Moving affiliates closer to parent

[gstommylee]

Seattle is going to have to share with someone their first year because they aren't going to have enough prospects to fill out their own team.

Not necesarily if they acquire get a AHL via buying a ECHL team and promoting them.

 

[Centrum Hockey]

Not necesarily if they acquire get a AHL via buying a ECHL team and promoting them.

If Seattle doesn’t get the expansion team they could still move the team they affiliate with anywhere they want for example Tampa Gets team 32 which is placed in Orlando Seattle then has complete control over the fate of the crunch

 

[LadyStanley]

Not necesarily if they acquire get a AHL via buying a ECHL team and promoting them.

You cannot simply "upgrade" an ECHL franchise to an AHL franchise

NHL expansion franchises are purchased from NHL. AHL expansion franchises are purchased through AHL. ECHL expansion franchises are purchased through ECHL. (Or purchase existing franchise from current owner) All purchases require respective league BOG approval. (Including any relocation)

NOW, perhaps a team wants to have the ice hockey MONOPOLY in a market, so purchases an ECHL team TO GET THE MARKET. They still own that franchise, even if they get an AHL franchise. And they would need permission from both AHL and ECHL to do what they want to do.

 

[Stumbledore]

There are 5 AM flights from St John's to Toronto ( which in itself is 3 1/2 hours) but many of them are delayed or canceled because of fog.

Not sure how a reference to Toronto figures into my post about the difficulties of getting a player from St. John's to Anaheim...

 

[KevFu]

Nope. NHL and AHL teams do NOT practice together. Not allowed. Must have separate facilities for practice, training. The AHL Barracuda practice facility is adjacent (literally) but separate from NHL Sharks facility. They don't even use the same locker rooms at the arena. (Now the NHL medical suite just off the ice IS used for AHL games, but that's for convenience.)

That's weird, because I definitely didn't "make that up." I saw read or saw something on the whole thing of the synergy or cohesiveness between the Sharks/Barracuda. (I live in the San Jose market, I've seen the NBC/Comcast California/Bay Area coverage of the team). Maybe they meant guys on the de facto taxi squad, who are called up and healthy scratched before being sent down, etc.

 

[LadyStanley]

At training camp, the "Sharks system" is covered. And AHL coach uses the same system.

Sharks brass is at every home game. AHL guys know they are being watched by the Sharks.

Perhaps that's what you meant?

 

[KevFu]

At training camp, the "Sharks system" is covered. And AHL coach uses the same system.

Sharks brass is at every home game. AHL guys know they are being watched by the Sharks.

Perhaps that's what you meant?

Yeah, maybe it was the two coaching staffs together, NHL players on ice, AHL players watching? I vaguely remember the video package.

 

[BJNT]

It’s strange too me that they don’t allow the teams to practice against each other. I would think that the JV(which is pretty much what an AHL team is) practicing against the Varsity(the NHL team) would be good for player development because they are playing against a higher caliber of player and therefore will get better because of the competition.

 

[AdmiralsFan24]

It’s strange too me that they don’t allow the teams to practice against each other. I would think that the JV(which is pretty much what an AHL team is) practicing against the Varsity(the NHL team) would be good for player development because they are playing against a higher caliber of player and therefore will get better because of the competition.

Practicing against guys who aren't going to be trying their hardest would be pretty pointless.

 

[Iron Mike Sharpe]

But if Vancouver moves theirs to let say somewhere in BC it would make sense to have Seattle's be somewhere in the northwest.

Abbotsford is the only viable place in British Columbia that could host an AHL team, as they have a 7000-seat arena but they don't even have a junior A team. The Flames had their affiliate the Heat there from 2009-2014, but they really struggled with poor attendance. The Canucks briefly flirted with the idea of taking over the Heat but ultimately ended up in Utica, because they figured they couldn't make a go of it in Abbotsford. I can't really imagine the Canucks or anyone else placing an affiliate in the province any time in the near future, there really isn't anywhere to have a viable team.

 

[Iron Mike Sharpe]

Also, not sure where else in the Northwest an AHL affiliate could go because all the top cities are squatted by the WHL. The AHL would not be able to break into any WHL city, I would think.

 

[gstommylee]

Also, not sure where else in the Northwest an AHL affiliate could go because all the top cities are squatted by the WHL. The AHL would not be able to break into any WHL city, I would think.

Boise Idaho. Is the only city that would make sense for a AHL if its going to be in the PNW.

 

[LadyStanley]

Boise Idaho. Is the only city that would make sense for a AHL if its going to be in the PNW.

Nope.

Segregated from other AHL teams (closest would be Manitoba, Colorado and Stockton). Requires flying in.

Requires ECHL buy in as well.

 

[tank44]

Salt Lake makes much more sense than Boise. Closer to Colorado & California (even though still a very long bus ride) but Salt lake is at least a hub for Delta airlines thus you can get much better flight options for call ups to Seattle, California or the rest of the US.

I've said in the Seattle thread too, that Seattle & Vancouver would need to move AHL to PNW as a pair and not a 1-off; an Abbotsford & Everett/Tacoma pairing. Also, it's no guarantee that Seattle will get ownership of an AHL team since there are many teams that do not have one of their own (i.e. Vegas didnt get the 31st, that went to Colorado). From moves and attempts in the past, St Louis getting a AHL team in Kansas City should be a thing in my opinion.

What will be interesting is "IF" Arizona does move to say Houston. Houston & Tucson both become AHL "free agent" franchises. I'd assume then that the Houston franchise would pair up with San Antonio which is kind of an outlier at present. I'd also assume Tuscon would not stick around and Phoenix/Glendale could come back as a AHL city.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

I know I keep hoping Fort Myers will get either Tampa or Florida, with the other one getting Orlando. I feel like this will happen during the next decade.

 

[garnetpalmetto]

I know I keep hoping Fort Myers will get either Tampa or Florida, with the other one getting Orlando. I feel like this will happen during the next decade.

Are you thinking Fort Myers proper or would the Everblades down in Estero work? I'm not sure of their ownership situation (if they're still owned by Karmanos or were included in the sale to Dundon or found local ownership) but that could be a possibility, especially if Gwinnett came along as the landing place for a relocated franchise.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

Are you thinking Fort Myers proper or would the Everblades down in Estero work? I'm not sure of their ownership situation (if they're still owned by Karmanos or were included in the sale to Dundon or found local ownership) but that could be a possibility, especially if Gwinnett came along as the landing place for a relocated franchise.

Technically that would be Estero yes. But in Fort Myers you have the third fastest growing area in the country and an area that has crested the big 1 million residents mark that brings corporate interest. The facility could use a little update which probably would come with a combination of Florida Gulf Coast University and whatever team owned the affiliate or new ownership though there are no shortage of Cash rich people in Southwest Florida.

I just think it is ready made along with bumping up the Orlando Solar Bears. They are also ideal in terms of flights from a lot of northern cities that currently have teams. I believe most of these are going to move into an area where they are closer to the NHL team. It will be a bumpy moment in the AHL, but the NHL now has controlling interest in these votes having bought up most of the league. I think a restructuring is on the horizon, to me this is kind of like you could see the landscape of the College conferences where it is shaping up to change here shortly in my opinion.

We will see where that leads, but I have often told people locally I expect the Everblades should be in the picture if they play their cards right and the Panthers continue to be a based in the Miami area.

 

[KevFu]

I think to get the AHL thing done regionally, you have to convince three others to do "four-team groups"

Like if you had FLA/TB with SolarBears/EverBlades, and you got Nashville to put their AHL team in the Atlanta suburbs and did a "half division" of Charlotte/Atlanta/Florida.

 

[LadyStanley]

WRT "long" bus rides.... Barracuda usually buses to other California destinations, but if San Diego is stand alone, will fly. Usually flies to Tucson, Colorado.

My guess is that any Oregon, Idaho, Utah or Washington team would require air travel.

 

[Fenway]

Technically that would be Estero yes. But in Fort Myers you have the third fastest growing area in the country and an area that has crested the big 1 million residents mark that brings corporate interest. The facility could use a little update which probably would come with a combination of Florida Gulf Coast University and whatever team owned the affiliate or new ownership though there are no shortage of Cash rich people in Southwest Florida.

I just think it is ready made along with bumping up the Orlando Solar Bears. They are also ideal in terms of flights from a lot of northern cities that currently have teams. I believe most of these are going to move into an area where they are closer to the NHL team. It will be a bumpy moment in the AHL, but the NHL now has controlling interest in these votes having bought up most of the league. I think a restructuring is on the horizon, to me this is kind of like you could see the landscape of the College conferences where it is shaping up to change here shortly in my opinion.

We will see where that leads, but I have often told people locally I expect the Everblades should be in the picture if they play their cards right and the Panthers continue to be a based in the Miami area.

Tampa - Orlando and Panthers - Estero makes sense BUT how many more loyal AHL markets are be sent to the scrap pile? Logic would dictate that Vancouver would be far better off in Abbotsford than Utica.

The core problem is the NHL parent teams look at the ECHL as a feeder to the AHL team but not the parent club. For fans in former AHL cities that now have the ECHL it is a TOUGH sell.

There are whispers that Manchester is looking hard at getting a team in the QMJHL and that could be a good fit.

 

[Centrum Hockey]

Tampa - Orlando and Panthers - Estero makes sense BUT how many more loyal AHL markets are be sent to the scrap pile? Logic would dictate that Vancouver would be far better off in Abbotsford than Utica.

The core problem is the NHL parent teams look at the ECHL as a feeder to the AHL team but not the parent club. For fans in former AHL cities that now have the ECHL it is a TOUGH sell.

There are whispers that Manchester is looking hard at getting a team in the QMJHL and that could be a good fit.

losing Manchester would mean Portland and Worcester would be on a island like Manchester's 2015 ECHL season The owner in Worcester has done a good job investing in the community with a new ice center and more developments it would be a shame if having a team in Worcester would become a geographical nightmare for the ECHL.
How Cliff Rucker's chance visit to Worcester turned into a catalyst for revitalization

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

San Jose didn’t care about makeing money or haveing good attendance in Worcester either the sharks are like the west coast devils when It comes to minor league parent clubs New Jersey has a rough history of minor league teams Trenton Titans - Wikipedia What Killed the AHL in Albany?

false, Js, what is the history of San Jose's affiliation? the Sharks only bought the now Barracuda after USA Hockey elected to back out of ownership, it was also the same reason why the Sharks were forced out of Cleveland after the parent club was bought out of the expiring real estate contract by Dan Gilbert it has absolutely nothing to do with the Devils affiliation history since you can make the same claim about Calgary's affiliation history since they left Saint John, which, ironically, is the original franchise granted to Portland in 1977, answer me this, why did Philadelphia sell the AHL Affiliate they were granted in 1977, outright, to the Devils prior to the 1983-84 season, when it was the Islanders affiliation that landed in Albany to begin with....

 

[Centrum Hockey]

false, Js, what is the history of San Jose's affiliation? the Sharks only bought the now Barracuda after USA Hockey elected to back out of ownership, it was also the same reason why the Sharks were forced out of Cleveland after the parent club was bought out of the expiring real estate contract by Dan Gilbert it has absolutely nothing to do with the Devils affiliation history since you can make the same claim about Calgary's affiliation history since they left Saint John, which, ironically, is the original franchise granted to Portland in 1977, answer me this, why did Philadelphia sell the AHL Affiliate they were granted in 1977, outright, to the Devils prior to the 1983-84 season, when it was the Islanders affiliation that landed in Albany to begin with....

i just used New Jersey as an example of a bad NHL parent i did not mean the sharks and devils where related in anyway

 

[garnetpalmetto]

Tampa - Orlando and Panthers - Estero makes sense BUT how many more loyal AHL markets are be sent to the scrap pile? Logic would dictate that Vancouver would be far better off in Abbotsford than Utica.

The core problem is the NHL parent teams look at the ECHL as a feeder to the AHL team but not the parent club. For fans in former AHL cities that now have the ECHL it is a TOUGH sell.

There are whispers that Manchester is looking hard at getting a team in the QMJHL and that could be a good fit.

It's not just fans of former AHL teams that have a tough time buying into a new ECHL team. I remember when the ECHL added the Victoria Salmon Kings and many of their fans were upset that they had a team that had no connection to Vancouver (initially) and wasn't a WHL team.

To that end, would Victoria end up being a better landing spot for an AHL team than Abbottsford or Tacoma/Everett?

 

[Centrum Hockey]

I think to get the AHL thing done regionally, you have to convince three others to do "four-team groups"

Like if you had FLA/TB with SolarBears/EverBlades, and you got Nashville to put their AHL team in the Atlanta suburbs and did a "half division" of Charlotte/Atlanta/Florida.

Nashville seems happy with Milwaukee and Viola said the Panthers lose to much money to take on a AHL team it did not stop the coyotes though