Value of: Myers to Leafs

[The Winter Soldier]

Myers is playing very well. I have liked how he has looked this year. After pretty much having a year off due to personal matters. He's got a year + left on his contract at 5.5. No problem with this. He's too valuable to the Jets 1-6-7 deep D this year to deal. The return would have to be an overpayment for the Jets to deal him.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

Myers would be the Leafs 2nd best Dman

LOL. No, he would not. He would be our 4th best D-Man.

2nd or 3rd or 4th best? Why does it matter when he’s not available?

It doesn't. But the first post above is always a "trigger" for the kind of reaction that it got.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

2nd or 3rd or 4th best? Why does it matter when he’s not available?

Myers would be a top 2 pairing D man on most teams. Maybe even #1 pairing for a right handed shot. Leafs really want a right handed D man so the Jets could really ask for the sky if they want. Babcock likes to use a right/left tandem. From this perspective Myers value is super high if a deal was to be entertained. However, I see the Jets 3 pairings so interchangeable. They can ice 3 pairings and they all would be better than most teams 3rd units. And better and as good as most 2nd pairings. I agree the Jets have no desire to deal a right handed shooting D man playing well this year since they are tied for 1st overall in the NHL and looking like they will be playing important games late in the year.

 

[Pyrophorus]

2nd or 3rd or 4th best? Why does it matter when he’s not available?

Exactly the point, why to stay away.

 

[FerrisRox]

I don't know if Myers is an upgrade on Hainsey or Zaitsev.

Seriously? You don't know?

 

[Ziggdiezan]

Seriously? You don't know?

Even if Myers is twice the player Hainsey or Zaitsev is you still take Hainsey and Zaitsev as Myers will only player like 40 games

 

[Hunter368]

Even if Myers is twice the player Hainsey or Zaitsev is you still take Hainsey and Zaitsev as Myers will only player like 40 games

40 games? Hyperbole

 

[Brock Radunske]

Even if Myers is twice the player Hainsey or Zaitsev is you still take Hainsey and Zaitsev as Myers will only player like 40 games

And at zero cost to acquire

Even if Myers is a 6/10 and Zaitsev is a 5/10, the minor upgrade (if any) isn't worth the assets.

 

[oooooooooohCanada]

If we sold Myers, the prime objective would be to convert him into meaningful futures, which basically means either C or D prospects. Dermott is definitely one of those, and the pick, albeit a late one, would likely turn into another. Is that too big an ask?

Dermott is definitely not a C or D prospect.. he's only gone up in value since being taken 34th. Was the #1 D on a very good Marlies team last year, and is the #1 D on one of the best AHL teams this year, despite not even being 21 yet (has a late December birthday).

 

[FerrisRox]

Dermott is definitely not a C or D prospect.. he's only gone up in value since being taken 34th. Was the #1 D on a very good Marlies team last year, and is the #1 D on one of the best AHL teams this year, despite not even being 21 yet (has a late December birthday).

If he's so good why is he in the American Hockey League and Roman Polak is taking shifts in Toronto?

 

[Michel Beauchamp]

Exactly the point, why to stay away.

Hum, this makes no sense.

Rephrase ?

 

[Ziggdiezan]

40 games? Hyperbole

Over the last 5 years before this season he played 43 games on average a season so not too far off....

 

[Liferleafer]

If he's so good why is he in the American Hockey League and Roman Polak is taking shifts in Toronto?

Just a shot in the dark here....buf he may be in the AHL because he's a developing young player?

 

[Ciao]

If he's so good why is he in the American Hockey League and Roman Polak is taking shifts in Toronto?

The Leafs want Dermott to develop properly. Thats why.

 

[Martin Skoula]

Just a shot in the dark here....buf he may be in the AHL because he's a developing young player?

No no, you don't get it. Every single player in the NHL > every single player in any other league regardless of circumstance.

 

[Kiwi]

If he's so good why is he in the American Hockey League and Roman Polak is taking shifts in Toronto?

I know this is a foreign concept around here but he's in the AHL developing so that he doesn't end up a 15 minute a night bottom pair plug

 

[inthe6ix]

Not enough of an upgrade on what already have. Would prefer Trouba, but that would cost too much, so better to just move on.

 

[zeke]

kulikov-myers is getting the softest minutes on their dcorps and getting buried possession wise still.

zero interest in myers.

 

[zeke]

Legend:

Letter Grades = Quality of Competition measured by opponents' time on ice, Converted into Letter Grades for simplicity
p60 = points per 60 minutes
CF% = Corsi For Percentage (i.e. shot attempts for percentage)
xGF% = Expected Goals For Percentage (i.e. shot attempt percentage adjusted for shot quality) - this stat is already adjusted for zone deployment and game score
In Brackets = CF% and xGF% relative to team


Pair 1

Rielly (23): 28gms, ES 17:57 (A+ qoc), 1.13p60, 52.8cf% (+3.1), 51.1xgf% (-1.1) / PP 2:14, 6.77p60 / SH 1:25
Trouba (23): 27gms, ES 17:08 (A qoc), 0.79p60, 49.3cf% (-0.3), 50.5xgf% (+0.0) / PP 1:28, 1.50p60 / SH 2:33

Hainsey (36): 28gms, ES 17:19 (A+ qoc), 1.42p60, 51.6cf% (+1.0), 51.3xgf% (-0.9) / PP 0:05, 0.00p60 / SH 4:28
Morrissey (22): 27gms, ES 16:30 (A+ qoc), 0.96p60, 48.1cf% (-2.3), 51.3xgf% (+1.2) / PP 0:18, 0.00p60 / SH 2:22

So Toronto’s top pair is getting moderately tougher ice time and still playing moderately better than the jets’ top pair.

Pair 2

Gardiner (27): 28gms, ES 19:30 (B+ qoc), 0.69p60, 49.7cf% (-1.7), 51.4xgf% (-0.8) / PP 2:17, 5.62p60 / SH 0:37
Byfuglien (32): 25gms, ES 20:00 (B qoc), 0.37p60, 50.0cf% (+1.1), 51.0xgf% (+1.3) / PP 3:22, 5.70p60 / SH 0:38

Zaitsev (26): 28gms, ES 19:00 (B+ qoc), 1.06p60, 48.1cf% (-4.3), 52.1xgf% (+0.4) / PP 0:15, 0.00p60 / SH 3:43
Enstrom (33): 19gms, ES 15:45 (B qoc), 0.41p60, 48.8cf% (+2.4), 53.8xgf% (+7.7) / PP 0:04, 0.00p60 / SH 0:47

Again the leafs’ pair is getting moderately tougher icetime but this time the jets’ pair seems to be outplaying them enough to more than make up for it.

Pair 3

Borgman (22): 26gms, ES 13:31 (D- qoc), 1.04p60, 51.3cf% (+1.0), 51.8xgf% (+1.4) / PP 0:02, 0.00p60 / SH 0:19
Myers (27): 27gms, ES 14:58 (C qoc), 0.75p60, 49.1cf% (-0.5), 45.9xgf% (-6.2) / PP 2:07, 8.33p60 / SH 2:55

Polak (31): 9gms, ES 14:09 (F qoc), 0.96p60, 50.2cf% (-0.4), 57.8xgf% (+4.0) / PP 0:00, 0.00p60 / SH 0:53
Kulikov (27): 25gms, ES 13:44 (C- qoc), 1.23p60, 49.0cf% (-0.9), 50.3xgf% (-1.2) / PP 0:01, 0.00p60 / SH 2:49

Carrick (23): 17gms, ES 13:33 (D qoc), 0.80p60, 51.0cf% (+0.3), 52.6xgf% (+5.8) / PP 0:02, 0.00p60 / SH 0:02
Chiarot (26): 9gms, ES 15:53 (C+ qoc), 0.42p60, 53.8cf% (-0.9), 52.4xgf% (-4.2) / PP 0:03, 0.00p60 / SH 0:07

This time the jets pair is getting the tougher icetime, but still getting soft icetime. The Leafs’ bottom pair is doing better, but this time i’d say that that doesn't quite make up the gap in usage, even though the jets’ pair isn't doing well even in their soft usage.

Would Myers upgrade the leafs’ bottom pair? sure. But the leafs would have no interest in that contract, even as a salary dump.

 

[Carson22]

Legend:

Letter Grades = Quality of Competition measured by opponents' time on ice, Converted into Letter Grades for simplicity
p60 = points per 60 minutes
CF% = Corsi For Percentage (i.e. shot attempts for percentage)
xGF% = Expected Goals For Percentage (i.e. shot attempt percentage adjusted for shot quality) - this stat is already adjusted for zone deployment and game score
In Brackets = CF% and xGF% relative to team


Pair 1

Rielly (23): 28gms, ES 17:57 (A+ qoc), 1.13p60, 52.8cf% (+3.1), 51.1xgf% (-1.1) / PP 2:14, 6.77p60 / SH 1:25
Trouba (23): 27gms, ES 17:08 (A qoc), 0.79p60, 49.3cf% (-0.3), 50.5xgf% (+0.0) / PP 1:28, 1.50p60 / SH 2:33

Hainsey (36): 28gms, ES 17:19 (A+ qoc), 1.42p60, 51.6cf% (+1.0), 51.3xgf% (-0.9) / PP 0:05, 0.00p60 / SH 4:28
Morrissey (22): 27gms, ES 16:30 (A+ qoc), 0.96p60, 48.1cf% (-2.3), 51.3xgf% (+1.2) / PP 0:18, 0.00p60 / SH 2:22

So Toronto’s top pair is getting moderately tougher ice time and still playing moderately better than the jets’ top pair.

Pair 2

Gardiner (27): 28gms, ES 19:30 (B+ qoc), 0.69p60, 49.7cf% (-1.7), 51.4xgf% (-0.8) / PP 2:17, 5.62p60 / SH 0:37
Byfuglien (32): 25gms, ES 20:00 (B qoc), 0.37p60, 50.0cf% (+1.1), 51.0xgf% (+1.3) / PP 3:22, 5.70p60 / SH 0:38

Zaitsev (26): 28gms, ES 19:00 (B+ qoc), 1.06p60, 48.1cf% (-4.3), 52.1xgf% (+0.4) / PP 0:15, 0.00p60 / SH 3:43
Enstrom (33): 19gms, ES 15:45 (B qoc), 0.41p60, 48.8cf% (+2.4), 53.8xgf% (+7.7) / PP 0:04, 0.00p60 / SH 0:47

Again the leafs’ pair is getting moderately tougher icetime but this time the jets’ pair seems to be outplaying them enough to more than make up for it.

Pair 3

Borgman (22): 26gms, ES 13:31 (D- qoc), 1.04p60, 51.3cf% (+1.0), 51.8xgf% (+1.4) / PP 0:02, 0.00p60 / SH 0:19
Myers (27): 27gms, ES 14:58 (C qoc), 0.75p60, 49.1cf% (-0.5), 45.9xgf% (-6.2) / PP 2:07, 8.33p60 / SH 2:55

Polak (31): 9gms, ES 14:09 (F qoc), 0.96p60, 50.2cf% (-0.4), 57.8xgf% (+4.0) / PP 0:00, 0.00p60 / SH 0:53
Kulikov (27): 25gms, ES 13:44 (C- qoc), 1.23p60, 49.0cf% (-0.9), 50.3xgf% (-1.2) / PP 0:01, 0.00p60 / SH 2:49

Carrick (23): 17gms, ES 13:33 (D qoc), 0.80p60, 51.0cf% (+0.3), 52.6xgf% (+5.8) / PP 0:02, 0.00p60 / SH 0:02
Chiarot (26): 9gms, ES 15:53 (C+ qoc), 0.42p60, 53.8cf% (-0.9), 52.4xgf% (-4.2) / PP 0:03, 0.00p60 / SH 0:07

This time the jets pair is getting the tougher icetime, but still getting soft icetime. The Leafs’ bottom pair is doing better, but this time i’d say that that doesn't quite make up the gap in usage, even though the jets’ pair isn't doing well even in their soft usage.

Would Myers upgrade the leafs’ bottom pair? sure. But the leafs would have no interest in that contract, even as a salary dump.

This is a hilarious way to twist things around to try to make things look the way you want them to. Jets top players getting easy minutes, third pair faces tougher minutes....doesn’t that make their third pair their top pair, cause Maurice is putting them out against unfavourable matchups? Are you sure the Leafs don’t play against NHL teams, and the Jets play against junior teams....but no one has noticed? Excuses excuses excuses.

And you obviously have no idea about Myers salary structure. Why embarrass yourself by posting these fairytales? Do you think people can’t see what your agenda is?

 

[zeke]

This is a hilarious way to twist things around to try to make things look the way you want them to. Jets top players getting easy minutes, third pair faces tougher minutes....doesn’t that make their third pair their top pair, cause Maurice is putting them out against unfavourable matchups? Are you sure the Leafs don’t play against NHL teams, and the Jets play against junior teams....but no one has noticed? Excuses excuses excuses.

And you obviously have no idea about Myers salary structure. Why embarrass yourself by posting these fairytales? Do you think people can’t see what your agenda is?

i think you may have misread.

i listed the pairings in order of their quality of competition.

trouba/morrissey faces the toughest, buff/enstrom the middle, and myers/kuly the easiest.

when i said tougher and easier i meant to say the leafs top pair get tougher minutes than the jets top pair, while the jets bottom pair gets tougher minutes than the leafs bottom pair.

 

[Brock Radunske]

If he's so good why is he in the American Hockey League and Roman Polak is taking shifts in Toronto?

The same reason why Nylander and Kapanen did extended tours in the AHL. The Leafs now know how to properly develop players.
Shouldn't be that hard to figure out.

 

[dirty stanchion]

If he's so good why is he in the American Hockey League and Roman Polak is taking shifts in Toronto?

Because D-men don't take much time to develop.

And he's a bust too, so....

 

[cneely]

Legend:

Letter Grades = Quality of Competition measured by opponents' time on ice, Converted into Letter Grades for simplicity
p60 = points per 60 minutes
CF% = Corsi For Percentage (i.e. shot attempts for percentage)
xGF% = Expected Goals For Percentage (i.e. shot attempt percentage adjusted for shot quality) - this stat is already adjusted for zone deployment and game score
In Brackets = CF% and xGF% relative to team


Pair 1

Rielly (23): 28gms, ES 17:57 (A+ qoc), 1.13p60, 52.8cf% (+3.1), 51.1xgf% (-1.1) / PP 2:14, 6.77p60 / SH 1:25
Trouba (23): 27gms, ES 17:08 (A qoc), 0.79p60, 49.3cf% (-0.3), 50.5xgf% (+0.0) / PP 1:28, 1.50p60 / SH 2:33

Hainsey (36): 28gms, ES 17:19 (A+ qoc), 1.42p60, 51.6cf% (+1.0), 51.3xgf% (-0.9) / PP 0:05, 0.00p60 / SH 4:28
Morrissey (22): 27gms, ES 16:30 (A+ qoc), 0.96p60, 48.1cf% (-2.3), 51.3xgf% (+1.2) / PP 0:18, 0.00p60 / SH 2:22

So Toronto’s top pair is getting moderately tougher ice time and still playing moderately better than the jets’ top pair.

Pair 2

Gardiner (27): 28gms, ES 19:30 (B+ qoc), 0.69p60, 49.7cf% (-1.7), 51.4xgf% (-0.8) / PP 2:17, 5.62p60 / SH 0:37
Byfuglien (32): 25gms, ES 20:00 (B qoc), 0.37p60, 50.0cf% (+1.1), 51.0xgf% (+1.3) / PP 3:22, 5.70p60 / SH 0:38

Zaitsev (26): 28gms, ES 19:00 (B+ qoc), 1.06p60, 48.1cf% (-4.3), 52.1xgf% (+0.4) / PP 0:15, 0.00p60 / SH 3:43
Enstrom (33): 19gms, ES 15:45 (B qoc), 0.41p60, 48.8cf% (+2.4), 53.8xgf% (+7.7) / PP 0:04, 0.00p60 / SH 0:47

Again the leafs’ pair is getting moderately tougher icetime but this time the jets’ pair seems to be outplaying them enough to more than make up for it.

Pair 3

Borgman (22): 26gms, ES 13:31 (D- qoc), 1.04p60, 51.3cf% (+1.0), 51.8xgf% (+1.4) / PP 0:02, 0.00p60 / SH 0:19
Myers (27): 27gms, ES 14:58 (C qoc), 0.75p60, 49.1cf% (-0.5), 45.9xgf% (-6.2) / PP 2:07, 8.33p60 / SH 2:55

Polak (31): 9gms, ES 14:09 (F qoc), 0.96p60, 50.2cf% (-0.4), 57.8xgf% (+4.0) / PP 0:00, 0.00p60 / SH 0:53
Kulikov (27): 25gms, ES 13:44 (C- qoc), 1.23p60, 49.0cf% (-0.9), 50.3xgf% (-1.2) / PP 0:01, 0.00p60 / SH 2:49

Carrick (23): 17gms, ES 13:33 (D qoc), 0.80p60, 51.0cf% (+0.3), 52.6xgf% (+5.8) / PP 0:02, 0.00p60 / SH 0:02
Chiarot (26): 9gms, ES 15:53 (C+ qoc), 0.42p60, 53.8cf% (-0.9), 52.4xgf% (-4.2) / PP 0:03, 0.00p60 / SH 0:07

This time the jets pair is getting the tougher icetime, but still getting soft icetime. The Leafs’ bottom pair is doing better, but this time i’d say that that doesn't quite make up the gap in usage, even though the jets’ pair isn't doing well even in their soft usage.

Would Myers upgrade the leafs’ bottom pair? sure. But the leafs would have no interest in that contract, even as a salary dump.

That's interesting. Certainly doesn't match the eye test, Myers has been excellent this year when I've watched.

You also didn't include simple stats. Myers has more points than any Leaf D man save Rielly.

 

[zeke]

That's interesting. Certainly doesn't match the eye test, Myers has been excellent this year when I've watched.

You also didn't include simple stats. Myers has more points than any Leaf D man save Rielly.

didja watch him last night? yikes.

his offense? yeah surprisingly he's the Jets' top PP point man for some reason. He wouldn't get any PP time on the leafs, given they only use one point man on either unit, Mo and Jake.

As for even strength Offense:

Hainsey: 12pts (28gms)
Rielly: 11pts (28gms)
Zaitsev: 10pts (28gms)
Gardiner: 7pts (28gms)
Borgman: 7pts (26gms)
Carrick/Polak: 5pts (26gms)
-- Myers: 5pts (28gms) --