New: 3rd Class-Action lawsuit (CHL/NHL/AHL)

[Juniorhockeyguru]

More ex CHL flops that have no chance at a hockey career, especially Kobe Mohr, and are just trying to collect as much as possible to make up for it.

 

[gstommylee]

More ex CHL flops that have no chance at a hockey career, especially Kobe Mohr, and are just trying to collect as much as possible to make up for it.

if the player is terrible as a CHL player what makes he think he has a shot at ECHL or the AHL?

 

[Juniorhockeyguru]

if the player is terrible as a CHL player what makes he think he has a shot at ECHL or the AHL?

Mohr wasn't terrible, but was a 1st round Bantam pick and really didn't do anything in 5 years in the dub.

 

[gstommylee]

Mohr wasn't terrible, but was a 1st round Bantam pick and really didn't do anything in 5 years in the dub.

by i mean terrible as in not good enough for ECHL/AHL/NHL. WHy is it alway these ex disgruntle players trying to sue for the moon. CHL makes up half the NHL, if there was such an seriously legitimate issue why in all these years someone finally decides to challenge it...

If i was a WHL player (earily 00's for me) i would never had made it to the ECHL/AHL/NHL but would i have sued all of the leagues cause i never made it outside the CHL. No I would be grateful to the league/team/host family and use the free college to my advantage. I am 5'8 and i would been too short by the standard at the time to have a pro hockey career.

 

[UsernameWasTaken]

and i recognize that as being a fair claim as well as the travel times. But the issue is what has this to go to do with the ECHL and the AHL. like they all agree to in a plot to screw the CHL players.

Well the CHL contract doesn't end until A) team terminates it or he ages out which happens to be 20. they are saying the player after he turns 18 should be legally allowed to break his legally signed agreemnt contract to play in ECHL or the AHL.

I think contracts have release causes with them which they are claiming is ridicilous (500k) they also claim that NHL paying the training cost of a player they drafted is proving they are intentionally trying to screw the CHL player. Training fee payment is perfectly legal and happens in soccer.

Again, the caveat being that i haven't seen all the inter-league agreements in play...but a CHL player can't just turn 18, exit the league, and then sign a contract with an ECHL or AHL team.

By playing in the CHL, a player ends up with his playing options confined for a relatively lengthy period of time. And compensation for playing in the league is minimal - it involves room/board/training that seems necessary given a player's status. There's also the so-called "scholarship" which is heavily dependent on the length of time the player spends in the league (or otherwise negotiates) and can be cancelled if the player doesn't meet specific conditions once he leaves the league.

 

[Chootoi]

Unless I'm missing something (and I usually am), it seems like they could fix all of this by just raising the draft age to 19. Then as a minor you have a CHL contract for 3 years (16, 17, 18) then at 19 you are free to pursue other options. Most of these marginal players would probably be back as 19s and 20s anyway, but they would at least have the option. You could have separate contracts for overagers which would be 19's and 20's instead of just 20's like it is now.

CHL teams would have superstar talents for an extra year and NHL teams could send prospects to the ECHL or AHL a year earlier at 19 instead of 20. Seems like it would be good for everyone.

 

[Juniorhockeyguru]

Either way, it's garbage and won't win. Especially to do it now? What a dick move.

 

[LeHab]

Either way, it's garbage and won't win. Especially to do it now? What a dick move.

Some lawyers are likely hoping for a settlement for a quick cash grab.

Also a CHL Union has been in talks for a while: Canadian Hockey League Players' Association - Wikipedia

Certification efforts[edit]
The CHLPA accused the WHL's Alberta teams of disrupting unionization meetings and cutting organizing players' ice time as punishment.[8] Additionally, it sent letters to all 60 teams threatening them with lawsuits over what it described as running "sweatshops" and for the "blatant disregard for the bare minimum working standards that have been set for employees.".[11] The union then filed legal claims against the Halifax Mooseheads in Nova Scotia, promising it would be "the first of many".[12]
The CHL, meanwhile, received complaints from players about late-night calls from union representatives from blocked numbers. Stating it was acting for the players' security, the league hired private investigators to try and identify who Derek Clarke is.[13] The CHLPA's organization efforts were thrown into disarray at the start of November 2012 when questions surfaced as to whether Clarke is actually Randy Gumbley, a man twice convicted of defrauding junior hockey players.[14] In a television interview, Laraque identified a photograph of Gumbley as being Derek Clarke, but denied they were the same person in a subsequent interview.[15] The CHLPA denied that Randy Gumbley is involved with the association, but rather his brother Glenn is. The Sports Network's Dave Naylor, meanwhile, claimed he had spoken to more than one person calling themselves Derek Clarke.[16]
The CHLPA had already received the required support from the players on the QMJHL's Sherbrooke Phoenix and had scheduled a vote with the players on the Cape Breton Screaming Eagles.[17] However, the union's ratification efforts collapsed after the confusion over Clarke's identity was revealed. The vote in Cape Breton was cancelled after its application was withdrawn.[18] At the same time, legal representatives for the CHLPA in Alberta and Quebec cut ties,[19] and the player behind the action against the Halifax Mooseheads withdrew his complaint.[20] With the CHLPA's future left in doubt, Georges Laraque announced on November 1 that he would step down as executive director once the association could be transitioned into an established organization.[21]
Following the demise of the CHLPA effort, Canada's largest private sector union, Unifor, began to press for unionization of junior players in 2014. Though the union initially denied Gumbley was involved, the Toronto Star revealed evidence that it was not Randy Gumbley but rather Glenn Gumbley who was central to Unifor's efforts to certify the Quebec League's players. Glenn Gumbley was paying QMJHL alumni to try and convince current players to sign union cards.[22] Also in 2014, a trio of lawsuits were filed by some former players, and seeking class action status, against the CHL and its three constituent leagues over claims of being owed back pay, vacation pay and other benefits totaling nearly $300 million.[23] Glenn Gumbley also filed a $100,000 defamation lawsuit against the CHL, alleging that the league had issued a "'malicious' press release" that "strategically and intentionally used (Gumbley’s) name ... in an attempt to find the perfect scapegoat to demonize in order to deflect the negative press surrounding their legal matters".[24] As of February 2015, no claims in any of the lawsuits had been proven in court.
On August 22, 2016, The London Free Press reported that the London Knights organization of the Ontario Hockey League had become aware of a CHLPA social media campaign that focused on suspected fraudulent hockey jersey and memorabilia sales by the Knights through the Canadian Hockey League's auction website.[25] Almost 6 months later to the day, the Toronto Star, after a lengthy investigation, reported several other suspected fraudulent jerseys were sold to unsuspecting fans.[26]
Looking to protect the rights of hockey players throughout Canada, Glenn Gumbley called for the resignation of Hockey Newfoundland President, Jack Lee, due to numerous conflicts of interest, including; owning a private, for-profit, hockey business organization that is in direct conflict with the Presidency of Newfoundland's minor hockey association.[27]
In March 2017, the CHLPA become a member of the World Association of Ice Hockey Players' Union.[28]

What a mess.

 

[BadgerBruce]

Either way, it's garbage and won't win. Especially to do it now? What a dick move.

They had to do it now. Court approval of the minimum wage class action settlement was scheduled and they needed to pursue intervenor status and make their position clear to the court.

 

[LadyStanley]

18+ year old players do have an option other than NHL/AHL/ECHL: Europe (and ROW).

Austin Mathews

Auston Matthews Hockey Stats and Profile at hockeydb.com

With a birthday two days after cut off, he played a year in Switzerland at age 18 before being drafted in NHL.

 

[voyageur]

I think the reason why ECHL/AHL/NHL is involved is cause they have $$$ they are after money. Its one of those pay us and it'll go away lawsuit since its the damage amount is so bloody ridiculously high.

I think it has to do with freedom. If you want to earn money as an 18 year old CHL drafted player, you have to go overseas if you don't make the NHL. That's unfair competition with the European leagues, and the USHL players who can bypass college. If the CHL became an 18 and under league it would have a much different complexion. I think it would be good for the NHL teams to be able to bring drafted players straight into their organization. It would increase the overall talent of the development leagues, which the A and ECHL are supposed to be. Might recruit more players to the U.S college route as well, and to a lesser extent Canadian university hockey.

 

[surixon]

Players don't have to go the CHL route. They can go tier 2 junior and sign pro deals at 18 or they can go to the NCAA and sign pro deals whenever.

If you go the CHL route you know what your contract entails. If you don't like that deal then pursue a different route.

 

[voyageur]

Players don't have to go the CHL route. They can go tier 2 junior and sign pro deals at 18 or they can go to the NCAA and sign pro deals whenever.

If you go the CHL route you know what your contract entails. If you don't like that deal then pursue a different route.

Does that seem like a competitive disadvantage? Going to a lower league or having to leave your country, go to college, only to drop out after a year to become a pro. I think the CHL monolopy is about to end. There are a lot of lawsuits being thrown its way.

 

[surixon]

Does that seem like a competitive disadvantage? Going to a lower league or having to leave your country, go to college, only to drop out after a year to become a pro. I think the CHL monolopy is about to end. There are a lot of lawsuits being thrown its way.

Well the CHL doesn't exactly make a lot of cash so perhaps some of these players will need to be careful what they wish for. They may end up sewering the league and then have even more limited options if a bunch of teams fold.

Simple fact of the matter the CHL invests significant cash into developing these players at 16 and 17 to get some competitive payoff when they are 18 and 19.

How many CHL players are actually good prior to age 18? Likely only the players with NHL prospects.

 

[Yukon Joe]

Some lawyers are likely hoping for a settlement for a quick cash grab.

As a fellow law-talker, I saw a few posts like this. I believe the proper response is "don't hate the player, hate the game".

Remember class action lawyers only get paid if they win or negotiate a settlement - their clients pay them nothing. If they do this it is because it works.

 

[gstommylee]

Does that seem like a competitive disadvantage? Going to a lower league or having to leave your country, go to college, only to drop out after a year to become a pro. I think the CHL monolopy is about to end. There are a lot of lawsuits being thrown its way.

What monopoly you act the only choice for a Canadian or a American player is CHL like no other league exist. They DO NOT HAVE TO play or continue to play in the CHL after they turn 18 or have to play in the ECHL/NHL/AHL. This lawsuit acts like the only option for CHL player is continue to play in the CHL until they are 20. Again European hockey is a thing.

Not everyone that plays in the NHL actually went to the CHL some played in other US/canada leagues others played in a Europe league. They played in the CHL cause they chose to be.

Oh and for CHL for players you really do have to leave your home region and/or country to play in the CHL. So the idea they have to travel to a European country to play when you technically already have to for some players.

 

[gstommylee]

Also in early days of MLS, they dealt with a smilar lawsuit over restrictions of player movement the person/group lost cause there are alternates to Soccer than MLS. Like there are alternates pro leagues than just NHL/AHL/ECHL.

To add. about the age 20 requirement issue for AHL etc, I think the reason why such a restriction is in place has to do with are you mature physically, emotionally and mentally enough as a person to handle players that are older and stronger/bigger than you.

Even if this person suing was drafted by a NHL player is he mature enough to handle players that are way older than him and possible bigger in weight and size. If he isn't mature enough to be on a NHL roster why would he necessary be mature enough a ECHL or a AHL roster.

 

[GordonGraham]

Looks like they have a sure fire case, anything to kill the CHL model is good news

 

[gstommylee]

Looks like they have a sure fire case, anything to kill the CHL model is good news

So kill the entire league to the point where the players end up getting NOTHING. How is that a benefit to the CHL players? To kill the entire league and the 3 jr major leagues.

Btw no way in hell they are getting 825m (or what ever the amount was ) in damages or 50k per player + other damages per year. The issue is about restrictions after 18 and getting low allowances from the team. Basically he wants higher pay from team and free to do what ever he wants after turning 18. Btw he's a CHL player he well knows what he was getting benefits from the team and probably knew well enough what restrictions were. If he want go directly to AHl or ECHL if not drafted by the NHL then why did he join the CHL in the first place... So he wants the players to get paid money guess what good bye benefits..

The guy that is suing is whining that he wasn't good enough to make the NHL and crying foul that he is getting screwed cause he wasn't good enough if he wasn't good enough at the NHL why would he be good enough at the AHL or ECHL level.

 

[LeHab]

As a fellow law-talker, I saw a few posts like this. I believe the proper response is "don't hate the player, hate the game".

Remember class action lawyers only get paid if they win or negotiate a settlement - their clients pay them nothing. If they do this it is because it works.

The contingency fee is why I believe these lawyers would want a quick settlement instead of a lengthy trial and possibly earn nothing. Unless they truly believe the case is a slam dunk.

 

[gstommylee]

The contingency fee is why I believe these lawyers would want a quick settlement instead of a lengthy trial and possibly earn nothing. Unless they truly believe the case is a slam dunk.

Lengthy and expensive trail. The last thing is i don't think the party suing wants this to be dragged out in courts for years and years. I mean you are suing leagues that happens to have a whole lot of money to actually fit this lawsuit.

If this is dragged out and the suing party loses. The defendants can ask that the lawyer fees be paid by the group suing.

To be honest i don't think they have a 100% slam dunk case, i am not sure if they really have a case at all for a few reasons one the argument they are making is there is no other league that exists that the CHL players can go to if they don't get into the NHL and make the team. Defense can argue that European hockey exists and that there were other options than CHL that didn't have the age restrictions to the echl/AHL that the players knew about the restrictions per contract he signed.

2nd thing is the money issue, CHL could argue that they are getting benefits that worth more than what they could possible make if they were getting minimal wage.

 

[Juniorhockeyguru]

Looks like they have a sure fire case, anything to kill the CHL model is good news

lol wow bud, completely clueless. Why is it oh wise one, that in all these lawsuits, it's always just the players that didn't have a chance for a pro career?

 

[gstommylee]

lol wow bud, completely clueless. Why is it oh wise one, that in all these lawsuits, it's always just the players that didn't have a chance for a pro career?

it was just an observation i made between this lawsuit and the minimal wage lawsuit that was settled. Both involved CHL players that never made it but never involved players that actually made it to the NHL. So why isn't other former CHL players suing that got drafted but had to wait until 20 to move up to the AHL for development. Its just weird one thing you would have a whole lot more people filing the lawsuit regarding both cases. Its very very very hard for a drafted 18/19 year old to make it on the NHL roster right away so you would think it would also be those that would sue over the movement restriction.

Even if AHL/NHl/CHL/ECHL end up losing the case the judge isn't going to award 825m in damages. He'll make a fair determine on what they players should be had made based on what the Canadian laws says as it relates to minors and the benefits they are getting as a CHL player. No way a minor under 18 could even make 50k a year. THen they need to consider the age range too since it involves minors between 15-17 and adults between 18-20/21 if player makes it as a overage player.

 

[alko]

what a WHL players gets while playing for the WHL.

Standard Player Agreement – WHL Prospects

Is there any "non standard" player agreement?

 

[gstommylee]

Is there any "non standard" player agreement?

Not that i am aware of