Next Season (OHL-Related COVID-19 Discussion Thread) [Part 4]

[Generalsupdates]

Government states ohl non essential.
Meeting closed.

So you just proved that your original post made no sense and was just complaining about something just for the sake of complaining about something.

At least we're making some ground I guess

 

[windsor7]

So you just proved that your original post made no sense and was just complaining about something just for the sake of complaining about something.

At least we're making some ground I guess

See it however u feel fit.
We all see things "how" we want to!

 

[Saggy]

If border remains closed, I could see the 3 teams relocating before I could see them move forward with 17 Teams.

If the USA based teams decide not to play then I'm pretty sure that would make all their players contracts null and void as they would have not fulfilled on their agreement to "offer development" to their players.

Then what? Who knows......maybe they have a draft of the 3 teams players to all other 17 teams? But then what happens next season.....do they remain with their "new" team or go back.......situation is ugly either way.

Personally, I'd like to see the Ontario Government and the NHL reach into their pockets and do some sort of league subsidy.....not holding my breath on either stepping up though

 

[windsor7]

If border remains closed, I could see the 3 teams relocating before I could see them move forward with 17 Teams.

If the USA based teams decide not to play then I'm pretty sure that would make all their players contracts null and void as they would have not fulfilled on their agreement to "offer development" to their players.

Then what? Who knows......maybe they have a draft of the 3 teams players to all other 17 teams? But then what happens next season.....do they remain with their "new" team or go back.......situation is ugly either way.

Personally, I'd like to see the Ontario Government and the NHL reach into their pockets and do some sort of league subsidy.....not holding my breath on either stepping up though

I agree. Dont hold your breath.

 

[Otto]

Personally, I'd like to see the Ontario Government and the NHL reach into their pockets and do some sort of league subsidy.....not holding my breath on either stepping up though

I've said it before, I'd be shocked if there were any compensation given that involved Ontario providing funds to American teams. Dougie is already on the hot seat as it is... giving funds to the USA would be another nail in the coffin

 

[Mata]

If border remains closed, I could see the 3 teams relocating before I could see them move forward with 17 Teams.

If the USA based teams decide not to play then I'm pretty sure that would make all their players contracts null and void as they would have not fulfilled on their agreement to "offer development" to their players.

Then what? Who knows......maybe they have a draft of the 3 teams players to all other 17 teams? But then what happens next season.....do they remain with their "new" team or go back.......situation is ugly either way.

Personally, I'd like to see the Ontario Government and the NHL reach into their pockets and do some sort of league subsidy.....not holding my breath on either stepping up though

According to the last season ticket holders meeting, moving and relocating Erie is not an option and not even being considered.

 

[OHLTG]

According to the last season ticket holders meeting, moving and relocating Erie is not an option and not even being considered.

If this is the case, then we're down to... a) a 3-team US-based division... b) 17-team season... c) no season at all. Which is the most realistic?

 

[windsor7]

If this is the case, then we're down to... a) a 3-team US-based division... b) 17-team season... c) no season at all. Which is the most realistic?

No season

 

[Otto]

If this is the case, then we're down to... a) a 3-team US-based division... b) 17-team season... c) no season at all. Which is the most realistic?

In order?

C
A












B

 

[OMG67]

More grey areas might pop up more than gta area which would prevent more hockey fir season.

That’s very possible but since those two GTA regions have turned Grey, no other Region has seriously slipped to the point of the discussion of Grey. Even if there were to be “sprawl” from those Regions, it would need to get to Oshawa and Hamilton. I’m not too sure it will spread that badly with the precautions in place.

In the end, we’d just be speculating on the “chance” of that happening. I think the OHL would need to look more at the current status and then the percentage chances of mass spread.

 

[OHLTG]

In order?

C
A












B

I'm leaning...

C


A






















B

But that could be just me.

 

[OMG67]

If border remains closed, I could see the 3 teams relocating before I could see them move forward with 17 Teams.

If the USA based teams decide not to play then I'm pretty sure that would make all their players contracts null and void as they would have not fulfilled on their agreement to "offer development" to their players.

Then what? Who knows......maybe they have a draft of the 3 teams players to all other 17 teams? But then what happens next season.....do they remain with their "new" team or go back.......situation is ugly either way.

Personally, I'd like to see the Ontario Government and the NHL reach into their pockets and do some sort of league subsidy.....not holding my breath on either stepping up though

First, I agree that the teams would choose to relocate all things being equal.

Problem. If there are teams not happy about playing but are somewhat forced to play, how much of that pressure will be applied to the American teams that not only have to lose money playing but lose additional money relocating? The possibility exists, they say, “we play in our city or don’t play.” How can the OHL apply force on that stance? I don’t have an answer for that.

Regarding players, I would think at absolute worse, they would be “loaned” to other teams. There is no way they would do a permanent dispersal draft. That would effectively fold three teams.

My issue with a US based division is they would be precluded from participating in the playoffs because:
A> They’d have to cross the border to play games
B> They’d have more than likely have to quarantine even if the border is open and vice-versa for Canadian teams
C> even if they work out a plan for the regular season and they build in a 14 day quarantine plan for the US based teams to play the playoffs, they’d still need to relocate for the playoffs. They wouldn’t be able to go back and forth.

I also agree with Otto regarding the subsidies. It would be up to PA and MI to subsidize their teams, not Ontario.

In my mind, the US based teams need to relocate if they want to participate in the OHL this season. Simple as that. I really don’t see a way around it that allows them to participate in the playoffs. Ball is really in their court. If they don't want to relocate and the league doesn’t cancel the season, I don’t see any options.

 

[OMG67]

If this is the case, then we're down to... a) a 3-team US-based division... b) 17-team season... c) no season at all. Which is the most realistic?

I think you have to build in some caveats.

Regardless of anything, I would suggest “C” is the most viable result.

I don’t think a 3 team US division is viable under any circumstances because they cannot participate in the playoffs. It makes zero sense. If the reason why they play a 3 team US division is because of a closed border, what will change when the playoffs start? We aren’t talking about a 6 month season. We are looking at a three month season max. Even if the border opens, there is nothing to suggest there won’t be a quarantine period regardless.

The vaccine won’t make a difference in the short term. So, I cannot see regulations changing until at least deep into the summer. That is far after the Memorial Cup.

My assumptions:

D - Season with 20 teams (US based teams relocating)
C - No season
B - 17-19 team season
A - ZERO CHANCE of a US based division

 

[windsor7]

First, I agree that the teams would choose to relocate all things being equal.

Problem. If there are teams not happy about playing but are somewhat forced to play, how much of that pressure will be applied to the American teams that not only have to lose money playing but lose additional money relocating? The possibility exists, they say, “we play in our city or don’t play.” How can the OHL apply force on that stance? I don’t have an answer for that.

Regarding players, I would think at absolute worse, they would be “loaned” to other teams. There is no way they would do a permanent dispersal draft. That would effectively fold three teams.

My issue with a US based division is they would be precluded from participating in the playoffs because:
A> They’d have to cross the border to play games
B> They’d have more than likely have to quarantine even if the border is open and vice-versa for Canadian teams
C> even if they work out a plan for the regular season and they build in a 14 day quarantine plan for the US based teams to play the playoffs, they’d still need to relocate for the playoffs. They wouldn’t be able to go back and forth.

I also agree with Otto regarding the subsidies. It would be up to PA and MI to subsidize their teams, not Ontario.

In my mind, the US based teams need to relocate if they want to participate in the OHL this season. Simple as that. I really don’t see a way around it that allows them to participate in the playoffs. Ball is really in their court. If they don't want to relocate and the league doesn’t cancel the season, I don’t see any options.

I dont see relocating a choice at all.

 

[OHLTG]

Given everything we know so far, and the current trajectories, I'd honestly be surprised if there's a season. Get the vaccines out there, get the numbers down, and start fresh in Sept 2021.

 

[letsgofirebirds1]

My issue with a US based division is they would be precluded from participating in the playoffs because:
A> They’d have to cross the border to play games

I've said it before and I'll say it again...no they don't. No one from anywhere in MI travels through Canada to get to Erie, PA and vice versa (unless they want to take a scenic route that will make the trip longer in both mileage and time.

 

[OMG67]

My issue with a US based division is they would be precluded from participating in the playoffs because:
A> They’d have to cross the border to play games

I've said it before and I'll say it again...no they don't. No one from anywhere in MI travels through Canada to get to Erie, PA and vice versa (unless they want to take a scenic route that will make the trip longer in both mileage and time.

First it is an illegitimate 3 team division. That in itself is ridiculous.

Second, when the season is over, how do they play playoff games?

Think about it.

 

[letsgofirebirds1]

First it is an illegitimate 3 team division. That in itself is ridiculous.

In your opinion. It is my opinion that temporarily relocating 3 entire teams, their staffs, and other infrastructure is ridiculous (and practically impossible). So there’s that.

Second, when the season is over, how do they play playoff games?

They quarantine for 14 days, if that is still in effect 4 months from now, and remain in a bubble environment until they are eliminated.

Think about it.

Think about it.

 

[OMG67]

The COVID based issues will be whether the OHL can reasonably not spread the Virus based on playing hockey games. By all accounts, that seems a reasonably decent objective that can be achieved.

No one should be making decisions based on what may happen sometime in the future in locations we simply cannot predict. If decisions were made like that, everything would be closed and the whole Province would be declared a Grey zone because of what “may happen”

If the OHL can present a set of Standard Operating Procedures to the Province of Ontario that the Province agrees is safe compared to other accepted Standard Operating Procedures in other business sectors, the OHL will be able to operate in all Health Unit Zones that allow for that type of activity (playing hockey in an arena).

What you are talking about has absolutely Zero bearing on whether the OHL plays. The Province has a set of procedures and protocols in place that all businesses adhere to. If and when a Health Unit Zone reaches a threshold that requires modifications to business activity, those modifications become mandated at that point.

As of right now, Mississauga is the only team operating in a Grey Zone. A small handful of teams are in a Red Zone. I would suggest even if 12 teams play a complete full schedule, 4 play 75% of a schedule and 4 play 25% of a schedule, it is still better than no schedule.

I think you seriously need to take about five steps back and look at the big picture with respect to legal comparisons of what is going on and stop automatically bringing your own invalid personal belief to the table. Personal belief is far too general of a stance because that personal belief extends to all business sectors not considered “essential.” That goes far beyond OHL hockey and spills into a myriad of sectors. IF that is your stance, that is fine but it then becomes invalid when talking about the OHL specifically.

 

[OMG67]

Think about it.

OK, so let’s just say Flint gets the one playoff spot that comes out of your US division. IT is April 15 and the border is still closed. Game one is scheduled for April 16th. Do they play round one against London via PlayStation?

Assuming the possibility of the border being open (unlikely base on current Federal announcements that suggest the Virus needs to be under control before the border opens), we cannot assume there will be no quarantine period for travel. So that is another potential hurdle. The HEalth Misister has already suggested certain restrictions will stay in place until a person has been vaccinated and travel was the prime example given.

With respect to vaccinations, young people are last on the list. They won’t jump the queue for Amateur hockey. So that isn’t an answer either. It is likely adults aged 18-50 won’t have access to the vaccine until mid-Summer earliest.

So can you explain what happens in your mind when the Playoffs start and Flint is still in Michigan?

 

[bcspragu]

OK, so let’s just say Flint gets the one playoff spot that comes out of your US division. IT is April 15 and the border is still closed. Game one is scheduled for April 16th. Do they play round one against London via PlayStation?

Assuming the possibility of the border being open (unlikely base on current Federal announcements that suggest the Virus needs to be under control before the border opens), we cannot assume there will be no quarantine period for travel. So that is another potential hurdle. The HEalth Misister has already suggested certain restrictions will stay in place until a person has been vaccinated and travel was the prime example given.

With respect to vaccinations, young people are last on the list. They won’t jump the queue for Amateur hockey. So that isn’t an answer either. It is likely adults aged 18-50 won’t have access to the vaccine until mid-Summer earliest.

So can you explain what happens in your mind when the Playoffs start and Flint is still in Michigan?

Have a quarantine period build into the schedule and have all playoff teams bubble in one city. The regular season is all made up and they can do whatever they want for the most part. The post season is what the OHL needs to figure out. It's much cheaper to move the US teams to Canada for a couple of weeks in the playoffs vs the entire season. Plus the opportunity of changes to border and vaccine can change rapidity by then.

 

[foghorn]

bubble up? most teams have no money after paying coaches and staff up until now so to bubble up im assuming meaning hotels and remaining in one area for duration is just not practical for most ohl teams with no revenue coming in currently from what ive heard a bubble wont work for ohl, the Q received money from their govt which would have covered some costs of bubbling prior to their stoppage. there will be no money to ohl teams from govt in ontario from my understanding.

 

[Billyjack]

Given everything we know so far, and the current trajectories, I'd honestly be surprised if there's a season. Get the vaccines out there, get the numbers down, and start fresh in Sept 2021.

Bingo

 

[OMG67]

Have a quarantine period build into the schedule and have all playoff teams bubble in one city. The regular season is all made up and they can do whatever they want for the most part. The post season is what the OHL needs to figure out. It's much cheaper to move the US teams to Canada for a couple of weeks in the playoffs vs the entire season. Plus the opportunity of changes to border and vaccine can change rapidity by then.

Not really practical.

It would require teams to take a 14 day break prior to playoffs. The regular season is already hardly legitimate, especially if there will be some minor stoppages for a few teams here and there.

To take a 2 week break during a 10 week regular season to bring one team in from the USA for playoffs isn't viable or productive IMO.

 

[analyser]

I would like to know how the 3 American teams move to Canada due to the cost involved. They must have accomodation, meals, laundry facilities and all other related. This will also affect the schooling for these young men as well, they may have streaming but sometime teacher/professor interaction is required.

The idea of some teams getting quarantined due to Covid issues and playing less games does not interest me either. I love watching OHl hockey but an unblanced schedule or team omission does not really really move the needle for me.

I personally believe get people vaccinated and let's prepare for the 21/22 season.