams changes that. With an 8th Pacific division team, they could play 10 vs each other and 8 Central teams (4 home, 4 away) and leave the division footprint once each for a four-game trip (like SA-TEX-IOWA-ROCK or WIN-CHI-STL-GR).

 

[gstommylee]

The problem with Tacoma dome is going to cost additional funds to make it able to house hockey and it already had 2 hockey teams and both failed there. WHL Tacoma Rockets (relocated) and WCHL Sabercats (folded)

 

[S E P H]

That new arena is already built and is about to begin serving its 3rd season for the Kings. It is very Barclays insofar as hockey goes (seriously doubt they even have an ice plant)... it's not happening. It's a cool place, though, if you discount the exterior and surrounding work.

Sac State hired a new AD a couple summers ago. He started by stumping to build a new on-campus arena, and the AD expressed an interest in bringing in the G-League and hockey (probably his way of trying to get private money to help build the thing). We've heard nothing more about this since the Kings arranged for their team in Reno to end up in Stockton (starting next month).

San Antonio Rampage play in a basketball-only arena and it doesn't really hurt their attendance, last time I saw they were always constantly in the top tier in fans.

 

[BKIslandersFan]

San Antonio Rampage play in a basketball-only arena and it doesn't really hurt their attendance, last time I saw they were always constantly in the top tier in fans.

They are a minor league team.

 

[gstommylee]

This is interesting



Looks like Simons mall was also thinking of a ice rink there too.

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

Vegas Could move the Wolves tomorrow if they wanted to the NHL has complete control of where the Ahl teams play independent owners do not matter in the ahl

there was also a report that Don Levin, not Leiweke et all would be the owner of the POTENTIAL Seattle franchise, js, that team is not on the block or being sold, Vegas does NOT own the franchise, they never have

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

They are a minor league team.

owned by who, BK, Bridgeport is a minor league team OWNED by who, the Islanders, the Rampage are Spurs Sports, and were originally a Detroit owned franchise much like Grand Rapids is today

 

[BKIslandersFan]

owned by who, BK, Bridgeport is a minor league team OWNED by who, the Islanders, the Rampage are Spurs Sports, and were originally a Detroit owned franchise much like Grand Rapids is today

I am saying, requirements of minor league teams and NHL teams are different

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

I am saying, requirements of minor league teams and NHL teams are different

not when the NHL TEAMS OPERATE the clubs that supply them, you clearly don't understand that dynamic

 

[gstommylee]

there was also a report that Don Levin, not Leiweke et all would be the owner of the POTENTIAL Seattle franchise, js, that team is not on the block or being sold, Vegas does NOT own the franchise, they never have

Don Levin isn't even involved anymore in anything here. That was back like in 2010-2011 that his name was mention. So no idea why you needed to bring that up.

 

[tank44]

Don Levin isn't even involved anymore in anything here. That was back like in 2010-2011 that his name was mention. So no idea why you needed to bring that up.

Don Levin owns the AHL Chicago Wolves. One of the independent AHL owners and home to the current AHL affiliate to Vegas. If you're a west coast team and need to affiliate with someone outside of the Pacific time zone, Chicago is a great option as it's right beside O'Hare airport which is the 3rd busiest airport in the US. Partly as result they end up as a transition affiliate for many teams as Atlanta, Vancouver, St Louis & Vegas have been affiliated with them in the past 20 years or so.

It's also no guarantee that NHL_Seattle group will be gifted/granted a AHL franchise. AHL will probably expand to match NHL expansion but Vegas or many other NHL teams wanting their own AHL franchise are likely ahead of Seattle in the queue. With that in mind, I wouldnt be surprised to see StLouis get the 32nd franchise and they finally get to put their affiliate in Kansas City; Vegas moves in with San Antonio and Seattle gets Chicago.

 

[jbron]

Most likely the Seattle NHL team for their first season will share with an existing AHL team similar to what Vegas and St Louis did with the
Chicago Wolves. While not the best situation it does work for the first year. Upon which, the new team in Seattle can continue to work to
get an association with a existing AHL team or an addition.

 

[BattleBorn]

Don Levin owns the AHL Chicago Wolves. One of the independent AHL owners and home to the current AHL affiliate to Vegas. If you're a west coast team and need to affiliate with someone outside of the Pacific time zone, Chicago is a great option as it's right beside O'Hare airport which is the 3rd busiest airport in the US. Partly as result they end up as a transition affiliate for many teams as Atlanta, Vancouver, St Louis & Vegas have been affiliated with them in the past 20 years or so.

It's also no guarantee that NHL_Seattle group will be gifted/granted a AHL franchise. AHL will probably expand to match NHL expansion but Vegas or many other NHL teams wanting their own AHL franchise are likely ahead of Seattle in the queue. With that in mind, I wouldnt be surprised to see StLouis get the 32nd franchise and they finally get to put their affiliate in Kansas City; Vegas moves in with San Antonio and Seattle gets Chicago.

Chicago is a pretty unique situation, and I've got a feeling people see what's happened in the past and assume that's what the future will look like.

Prior to the VGK affiliation, the Chicago Wolves saw themselves as a team to compete in the Chicago market with the Blackhawks. Getting people buying tickets and winning games has been the MO of the Chicago Wolves for that reason. This has had a tendency to put player development toward the lower end of the priority list for the franchise, which, of course, is the ultimate goal of any NHL/AHL affiliation.

Apparently, that has changed now and the parent affiliate has far more control over the Wolves operations than it has in the past. All that being said, I don't expect the affiliation to change soon.

Chicago isn't supposed to be the "transition affiliate," they just kept running teams off and were the last seat available when the music stopped in the affiliation game. That has supposedly changed now.

 

[gstommylee]

Don Levin owns the AHL Chicago Wolves. One of the independent AHL owners and home to the current AHL affiliate to Vegas. If you're a west coast team and need to affiliate with someone outside of the Pacific time zone, Chicago is a great option as it's right beside O'Hare airport which is the 3rd busiest airport in the US. Partly as result they end up as a transition affiliate for many teams as Atlanta, Vancouver, St Louis & Vegas have been affiliated with them in the past 20 years or so.

It's also no guarantee that NHL_Seattle group will be gifted/granted a AHL franchise. AHL will probably expand to match NHL expansion but Vegas or many other NHL teams wanting their own AHL franchise are likely ahead of Seattle in the queue. With that in mind, I wouldnt be surprised to see StLouis get the 32nd franchise and they finally get to put their affiliate in Kansas City; Vegas moves in with San Antonio and Seattle gets Chicago.

Look at the alignment picture. There is one spot open in the pacific. Seattle AHL needs to be close to them. No way Seattle is going to have Chicago as theirs it's too far away.

Colorado AHL was a new team this year so i don't see why you think we get no say in who our AHL should be when colorado did.

We could have Idaho Steelheads as our AHL for example after promoting them. I doubt the AHL wants to realign the divisions again after #32 joins so #32 will be somewhere in the pacific region and it'll be for Seattle not Vegas.

 

[BattleBorn]

Look at the alignment picture. There is one spot open in the pacific. Seattle AHL needs to be close to them. No way Seattle is going to have Chicago as theirs it's too far away.

Colorado AHL was a new team this year so i don't see why you think we get no say in who our AHL should be when colorado did.

We could have Idaho Steelheads as our AHL for example after promoting them. I doubt the AHL wants to realign the divisions again after #32 joins so #32 will be somewhere in the pacific region and it'll be for Seattle not Vegas.

There's as many spots as there needs to be in the Pacific.

The mistake is thinking Boise is a better location than somewhere like Chicago just because it's "closer." Unless you're sending private jets for callups (which is not normal) you want your affiliate in a place with as many nonstop flights to as many NHL cities as possible. Boise can get you nonstop as far east as Minneapolis-St. Paul and DFW, but your prospect is on a connecting flight if they're trying to make it in time for an Eastern Conference game.

Most of the AHL Pacific teams themselves aren't in great locations with regards to airports and transcon call ups. However, the proximity to 50% (or so) of their NHL affiliate's games seems to make it worth it versus playing in the northeast like many used to.

 

[SabresSharks]

Meh. I'm just happy an NHL hockey game will be a 3 hour drive for me instead of 5.

 

[Dirty Old Man]

Prior to the VGK affiliation, the Chicago Wolves saw themselves as a team to compete in the Chicago market with the Blackhawks. Getting people buying tickets and winning games has been the MO of the Chicago Wolves for that reason.

(OT to the OT - in 2000 before airport security became such a huge pain, I once had a long layover in ORD. Got bored, started wandering around outside the terminals, and decided to go to the top of a parking garage for a wider view. The garage had floors coded by Chi team logo, presumably to help you remember where you parked, and the floors were Bears, Bulls, Blackhawks, Cubs, White Sox, and....Wolves. Which I thought was interesting.)