World Cup: National Team threads #2

[Evilo]

If Pavard steps forward instead of turning to run with Kai, then Kroos plays it right over their heads and Havertz has a 1-on-1 with the keeper. As we saw, the press wasn't going to get to Toni in time.

Nah if all step forward, they'd pressure the guys who are supposed to control the ball and play offside the others.

 

[cgf]

Nah if all step forward, they'd pressure the guys who are supposed to control the ball and play offside the others.

…but we can see that they didn’t get to Kroos before our attackers were on your defense…

They’d all have stepped up just in time to watch Havertz run past them to latch onto the end of Toni’s pass.

 

[Evilo]

I don't care about Kroos. He's not the problem here. A passer doesn't have any impact if he has nowhere to pass the ball.
When the french midfield gets up to press, the defensemen should ALSO press up to defend the attackers and prevent the pass. By staying put (or even worse, running back, or even even worse, running right like Pavard), they create a major hole in front of them which enables Wirtz to easily control the ball (when he should be pressed) and the german attackers to make run where they should be offside.

Also, let's not kid ourselves, Havertz is running past nobody except grandmas.

 

[cgf]

I don't care about Kroos. He's not the problem here. A passer doesn't have any impact if he has nowhere to pass the ball.
When the french midfield gets up to press, the defensemen should ALSO press up to defend the attackers and prevent the pass. By staying put (or even worse, running back, or even even worse, running right like Pavard), they create a major hole in front of them which enables Wirtz to easily control the ball (when he should be pressed) and the german attackers to make run where they should be offside.

Also, let's not kid ourselves, Havertz is running past nobody except grandmas.

If they step up they create an even bigger hole right behind them, which the German attackers were running into with momentum.

Havertz didn't have any trouble running past the grandmas you have in defense

 

[Evilo]

Yeah not hard with Pavard and Kounde

Nope you still don't get what I mean. They step up to prevent Wirtz (or others) from controlling the ball easily after the pass.

 

[Jussi]

 

[cgf]

Yeah not hard with Pavard and Kounde

Nope you still don't get what I mean. They step up to prevent Wirtz (or others) from controlling the ball easily after the pass.

Right and when they step up, Kroos plays his pass right over their heads and we get a 1-on-1 with the keeper...

 

[PanniniClaus]

Just can't seem to stamp this out but it seems playing in France, Germany or England would be better than Spain..

 

[Evilo]

Right and when they step up, Kroos plays his pass right over their heads and we get a 1-on-1 with the keeper...

No because they press the guys or put them offside...

 

[spintheblackcircle]

Chelsea youngster Kendry Paez caught in nightclub aged 16

Ecuador national federation have threatened to axe senior members of their squad after Chelsea's 16-year-old wonderkid Kendry Paez was taken to a New York strip club.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[luiginb]

Wonderkid indeed

 

[cgf]

No because they press the guys or put them offside...

Watch it again. Kroos would have had tons of time to play the ball in behind the defenders before our attackers got into in an offsides position...unless you're saying that your defenders should've ran in front of your midfielders...

...and if the defenders had all stepped up instead of turning & starting to run with our attackers, Havertz could've stopped for a doner and still beaten them to get a 1-on-1 with the keeper.

Or did you forget that offsides is determined when the pass is played, rather than when it's received? You remember that a player in an onsides position can run in behind the defense after the ball has been played, right?

 

[Evilo]

Watch it again. Kroos would have had tons of time to play the ball in behind the defenders before our attackers got into in an offsides position...unless you're saying that your defenders should've ran in front of your midfielders...

...and if the defenders had all stepped up instead of turning & starting to run with our attackers, Havertz could've stopped for a doner and still beaten them to get a 1-on-1 with the keeper.

Or did you forget that offsides is determined when the pass is played, rather than when it's received? You remember that a player in an onsides position can run in behind the defense after the ball has been played, right?

We won't agree with this. If the pressing had been the whole team, as any press should be, the german players wouldn't have had time to control the ball, get forward for 10 meters and shoot.

As for your poor attempt at explaining rules when you can't even understand how a press works, I suggest you change your attitude.

 

[cgf]

We won't agree with this. If the pressing had been the whole team, as any press should be, the german players wouldn't have had time to control the ball, get forward for 10 meters and shoot.

As for your poor attempt at explaining rules when you can't even understand how a press works, I suggest you change your attitude.

I know you'll never admit that your comment about a match you didn't watch was wrong, but it's fun to see what logical knots you'll tie yourself into when you've dug in. It's why I like shooting the s*** with you

The video's right there, you can see that the press doesn't get to Kroos before our runners are already past your midfield. So if your defenders had stepped up like you suggest they should've, Toni would just play a ball in behind while we were still onsides.

And since our guys were already running at speed, while your defenders would still be moving in the wrong direction when the ball was played over their heads, those defenders would have no chance to recover.

 

[Incubajerks]

I know you'll never admit that your comment about a match you didn't watch was wrong, but it's fun to see what logical knots you'll tie yourself into when you've dug in. It's why I like shooting the s*** with you

The video's right there, you can see that the press doesn't get to Kroos before our runners are already past your midfield. So if your defenders had stepped up like you suggest they should've, Toni would just play a ball in behind while we were still onsides.

And since our guys were already running at speed, while your defenders would still be moving in the wrong direction when the ball was played over their heads, those defenders would have no chance to recover.

Look, there is no team that prepares the offside 7 seconds after the start of the match, the main fault lies with the midfielders who get up at the same time leaving a 4vs4, then the mistake is Upamecano's and anyone who has played football knows it.

Edited to say that yes France made a mistake but credit to Germany who found the goal on something that, as Kroos said, was prepared and studied.

 

[cgf]

Chelsea youngster Kendry Paez caught in nightclub aged 16

Ecuador national federation have threatened to axe senior members of their squad after Chelsea's 16-year-old wonderkid Kendry Paez was taken to a New York strip club.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Seems weird to me to go too hard at the players if this would be acceptable back in Ecuador. Yes slap them on the wrist for not following the local laws of where they are playing, but if this would be culturally acceptable back home, seems silly to make a stink out of it.

But maybe this is just the German in me, who was already getting bored of clubbing by 16, speaking

 

[HajdukSplit]

Iraq and Australia first Asian teams to qualify for the next round of qualifications; remember AFC gets 8 automatic spots for the next World Cup and a potential 9th in the playoff. China will still probably fail

 

[cgf]

Look, there is no team that prepares the offside 7 seconds after the start of the match, the main fault lies with the midfielders who get up at the same time leaving a 4vs4, then the mistake is Upamecano's and anyone who has played football knows it.

Edited to say that yes France made a mistake but credit to Germany who found the goal on something that, as Kroos said, was prepared and studied.

Yeah. It was flukey and typically that French midfield is much sharper...at least when they play non-german teams...but we caught them off guard, in the game where they weren't at their best, and punished them for it.

There was nothing Pavard could do but hope we wasted our chance once Tchou, WZE, and Rabiot let our front 4 charge right by them before anyone was even close to Kroos. At that point the defense was on the back foot and vulnerable to a great play...which Toni & Flo made.

But Evilo's hate-boner for Pavard is kinda fascinating to me. Knowing what I know about how big of assholes pro footballers can be, even to the people they work with, I can't help but wonder what Pavard did to inspire such passion.

 

[Evilo]

I know you'll never admit that your comment about a match you didn't watch was wrong, but it's fun to see what logical knots you'll tie yourself into when you've dug in. It's why I like shooting the s*** with you

The video's right there, you can see that the press doesn't get to Kroos before our runners are already past your midfield. So if your defenders had stepped up like you suggest they should've, Toni would just play a ball in behind while we were still onsides.

And since our guys were already running at speed, while your defenders would still be moving in the wrong direction when the ball was played over their heads, those defenders would have no chance to recover.

I think it's hilarious you talk about pressing all day long and don't understand the basic principles of it.
And watching this particular play has nothing to do with the rest of the game I admited not watching.
Your logic is pure Fifa. Either skip the midfield or hoof it over the top for a 1 on 1 on the goalie. There's absolutely no understanding of the football game. And yet YOU try to tell others they're lacking logic. Hilarious indeed.
The video is indeed here. All you need is to understand that if the team was pressing together no recipient of the ball would have been free.
The only 1 on 1 possible would have been to give to Wirtz and then over the D but obviously with a press the Germans would have been offside. Easy to understand.

 

[cgf]

I think it's hilarious you talk about pressing all day long and don't understand the basic principles of it.
And watching this particular play has nothing to do with the rest of the game I admited not watching.
Your logic is pure Fifa. Either skip the midfield or hoof it over the top for a 1 on 1 on the goalie. There's absolutely no understanding of the football game. And yet YOU try to tell others they're lacking logic. Hilarious indeed.
The video is indeed here. All you need is to understand that if the team was pressing together no recipient of the ball would have been free.
The only 1 on 1 possible would have been to give to Wirtz and then over the D but obviously with a press the Germans would have been offside. Easy to understand.

I love how you act like such a know it all while your need to blame Pavard for everything has forced you to pretend that an offsides trap can't be beaten if the pass comes before any attackers are in an offsides position

As though the defenders stepping up wouldn't have left a ton of space in behind them to play a ball into while we were still onsides; or that our attackers would not have been heavy favorites to win the race for that ball since they were already moving in that direction with speed, while your defenders would need to stop advancing, turn around, and start accelerating...

How petulant you get just because you've dug yourself into this hole is adorable. This is why I start to miss you *hug*

Wanna PM me about what Pavard did that has inspired such profound hatred for him? I won't tell anyone, I'm just really curious.

 

[Evilo]

I love how you act like such a know it all while your need to blame Pavard for everything has forced you to pretend that an offsides trap can't be beaten if the pass comes before any attackers are in an offsides position

As though the defenders stepping up wouldn't have left a ton of space in behind them to play a ball into while we were still onsides; or that our attackers would not have been heavy favorites to win the race for that ball since they were already moving in that direction with speed, while your defenders would need to stop advancing, turn around, and start accelerating...

How petulant you get just because you've dug yourself into this hole is adorable. This is why I start to miss you *hug*

Wanna PM me about what Pavard did that has inspired such profound hatred for him? I won't tell anyone, I'm just really curious.

Don't blame me for being unable to read.
Read what I wrote and let me know if I blamed everything on Pavard.
Once you realize you're writing crap you can try again.
No if the D had closed down nobody could have ran towards the goal onside. That's the whole point of the D press. Glad I taught you something today.

You continue to be petulant and try to tell me how football works while ignoring the basic logic of it all.

Just to remind you you're the one who made it aggressive by trying to explain rules while not even understanding how you put someone offside.
If the D steps up the Germans can't run forward like they did and Wirtz can't pass to them if they do. It's simple 101 football.

 

[cgf]

Can I blame you for not being able to read your own posts? Cause you can't pretend you didn't try to blame it all on Pavard just one page after making these.

Didn't watch the game and glad I didn't. Starting Pavard at CB is just trouble waiting to happen.
[snip]

When you get scored on after 9 seconds, I think it's fair to say your D and not your midfield got ran over.
Literaly, the CB looked at Wirtz and never pressed him before his shot. All the time in the world. Blaming tthe midfield there is weird to me.
And without that goal at second 9, I believe match would have been different.
I didn't watch it, but I saw the goal which is ridiculous to give up. And starting a game at 0-1 changes the whole complexity of it.

Which is the problem. Pavard and Kounde both crossed their path which was nonsense. Upa expected Pavard to step up, he didn't and Upa moved too late.

And maybe if you review the offsides rules you'll understand why what you're saying is so silly. Kroos can pass the ball past the defenders before any germans are offside, and a German running onto the ball would still be onside.

Hopefully that helped you understand your mistake.

 

[cgf]

Maybe this will help you understand. Look at the pass Toni Kroos hits at the 58second mark of this video. The Real attacker receives the ball behind the defense, but it's not offsides because when the pass was hit, he was still onside.

Again at the 1:14 mark, Kroos hits the pass while his team-mate is onsides, so even though the pass is received behind the defense, it's not offside.

At 1:44 is another example, the ball is hit while the runner is still onside, so even though he runs behind the defense it's a good goal.





Do you now understand how your defense stepping up wouldn't have guaranteed you trapped us offsides, since Kroos had so much time to pick out his pass and he could've sent it past them before Havertz was offside?

 

[luiginb]

I love how you act like such a know it all while your need to blame Pavard for everything has forced you to pretend that an offsides trap can't be beaten if the pass comes before any attackers are in an offsides position

This.

 

[John Price]