News Around the League Part V: Offseason continues

[Ripshot 43]

I wouldn't trade those 3 picks for the one 3rd rounder let alone even more high picks for Fowler. I like the idea of strengthening our blue line but we need to stay on course with rebuilding through the draft and restocking picks.

 

[NJDevs26]

I'm not a fan of the idea of throwing out an offer sheet.

If we did it, you can rest assure that team will wind up doing it to one of our guys when they hit RFA, if we have anyone worthwhile to throw one at.

Which is exactly why many teams don't do it...the whole mutually assured destruction theory. Not to mention most offer sheets basically amount to nuisance errands that don't really 'work', and if they do that alone's a red flag.

 

[R8Devs]

out of all the offer sheets that happened recently i don't think there's been a retaliatory one thrown back at the other team. san jose offer sheeted hjalmarsson and chicago still traded them niemi in the same offseason.

offersheets are hard to fit because of the compensation and the player has to sign the contract as well it's a two way street. and who knows maybe there were offers that just haven't been signed.

 

[Brodeur]

out of all the offer sheets that happened recently i don't think there's been a retaliatory one thrown back at the other team. san jose offer sheeted hjalmarsson and chicago still traded them niemi in the same offseason.

Niemi was actually a free agent. In part to the Hjalmarsson deal, Chicago walked away from Niemi's arbitration ruling. Niemi signed with San Jose a month later.

The main retaliatory one was St. Louis offer sheeting Steve Bernier after Vancouver offer sheeted David Backes. Then there was the whole Brian Burke challenging Kevin Lowe to a fight after things escalated stemming from the Dustin Penner offer sheet.

Nashville ownership was still pissed at Philadelphia over the Shea Weber offer sheet. Allegedly David Poile had a trade in place to take Vinny Lecavalier off their hands, but Nashville ownership didn't want to bail out the Flyers.

 

[R8Devs]

Niemi was actually a free agent. In part to the Hjalmarsson deal, Chicago walked away from Niemi's arbitration ruling. Niemi signed with San Jose a month later.

The main retaliatory one was St. Louis offer sheeting Steve Bernier after Vancouver offer sheeted David Backes. Then there was the whole Brian Burke challenging Kevin Lowe to a fight after things escalated stemming from the Dustin Penner offer sheet.

Nashville ownership was still pissed at Philadelphia over the Shea Weber offer sheet. Allegedly David Poile had a trade in place to take Vinny Lecavalier off their hands, but Nashville ownership didn't want to bail out the Flyers.

oh yeah for some reason i was thinking of another san jose chicago trade that happened way later(Desjardins and that was a couple years after). I think chicago and sj had two trades after that offersheet.

 

[Stephen Gionta]

I wouldn't trade those 3 picks for the one 3rd rounder let alone even more high picks for Fowler. I like the idea of strengthening our blue line but we need to stay on course with rebuilding through the draft and restocking picks.

I generally agree with this, but theres a big part of me that thinks we need to capitalize on a Stanley Cup in 2018 or 2019 or 2020.

Reason: Greene and Schneider wont stay this good forever. Greene has 2-4 years left of being a top 4 D.
Another Reason: It would be great to win a Cup when McLoed/Zacha/Quenneville/Santini are still on their ELCs.

 

[SpeakingOfTheDevils]

I cannot, for the life of me, understand the narrative that Greene and Schneider are somehow on the verge of declining.

 

[Stephen Gionta]

I cannot, for the life of me, understand the narrative that Greene and Schneider are somehow on the verge of declining.

Schneider won't for a while... But how can you not understand that Greene's decline is in the near future? He turns 34 in October.

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

Andy is more of a question mark for me (but hopefully by the time age hits him, guys like Severson are ready to take over the defense), but I think Cory has plenty of time left. If not, definitely is a good thing we drafted Blackwood...

 

[NJDevils17]

Greene is similar to Schneider in that neither have a lot of miles on their body. Schneider wasn't a starter until two years ago and Greene wasn't a regular until he was like 27.

However, the body simply gets older and worn down regardless with age. Greene will decline sooner rather than later. There needs to be a transition eventually. Severson, Santini and and Jacobs have a lot of work to do but they're the future of the defense.

Schneider I'm not concerned about. He could be like Tim Thomas and play at an older age because he started late(I think Thomas debuted at 31 or 8 years after being drafted). Even then, I have a lot of confidence in Blackwood to be a starter in 4-5 years.

 

[SpeakingOfTheDevils]

Schneider won't for a while... But how can you not understand that Greene's decline is in the near future? He turns 34 in October.

As someone else pointed out for me, Greene wasn't a full-time NHLer until he was 27. He doesn't have the mileage that a "traditional" 34-year-old NHL defenseman would have. Simply listing his age is lazy number-watching.

Greene has played 641 games. For context, Alex Edler has played 620. Marc-Edouard Vlasic has played 737. They're 30 and 29, respectively. Do we hear anything along the lines of imminent declines with those guys?

I understand the argument that the body simply wears down with age. That will definitely play a factor. But Greene is not your typical 34-year-old NHL defenseman. I expect him to be an effective player for us until he's 38 or so.

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

As someone else pointed out for me, Greene wasn't a full-time NHLer until he was 27. He doesn't have the mileage that a "traditional" 34-year-old NHL defenseman would have. Simply listing his age is lazy number-watching.

Greene has played 641 games. For context, Alex Edler has played 620. Marc-Edouard Vlasic has played 737. They're 30 and 29, respectively. Do we hear anything along the lines of imminent declines with those guys?

I understand the argument that the body simply wears down with age. That will definitely play a factor. But Greene is not your typical 34-year-old NHL defenseman. I expect him to be an effective player for us until he's 38 or so.[/QUOTE]

To clarify, I think Andy could have about four good years left. I just think Cory has more than that. But I could be wrong. Sometimes my crystal ball gets foggy.

 

[Ripshot 43]

I generally agree with this, but theres a big part of me that thinks we need to capitalize on a Stanley Cup in 2018 or 2019 or 2020.

Reason: Greene and Schneider wont stay this good forever. Greene has 2-4 years left of being a top 4 D.
Another Reason: It would be great to win a Cup when McLoed/Zacha/Quenneville/Santini are still on their ELCs.

I feel like fans with this line of thinking started to think this way when we traded for Hall. As excited for Hall as I am, I just look at his addition as a jumpstart to our forward issue that was already getting a Zacha infusion this year. IMO we should keep stocking up on the young players and build a strong long term team, otherwise I feel like we would be right back into the same mistakes Lou was making at the end of his reign.

 

[Triumph]

As someone else pointed out for me, Greene wasn't a full-time NHLer until he was 27. He doesn't have the mileage that a "traditional" 34-year-old NHL defenseman would have. Simply listing his age is lazy number-watching.

Greene has played 641 games. For context, Alex Edler has played 620. Marc-Edouard Vlasic has played 737. They're 30 and 29, respectively. Do we hear anything along the lines of imminent declines with those guys?

I understand the argument that the body simply wears down with age. That will definitely play a factor. But Greene is not your typical 34-year-old NHL defenseman. I expect him to be an effective player for us until he's 38 or so.

Yes, I expect Edler and Vlasic to decline. Not Vlasic so much - he's a very, very good player and smart too, but Edler? Sure. I also expect Greene to decline as well. He's not immune to aging. Haven't we watched enough Devils decline over the last few seasons to be able to say that yeah, Greene is not immune to the laws of time?

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

With Hall added to the team, I think we should at least be trying to be a playoff team this season. Personally, I believe this team can get back into the playoffs starting this year. One thing I really liked about Hall's NHL Network video was he did talk about the playoffs in relation to NJ. I had the impression that he believes that with Cory in net and him at forward the team can get to the playoffs. I like the way he thinks if that's true.

 

[Ripshot 43]

With Hall added to the team, I think we should at least be trying to be a playoff team this season. Personally, I believe this team can get back into the playoffs starting this year. One thing I really liked about Hall's NHL Network video was he did talk about the playoffs in relation to NJ. I had the impression that he believes that with Cory in net and him at forward the team can get to the playoffs. I like the way he thinks if that's true.

It's all going to depend on our defense. With our forwards we are adding at least Hall, Zacha and Fiddler while subtracting a horrible 4th line. Cory will be who we all know him to be. If the D can be somewhat competent this team will be competitive all year.

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

It's all going to depend on our defense. With our forwards we are adding at least Hall, Zacha and Fiddler while subtracting a horrible 4th line. Cory will be who we all know him to be. If the D can be somewhat competent this team will be competitive all year.

Defense is probably the biggest question mark but teams like Detroit last year made the playoffs with what I regard as a weaker defense than what the Devils have going into this year. If the team plays with a strong defensive structure, I believe we'll be okay. Andy I don't worry about, Damon I have a sense will have a good season especially if he is paired with Andy, and I think Lovejoy will be competent in a second pairing, stay-at-home role. Everybody else I'll have to see how they do, but overall our defense is going to certainly have to be "by committee" a bit. And Captain Andy is going to have to keep the ship steady on defense again this season. You are right, though, that defense is where I'd most like to see Shero shore up the roster at this point. I wonder if he will make some sort of shrewd signing or something to get another defenseman before the season starts. Will be interesting to see, but this off-season I'm much more excited than I was this time last year.

 

[Stephen Gionta]

As someone else pointed out for me, Greene wasn't a full-time NHLer until he was 27. He doesn't have the mileage that a "traditional" 34-year-old NHL defenseman would have. Simply listing his age is lazy number-watching.

Greene has played 641 games. For context, Alex Edler has played 620. Marc-Edouard Vlasic has played 737. They're 30 and 29, respectively. Do we hear anything along the lines of imminent declines with those guys?

I understand the argument that the body simply wears down with age. That will definitely play a factor. But Greene is not your typical 34-year-old NHL defenseman. I expect him to be an effective player for us until he's 38 or so.

Buddy, just because he didn't start becoming a NHL regular until 27, doesn't mean you can just assume that he will be effective until 38. 641 NHL games is A LOT of NHL games. Greene is a 34 year old hockey player. Just because he didn't start playing a lot until he was 27 that doesn't mean you can ignore the fact that he's about to turn 34 years old. Some players (like Jagr) don't really get as effected with age. Some do. We have ZERO idea what will happen with Andy.



And in response to someone talking about the end of Lou's reign.. Trying to add Cam Fowler or Jacob Trouba are two different stories then signing guys like Clowe Ryder Tallinder etc.

 

[OmNomNom]

i just don't agree with the way you propose going about things. offer sheets are pipe dreams.

also, isn't word on the street that trouba is way overrated?

lastly, sure we should be gunning for the cup. but i don't wanna expend prospects for players so crazily that way. that's how the rangers got into the position they're in now. what'd it get them?

nothing

 

[Stephen Gionta]

i just don't agree with the way you propose going about things. offer sheets are pipe dreams.

also, isn't word on the street that trouba is way overrated?

lastly, sure we should be gunning for the cup. but i don't wanna expend prospects for players so crazily that way. that's how the rangers got into the position they're in now. what'd it get them?

nothing

What got the Rangers into the position they're in now was multiple things:

1. Signing Girardi to a ridiculous contract extension.
2. Signing M. Staal to a ridiculous contract extension.
3. Trading Callahan, a 1st, and a 2nd for 1.25 seasons of a 39 year old St. Louis
4. Trading Duclair, Moore, a 1st and a 2nd for 1.25 seasons of Yandle when they knew resigning him would be hard with their cap situation


Trading for Cam Fowler, a 24 year old with 2 years left on his contract is different.
Also, we have the cap space to resign him when his deal expires. The Devils NEED any LHD depth they can get. Cuz after Greene, we don't really have anyone coming through the system.

Offersheeting Trouba sure wouldn't bode well for us in the future when trying to make a deal with Winnipeg, but adding a 22 year old Trouba would be HUGE for this team.

 

[Burner Account]

It's all going to depend on our defense. With our forwards we are adding at least Hall, Zacha and Fiddler while subtracting a horrible 4th line. Cory will be who we all know him to be. If the D can be somewhat competent this team will be competitive all year.

I don't think Zacha is a shoe-in.

 

[Stephen Gionta]

I don't think Zacha is a shoe-in.

To make the roster? or to be a key contributor?

I think Zacha DEFINITELY doesn't go back to junior.

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

I'm over 90% sure Zacha will be in the NHL this year. I still remember Hynes' interview on that stream the Devils had at the draft where he spoke about Zacha spending a year in juniors and then hopefully being ready for the NHL. I have the impression that both Shero and Hynes are penciling him into the roster, and Zacha looked NHL ready during the Toronto game. He was one of the most noticeable players on the ice.

 

[Devilsgrl35]

Is Zacha eligible for the 9 games at the start of the year?

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

Is Zacha eligible for the 9 games at the start of the year?

To my knowledge, yes.