Minnesota Wild General Discussion IX

[Lapa]

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[Dr Jan Itor]

@2Pair

And Ryan Ellis dollars in the summer of 2020 (when Spurgeon's contract kicks in) is 6 x ~$6.5M. My point has always been that 1 extra year and ~$1M isn't anything to go postal over. At the very least, it isn't "way too long" or "way to much".

I don't care that Spurgeon is overpaid by the player-equivalent of JT Brown.

 

[TaLoN]

The fact that you can't say that it's easy is the reason why there's a reason to believe that it wouldn't need a 4-5 year timeline.

It's not easy being a GM in general. Things don't always work as planned.

That said, with the talent we have coming and the talent we have on the roster, I still see no reason to want to blow it up, try for repeat top 5 picks for several years to "solve" this, which is what others were asking for that started this conversation.

Unless you're saying they're right?

 

[Jaakarh]

That's the thing, I don't see a years long rebuild coming. We have high quality talent coming soon.

If we go into a years long rebuild, how long do you think Kaprizov wants to stay in flyover country on a losing team?

That is a dilemma. But how do you sell a team to him anyway if we are in bottom 5 this year? Quite a challenge for Guerin. You are right that he probably does not want to mention a rebuild.

 

[TaLoN]

That is a dilemma. But how do you sell a team to him anyway if we are in bottom 5 this year? Quite a challenge for Guerin. You are right that he probably does not want to mention a rebuild.

You show him video of Boldy and tell him he's joining the team too...

 

[2Pair]

@2Pair

And Ryan Ellis dollars in the summer of 2020 (when Spurgeon's contract kicks in) is 6 x ~$6.5M. My point has always been that 1 extra year and ~$1M isn't anything to go postal over. At the very least, it isn't "way too long" or "way to much".

I don't care that Spurgeon is overpaid by the player-equivalent of JT Brown.

The fact that you have to come up with a handful of qualifiers just to explain why it "isn't that bad" for a 7 year contract that hasn't even started yet? Yeah, that says enough by itself.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

It's not easy being a GM in general. Things don't always work as planned.

That said, with the talent we have coming and the talent we have on the roster, I still see no reason to want to blow it up, try for repeat top 5 picks for several years to "solve" this, which is what others were asking for that started this conversation.

Unless you're saying they're right?

What I am saying is that it's hard to try for a one top 5 pick without recognizing that it could lead to two, three or five of the same.

We aren't the first team to like our prospects. I'm just asking how much historical data there is on teams dropping to the top of the draft and then bouncing right back up right away.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

The fact that you have to come up with a handful of qualifiers just to explain why it "isn't that bad" for a 7 year contract that hasn't even started yet? Yeah, that says enough by itself.

I have qualifiers and you have exaggerations. We both win (or lose).

 

[TaLoN]

What I am saying is that it's hard to try for a one top 5 pick without recognizing that it could lead to two, three or five of the same.

We aren't the first team to like our prospects. I'm just asking how much historical data there is on teams dropping to the top of the draft and then bouncing right back up right away.

Who said "try" for one? I'm saying one looks possibly inevitable right now. I still want to see us win this year, but I recognize that might not be in the cards.

I don't know how often, but I know the Avs did it. We have a talent pool the might be able to pull out off if it happens. I don't want to see this team to go into full on rebuild.

 

[2Pair]

That is a dilemma. But how do you sell a team to him anyway if we are in bottom 5 this year? Quite a challenge for Guerin. You are right that he probably does not want to mention a rebuild.

There's nothing to sell to Kaprizov. Either he wants to play in the NHL or he doesn't. If he comes over and you're still a terrible team? Then you might have something to worry about

 

[2Pair]

I have qualifiers and you have exaggerations. We both win (or lose).

How is using comparable players an "exaggeration"?

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

How is using comparable players an "exaggeration"?

Using phrases like "way too..." are exaggerations.

7 years isn't "way too" long compared to 6.

$7.5M isn't "way too" much compared to $6.5M

 

[2Pair]

Using phrases like "way too..." are exaggerations.

7 years isn't "way too" long compared to 6.

$7.5M isn't "way too" much compared to $6.5M

5 years would be the proper term. $7.5M is certainly way too much compared to $6.25M even more so when you're adding additional years

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

5 years would be the proper term. $7.5M is certainly way too much compared to $6.25M even more so when you're adding additional years

1 additional year.

$6.25M turns into $6.5M+ when you're dealing with the cap %.

 

[2Pair]

1 additional year.

$6.25M turns into $6.5M+ when you're dealing with the cap %.

It's 2 years when you factor in age. $6.25M is $6.25M

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

It's 2 years when you factor in age. $6.25M is $6.25M

No, it isn't.

 

[Wabit]

The GM should have just waited to see how the season played out instead of re-signing Spurgeon to a non-team friendly deal. You don't re-sign a (soon to be) 30yo player coming off a career year, especially 1 with the injury history Spurgeon has.

There was no upside for the team signing him to the contract they did, when they did. All it did was tie the hand of the team even more with their roster from the next several years.
-If he walks for nothing at the end of the season, so what? The team has gotten it's money's worth out of him. The Wild lose nothing and gain nothing.
-If he was traded during the season the Wild lose nothing, and gain whatever the return for him is.
-If they signed him to a good deal they lose nothing and gain a good contract.
-If they re-sign him to a bad deal the gain nothing, and lose out on cap space, and potentially assets to dump him somewhere else.
-If the GM signed him to a bad deal because his job depended on Spurgeon being re-signed. The GM gains a job and the team loses in the long run.

I'll be happy if Spurgeon earns his $5.2m pay this season. He doesn't need to be a $7.5m d-man (top-10 in the league for pay) until next season, but if he's not a $7.5m d-man this year then the contract will look really bad come the start of next year.

 

[Jtown]

It's not easy being a GM in general. Things don't always work as planned.

That said, with the talent we have coming and the talent we have on the roster, I still see no reason to want to blow it up, try for repeat top 5 picks for several years to "solve" this, which is what others were asking for that started this conversation.

Unless you're saying they're right?

What talent is coming?

 

[2Pair]

What talent is coming?

Nikita Nesterenko

 

[Jtown]

Nikita Nesterenko

Well obviously. I meant who else

 

[Binister]

This season has started just as expected and now we are paying the price for being too stubborn about the Cup. We're on a long downhill now so get your dancing shoes on and enjoy the gig.

 

[AKL]

Well obviously. I meant who else

Damien Giroux, Filip Johansson and Ivan Lodnia, to name a few

 

[Mickey the mouse]

Damien Giroux, Filip Johansson and Ivan Lodnia, to name a few

Do you really think any 1 of those 3 are legit prospects ?
all 3 are LONGSHOTS at best with Giroux having the most upside as a 3r / 4th liner.

 

[Mickey the mouse]

The GM should have just waited to see how the season played out instead of re-signing Spurgeon to a non-team friendly deal. You don't re-sign a (soon to be) 30yo player coming off a career year, especially 1 with the injury history Spurgeon has.

There was no upside for the team signing him to the contract they did, when they did. All it did was tie the hand of the team even more with their roster from the next several years.
-If he walks for nothing at the end of the season, so what? The team has gotten it's money's worth out of him. The Wild lose nothing and gain nothing.
-If he was traded during the season the Wild lose nothing, and gain whatever the return for him is.
-If they signed him to a good deal they lose nothing and gain a good contract.
-If they re-sign him to a bad deal the gain nothing, and lose out on cap space, and potentially assets to dump him somewhere else.
-If the GM signed him to a bad deal because his job depended on Spurgeon being re-signed. The GM gains a job and the team loses in the long run.

I'll be happy if Spurgeon earns his $5.2m pay this season. He doesn't need to be a $7.5m d-man (top-10 in the league for pay) until next season, but if he's not a $7.5m d-man this year then the contract will look really bad come the start of next year.

Guerin DIDN"T sign Spurgeon it was Leipold who signed Spurgeon ( to try to win back the fan base ) after his own mistake hiring Fenton.

IMO, which means nothing just like everyone elses on here, Spurg contract is awful in term. I would have rather given him 5yr / 8 - 8.25 a yr and he's gone after age 35 / 36

 

[PuckInTheNards]

Guerin DIDN"T sign Spurgeon it was Leipold who signed Spurgeon ( to try to win back the fan base ) after his own mistake hiring Fenton.

IMO, which means nothing just like everyone elses on here, Spurg contract is awful in term. I would have rather given him 5yr / 8 - 8.25 a yr and he's gone after age 35 / 36

IMO - this whole mess is on Leipold. He has resisted the rebuild for years - even when it’s been obvious to everyone that’s what’s been needed for at least the last three years. He hires on those GM’s who agree with him...