NHL to review Pride tape use by Coyotes’ Travis Dermott as possible violation of ban

[Johnny Rifle]

Are they not allowed free speech? Are you saying that pundits being critical of these players was unwarranted?

It honesty seems like you just didn’t want anyone with a platform to talk about it at all.

Fair and nuanced criticism is certainly welcome, I just despise the hot-take culture and instant validation in the sports media. Social media only fans the flames and forces sports personalities and pundits to have extremist opinions else they get ignored.

There were some journalists that said that the non-participants should be banned from the league. I don’t think that’s fair and honest criticism.

Back to the business aspect, the league is trying to make the most people happy to maximize its profits. I think a reasonable compromise was made that protected the financial interests of the league while at the same time allowed players to participate in social causes.

 

[ArGarBarGar]

Back to the business aspect, the league is trying to make the most people happy to maximize its profits. I think a reasonable compromise was made that protected the financial interests of the league while at the same time allowed players to participate in social causes.

It’s funny how what they were doing prior to last year was making the most people happy until suddenly it wasn’t. Very interesting how that changed. It was probably the media that did it.

If the NHL had just not done any kind of ban and just reiterated that individuals do not necessarily reflect the opinions of the league, then they could have avoided all this.

 

[Yukon Joe]

Can you say with any certainty that there are players who are gay but just not open about it because it is nobody's business.

The thing is - people are almost always pretty open about who their partner is. Almost every team does a "wives and girlfriends" trip, or fundraiser. So you'd have to ask yourself why a gay NHL player would think "it's nobody's business and I'll keep my gay lover private".

But anyways - yes I'll give the NHL credit for realizing they made a mistake and backing down.

I said right from the beginning that the league "didn't think this through", and exactly what I thought would happen, happened. NHL players spoke out against the ban on stick tape, and then Travis Dermott wore a small amount of rainbow stick tape the other night, thus essentially daring the league to try and fine or suspend him.

By the way I rocked rainbow tape at my rec game the other night. One of my team mates said it was "really gay", which I didn't take as a criticism (looking "really gay" is kind of the point), and nobody else said a damn thing.

 

[daver]

The thing is - people are almost always pretty open about who their partner is. Almost every team does a "wives and girlfriends" trip, or fundraiser. So you'd have to ask yourself why a gay NHL player would think "it's nobody's business and I'll keep my gay lover private".

I was referring to someone who is not "openly" gay as in has made a point to make it public, not necessarily that his team wouldn't know. I am certain that the status of every single player (e.g. single, married etc.. ) is not public knowledge so we just don't know.

 

[Yukon Joe]

I was referring to someone who is not "openly" gay as in has made a point to make it public, not necessarily that his team wouldn't know. I am certain that the status of every single player (e.g. single, married etc.. ) is not public knowledge so we just don't know.

It kind-of is, actually.

Look, just as a random sample, I went to the ESPN Hockey homepage. Lets google the names of the first several players that get named and see if we can find out if they have a wife or girlfriend.

NHL on ESPN - Scores, Stats and Highlights

Visit ESPN for NHL live scores, video highlights and latest news. Stream exclusive ESPN+ games and play Fantasy Hockey.

www.espn.com

First name is Patrick Kane. Yup, his girlfriend is Amanda Grahovec, and they have one child together.

Gabriel Landeskog. Yup, his wife is Melissa Shouldice. They were married in 2018 and have 2 kids.

Matthew Poitras. OK this is more of a challenge, as he's only 19, drafted in 2022. I can't find anything online. But again he's only 19.

Connor Bedard. He's only 18 surely - Nope, apparently his girlfriend is Emma Loken.

Shea Theodore. HIs long time girlfriend is Mariana Alston.

And then hell - the next person named is Rick Bowness - and the story is actually all about his wife Judy who had a stroke recently.

 

[MeHateHe]

There is a fair amount of naivete in the stances suggesting 'it's nobody's business' and 'the media blew this out of proportion.'

Athletes, like other performers are paid because they're in the public eye. They're not paid as well as they are because they're good at their jobs; if they were good at their jobs and no one cared about what their jobs were, they'd be making subsistence wages like the rest of us. And yeah, it made Mike Fisher infinitely more interesting to the general public that he was dating (is dating? I don't follow it close enough) Carrie Underwood. Same with PK Subban and Lindsay Vonn. You might say that personal lives are personal, but savvy marketing professionals parlay glamourous relationships into money for these athletes.

If you don't think the reaction would have been different had Subban shown up in public a lot with a skier named Lester Vonn, then I don't know what to tell you.

And yeah, reporters are going to write about stuff that is in the public's eye. They write about things that people are going to have an emotional reaction to. It's been that way since the invention of the printing press. Does the issue of Pride jerseys or rainbow stick tape impact a lot of people? No. Is it a thing people are going to talk about? You better believe it and the numbers don't need to be big for it to get noticed. If only 10 per cent of the population cares about Pride jerseys, that's still 30 million pairs of eyeballs in the US. That's a lot. Is it possible it got attention that was outsized for its important? Maybe, but the topic has been a central point of controversy for decades, and the fact that there are still so many people weeping and wailing and gnashing their teeth over teh GaYs means it's still a topic worth having in the public eye. I don't believe the opinion of an athlete on this topic is more important than the opinion of any other Schmo on the street, but again, they live in the public eye and rightly or wrongly, they're going to get sought out for their thoughts.

 

[daver]

There is a fair amount of naivete in the stances suggesting 'it's nobody's business' and 'the media blew this out of proportion.'

Athletes, like other performers are paid because they're in the public eye. They're not paid as well as they are because they're good at their jobs; if they were good at their jobs and no one cared about what their jobs were, they'd be making subsistence wages like the rest of us. And yeah, it made Mike Fisher infinitely more interesting to the general public that he was dating (is dating? I don't follow it close enough) Carrie Underwood. Same with PK Subban and Lindsay Vonn. You might say that personal lives are personal, but savvy marketing professionals parlay glamourous relationships into money for these athletes.

If you don't think the reaction would have been different had Subban shown up in public a lot with a skier named Lester Vonn, then I don't know what to tell you.

And yeah, reporters are going to write about stuff that is in the public's eye. They write about things that people are going to have an emotional reaction to. It's been that way since the invention of the printing press. Does the issue of Pride jerseys or rainbow stick tape impact a lot of people? No. Is it a thing people are going to talk about? You better believe it and the numbers don't need to be big for it to get noticed. If only 10 per cent of the population cares about Pride jerseys, that's still 30 million pairs of eyeballs in the US. That's a lot. Is it possible it got attention that was outsized for its important? Maybe, but the topic has been a central point of controversy for decades, and the fact that there are still so many people weeping and wailing and gnashing their teeth over teh GaYs means it's still a topic worth having in the public eye. I don't believe the opinion of an athlete on this topic is more important than the opinion of any other Schmo on the street, but again, they live in the public eye and rightly or wrongly, they're going to get sought out for their thoughts.

It's hardly naïve to cite Freedom of Religious beliefs. It is naive to think that feelings trumps all other rights.

Not sure why it is naive to think to think that the media blew it out of proportion. It would be naive to think that someone not wearing a rainbow is actually newsworthy.

 

[MeHateHe]

It's hardly naïve to cite Freedom of Religious beliefs. It is naive to think that feelings trumps all other rights.

That's some strawman. Huff and puff. I never referenced any of that.

Not sure why it is naive to think to think that the media blew it out of proportion. It would be naive to think that someone not wearing a rainbow is actually newsworthy.

In this thread are five pages in a forum in which the bulk of the issue is essentially off limits for discussion. People are interested in this topic. Media report on things that interest people. It's the very definition of newsworthy.

 

[daver]

That's some strawman. Huff and puff. I never referenced any of that.

I thought you were dismissing the idea of Freedom of Religious belief. The players cited their beliefs, the NHL accepted those, as apparently did representatives of the LGBT organizations.

The players were not doing anything discriminatory or hateful. Their beliefs are nobody's business. The issue was it was made everybody's business with mandatory participation.

This has been corrected.

That people do not share those beliefs is not the responsibility of the league (or any business for that matter) to try to correct.

 

[TheLegend]

Not sure you know how social media works. There is no dopamine hit associated with your reasonable and rational comment.

Spending the last 35-40 years involved in social media in different capacities I can assure you that it’s a cesspool that’s probably brought out the worst in people far more than it’s been worth.

 

[daver]

Spending the last 35-40 years involved in social media in different capacities I can assure you that it’s a cesspool that’s probably brought out the worst in people far more than it’s been worth.

The amount of influence given to social media posts is scary these days. They can legitimately make individuals, companies and government take positions that boggle the mind.

For this thread, the opinion of a LGBT organization leader seemingly has no relevance (since noone has acknowledged the multiple times it has been mentioned) over social media posts made by anonymous people with questionable motives and zero accountability.

People want to feel outraged and feel they are right rather than making an effort to try to be right.

 

[ArGarBarGar]

Seems to me the media amplifying the hell out of it to the point it was a major distraction forced the league into making the initial decision.

The question is was it an overreaction? IMNSHO it was. Others may not see it as that way and that’s fine. Disagreement can be a positive thing.

Regardless of what anyone thinks, the league did what they felt was necessary and they had the right to adjust their decision as they see fit.

The media amplifying it by talking about it.

 

[norrisnick]

People want to feel outraged and feel they are right rather than making an effort to try to be right.

Many more people could stand to realize this point.

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

There were some journalists that said that the non-participants should be banned from the league. I don’t think that’s fair and honest criticism.

Could you provide the names of those "journalists", or link to those articles?

 

[TheLegend]

The amount of influence given to social media posts is scary these days. They can legitimately make individuals, companies and government take positions that boggle the mind.

For this thread, the opinion of a LGBT organization leader seemingly has no relevance (since noone has acknowledged the multiple times it has been mentioned) over social media posts made by anonymous people with questionable motives and zero accountability.

People want to feel outraged and feel they are right rather than making an effort to try to be right.

You also have many people these days feigning the outrage simply because..

1) It garners them attention
2) It gives them a thrill
3) In the case of Twitter…. It can be profitable.

And the media plays a big part in the feeding frenzy because they also see what mining for clicks can do for their own bottom lines.

 

[TheLegend]

Going to be interesting how this plays out…

 

[Shwan]

Looks like the Coyotes have already deleted their pride night Tweet.

 

[TheLegend]

Replaced it with this one. Not going to be surprised if the league had something to do with it.

 

[Shwan]

Replaced it with this one. Not going to be surprised if the league had something to do with it.

100%

 

[Crease]

Seems to me that if the league really wanted to support the LGBTQ community they would stop prioritizing the protection of the players who don’t.

 

[TheLegend]

Replaced it with this one. Not going to be surprised if the league had something to do with it.

Update:

Two other tweets featuring interview clips with Travis Dermott were also removed.

Also heard the Pride Night promo was on Facebook and was also taken down.

 

[ArGarBarGar]

You also have many people these days feigning the outrage simply because..

1) It garners them attention
2) It gives them a thrill
3) In the case of Twitter…. It can be profitable.

And the media plays a big part in the feeding frenzy because they also see what mining for clicks can do for their own bottom lines.

These vague declarations are cute but have nothing to do with the NHL choosing to shoot themselves in the foot multiple times on this issue.

People can keep banging that drum all they want but it won’t make it any more true.

 

[Yukon Joe]

Two other tweets featuring interview clips with Travis Dermott were also removed.

Also heard the Pride Night promo was on Facebook and was also taken down.

Interesting.

If you look at the Coyotes website the feature story is about Dermott and the pride tape, and that article does mention that tonight is Pride Night.

But I can't find any other mention of it being Pride Night on the website. It's not mentioned in the pre-game article, nor mentioned on the schedule.

 

[daver]

Seems to me that if the league really wanted to support the LGBTQ community they would stop prioritizing the protection of the players who don’t.

Why would you expect a corporate entity to do anything other than promote their own financial interests?

 

[Voight]

Seems to me that if the league really wanted to support the LGBTQ community they would stop prioritizing the protection of the players who don’t.

The media could also stop demonizing guys you dont want to participate because of religious or other beliefs.