OT: MMA General Discussion Thread (UFC, Strikeforce, Belator etc...) Part 2

[joestevens29]

Kinda sad seeing the buy rate on Mighty Mouse PPV's being so low, I knew he wasn't doing big numbers, but I guessed they would of been better than that.

I'm not overly shocked. Those real light weight divisions are tough to draw. Lack of knockouts hurts. Lot's of unknown fighters as well. One of the funniest reasons I heard last weekend "I don't want to watch this, it's disgusting I can barely get to that weight and a grown man is fighting at that weight". Of course from a female.

 

[joestevens29]

i always thought they were going to use the fox cable air times to build up contenders and build a casual free fanbase and then use the PPV's for title fights and #1 contender bouts. they did the opposite putting a few good fights on free TV (titles fights) then watering down ppvs and making 12 a year. its way too much.

an ideal way to hook fans into buying the PPVs is having tournys. the top 32 of whichever division that year. have the first 3 rounds free on TV then the semis and finals on a PPV card.

The question is would the fighters do this? Don't get me wrong I'd love it, but I'd question if the elite would participate.

 

[CornKicker]

The question is would the fighters do this? Don't get me wrong I'd love it, but I'd question if the elite would participate.

i think the motivation is PPV revenue for the fighters that make the PPV. you make the PPV you get this % of money. If the elite want that $ then fight. Also the elite fighters could skip tournys and fight the winners on PPV also. i mean as much as we'd all like to watch Mcgregor beat up 5 scrubs its a bigger build up to say i beat these 5 now i wanna fight conner.

 

[pistolpete11]

Below if the list of top UFC events by PPV buys. It's not like overall there is a ton more buys by my eyes with the exception of Mcgregor. The question if you are WME should be how do we gain the buys that we have lost in the past few years from the fans that use to buy every card?

It's great they have set records, but what happens when the new fans across the world start dropping like the fans in North America have already done? Not just a UFC issue though. Seems like far too often the main concern of sports leagues is to grow the sport, which makes sense. But far too often we are seeing the diehard fans being neglected.




http://www.tapology.com/search/mma-event-figures/ppv-pay-per-view-buys-buyrate

I mean the overall revenue. The PPV buys/fight aren’t much different (outside of Connor), but if they are getting similar PPV buys/fight and they are also doing more PPVs + Fight Nights, the total revenue is going to be higher.

i always thought they were going to use the fox cable air times to build up contenders and build a casual free fanbase and then use the PPV's for title fights and #1 contender bouts. they did the opposite putting a few good fights on free TV (titles fights) then watering down ppvs and making 12 a year. its way too much.

an ideal way to hook fans into buying the PPVs is having tournys. the top 32 of whichever division that year. have the first 3 rounds free on TV then the semis and finals on a PPV card.

That would probably be the best for real fans, but casual fans wouldn't tune in to see a bunch of nobodies. They need at least 1 fight they can promote to get more people to tune in.

 

[CornKicker]

I mean the overall revenue. The PPV buys/fight aren’t much different (outside of Connor), but if they are getting similar PPV buys/fight and they are also doing more PPVs + Fight Nights, the total revenue is going to be higher.



That would probably be the best for real fans, but casual fans wouldn't tune in to see a bunch of nobodies. They need at least 1 fight they can promote to get more people to tune in.

yes but hardcore fans are buying the PPV anyway, you need a way to capture casual fans then get them to buy ppvs. What better way then to build up a tourny show the first few fights build up the winners then say ooooooo you have to buy this PPV to see who wins.

 

[CornKicker]

also id be interested to see the data on establishments that have UFC PPV rights and how business is for them during the same ppvs?

 

[joestevens29]

I mean the overall revenue. The PPV buys/fight aren’t much different (outside of Connor), but if they are getting similar PPV buys/fight and they are also doing more PPVs + Fight Nights, the total revenue is going to be higher.



That would probably be the best for real fans, but casual fans wouldn't tune in to see a bunch of nobodies. They need at least 1 fight they can promote to get more people to tune in.

Getting similar revenue, but having more quantity to get that revenue is a business plan set for failure.

 

[pistolpete11]

yes but hardcore fans are buying the PPV anyway, you need a way to capture casual fans then get them to buy ppvs. What better way then to build up a tourny show the first few fights build up the winners then say ooooooo you have to buy this PPV to see who wins.

Well there are difficulties of doing a tournament, but that’s kinda my point. Hardcore fans are buying the PPVs regardless, so take a few of those good (or at least marketable) fights from the PPV and put them on TV for free to get casual fans to tune in. Casuals aren’t going to tune in to watch 2 guys that have 1 fight in the UFC and are 5 wins away from being in title contention. They want to see fights, at least the main event, that have some significance.

The most important thing for them are to get eyeballs on the sport. Having a marketable fight as the main event is step one. It can be a legend like BJ Penn, a fighter people from outside the fight world might recognize like PZV, or a title fight like the TUF finale this year. Once you get people to tune in, they start to learn the fighters, see how exciting the sport can be, see all the promotion for the next PPV, etc. For casual fans, you don’t do that with up and comers.

And before anyone says anything, I don't mean put Connor on Fox. There are obviously fights that need to be on PPV, but there are other good, marketable fights they can use for Fight Nights. I'm not saying that's what I want to see, but I understand why the UFC would do that.

Getting similar revenue, but having more quantity to get that revenue is a business plan set for failure.

First of all, they aren't getting similar revenue overall. Their revenue has been increasing for several years now. Second, I agree it’s not the best long term marketing strategy unless you are looking to sell….oh wait.

 

[joestevens29]

Well there are difficulties of doing a tournament, but that’s kinda my point. Hardcore fans are buying the PPVs regardless, so take a few of those good (or at least marketable) fights from the PPV and put them on TV for free to get casual fans to tune in. Casuals aren’t going to tune in to watch 2 guys that have 1 fight in the UFC and are 5 wins away from being in title contention. They want to see fights, at least the main event, that have some significance.

The most important thing for them are to get eyeballs on the sport. Having a marketable fight as the main event is step one. It can be a legend like BJ Penn, a fighter people from outside the fight world might recognize like PZV, or a title fight like the TUF finale this year. Once you get people to tune in, they start to learn the fighters, see how exciting the sport can be, see all the promotion for the next PPV, etc. For casual fans, you don’t do that with up and comers.

And before anyone says anything, I don't mean put Connor on Fox. There are obviously fights that need to be on PPV, but there are other good, marketable fights they can use for Fight Nights. I'm not saying that's what I want to see, but I understand why the UFC would do that.



First of all, they aren't getting similar revenue overall. Their revenue has been increasing for several years now. Second, I agree it’s not the best long term marketing strategy unless you are looking to sell….oh wait.

I didn't mean overall.

Cards like last night are what continue to drive people away. Yes it was free, but my god how the hell are you gaining fans but putting such a poor card out there.

Have a feeling this will be the fate of the Edmonton card. Probably a ton of washed up Canadians, heck what's Jason Macdonald doing?

 

[joestevens29]

Ortiz vs Sonnen free today on Spike.

Don't really expect anything from the fight, but what I found interesting is that Ortiz is saying this is his biggest payday of his career.

Kinda sad really and you can see why these guys will continue to fight even though they shouldn't.

 

[Burnt Biscuits]

That Holm vs de Randamie fight left a bad taste in my mouth, in my mind de Randamie is the better fighter, but Holm's won the last two rounds IMO and de Randamie definitely should of had atleast one point deducted for striking after the bell on two separate occassions. While it would of sucked to have a draw on the inaugural women's featherweight title fight, it would of been the right call.

 

[McShogun99]

That Holm vs de Randamie fight left a bad taste in my mouth, in my mind de Randamie is the better fighter, but Holm's won the last two rounds IMO and de Randamie definitely should of had atleast one point deducted for striking after the bell on two separate occassions. While it would of sucked to have a draw on the inaugural women's featherweight title fight, it would of been the right call.

She's just keeping the belt shiny for Cyborg.

 

[joestevens29]

I know it's late, but lol on the comments Lewis had after his fight Sunday. Pretty good troll job

 

[RandyBobandi]

I know it's late, but lol on the comments Lewis had after his fight Sunday. Pretty good troll job

Yeah that was pretty funny. I'm hoping Lewis next fight will be against Hunt that would be an awesome slugfest.

 

[molsonmuscle360]

GSP vs Bisping....Could this finally be Dana making it up to Alberta? I have heard rumors in the last few weeks that Katz/Nicholson was really pushing for GSP to be on the planned Edmonton card (my guess is either August or September)

 

[Burnt Biscuits]

GSP vs Bisping....Could this finally be Dana making it up to Alberta? I have heard rumors in the last few weeks that Katz/Nicholson was really pushing for GSP to be on the planned Edmonton card (my guess is either August or September)

Dana said the plan was GSP in Vegas, I also think August/September that is way too far away, Bisping needs to defend his belt sooner then that. Also a little miffed that Bisping found a way to duck fighting a top contender again.

 

[Canovin]

I hope the GSP fight is in Edmonton. I remember being at the Bell Center for the GSP vs Condit fight. That was the loudest event I've ever been to. The place was absolutely so loud and rumbling that I was legitimately scared the building was going to collapse. Big fan of GSP since I spent a decade of my life in Montreal. Hometown hero

 

[Spawn]

I wonder if Bisping is going to just be too big for GSP.

I hope the GSP fight is in Edmonton. I remember being at the Bell Center for the GSP vs Condit fight. That was the loudest event I've ever been to. The place was absolutely so loud and rumbling that I was legitimately scared the building was going to collapse. Big fan of GSP since I spent a decade of my life in Montreal. Hometown hero

As Burnt Biscuits said above, Dana White already said that the GSP/Bisping fight would take place in Vegas.

 

[Canovin]

I wonder if Bisping is going to just be too big for GSP.



As Burnt Biscuits said above, Dana White already said that the GSP/Bisping fight would take place in Vegas.

GSP usually walks around 195. I don't think Bisping is much bigger than that. I can't see any advantage Bisping has over GSP maybe aside from boxing. Even then GSP has some of the best jabs and shoot boxing in the game. Bisping certainly won't be able to man handle GSP.

 

[Oildrum]

I finally have a reason to watch UFC again. Since GSP "retired" and Rory MacDonald (who seemed unbeatable early on) dropped off, I haven't watched in years.

 

[ZJuice]

I got sick of UFC during GSP's reign of lay n' pray.
Lots of the fights I've been watching lately have been very entertaining though. Much better then lay n' pray/scared to lose events of old

 

[Spawn]

GSP usually walks around 195. I don't think Bisping is much bigger than that. I can't see any advantage Bisping has over GSP maybe aside from boxing. Even then GSP has some of the best jabs and shoot boxing in the game. Bisping certainly won't be able to man handle GSP.

Bisping fought at light heavy weight once upon a time. He's going to have a significant height and weight advantage during the fight.

Don't get me wrong, 5 years ago I would have given this to GSP no questions asked in a walk off. But he's now 35, hasn't fought in more than three years, and in that span suffered a second very significant knee injury (the first knee injury took away a lot of his explosiveness).

Who knows what kind of GSP we're going to see when he steps into the octagon again.

Personally I was hoping he'd never come back. No MMA fighters have escaped MMA without ending up embarrassed at the end of their careers. I was hoping GSP would be the one to be able to do that. Doesn't look like it now. If not Bisping, there are any number of middleweights in the prime of their careers who are going to beat a 35 year old GSP.

 

[joestevens29]

Bisping fought at light heavy weight once upon a time. He's going to have a significant height and weight advantage during the fight.

Don't get me wrong, 5 years ago I would have given this to GSP no questions asked in a walk off. But he's now 35, hasn't fought in more than three years, and in that span suffered a second very significant knee injury (the first knee injury took away a lot of his explosiveness).

Who knows what kind of GSP we're going to see when he steps into the octagon again.

Personally I was hoping he'd never come back. No MMA fighters have escaped MMA without ending up embarrassed at the end of their careers. I was hoping GSP would be the one to be able to do that. Doesn't look like it now. If not Bisping, there are any number of middleweights in the prime of their careers who are going to beat a 35 year old GSP.

Thing is Bisping is 38, he's no spring chicken. He's also not exactly that great of a champion.

I do agree with your last paragraph, but at the end of the day who knows what happens after this fight. GSP could just retire.

 

[Canovin]

Bisping fought at light heavy weight once upon a time. He's going to have a significant height and weight advantage during the fight.

Don't get me wrong, 5 years ago I would have given this to GSP no questions asked in a walk off. But he's now 35, hasn't fought in more than three years, and in that span suffered a second very significant knee injury (the first knee injury took away a lot of his explosiveness).

Who knows what kind of GSP we're going to see when he steps into the octagon again.

Personally I was hoping he'd never come back. No MMA fighters have escaped MMA without ending up embarrassed at the end of their careers. I was hoping GSP would be the one to be able to do that. Doesn't look like it now. If not Bisping, there are any number of middleweights in the prime of their careers who are going to beat a 35 year old GSP.

I actually think Bisping is of the more favorable match up for GSP. Sure he's taller and weighs more. But GSP has the longer reach. Wrestling, physical strength and timing are also in his favor.

The only reason GSP would lose is due to ring rust from the 3 years lay off. That Iagree but his style of fighting is the Floyd Mayweather of MMA. Ever since he became a big draw he only goes for the points and draws out a decision. Bisping certainly doesn't pack the power to take out GSP. Sure Bisping KO'd Rockhold but that punch was more luck than anything

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

Any word on what GSP is getting paid for this fight, one would think it's a significant sum.