Proposal: MTL & STL

[Thallis]

the proposal is not about moving up from 16 to 5. it's about acquiring dvorsky. op is a montreal fan. there is no single blues fan here, asking for the #5 pick.

I'm a Blues fan asking for the #5 pick. We'd be stupid if didn't want it.

 

[Gaud]

at #5 Blues would get a really good top 1 D either left or right while getting a good prospect in Farrell.
Habs are set on D and since Demidov and Celebrini will be gone mind as well drop down a bit and get a player like Greentree while getting a A prospect in Dvorsky

Habs fan here. I respectfully disagree that habs are set on D or that Farrell is that good a prospect. Mtl has too much D in the system right now and with Hutson done in BU and Reinbacker, etc, I think management is clearly looking for front-end talent. I think they would like to keep Caufield, Suzuki and Slaf on the first line (though slaf and dach is a huge duo), but Dach would have no one to play with.

I've been hearing a lot of buzz about habs meeting repeatedly with Iginla, specifically.

 

[Jared Dunn]

The problem with this theory is there is no chance Levshunov is making it out of the top 4

Yup, I think someone gets giddy and takes him at 2

Starting to think Montreal is just going to take Iginla if Celebrini, Demidov and Lindstrom are all gone. Maybe they'll trade back to 7 or 8 if they think they can still get him there

 

[Junohockeyfan]

I think the deal favors the Habs. But the Habs need quality (a potential superstar) and the #5 pick given them that.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

Yup, I think someone gets giddy and takes him at 2

Starting to think Montreal is just going to take Iginla if Celebrini, Demidov and Lindstrom are all gone. Maybe they'll trade back to 7 or 8 if they think they can still get him there

Levshunov probably gets selected by Chicago if they don't win the lottery but definitely not past both Chicago and Anaheim. Him and Demidov are a toss up. Lindstrom could move up past him due to team need but I doubt it

Iginla probably isn't getting past Calgary so if Montreal wants him they should take him with their own pick.

 

[Jared Dunn]

Levshunov probably gets selected by Chicago if they don't win the lottery but definitely not past both Chicago and Anaheim. Him and Demidov are a toss up. Lindstrom could move up past him due to team need but I doubt it

Iginla probably isn't getting past Calgary so if Montreal wants him they should take him with their own pick.

Yeah I think Iginla might end up the 5th or 6th pick and absolutely Calgary is praying he falls to them.

Whether San Jose falls due to the lottery or one of Anaheim or Chicago is at #3 - all 3 teams need a RD. If Levshunov goes #2 it feels like Demidov could fall to #4, I feel like Verbeek might avoid him and go with Lindstrom

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

Yeah I think Iginla might end up the 5th or 6th pick and absolutely Calgary is praying he falls to them.

Whether San Jose falls due to the lottery or one of Anaheim or Chicago is at #3 - all 3 teams need a RD. If Levshunov goes #2 it feels like Demidov could fall to #4, I feel like Verbeek might avoid him and go with Lindstrom

I don't think Calgary is praying he falls at all actually. They need defense and centers far more than another winger. I think Calgary will pick him if he's available but ideally they want someone like Dickinson or Catton.

 

[Lockin17]

Including Farrell in the proposal seems kind of pointless, until he shows he has higher-end potential, I don't see him holding much value.

But Dvorsky+16 for #5, as a basis, gives me pause. I wonder if Montreal doesn't have to add the Avs 2nd or something of some value. The cost for trading up in the draft is always insane, so it's normal STL fans think it's crazy expensive.... but if their management is high on whoever is available, and Montreal's scouts aren't sold on anyone available... and remember Dvorsky as being a player to consider if they traded down, then, who knows, it could happen.

The proposal also fits with Hughes' expressed wish to trade for kids with some development baked in. OTOH, I'm always weary of trading for kids, since the team trading them away has gotten a much better look at them and know what they are trading away...

Overall, solid proposal. Without knowing who MTL and STL like, I have to figure this is plausible (even though STL fans hate giving up last year's 1st and Montreal fans hate trading out of the top-10).

Farrell is Laval top forward. he's not pointless at all.
Could very well be in the NHL next year.

 

[pth2]

Farrell is Laval top forward. he's not pointless at all.
Could very well be in the NHL next year.

I wasn't saying pointless as in "he has no points this year". I was saying "including him in the deal is pointless".

He isn't a high-end prospect at this point, unless STL explicitly wants him, he won't be a difference maker in a deal.

 

[Frenzy31]

Farrell is Laval top forward. he's not pointless at all.
Could very well be in the NHL next year.

No he isn't. 23 year old, 5-9, 175 and all of 28 points. '

Quit the used car saleman stuff. Logan Mailloux or Josh Roy are the top young players at LAV.

 

[Baksfamous112]

the proposal is not about moving up from 16 to 5. it's about acquiring dvorsky. op is a montreal fan. there is no single blues fan here, asking for the #5 pick.

Still doesn’t change the facts. Montreal turned down Askarov + 15 + 21. Gives you a good idea of how high teams value top 5 picks

Farrell is Laval top forward. he's not pointless at all.
Could very well be in the NHL next year.

No he’s not. Far from it

 

[Lockin17]

No he isn't. 23 year old, 5-9, 175 and all of 28 points. '

Quit the used car saleman stuff. Logan Mailloux or Josh Roy are the top young players at LAV.

Roy is a NHLer now, Mailloux is a D ,
Farrell plays on the top line and he's better then Heinemen, yes he is Laval top forward.
Stop looking at stats and whatch some games a bit..

 

[Stealth JD]

Blues fan here. If one of the desired D-men were on the board I’d do:

Dvorsky, #16OA (STL 1st) & # 48 OA (STL 2nd)

For #5 OA & #26OA (WPG 1st)

Blues would still have three picks in the top-60 (5, 26 & 56) & Montreal would have 16, 48, 57 & a former top-10 pick with a year of development.

 

[pth2]

Blues fan here. If one of the desired D-men were on the board I’d do:

Dvorsky, #16OA (STL 1st) & # 48 OA (STL 2nd)

For #5 OA & #26OA (WPG 1st)

Blues would still have three picks in the top-60 (5, 26 & 56) & Montreal would have 16, 48, 57 & a former top-10 pick with a year of development.

At this point, it comes down to player evaluation.... if Montreal liked Dvorsky a year ago (not to the point of #5 overall, but saw him as a top-10 prospect), and doesn't like whoever is on the board at their pick, and STL conversely REALLY likes whoever is available, I could see this deal making sense.

I'm pricing this as "#10+#16 for #5" and "#48 and a years worth of solid development in that #10 for #26"

This is a deal that would be disappointing to Habs fans in that it means moving the #5 pick without getting blue-chip elite talent back (like, say, Zegras, who is already a point-producing NHLer) .... but Dvorsky seems like the next best thing, so I'd be in favor.

 

[Junohockeyfan]

At this point, it comes down to player evaluation.... if Montreal liked Dvorsky a year ago (not to the point of #5 overall, but saw him as a top-10 prospect), and doesn't like whoever is on the board at their pick, and STL conversely REALLY likes whoever is available, I could see this deal making sense.

I'm pricing this as "#10+#16 for #5" and "#48 and a years worth of solid development in that #10 for #26"

This is a deal that would be disappointing to Habs fans in that it means moving the #5 pick without getting blue-chip elite talent back (like, say, Zegras, who is already a point-producing NHLer) .... but Dvorsky seems like the next best thing, so I'd be in favor.

At this stage in the rebuild it doesn't make sense. Habs are looking for a prospect with elite potential that can contribute sooner rather than later. Dvorsky can contribute sooner but just doesn't have anything close to elite potential.

 

[Memento]

The cost to move up to 5 from 16 is a huge premium.

That was my mistake; I looked at the Calgary draft position after the convoluted confusion that was the proposal.

My point still stands. I'd rather just draft Hage at sixteen or wherever we end up and get a first-round pick by trade Buchnevich to a playoff team at the draft, draft a defenseman with that pick and one with one of our two seconds and one or more of our two thirds. We don't need an undersized left wing that not even Montreal fans want, considering we already have potentially Buchnevich (if he isn't traded), Bolduc and Neighbours (as well as eventually Stenberg, as well as potentially Pekarcik), and I'm not spending Dvorsky and our first to move up.

And then you have the same guy who made the proposal then shitting on Dvorsky after proposing a deal for him, by saying David Goyette - David f***ing Goyette! - is better. Yeah, no, I have no issues calling him out.

 

[pth2]

At this stage in the rebuild it doesn't make sense. Habs are looking for a prospect with elite potential that can contribute sooner rather than later. Dvorsky can contribute sooner but just doesn't have anything close to elite potential.

Well, it all comes down to how Habs management rates these guys. If the highest skater left at their pick isn't anything special (in their opinion), then you take this deal and run with it.

But of course, if a guy they love is on the board (like last year), then you keep that very high pick.

 

[Junohockeyfan]

Well, it all comes down to how Habs management rates these guys. If the highest skater left at their pick isn't anything special (in their opinion), then you take this deal and run with it.

But of course, if a guy they love is on the board (like last year), then you keep that very high pick.

Riveting stuff! lol

 

[pth2]

Riveting stuff! lol

Well, it just has to be said that it comes down to subjective ratings, and not some kind of objective value we can chop tons of cybertrees discussing.

Last year I expected Montreal to get a haul for trading down from Michkov, since what I read had him as a notch above everyone else. Turns out, that wasn't representative of consensus opinion.

 

[Baksfamous112]

Blues fan here. If one of the desired D-men were on the board I’d do:

Dvorsky, #16OA (STL 1st) & # 48 OA (STL 2nd)

For #5 OA & #26OA (WPG 1st)

Blues would still have three picks in the top-60 (5, 26 & 56) & Montreal would have 16, 48, 57 & a former top-10 pick with a year of development.

Unfortunately it doesn’t make any sense from Montreal POV. We need high end talent and we’ll get just that with #5. We don’t need more depth, we have enough of that already in our pool

 

[bleedblue1223]

What would Guhle cost?

 

[Junohockeyfan]

What would Guhle cost?

Why? He's not on the table.

 

[bleedblue1223]

Why? He's not on the table.

Fair enough, was just curious the cost difference between him and the #5 pick that this thread is based on. Would Montreal value him more or less than Levshunov.

 

[Junohockeyfan]

Fair enough, was just curious the cost difference between him and the #5 pick that this thread is based on. Would Montreal value him more or less than Levshunov.

Probably the same or less. I don't really know because we wouldn't trade Guhle - a burgeoning star player who the Habs have developed for 4 x years.

 

[Baksfamous112]

What would Guhle cost?

Nothing St-Louis can spare. He’s as needed here in Montreal as he would be in St-Louis