News Article: Nazem Kadri: Wrongly Undervalued In Leafs Nation

[RLF]

Sadly, Carlyle is a terrible coach. He has been for several years, dating back to his final seasons in Anaheim. His systems are ancient in this NHL, and the pathetic possession numbers of his teams prove that.

Kadri was the 3rd line center, however he was the best center on the team, by a wide margin. He earned 1st line duty that season, but was never rewarded for it. Have you ever seen a 3rd line center score at a near point per game rate, and not be promoted? Carlyle refused to give him an opportunity shouldering the biggest minutes in all situations, which honestly made no sense whatsoever.

There's no doubt that he should be the first line center this year. Bozak and Holland are interchangeable at 2c and 3c. But this is finally Kadri's year to tackle the heaviest workload. I think he's ready.

Sorry, I still disagree on Carlisle being a horrible coach. Horrible coaches don't tend to be in the league for that long or win cups. The coaching is also the first thing fans blame when things go wrong or they feel a certain player deserves more time and responsibility. Only a few tend to look at the players it seems. First it was Wilson's fault, then Carlisle, then Horacek didn't give him a chance. Makes you wonder why 3 different coaches had trouble giving Naz the reigns. No?

As for the bolded, it was his best year for sure, it was also when he received the ever popular "sheltered" minutes and he capitalized for 1(1/2) season. He was given opportunity ever since that season and has done nothing with it. He was even given more ice-time as the season went on in the 12/13 season and has averaged 1 1/2 mnutes more per game over the past two seasons than he got in 2012/13. He had a golden opportunity when Bozak was hurt, but he looked lost and out of place most nights. Holland out played him during that time.

He has been given opportunity, but with more icetime, more weaknesses showed in his game. He has been reprimanded for being late to practice and it was made clear that there has been other issues which is why the team suspension was incurred. More minutes and responsibility meant lower ppg production, exposed defensive deficiencies, and he continued with off-ice issues obviously. Yet it's all coaching issues?

I think Nazen is the more talented centre, but Carlisle is not to blame with Nazem's lack of focus, dedication or whatever the issues are. He needs to learn and earn it, plus show his dedication (something he has admitted has been lacking). Shanny even said he needs to grow up. Is that also the coaches fault?

To this point, there has been a lot to show that Naz hasn't "got it" yet, and it's time people(fans) start making Naz responsible and stop blaming coaches, management etc. for his lack of growth since 12/13.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Sorry, I still disagree on Carlisle being a horrible coach. Horrible coaches don't tend to be in the league for that long or win cups. The coaching is also the first thing fans blame when things go wrong or they feel a certain player deserves more time and responsibility. Only a few tend to look at the players it seems. First it was Wilson's fault, then Carlisle, then Horacek didn't give him a chance. Makes you wonder why 3 different coaches had trouble giving Naz the reigns. No?

As for the bolded, it was his best year for sure, it was also when he received the ever popular "sheltered" minutes and he capitalized for 1(1/2) season. He was given opportunity ever since that season and has done nothing with it. He was even given more ice-time as the season went on in the 12/13 season and has averaged 1 1/2 mnutes more per game over the past two seasons than he got in 2012/13. He had a golden opportunity when Bozak was hurt, but he looked lost and out of place most nights. Holland out played him during that time.

He has been given opportunity, but with more icetime, more weaknesses showed in his game. He has been reprimanded for being late to practice and it was made clear that there has been other issues which is why the team suspension was incurred. More minutes and responsibility meant lower ppg production, exposed defensive deficiencies, and he continued with off-ice issues obviously. Yet it's all coaching issues?

I think Nazen is the more talented centre, but Carlisle is not to blame with Nazem's lack of focus, dedication or whatever the issues are. He needs to learn and earn it, plus show his dedication (something he has admitted has been lacking). Shanny even said he needs to grow up. Is that also the coaches fault?

To this point, there has been a lot to show that Naz hasn't "got it" yet, and it's time people(fans) start making Naz responsible and stop blaming coaches, management etc. for his lack of growth since 12/13.

The flip side to this is that if Naz thrives this year under Babcock then maybe it's time people consider the possibility that previous coaches have dropped the ball when it comes to Naz.

 

[RLF]

The flip side to this is that if Naz thrives this year under Babcock then maybe it's time people consider the possibility that previous coaches have dropped the ball when it comes to Naz.

For sure, and I hope he does thrive. It may also mean that he has started to "get it". That what Shanny has said and did, is clicking. A 1 year show me deal my have also helped get the point across.
He is a talented guy, but I don't believe it is all everyone else fault when there is so much that has shown there are issues with Naz himself, and this goes back to the AHL.

 

[Menzinger]

The flip side to this is that if Naz thrives this year under Babcock then maybe it's time people consider the possibility that previous coaches have dropped the ball when it comes to Naz.

Pretty telling that neither Carlyle or Wilson are employed by NHL clubs.

 

[Daisy Jane]

Sorry, I still disagree on Carlisle being a horrible coach. Horrible coaches don't tend to be in the league for that long or win cups. The coaching is also the first thing fans blame when things go wrong or they feel a certain player deserves more time and responsibility. Only a few tend to look at the players it seems. First it was Wilson's fault, then Carlisle, then Horacek didn't give him a chance. Makes you wonder why 3 different coaches had trouble giving Naz the reigns. No?

While I am ultimately on your side. there are just a few things I need to disagree with you here.

I don't think Wilson was a bad coach either (I think he was just a victim of not having goal tending. like. at all. his attitude didn't help any, and regardless of why he is not working in the league (I think as a whole, the league wants to start tapping into newer younger, coaches.

Carlyle while he was here. and I don't beat the statistical drum as loudly as others - outside the 5+ game winning streaks they put on - they have always, always been worse overall than Buffalo and Edmonton . And that's with better players, and better goaltending for the most part. I will always put a massive amount of blame on the player - but Carlyle never adjusted really. I don't think he's one of the best coaches out there. (and in this league everyone should default be "good")


with that being said:
Exactly to your bolded point.

it was his best year for sure, it was also when he received the ever popular "sheltered" minutes and he capitalized for 1(1/2) season. He was given opportunity ever since that season and has done nothing with it. He was even given more ice-time as the season went on in the 12/13 season and has averaged 1 1/2 mnutes more per game over the past two seasons than he got in 2012/13. He had a golden opportunity when Bozak was hurt, but he looked lost and out of place most nights. Holland out played him during that time.

that was always my argument too. it's not like he didn't have chances (especially with Bozak being hurt as well). I don't think he did the best he could with it. that's just my opinion. I do think the suspensions hurt his confidence a bit.

and this (because I know someone will do this) - does not mean that because Holland played better during that time - Holland >> Kadri, because that's not the case. It's obvious as rain that Kadri has the better talent.

he did have Clarkson to lug around, so I'd give everyone that mulligan. the man was bad.

He has been given opportunity, but with more icetime, more weaknesses showed in his game. He has been reprimanded for being late to practice and it was made clear that there has been other issues which is why the team suspension was incurred. More minutes and responsibility meant lower ppg production, exposed defensive deficiencies, and he continued with off-ice issues obviously. Yet it's all coaching issues?

yup, yup, yup. I agree with you here.

I think Nazen is the more talented centre, but Carlisle is not to blame with Nazem's lack of focus, dedication or whatever the issues are. He needs to learn and earn it, plus show his dedication (something he has admitted has been lacking). Shanny even said he needs to grow up. Is that also the coaches fault?

To this point, there has been a lot to show that Naz hasn't "got it" yet, and it's time people(fans) start making Naz responsible and stop blaming coaches, management etc. for his lack of growth since 12/13.

agreed. which - is why I think for what ALL Naz brings, can bring, and hopefully can bring needs to click in this season. which is something, I think management (obviously, clearly wants him to do because they all like him and they want him around).

 

[RLF]

Pretty telling that neither Carlyle or Wilson are employed by NHL clubs.

People do realize that Carlyle actually had a winning record as the Leafs head coach right? A winning record on a dysfunctional team...that he didn't build. 21-16-3 when he got fired and in a payoff spot still. Are fans suggesting it was all because of the players we were winning? Then why didn't we go on a tear after he was fired? We got worse and the management deemed it a players issue an shipped out our leading scorer.

The telling part is what management has done, and tried to do, with the cast of characters that Carlyle had to work with.

My point was that it isn't all coaching problems with Naz.

I can't wait for the "Babcock sucks" if Bozak is still the #1 centre 1/2 way through the season.

 

[RLF]

While I am ultimately on your side. there are just a few things I need to disagree with you here.

I don't think Wilson was a bad coach either (I think he was just a victim of not having goal tending. like. at all. his attitude didn't help any, and regardless of why he is not working in the league (I think as a whole, the league wants to start tapping into newer younger, coaches.

Carlyle while he was here. and I don't beat the statistical drum as loudly as others - outside the 5+ game winning streaks they put on - they have always, always been worse overall than Buffalo and Edmonton . And that's with better players, and better goaltending for the most part. I will always put a massive amount of blame on the player - but Carlyle never adjusted really. I don't think he's one of the best coaches out there. (and in this league everyone should default be "good")


with that being said:
Exactly to your bolded point.



that was always my argument too. it's not like he didn't have chances (especially with Bozak being hurt as well). I don't think he did the best he could with it. that's just my opinion. I do think the suspensions hurt his confidence a bit.

and this (because I know someone will do this) - does not mean that because Holland played better during that time - Holland >> Kadri, because that's not the case. It's obvious as rain that Kadri has the better talent.

he did have Clarkson to lug around, so I'd give everyone that mulligan. the man was bad.



yup, yup, yup. I agree with you here.



agreed. which - is why I think for what ALL Naz brings, can bring, and hopefully can bring needs to click in this season. which is something, I think management (obviously, clearly wants him to do because they all like him and they want him around).

I did not like Wilson and I am not suggesting Carlyle was a great coach. I am just trying to point out that there are more issues with Naz, then coaching. Otherwise, yes, I think we view it very similarly

 

[ULF_55]

I predict 68 points based on 48 games from the lock-out season to the first 32 games of the following season.

This seems reasonable.

Date|Game|Goals|Assists|Points|Acmltd|PPG|Game Cnt|16 GTs
19-Jan-13|Jan 19 '13 TOR @ MTL|1|0|1|1|1|1|
21-Jan-13|Jan 21 '13 BUF @ TOR|1|0|1|2|1|2|
23-Jan-13|Jan 23 '13 TOR @ PIT|0|1|1|3|1|3|
24-Jan-13|Jan 24 '13 NYI @ TOR|1|1|2|5|1.25|4|
26-Jan-13|Jan 26 '13 TOR @ NYR|0|0|0|5|1|5|
29-Jan-13|Jan 29 '13 TOR @ BUF|0|1|1|6|1|6|
31-Jan-13|Jan 31 '13 WSH @ TOR|0|1|1|7|1|7|
02-Feb-13|Feb 2 '13 BOS @ TOR|0|0|0|7|0.88|8|
04-Feb-13|Feb 4 '13 CAR @ TOR|0|1|1|8|0.89|9|
05-Feb-13|Feb 5 '13 TOR @ WSH|0|0|0|8|0.8|10|
07-Feb-13|Feb 7 '13 TOR @ WPG|0|1|1|9|0.82|11|
09-Feb-13|Feb 9 '13 TOR @ MTL|0|0|0|9|0.75|12|
11-Feb-13|Feb 11 '13 PHI @ TOR|0|2|2|11|0.85|13|
14-Feb-13|Feb 14 '13 TOR @ CAR|1|0|1|12|0.86|14|
16-Feb-13|Feb 16 '13 OTT @ TOR|0|0|0|12|0.8|15|
18-Feb-13|Feb 18 '13 TOR @ FLA|1|1|2|14|0.88|16|
| 16 Game Total |5|9|14||0.88||14
19-Feb-13|Feb 19 '13 TOR @ TBL|0|0|0|14|0.82|17|
21-Feb-13|Feb 21 '13 BUF @ TOR|0|0|0|14|0.78|18|
23-Feb-13|Feb 23 '13 TOR @ OTT|0|1|1|15|0.79|19|
25-Feb-13|Feb 25 '13 TOR @ PHI|0|2|2|17|0.85|20|
27-Feb-13|Feb 27 '13 MTL @ TOR|0|1|1|18|0.86|21|
28-Feb-13|Feb 28 '13 TOR @ NYI|3|0|3|21|0.95|22|
04-Mar-13|Mar 4 '13 NJD @ TOR|1|1|2|23|1|23|
06-Mar-13|Mar 6 '13 OTT @ TOR*|1|0|1|24|1|24|
07-Mar-13|Mar 7 '13 TOR @ BOS|1|0|1|25|1|25|
09-Mar-13|Mar 9 '13 PIT @ TOR|0|0|0|25|0.96|26|
12-Mar-13|Mar 12 '13 TOR @ WPG|0|0|0|25|0.93|27|
14-Mar-13|Mar 14 '13 PIT @ TOR|0|0|0|25|0.89|28|
16-Mar-13|Mar 16 '13 WPG @ TOR|0|2|2|27|0.93|29|
20-Mar-13|Mar 20 '13 TBL @ TOR|0|3|3|30|1|30|
21-Mar-13|Mar 21 '13 TOR @ BUF|2|1|3|33|1.06|31|
23-Mar-13|Mar 23 '13 BOS @ TOR|1|0|1|34|1.06|32|
| 16 Game Total |9|11|20||1.25||20
25-Mar-13|Mar 25 '13 TOR @ BOS|0|1|1|35|1.06|33|
26-Mar-13|Mar 26 '13 FLA @ TOR|0|0|0|35|1.03|34|
28-Mar-13|Mar 28 '13 CAR @ TOR|0|0|0|35|1|35|
30-Mar-13|Mar 30 '13 TOR @ OTT|3|1|4|39|1.08|36|
04-Apr-13|Apr 4 '13 PHI @ TOR|0|0|0|39|1.05|37|
06-Apr-13|Apr 6 '13 TOR @ NJD|0|0|0|39|1.03|38|
08-Apr-13|Apr 8 '13 NYR @ TOR|0|1|1|40|1.03|39|
10-Apr-13|Apr 10 '13 TOR @ NYR|0|0|0|40|1|40|
13-Apr-13|Apr 13 '13 MTL @ TOR|0|1|1|41|1|41|
15-Apr-13|Apr 15 '13 NJD @ TOR|0|0|0|41|0.98|42|
16-Apr-13|Apr 16 '13 TOR @ WSH|0|0|0|41|0.95|43|
18-Apr-13|Apr 18 '13 NYI @ TOR|0|0|0|41|0.93|44|
20-Apr-13|Apr 20 '13 TOR @ OTT|1|0|1|42|0.93|45|
24-Apr-13|Apr 24 '13 TOR @ TBL|0|0|0|42|0.91|46|
25-Apr-13|Apr 25 '13 TOR @ FLA|0|2|2|44|0.94|47|
27-Apr-13|Apr 27 '13 MTL @ TOR|0|0|0|44|0.92|48|
| 16 Game Total |4|6|10||0.63||10
01-Oct-13|Oct 1 '13 TOR @ MTL|0|1|1|1|1|1|
02-Oct-13|Oct 2 '13 TOR @ PHI|0|0|0|1|0.5|2|
05-Oct-13|Oct 5 '13 OTT @ TOR|1|1|2|3|1|3|
08-Oct-13|Oct 8 '13 COL @ TOR|0|0|0|3|0.75|4|
10-Oct-13|Oct 10 '13 TOR @ NSH|0|1|1|4|0.8|5|
12-Oct-13|Oct 12 '13 EDM @ TOR|1|1|2|6|1|6|
15-Oct-13|Oct 15 '13 MIN @ TOR|0|1|1|7|1|7|
17-Oct-13|Oct 17 '13 CAR @ TOR|0|0|0|7|0.88|8|
19-Oct-13|Oct 19 '13 TOR @ CHI|1|0|1|8|0.89|9|
22-Oct-13|Oct 22 '13 ANA @ TOR|0|0|0|8|0.8|10|
25-Oct-13|Oct 25 '13 TOR @ CBJ|0|0|0|8|0.73|11|
26-Oct-13|Oct 26 '13 PIT @ TOR*|1|0|1|9|0.75|12|
29-Oct-13|Oct 29 '13 TOR @ EDM|1|2|3|12|0.92|13|
30-Oct-13|Oct 30 '13 TOR @ CGY|0|1|1|13|0.93|14|
02-Nov-13|Nov 2 '13 TOR @ VAN|0|0|0|13|0.87|15|
08-Nov-13|Nov 8 '13 NJD @ TOR|0|0|0|13|0.81|16|
| 16 Game Total |5|8|13||0.81||13
09-Nov-13|Nov 9 '13 TOR @ BOS|0|0|0|13|0.76|17|
13-Nov-13|Nov 13 '13 TOR @ MIN|0|1|1|14|0.78|18|
21-Nov-13|Nov 21 '13 NSH @ TOR|1|0|1|15|0.79|19|
23-Nov-13|Nov 23 '13 WSH @ TOR|0|1|1|16|0.8|20|
25-Nov-13|Nov 25 '13 CBJ @ TOR|0|0|0|16|0.76|21|
27-Nov-13|Nov 27 '13 TOR @ PIT|1|0|1|17|0.77|22|
29-Nov-13|Nov 29 '13 TOR @ BUF|0|0|0|17|0.74|23|
30-Nov-13|Nov 30 '13 TOR @ MTL|0|0|0|17|0.71|24|
05-Dec-13|Dec 5 '13 DAL @ TOR|2|0|2|19|0.76|25|
07-Dec-13|Dec 7 '13 TOR @ OTT|0|1|1|20|0.77|26|
08-Dec-13|Dec 8 '13 BOS @ TOR|0|0|0|20|0.74|27|
11-Dec-13|Dec 11 '13 LAK @ TOR|0|0|0|20|0.71|28|
12-Dec-13|Dec 12 '13 TOR @ STL|1|0|1|21|0.72|29|
14-Dec-13|Dec 14 '13 CHI @ TOR|0|1|1|22|0.73|30|
16-Dec-13|Dec 16 '13 TOR @ PIT|0|0|0|22|0.71|31|
17-Dec-13|Dec 17 '13 FLA @ TOR|0|0|0|22|0.69|32|
| 16 Game Total |5|4|9||0.56||9
|80 Game Total|||||0.83||66
|82 Game Projection|||||||68

Now lunch is over I have to do work related stuff.

 

[Menzinger]

People do realize that Carlyle actually had a winning record as the Leafs head coach right? A winning record on a dysfunctional team...that he didn't build. 21-16-3 when he got fired and in a payoff spot still. Are fans suggesting it was all because of the players we were winning? Then why didn't we go on a tear after he was fired? We got worse and the management deemed it a players issue an shipped out our leading scorer.

The telling part is what management has done, and tried to do, with the cast of characters that Carlyle had to work with.

My point was that it isn't all coaching problems with Naz.

I can't wait for the "Babcock sucks" if Bozak is still the #1 centre 1/2 way through the season.

I think Carlyle was given a poor roster to work with - but he still made awful coaching decisions.

His defensive system was inept (it was the same style he was using when he was fired from the Ducks), and didn't utilize the lineup well enough (over playing guys like Bozak, and only giving the 4th line 5 minutes a night, ect).

Yes he had a winning record, but a lot of those wins came from a shoutout (a glorified coin flip) and having a favourable schedule for much of the fall. It was the same story the year before - the Leafs won a bunch of games in the shoot out/overtime and inflated their record.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

I predict 68 points based on 48 games from the lock-out season to the first 32 games of the following season.

This seems reasonable.

Date|Game|Goals|Assists|Points|Acmltd|PPG|Game Cnt|16 GTs
19-Jan-13|Jan 19 '13 TOR @ MTL|1|0|1|1|1|1|
21-Jan-13|Jan 21 '13 BUF @ TOR|1|0|1|2|1|2|
23-Jan-13|Jan 23 '13 TOR @ PIT|0|1|1|3|1|3|
24-Jan-13|Jan 24 '13 NYI @ TOR|1|1|2|5|1.25|4|
26-Jan-13|Jan 26 '13 TOR @ NYR|0|0|0|5|1|5|
29-Jan-13|Jan 29 '13 TOR @ BUF|0|1|1|6|1|6|
31-Jan-13|Jan 31 '13 WSH @ TOR|0|1|1|7|1|7|
02-Feb-13|Feb 2 '13 BOS @ TOR|0|0|0|7|0.88|8|
04-Feb-13|Feb 4 '13 CAR @ TOR|0|1|1|8|0.89|9|
05-Feb-13|Feb 5 '13 TOR @ WSH|0|0|0|8|0.8|10|
07-Feb-13|Feb 7 '13 TOR @ WPG|0|1|1|9|0.82|11|
09-Feb-13|Feb 9 '13 TOR @ MTL|0|0|0|9|0.75|12|
11-Feb-13|Feb 11 '13 PHI @ TOR|0|2|2|11|0.85|13|
14-Feb-13|Feb 14 '13 TOR @ CAR|1|0|1|12|0.86|14|
16-Feb-13|Feb 16 '13 OTT @ TOR|0|0|0|12|0.8|15|
18-Feb-13|Feb 18 '13 TOR @ FLA|1|1|2|14|0.88|16|
| 16 Game Total |5|9|14||0.88||14
19-Feb-13|Feb 19 '13 TOR @ TBL|0|0|0|14|0.82|17|
21-Feb-13|Feb 21 '13 BUF @ TOR|0|0|0|14|0.78|18|
23-Feb-13|Feb 23 '13 TOR @ OTT|0|1|1|15|0.79|19|
25-Feb-13|Feb 25 '13 TOR @ PHI|0|2|2|17|0.85|20|
27-Feb-13|Feb 27 '13 MTL @ TOR|0|1|1|18|0.86|21|
28-Feb-13|Feb 28 '13 TOR @ NYI|3|0|3|21|0.95|22|
04-Mar-13|Mar 4 '13 NJD @ TOR|1|1|2|23|1|23|
06-Mar-13|Mar 6 '13 OTT @ TOR*|1|0|1|24|1|24|
07-Mar-13|Mar 7 '13 TOR @ BOS|1|0|1|25|1|25|
09-Mar-13|Mar 9 '13 PIT @ TOR|0|0|0|25|0.96|26|
12-Mar-13|Mar 12 '13 TOR @ WPG|0|0|0|25|0.93|27|
14-Mar-13|Mar 14 '13 PIT @ TOR|0|0|0|25|0.89|28|
16-Mar-13|Mar 16 '13 WPG @ TOR|0|2|2|27|0.93|29|
20-Mar-13|Mar 20 '13 TBL @ TOR|0|3|3|30|1|30|
21-Mar-13|Mar 21 '13 TOR @ BUF|2|1|3|33|1.06|31|
23-Mar-13|Mar 23 '13 BOS @ TOR|1|0|1|34|1.06|32|
| 16 Game Total |9|11|20||1.25||20
25-Mar-13|Mar 25 '13 TOR @ BOS|0|1|1|35|1.06|33|
26-Mar-13|Mar 26 '13 FLA @ TOR|0|0|0|35|1.03|34|
28-Mar-13|Mar 28 '13 CAR @ TOR|0|0|0|35|1|35|
30-Mar-13|Mar 30 '13 TOR @ OTT|3|1|4|39|1.08|36|
04-Apr-13|Apr 4 '13 PHI @ TOR|0|0|0|39|1.05|37|
06-Apr-13|Apr 6 '13 TOR @ NJD|0|0|0|39|1.03|38|
08-Apr-13|Apr 8 '13 NYR @ TOR|0|1|1|40|1.03|39|
10-Apr-13|Apr 10 '13 TOR @ NYR|0|0|0|40|1|40|
13-Apr-13|Apr 13 '13 MTL @ TOR|0|1|1|41|1|41|
15-Apr-13|Apr 15 '13 NJD @ TOR|0|0|0|41|0.98|42|
16-Apr-13|Apr 16 '13 TOR @ WSH|0|0|0|41|0.95|43|
18-Apr-13|Apr 18 '13 NYI @ TOR|0|0|0|41|0.93|44|
20-Apr-13|Apr 20 '13 TOR @ OTT|1|0|1|42|0.93|45|
24-Apr-13|Apr 24 '13 TOR @ TBL|0|0|0|42|0.91|46|
25-Apr-13|Apr 25 '13 TOR @ FLA|0|2|2|44|0.94|47|
27-Apr-13|Apr 27 '13 MTL @ TOR|0|0|0|44|0.92|48|
| 16 Game Total |4|6|10||0.63||10
01-Oct-13|Oct 1 '13 TOR @ MTL|0|1|1|1|1|1|
02-Oct-13|Oct 2 '13 TOR @ PHI|0|0|0|1|0.5|2|
05-Oct-13|Oct 5 '13 OTT @ TOR|1|1|2|3|1|3|
08-Oct-13|Oct 8 '13 COL @ TOR|0|0|0|3|0.75|4|
10-Oct-13|Oct 10 '13 TOR @ NSH|0|1|1|4|0.8|5|
12-Oct-13|Oct 12 '13 EDM @ TOR|1|1|2|6|1|6|
15-Oct-13|Oct 15 '13 MIN @ TOR|0|1|1|7|1|7|
17-Oct-13|Oct 17 '13 CAR @ TOR|0|0|0|7|0.88|8|
19-Oct-13|Oct 19 '13 TOR @ CHI|1|0|1|8|0.89|9|
22-Oct-13|Oct 22 '13 ANA @ TOR|0|0|0|8|0.8|10|
25-Oct-13|Oct 25 '13 TOR @ CBJ|0|0|0|8|0.73|11|
26-Oct-13|Oct 26 '13 PIT @ TOR*|1|0|1|9|0.75|12|
29-Oct-13|Oct 29 '13 TOR @ EDM|1|2|3|12|0.92|13|
30-Oct-13|Oct 30 '13 TOR @ CGY|0|1|1|13|0.93|14|
02-Nov-13|Nov 2 '13 TOR @ VAN|0|0|0|13|0.87|15|
08-Nov-13|Nov 8 '13 NJD @ TOR|0|0|0|13|0.81|16|
| 16 Game Total |5|8|13||0.81||13
09-Nov-13|Nov 9 '13 TOR @ BOS|0|0|0|13|0.76|17|
13-Nov-13|Nov 13 '13 TOR @ MIN|0|1|1|14|0.78|18|
21-Nov-13|Nov 21 '13 NSH @ TOR|1|0|1|15|0.79|19|
23-Nov-13|Nov 23 '13 WSH @ TOR|0|1|1|16|0.8|20|
25-Nov-13|Nov 25 '13 CBJ @ TOR|0|0|0|16|0.76|21|
27-Nov-13|Nov 27 '13 TOR @ PIT|1|0|1|17|0.77|22|
29-Nov-13|Nov 29 '13 TOR @ BUF|0|0|0|17|0.74|23|
30-Nov-13|Nov 30 '13 TOR @ MTL|0|0|0|17|0.71|24|
05-Dec-13|Dec 5 '13 DAL @ TOR|2|0|2|19|0.76|25|
07-Dec-13|Dec 7 '13 TOR @ OTT|0|1|1|20|0.77|26|
08-Dec-13|Dec 8 '13 BOS @ TOR|0|0|0|20|0.74|27|
11-Dec-13|Dec 11 '13 LAK @ TOR|0|0|0|20|0.71|28|
12-Dec-13|Dec 12 '13 TOR @ STL|1|0|1|21|0.72|29|
14-Dec-13|Dec 14 '13 CHI @ TOR|0|1|1|22|0.73|30|
16-Dec-13|Dec 16 '13 TOR @ PIT|0|0|0|22|0.71|31|
17-Dec-13|Dec 17 '13 FLA @ TOR|0|0|0|22|0.69|32|
| 16 Game Total |5|4|9||0.56||9
|80 Game Total|||||0.83||66
|82 Game Projection|||||||68

Now lunch is over I have to do work related stuff.

I am predicting a 75 point season for Kadri.

My math is simple, 44/48 = .916

Projected over 82 games is 75 points.

It seems some here think this is the real Kadri, based on the 48 game season.

So 75 points this year it is!

 

[Gary Nylund]

For sure, and I hope he does thrive. It may also mean that he has started to "get it". That what Shanny has said and did, is clicking. A 1 year show me deal my have also helped get the point across.
He is a talented guy, but I don't believe it is all everyone else fault when there is so much that has shown there are issues with Naz himself, and this goes back to the AHL.

I don't either. Usually the truth lies somewhere in the middle, meaning Kadri has issues he has to fix but the coaching staff didn't do a good job either. The coaching issue has been solved, now it's up to Kadri to show everyone if he's capable of upping his game to another level.

I would add that it's not like Kadri has been bad the last two years either. We don't know what the off-ice issues are but on the ice he has been pretty good. Those pointing to his point totals and criticizing him based on that are out to lunch IMO. Matching him up against the top lines in the league with 2nd and 3rd line wingers for support and expecting the same point production as he was able to do against 3rd lines is absurd.

As I've said many times before, I think he's proven to be a very good #2C. If that's all he is that's not bad at all (assuming whatever off-ice issues are resolved). If he can be more, that would be a huge bonus. Does he have it in him? We'll see.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Pretty telling that neither Carlyle or Wilson are employed by NHL clubs.

Yes it is.

I think Carlyle was given a poor roster to work with - but he still made awful coaching decisions.

His defensive system was inept (it was the same style he was using when he was fired from the Ducks), and didn't utilize the lineup well enough (over playing guys like Bozak, and only giving the 4th line 5 minutes a night, ect).

Yes he had a winning record, but a lot of those wins came from a shoutout (a glorified coin flip) and having a favourable schedule for much of the fall. It was the same story the year before - the Leafs won a bunch of games in the shoot out/overtime and inflated their record.

All true IMHO.

 

[Bluelines]

The flip side to this is that if Naz thrives this year under Babcock then maybe it's time people consider the possibility that previous coaches have dropped the ball when it comes to Naz.

..or the previous 3 coaches were right and Naz has finally matured into the role.

 

[Daisy Jane]

Yes it is.



All true IMHO.

again - I don't know.
Carlyle was interviewed for the San Jose Job. (and had Shanahan fired him last year, if reports were true he WOULD have been hired by Florida lickitysplit).
Marc Crawford is doing a really good job in Switzerland.
Hartley didn't work for a few years before he got a job in Calgary.
Boucher was regarded in being really good but didn't really go anywhere until we almost hired him.

I don't think it's telling that people are unemployed in a league where there are 30 jobs, and anything can happen at any given time. Especially when being a"gruffy pants" coach isn't doing it any more (something that Hartley had to change - and from all reports, Carlyle actually DID change when he was here).

anyhoo. it will be interesting to see what Monsieur Kadri does this season
(sigh) is it camp yet?

 

[Bluelines]

and this (because I know someone will do this) - does not mean that because Holland played better during that time - Holland >> Kadri, because that's not the case. It's obvious as rain that Kadri has the better talent.

Interesting point, brings a question to mind and I honestly don't know the answer, can Player A have more talent but Player B be the better player?

 

[Gary Nylund]

..or the previous 3 coaches were right and Naz has finally matured into the role.

That's possible too I guess, I don't think there's any way to ever know for sure. Athough as I've said before (and this just my opinion of course) Kadri has actually played pretty well the last couple of years. I don't know what's happening off the ice but on the ice he's been good.

I do think that the coaches have dropped the ball on Kadri and he will have his best season so far under Babcock.

Interesting point, brings a question to mind and I honestly don't know the answer, can Player A have more talent but Player B be the better player?

Without thinking about it a great deal I would say that of course it's possible. An extreme example would be huge talents who never got anywhere because they had issues with alcohol. Other issues are work ethic and drive to excel, I'm sure we could come up with a few more. Bottom line - not everyone makes the most of their god given abilities.

 

[Daisy Jane]

Interesting point, brings a question to mind and I honestly don't know the answer, can Player A have more talent but Player B be the better player?

I think so. but it would depend on who the players are and a "better" player for the spot, if that makes sense.

 

[Daisy Jane]

That's possible too I guess, I don't think there's any way to ever know for sure. Athough as I've said before (and this just my opinion of course) Kadri has actually played pretty well the last couple of years. I don't know what's happening off the ice but on the ice he's been good.

I do think that the coaches have dropped the ball on Kadri and he will have his best season so far under Babcock.

we'll have to agree to disagree on the first part of your statement, but I agree with the second. (Or - to be fair, I hope this is the case. I'm not one to make grandiose proclamations - not saying you are, but .. you know what i mean LOL)

 

[RLF]

I don't either. Usually the truth lies somewhere in the middle, meaning Kadri has issues he has to fix but the coaching staff didn't do a good job either. The coaching issue has been solved, now it's up to Kadri to show everyone if he's capable of upping his game to another level.

I would add that it's not like Kadri has been bad the last two years either. We don't know what the off-ice issues are but on the ice he has been pretty good. Those pointing to his point totals and criticizing him based on that are out to lunch IMO. Matching him up against the top lines in the league with 2nd and 3rd line wingers for support and expecting the same point production as he was able to do against 3rd lines is absurd.

As I've said many times before, I think he's proven to be a very good #2C. If that's all he is that's not bad at all (assuming whatever off-ice issues are resolved). If he can be more, that would be a huge bonus. Does he have it in him? We'll see.

Not sure why your part seems like it is part of my post. Bolded...This is my point, together with what has been obvious that off-ice issues do exist even though many have claimed it is bull. This is where Nazem has to take responsibility, not the coach.

Do I agree with everything Carlyle did? Of course not. But the fact that the new management group is dismantling the past and only gave Naz 1 year, says a lot as well. They didn't fire Carlyle because he was crap...they fired him because it was necessary moving forward. Shanny wanted to make sure it wasn't the coach before he moved forward with roster changes. That is why he went to the players after they fired Randy and gave them the ultimatum..."show me this core can work"...and they failed dramatically. Kadri included in that group.

 

[RLF]

again - I don't know.
Carlyle was interviewed for the San Jose Job. (and had Shanahan fired him last year, if reports were true he WOULD have been hired by Florida lickitysplit).
Marc Crawford is doing a really good job in Switzerland.
Hartley didn't work for a few years before he got a job in Calgary.
Boucher was regarded in being really good but didn't really go anywhere until we almost hired him.

I don't think it's telling that people are unemployed in a league where there are 30 jobs, and anything can happen at any given time. Especially when being a"gruffy pants" coach isn't doing it any more (something that Hartley had to change - and from all reports, Carlyle actually DID change when he was here).

anyhoo. it will be interesting to see what Monsieur Kadri does this season
(sigh) is it camp yet?

You can put Paul Maurice in there as well. Agreed, Carlyle was just fired this past season, doesn't mean his career is over because he doesn't have a job yet.

 

[Mess]

This thread has reached its upper limit.

/Closed